An Inconvenient Truth

[FireGoddess]

I apologize if there has already been a thread about this movie that I haven''t seen! Has anyone else gone to see the movie?

I''ve been talking about going and finally went to see it today. DH was working so I treated myself. WOW. I sort of left the theatre in a stupor. I seriously almost wanted to cry!

I thought it was very well done, factual, data-based but personal, and if I had any say I would make everyone sit down and watch the movie. There was an article in the SF Chronicle Saturday on the front page discusing whether the people who ''really need to see it'' are seeing it. Apparently to some extent they are. Whether they do something about the situation is another story!

I thought I would do my part to spread the word about this important issue...it seriously is jeopardizing our planet, and at quite a rapid pace in the last few years. There is also a website set up for the movie, and for educating people about what they can do as a single person yet still make a difference. If you''re interested, check out www.climatecrisis.net. Even if you don''t see the movie, a few simple things you can do in your day to day life can help.

Al Gore was on The View last week talking about the movie, and the book. All proceeds from both items are going to the global warming prevention cause.

 

[hlmr]

I haven''t seen the movie yet but what an appropriate title!!!

The sad reality is that most people will be shocked and express indignation and then proceed to change absolutely nothing about the way they live their lives.

 

[E B]

I thought it was fantastic. I wasn''t bored for a minute...but I was terrified. I sincerely hope that the people that really need to see it do (and if they have a problem with Al Gore, to get the #*$& over it!) and make some changes in their lives.

FI and I are already pretty environmentally concious (moreso than the average person, I think) but I''m still trying to make changes.

 

[movie zombie]

yes, saw the movie and while i think there was lots of good info it was like preaching to the choir: the people who need to see it the most probably won''t.

if you really want to cry and see how your tax dollars are being used, go see THE ROAD TO GUANTANAMO. makes me sick on every level and should be must see viewing for every US citizen.

movie zombie

 

[pinkflamingo]

its a hoax.

look carefully at both sides of the issue.

i did my senior project on this. i started out writing against the oil companies, etc, but if you look carefully into it, you may come to the same realization I did.

i am a huge liberal, but there are bigger things that we should be worried about...diseases, pandemics, nuclear war and terrorism.

A very interesting article...


The Tempest

By Joel Achenbach
Sunday, May 28, 2006; W08

 

[FireGoddess]

Date: 7/10/2006 9:37:10 AM
Author: pinkflamingo
its a hoax.

That's your prerogative and if you're that hellbent on it, I am not going to try to sway you. One can always find someone to agree with. Personal beliefs aside, is it still THAT big a deal to try and diminish your carbon usage? YOU think it's a hoax, so you're not going to recycle, or use energy efficient appliances, or get a car with better gas mileage? Whether you think it's a hoax or not, why not just DO some things that will unequivocally make the world a better place? It's a win-win situation.

I want to emphasize this point STRONGLY - regarding 'more important things to wory about like pandemics, nuclear war, and terrorism' - I want to make this VERY CLEAR - how is doing your part to be a responsible citizen of the earth in ANY WAY affecting the above issues???? Am I not monitoring information on bird flu or West Nile virus because I'm thinking about recycling my consumables? Are our politicians and lawmakers SO INTELLECTUALLY VACANT that they can't be thinking about and acting on more than 1 issue at a time? Because if so, they are not fit to hold office. The argument about having more important things to worry about holds NO water with me. It's a copout.

Lastly, I'm just curious. Do you live in Texas? I see your avatar is from Rice Univ. I lived in Texas for 5.5 years and it was the WORST place I have ever lived in terms of being good to this planet. I had to drive for half an hour to find someplace to recycle. And don't get me started on all the gas guzzlers.

 

[pinkflamingo]

My husband and I drive 14 year old cars. We do not plan on buying new ones for at least 10 years. My husband works on them himself. We live in an older home, we couldn't see the point in buying a new house, plowing down the beautiful woods here in FL when there are plenty of perfectly nice older homes. We recycle, we have a compost pile, we are responsible consumers. Does that do very much? Not much when I see what people throw out in their trash, people that upgrade their cars every 3 years, and throw out perfectly good appliances that aren't in style anymore.

I went to school at Rice, I lived in TX for 6 years when I went there. I voted for Gore, and Kerry, and would vote for Hillary or whoever comes along. I am not a gas guzzling Republican tooting SUV driver that doesnt give a sh*t about the environment, believe it or not. I am just pointing out that this is a complicated issue at the very least and I personally do not buy into a yellow journalism movie that skews facts to look one way. You can make a graph look anyway you want it. I was just pointing out to my pricescope friends that there are two sides to this issue and it is not as black and white as everyone seems to think. Kind of like conflict diamonds, I suppose. peace.

eta: I do think there are more serious issues than global warming. And since we can't seem to get anything done anymore politically (Hello, war in Iraq!) it seems like a waste. Poverty, hunger, and bird flu are more real concerns, IMO, among other things.

