Art Deco Halo - Custom Ring Woes

[hidingpearl]

I'm working with DK to have a replica made of an art deco halo ring. I have sent several inspiration photos and have been very descriptive in detailing features I want. I recently received these photos of the ring half made (there will be diamonds and milgrain added) unexpectedly as I hadn't seen or approved the final wax model yet. I want to love it but I just don't. I'm really sad and disappointed to be honest. In my opinion the ring is very different to my inspiration ring, and it doesn't carry over the dainty look with low profile and subtle fleur de lys details on the side. Instead, it is thick, bulky, and more modern looking (I realise this may change somewhat once milgrain and diamonds are added). The fleur de lys is pointy and far too big. The centre diamond is sitting way too low and looks odd. The basket is too high. And I just think the beautiful AVC centre diamond is just getting swallowed up. I paid a premium for that delightful AVC, and I really want that baby to shine, at the moment it looks lifeless and dull.

Here are some inspo v my version pics. Inspiration pics are taken from this amazing thead: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/good-things-come-to-those-who-wait-2-60-antique-cushion.193146/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/good-things-come-to-those-who-wait-2-60-antique-cushion.193146/[/URL] It won't allow me to attach the inspiration pictures, so to see them have a look at that thread. Below are the progress shots for now.







Here are my thoughts. For now I have told DK my issues and he has stopped progress on this ring for now. He will show me an updated wax model tomorrow hopefully. My main issues are: basket is too high and needs to have filigree detailing tucked underneath, fleur de lys are too big and pointy and side petals don't point downwards enough, centre diamond and bezel need to be set much higher so the crown angle of the diamond matches the angle of the halo. In addition to these issues, the diamond does not look like it's getting enough light in to make it really stand out. The bezel is quite thick and the halo is pretty big too, I'm worried the focus won't be on the lovely AVC, the whole thing will just blend into one look.

These are my options:
1. Continue entertaining the DK custom make and hope that he can achieve the changes I want.
2. Scrap the whole idea and have DK place it in a temporary rose gold solitaire for now until wedding planning settles down and I have more time available to try the custom route again.
3. Return the AVC to GOG and get a larger AVC/AVR and have them place it in a temp rose gold solitaire setting, with the option of upgrading diamond or ring later.
4. Return the AVC to GOG and get a larger AVC/AVR and have DK pop it in a temp rose gold solitaire setting, with the option of upgrading diamond or ring later.

In my crushed state, I am leaning towards options 3 and 4, but I don't know if that's the most sensible. I did expect a custom make to be challenging, but not to this degree. And at this point in time, I just want a beautiful and sparkly diamond on my 2 month engaged finger.

Any advice or encouragement or personal opinions would be very much welcomed Thanks!

 

[retrogamer]

Personally, I would opt for getting a bigger AVR and putting it in a temporary setting for now (either through DK or GOG). Based on your post, I am making the assumption that you eventually wanted to go bigger anyways and this would be good segway into doing so rather than plunking a money into a setting and having to start fresh again once you have a bigger diamond. Just a simple man's opinion. Go with what you would choose first. Good luck.

 

[arkieb1]

I think if you attempt this ring again you need to be going to someone like Brilliantly Engaged who have made this style look amazing before, Erica from Love Affair, Grace from J by G or if you have a larger budget Singlestone.

If you are running out of time I would also vote for a larger centre stone in a simple setting.

 

[hidingpearl]

Thanks retrogamer and arkieb1. I never actually intended on getting a larger stone, although now that thought is crossing my mind since this halo is not working out. I do have largeish and long fingers, so I like the finger coverage of a halo, but a larger diamond will also offer better finger coverage. I'm realising now that halos on smaller stones do really detract from the details of the centre diamond. If I'm saving costs on the custom ring, I could put that money towards a larger diamond. I'm not necessarily in a rush, but I am just itching to wear the diamond and my patience has unfortunately worn off with this custom build.

Does anyone know approximately how much DK charges on simple solitaires? I'd most likely get 14kt rose gold.

 

[retrogamer]

If done correctly, a halo would be able to frame the diamond appropriately. When I first proposed to my wife, we had a barely over 1 carat cushion and she desperately wanted a halo. The proportions were appropriate to the size of the diamond and it did not detract from the center stone. However, if you already feel like upgrading (based on your choices) it would be wiser to spend that money on an upgrade and not have to pay for a custom setting twice. Brilliantly Engaged (BE), Single Stone (be prepared to have a healthy budget of around 5-6k for a similar halo), Erika Winters, or Jewels by Grace seem to be forerunners for delicate halos.