Kind of OT, I think gas guzzling will disappear as gas prices go up. And, yes, although it hurts my wallet, I am relatively supportive of that. Look at European cars. Look at how they have adapted to gas prices being sky high per liter. That is what we need. Eighties econo cars replaced the giant gas guzzlers of the 60's and 70's by necessity. It will happen again.

 

[roxy7]

pinkflamingo, have you even seen the movie?

 

[FireGoddess]

You are taking this much more personally than I meant it. I actually was logging back on here to add that by saying YOU I actually meant a collective YOU (except for the question about Texas). But you have already replied, and have clearly taken it as a personal affront.

I don't care who you voted for, or whether you're a democrat or republican. This issue crosses party lines. It's the only planet we've got and it's not voting blue or red.

You are entitled to disagree. I'm not holding a gun to your head.

My actual POINT is that whether you have been programmed to believe it's a hoax (propaganda machine is working overtime you know by lots of fatcats) or, as you say, have bought into a yellow journalism movie (which I don't believe it is) ...is it THAT BIG A DEAL TO ACT RESPONSIBLY???? No, it's not.

I KNOW it can make a person quite despondent to see a neighbor acting irresponsibly. But if everyone gave up, would that really help anything? Why not try to spread the word instead?

I personally don't believe this is a hoax. I am doing my part. Even if one DOES believe it's a hoax, is it THAT HARD to do one's part to take care of the planet, something we should be doing anyway? Or would we rather find out too late that it WASN'T a hoax???

ETA: in response to pinkflamingo's ETA, I still maintain that there will ALWAYS be a hierarchy of which issues are more important. But preserving the planet we live on should NOT BE at the bottom of the list. I will repeat myself because this is really a lame excuse. Here's an example - Since we're fighting terrorism and nuclear war and all, which is so important...then we shouldn't have made time to pass Megan's law and the Amber alert system to find abducted children. There are SO many things that are more important than that. Not. It's a ridiculous argument. The president had the time to stop Terry Schiavo's breathing tube from being taken out. I think he has time to sit his arse down and do something about the planet.

ETAA: I'll do better. Forget Terry Schiavo. Let's compare apples to apples and talk about actual legislation. I'd like to see ANYone tell me that it's more important to block gay marriage than it is to take care of this planet. If John marries Mark, it doesn't affect my life. If the planet is uninhabitable, that DOES affect my life. So like I said, having 'more important things to worry about' is complete BS. If legislators have time to discuss gay marriage, they've got more than enough time to discuss this planet.

 

[roxy7]

I just took the time to thoughtfully read the Washington Post article that you cited, pinkflamingo. Surprisingly, i think the article really supports the proposition that climate change is happening. The article concedes that it is only a handful of skeptics who don''t believe global warming and also concedes that both sides of the issue are so highly politicized that it is really hard to get the facts straight. It even states that most skeptics don''t even give credence to their fellow skeptics, as the "skeptic" scientist who says, "I believe in climate change caused by human activity. What i''m skeptical about is the glib notion that it means the end of the world as we know it."

For every scientific point on the issue of global warming, there is a counterpoint. I think it is inaccurate to come here, cite one politicized "skeptic" article, and say the whole issue is a hoax.

 

[ephemery1]

Date: 7/10/2006 1:06:10 PM
Author: roxy7

For every scientific point on the issue of global warming, there is a counterpoint. I think it is inaccurate to come here, cite one politicized ''skeptic'' article, and say the whole issue is a hoax.

Well said, Roxy! I thought FireGoddess''s original post was excellent... she gave her personal reaction to the movie/issue, and encouraged others to educate themselves so they could form their own personal opinions on an important topic. I agree with her that taking measures to preserve our environment is a win-win situation... even if the extent of human damage is disputed, there is certainly no harm in living responsibly anyway.

I also agree that it is important to consider both sides of every issue, but that can be done without unequivocally declaring that somebody else''s intensively-researched, well-presented point of view is a "hoax" and that we should be concentrating on "bigger" things instead.

 

[hlmr]

Date: 7/10/2006 9:37:10 AM
Author: pinkflamingo

its a hoax.

look carefully at both sides of the issue.

i did my senior project on this. i started out writing against the oil companies, etc, but if you look carefully into it, you may come to the same realization I did.

i am a huge liberal, but there are bigger things that we should be worried about...diseases, pandemics, nuclear war and terrorism.

A very interesting article...


The Tempest

By Joel Achenbach
Sunday, May 28, 2006; W08

You have got to be kidding. You did a project so now you know that global warming is a hoax. I suppose the huge hole in the ozone layer has been fabricated as well.....

 

[snuga]

I saw the movie and deeply researched global warming in my college career. I think it is a terrible issue and things need to be done to stop it. I believe everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and I am certainly not trying to push my ideology on anyone...

but, it is a REAL issue and there are REAL problems associated with it, take the increasing hurricane seasons these past years, the extreme heat waves in Europe in 2003 killing many people, and the increase in diseases such as the avion flu and west nile virus. Global warming is affecting all of these problems. Scientists aren't disputing it, people are just disputing how to deal with it and if the issue takes precedence over others, such as the war in Iraq.

You certainly don't have to agree with me, because this is just my opinion! Peace!

 

[Mara]

actually i didn't take PF's post saying it was a hoax to mean that 'global warming' is a hoax, but rather the movie's URGENCY feel was more hoaxy. kind of like those urban legend emails that we all get. sure there may be some truth in there but really they just serve to freak people out about their achilles tendon's being cut or people hiding in their cars or whatever. the general feel about an urban legend at least from my point of view is that yes there is danger and yes people should be cautious, but it's not spot on fact by fact.

and that is kind of how i view something like this movie... or rather how it could be construed.

i read the website that you linked to FG and my first thought was, wow this was really well written marketing material for the movie and to tout al gore and his passion for the world or whatever. just for the record, i have no feelings at all towards al gore positive or negative and yes i would like to do my part to not cause the world to end...but the feeling i have is that this is all a lot of bru-ha-ha about an issue that could be serious, but there ARE other issues that are serious too.

i liken it to seeing a cop pulling someone over on the side of the road and i'm thinking, wow so that person was going 10 miles over the speed limit but across town someone is being murdered. yes both are wrong but which is more serious?

not trying to inflame anyone here but those are just some thoughts. we actually do things that were listed on the website already, aka we don't drive our cars as much, greg takes public transit 4 days a week, we change our filters in our house every 2 months or so, we don't use our AC and heat as much as our neighbors, i don't know about our light bulbs but i was going to mention it to greg....sure i would do my part to help if that is what it takes.

but some of the things listed on that site, aka 'dire straits' wording such as 'in 10 years we could be entering a climate crisis' or whatever and making it sound like in 10 years we could all be roasting due to some freak heat wave in alaska...i don't know if i buy into it.

i probably won't see the movie because i don't really like documentaries like that...it still IS someone's opinion or perception of the problem and while i think it is good to make people aware of what they can do to help...it'd be nice if maybe there was a cure for aids or cancer too. totally unrelated of course but kind of like my whole cop pulls over/murder analogy. lots of issues out there, wish more were being addressed with such public fanfare.

 

[FireGoddess]

To me the main point is, whether you agree with Gore or the movie or not, if it at least gets you to be conscious of how you are living, or inspires you to take some action, we all benefit. Whether one feels the facts have been sensationalized or not, certain facts remain and if the message is turned into self awareness and action, it will have done its job.

I think its highly commendable of Gore to put this out there and give a face to the cause, because it usually takes some ''celebrity type'' to call attention to any ''crisis'' these days and if someone will listen to him over Greenpeace or whatever, then so be it.

It would be great to hear ''I''m concerned about global warming and I''m going to evaluate the way I live.'' It would also be just as fine with me to hear ''I don''t believe in global warming but I will evaluate the way I live because it can only help anyway.'' If it turns out that the urgency about global warming is sensationalized.... swell - but I''m not willing to take the chance that it''s not.

 

[Mara]

i don't see anyone saying they weren't going to listen to some suggestions on how people could improve their lives to help the world, PF didn't say that either. honestly i thought she got kind of jumped on for stating her point re the movie seeming hoax-like (maybe it was just a wrong use of terminology)...it was just interesting to put my thoughts out there, because i can see both sides without getting too dramatic about either side/thought/idea.

the media is great for giving publicity and that's about it.

 

[FireGoddess]

Date: 7/10/2006 7:15:38 PM
Author: Mara
i don''t see anyone saying they weren''t going to listen to some suggestions on how people could improve their lives to help the world, PF didn''t say that either. honestly i thought she got kind of jumped on for stating her point re the movie seeming hoax-like (maybe it was just a wrong use of terminology)...