 

[hidingpearl]

If done correctly, a halo would be able to frame the diamond appropriately. When I first proposed to my wife, we had a barely over 1 carat cushion and she desperately wanted a halo. The proportions were appropriate to the size of the diamond and it did not detract from the center stone. However, if you already feel like upgrading (based on your choices) it would be wiser to spend that money on an upgrade and not have to pay for a custom setting twice. Brilliantly Engaged (BE), Single Stone (be prepared to have a healthy budget of around 5-6k for a similar halo), Erika Winters, or Jewels by Grace seem to be forerunners for delicate halos.

I don't necessarily feel like upgrading already (I haven't even seen my diamond in person yet!) but I think that could be an option instead of getting the intricate halo. I do understand that if done correctly a delicate halo can definitely complement a smaller sized diamond well, but I guess my budget won't cover those vendors suggested by arkieb1 and yourself. I do absolutely love their work though. My other idea was to keep this diamond and pop it in a simple setting, and then later down the track add 2 small side stones to make a three stone ring. But I'll wait and see how DK's new CADS go in the next day or two, just in case he can capture what I'm trying to achieve. I love so many rings he's created in the past which have the antique feel, so I was sure he'd be able to get that look with my inspiration too. I guess I'll wait and see!

 

[arkieb1]

Have you tried Caysie as another alternative? I don't think David does really delicate well, so if you are after something really specific then it is worth saving the extra money and getting someone who can achieve what you are after. Otherwise hopefully the next round of CADs are better.

 

[kb1gra]

David made me an excellent and very delicate halo previously. I think he is fully capable of doing that kind of work.

But you have to be clear about what you want. The inspiration pics show a very large stone set extremely low to the hand. What you are describing is wanting the stone higher, but then saying everything is too big and too high. I'm not clear from your description how that would be achievable.

I agree that the shank needs to be thinned down a bit in the profile view, but that also looks completely different once milgrain is added and metal is cut away.

For what it's worth I never saw the wax of either of my rings that he made for me. I approved the CADs and then got final photos.

I think it's really interesting that in one breath people say you have to use someone like singlestone, then says David doesn't do delicate well-- he shares a bench with singlestone, the person who did the milgrain work on my (very delicate) halo from him is the same person who does the milgraining for singlestone. This ring was made about a year and a half ago, so maybe that's changed, but that was the case then.

CVB is in a completely different price class from DK, and I think it's interesting that people offer her up as a less expensive alternative when I found her quotes to be quite expensive.

 

[junebug17]

I wouldn't throw in the towel just yet…I actually think this looks pretty good…you're seeing the rough outline, no milgrain or diamonds yet, hard to judge…I like the size of the halo. Sounds like you want the basket lower on the hand, but the diamond itself to be higher. See what David comes up with. I've never worked with him, but it seems like he tries really hard to make his customers happy. Here are the inspiration pics

 

[RandG]

I would get on the phone with the vendor and walk through your areas of concern as a first step.

Your inspiration ring is beautiful, and I actually have the same mount but with a slightly square old euro. Although the bezel looks out of proportion for the scale of the stone, you should be able to reign that in at this point and it should give your stone scale, not overwhelm it. The rest of it looks to need refinement/polishing, but pretty close to what you're aiming for, I think. The shoulders look very promising.

I'm also awaiting a custom piece and the early indicators have me nervous too, like I'm watching a runaway train, really. If your gut tells you something isn't right, don't hesitate to pull the plug. I probably should have. Nothing worse than commissioning a costly piece, not entirely of your vision.

Good luck-- can't wait to see the finished ring!

 

[hidingpearl]

Have you tried Caysie as another alternative? I don't think David does really delicate well, so if you are after something really specific then it is worth saving the extra money and getting someone who can achieve what you are after. Otherwise hopefully the next round of CADs are better.

I've seen Caysie's work here and it's really lovely, but I have a feeling it's a bit more than I'm willing to spend at this stage. Are we allowed to share prices? David quoted me $1750 for the ring in solid platinum. Anything more than that, I think I would rather spend on a larger diamond and get a simple solitaire. I am loving this stuller solitaire, I just don't like how a wedding band won't sit fully flush - http://www.stuller.com/products/build/122004/3642166/?groupId=113775#/center-stone If I were to go with the stuller solitaire, I just can't decide between the rose gold or the X1 white gold.

David made me an excellent and very delicate halo previously. I think he is fully capable of doing that kind of work.

But you have to be clear about what you want. The inspiration pics show a very large stone set extremely low to the hand. What you are describing is wanting the stone higher, but then saying everything is too big and too high. I'm not clear from your description how that would be achievable.