I don''t want to harp here...(!)...I''m not claiming that anyone has said they weren''t going to take stock of their actions!! I have been throwing it out there to clarify the point that everyone is entitled to their own opinion. That they don''t agree with mine or I don''t agree with theirs doesn''t matter, that they will or won''t see the movie doesn''t matter...what matters more is how we take stock of ourselves, that''s all. PF''s post seemed to indicate (to more than one person) that she thought global warming was a hoax, and that is a dangerous comment to make, particularly when not well substantiated. Whether she meant the movie seeming hoax-like or not is a different story.

 

[roxy7]

There''s always bigger things to worry about. Geez, for all the time and energy that people on this site spend worrying about their diamonds, I didn''t think so many people would pull the sanctimonious "there''s more important things to worry about" card. We all see that. Why is it that environmental issues bring up attitudes like this all the time?

 

[Mara]

Date: 7/10/2006 8:14:36 PM
Author: roxy7
There's always bigger things to worry about. Geez, for all the time and energy that people on this site spend worrying about their diamonds, I didn't think so many people would pull the sanctimonious 'there's more important things to worry about' card. We all see that. Why is it that environmental issues bring up attitudes like this all the time?

I guess I haven't seen all the other environmental threads where everyone has such a 'sanctimonious attitude' about pointing out that there ARE other issues in the world to worry about.

 

[pinkflamingo]

I don't want war or flames...Thank you to Mara, I really think your first post above said everything I was trying to say, very succintly.

I think there is a lot behind the global warming issue that is not covered. They are selective in which studies to report and the problem and which studies to study!! Weather is cyclical and it is difficult to understand and predict. Why is the globe warming? I don't think it is solely due to man. I doubt it will produce the chaos/end of the world scenario that he is predicting in 50 years.

I try to stay away from radical groups on either side of the issue. It is difficult to distinguish truth from fiction.

Yes, I agree that we should all try to conserve more. I think more personal responsibility would be great. I don't see where I said anything to the contrary?

 

[FireGoddess]

Date: 7/10/2006 8:40:24 PM
Author: pinkflamingo
I think there is a lot behind the global warming issue that is not covered. They are selective in which studies to report and the problem and which studies to study!! Weather is cyclical and it is difficult to understand and predict. Why is the globe warming? I don''t think it is solely due to man. I doubt it will produce the chaos/end of the world scenario that he is predicting in 50 years.

Just curious here PF, have you seen the movie? I''m not saying you need to see the movie to disagree with him but FYI, these arguments are addressed in the presentation.

 

[pinkflamingo]

I have read and studied both sides of the argument. I know politics that if any politician has your undivided attention for two hours he can skirt around any issue and present it however he wants. Although I do not like GWB, I never went to see Fahr.911. I lump this in the same category.

I am not an expert, Firegoddess, nor proclaim to be. Nor should anyone who has simply watched 2 hours of a movie... I spent hours researching this, and like you, I was on one side of the issue for a very long time!!

Did Gore answer these questions?
Why did the earth begin warming in 1850?

Why did the earth's temperatures drop during 1940 to 1975, even as CO2 emissions were rising rapidly?

Probably not. Because there are holes in the argument. He just chooses to gloss over them.

 

[galeteia]

*peeks in*

Gass guzzlers? Gay marriage? Global warming? Personal efforts made towards heping the enviroment?!

EEEEK! I''m not going down this road again! *runs away in abject terror, shrieking about ten-foot poles*

 

[roxy7]

Date: 7/10/2006 8:40:24 PM
Author: pinkflamingo
I don't want war or flames...Thank you to Mara, I really think your first post above said everything I was trying to say, very succintly.

I think there is a lot behind the global warming issue that is not covered. They are selective in which studies to report and the problem and which studies to study!! Weather is cyclical and it is difficult to understand and predict. Why is the globe warming? I don't think it is solely due to man. I doubt it will produce the chaos/end of the world scenario that he is predicting in 50 years.

I try to stay away from radical groups on either side of the issue. It is difficult to distinguish truth from fiction.

Yes, I agree that we should all try to conserve more. I think more personal responsibility would be great. I don't see where I said anything to the contrary?

Well, I respect trying to do what you say you want to do. I do not think that conclusory language like, "it's a hoax" is objective. i would say that statement is a radical one.

Mara, I think you will see from PF's last 2-3 posts that she wasn't (as you stated) arguing that the movie alone was a hoax. It's pretty clear that she things that the theory of global warming is a hoax. As for your last comment, I guess I didn't make myself clear. I wasn't really talking about environmental conversations on PS always devolving into "there could be worse problems" discussions. I was talking more about the world in general, which is a common way that people avoid talking about (and more importantly, doing anything about) environmental issues.

In any event, everyone is entitled to their opinion. We don't all have to agree on everything.

 

[FireGoddess]

Sorry - I'm not about to start trying to recall answers to specific questions. He did cite the most commonly used arguments (ie. weather being cyclical) and address them with data. But I don't have a photographic memory, though I wish I did.

I also don't claim to be an expert either. I don't think anyone here has. I do come across as being on one side of the issue. But for me, whether this comes across in my posts or not, it is NOT simply a political issue, nor do I think one's particular stance on the matter should polarize him or her into complete inaction or radical action.

My bedroom could be a total mess, and it could be that way because I threw my stuff around, or because there was an earthquake that knocked everything around. In the absence of further details, we could argue till we're blue in the face about what caused my room to look like this, but in the end, I should just clean it up. That's how I feel about this issue. Collectively speaking, whether you think you're the one causing harm to the environment or not, what harm would it do to just 'pick up after yourself?' That's my point. I have to be sounding like a broken record now because I feel that way myself already. But I keep feeling like I'm dragged back into the debate about whether the movie, or anyone else is RIGHT or WRONG about global warming and that's NOT my point! My point (beating dead horse now) is that trying to be ecofriendly as individuals can only HELP at this point. *throws beating stick and record player away*

 

[pinkflamingo]

no hard feelings. hugs and margaritas all around.

i agree that we need to clean up the mess. americans are incredibly wasteful. my college roommate lives in the UK and she and her hubby get one kitchen trash bag sized bag to throw out per week!! Americans would seriously freak out if anyone placed those regulations here. At least in 2006.
unfortunately there is not unlimited money to clean up the environment-- not on the scale that it would take to make a difference in the ozone layer/global warming/etc.
So back again we go to evaluating how serious the threats are. is it really a doomsday scenario? do we need to dump billions of dollars into the Kyoto protocol and subsequent regulations? will it make a difference in the earth's health? is it an efficient way to help? do the costs outweigh the benefits? I don't know. it is really too complex of an issue to answer simply.
the best i can do is live simply and save and conserve where i can.

 

[hlmr]

Date: 7/10/2006 7:45:53 PM
Author: FireGoddess

Date: 7/10/2006 7:15:38 PM
Author: Mara
i don't see anyone saying they weren't going to listen to some suggestions on how people could improve their lives to help the world, PF didn't say that either. honestly i thought she got kind of jumped on for stating her point re the movie seeming hoax-like (maybe it was just a wrong use of terminology)...

I don't want to harp here...(!)...I'm not claiming that anyone has said they weren't going to take stock of their actions!! I have been throwing it out there to clarify the point that everyone is entitled to their own opinion. That they don't agree with mine or I don't agree with theirs doesn't matter, that they will or won't see the movie doesn't matter...what matters more is how we take stock of ourselves, that's all. PF's post seemed to indicate (to more than one person) that she thought global warming was a hoax, and that is a dangerous comment to make, particularly when not well substantiated. Whether she meant the movie seeming hoax-like or not is a different story.

It definitely was not my impression that PF's comment was directed at the movie. I interpreted (and still interpret)her comment as claiming that global warming is a hoax and that she was enlightening PS'ers.

There will be no instant gratification for us to take care of the environment as there could be for some of the other important issues mentioned, but it is paramount and shouldn't be dismissed as being too costly or simply inconsequential. It IS our responsibility to ourselves and future generations to take care of our environment.

 

[Mara]

i guess i am missing it because i totally don't see where PF says 'global warming' is a hoax and should not be taken seriously. she even said that my first post was basically what she was trying to say....which to me was not that GW does not EXIST. anyway, my part is done here..

i actually typically try to make a conscious effort not to discuss stuff like religion, politics etc on PS...but here i felt like PF's comments were taken out of context so i wanted to speak up.

 

[hlmr]

She dismisses it over and over again in her posts, but I see it one way and you see it another way so I guess we will have to leave it at that and agree to disagree.

 

[portoar]

I''m embarrassed to say it, but I''m kind of holding off on seeing this movie until I get my new car (I''ve just today decided for sure on an Acura TL). I don''t want to see the movie and then feel obligated to run out and buy a Prius. (and I do have to have a new car) But I am planning to take my kids to see it so that maybe they will TURN OFF THE LIGHTS FOR A CHANGE!