I agree that the shank needs to be thinned down a bit in the profile view, but that also looks completely different once milgrain is added and metal is cut away.

For what it's worth I never saw the wax of either of my rings that he made for me. I approved the CADs and then got final photos.

I think it's really interesting that in one breath people say you have to use someone like singlestone, then says David doesn't do delicate well-- he shares a bench with singlestone, the person who did the milgrain work on my (very delicate) halo from him is the same person who does the milgraining for singlestone. This ring was made about a year and a half ago, so maybe that's changed, but that was the case then.

CVB is in a completely different price class from DK, and I think it's interesting that people offer her up as a less expensive alternative when I found her quotes to be quite expensive.

Hi, thank you for your response I have been much clearer with David than I have been here, apologies. What I meant about the basket and diamond height is that the diamond is sitting too low in the basket, where the basket almost swallows the diamond, however the basket is sitting very tall in comparison to the inspiration picture. I.E inspiration picture = low basket/taller diamond, DK picture = tall basket/low diamond. I have been very clear to him what I want in several emails, but that can sometimes be a difficult form of communicating, especially when he is as busy as he is. I do want to add though that he has been very pleasant throughout our interactions.

FWIW I personally don't like single stone rings anyway, that's not to say their craftsmanship isn't great, because it is, but I just wouldn't purchase a SS jewellery item for myself. I have had David touch up the milgrain of an antique ring, and I can absolutely agree with you that the milgraining work is amazing.

 

[hidingpearl]

I wouldn't throw in the towel just yet…I actually think this looks pretty good…you're seeing the rough outline, no milgrain or diamonds yet, hard to judge…I like the size of the halo. Sounds like you want the basket lower on the hand, but the diamond itself to be higher. See what David comes up with. I've never worked with him, but it seems like he tries really hard to make his customers happy. Here are the inspiration pics

Thanks for attaching the pics junebug17. I'm not throwing in the towel just yet, I'm hoping he does see where I'm coming from and make the appropriate changes. I have heard positive reviews that David does do a lot to please his customer and achieve what they want, so fingers crossed we both come out happy. I think I like the size of the halo too, it will look more delicate once diamonds and milgrain are added. You're absolutely correct about the basket and diamond placements.

I would get on the phone with the vendor and walk through your areas of concern as a first step.

Your inspiration ring is beautiful, and I actually have the same mount but with a slightly square old euro. Although the bezel looks out of proportion for the scale of the stone, you should be able to reign that in at this point and it should give your stone scale, not overwhelm it. The rest of it looks to need refinement/polishing, but pretty close to what you're aiming for, I think. The shoulders look very promising.

I'm also awaiting a custom piece and the early indicators have me nervous too, like I'm watching a runaway train, really. If your gut tells you something isn't right, don't hesitate to pull the plug. I probably should have. Nothing worse than commissioning a costly piece, not entirely of your vision.

Good luck-- can't wait to see the finished ring!

I do love the inspiration ring so much! I have tried on similar rings (way out of my price range) and they were so delicate and divine on the hand. Hopefully your custom piece turns out okay with no regrets. In terms of speaking on the phone, it's a little difficult due to overseas time differences, but I do think that's a good option if the next round of CADS don't have the adjustments I'm hoping to achieve.

 

[kb1gra]

I think you might be limited a bit on how high the diamond can actually sit. These old cuts have high crowns, but the bezel still has to sit at the girdle. I think if the bezel itself were thinner (and it will be once the milgrain is added by default, but it could probably be slimmed a bit) that might be the best you can do with this to get that appearance.

I found it helpful when I marked up images (I printed them off and drew on them by hand-- I am not a computer artist by any means) and sent those back to David that it helped convey my message. If I have one complaint about him it might be that he tends to make the shanks of rings too thick, that was my complaint with both my pieces. So I would address that point now.

 

[hidingpearl]

I think you might be limited a bit on how high the diamond can actually sit. These old cuts have high crowns, but the bezel still has to sit at the girdle. I think if the bezel itself were thinner (and it will be once the milgrain is added by default, but it could probably be slimmed a bit) that might be the best you can do with this to get that appearance.

I found it helpful when I marked up images (I printed them off and drew on them by hand-- I am not a computer artist by any means) and sent those back to David that it helped convey my message. If I have one complaint about him it might be that he tends to make the shanks of rings too thick, that was my complaint with both my pieces. So I would address that point now.

I think you're misunderstanding me a bit. I don't want to change the placement of the bezel on the girdle. I want the entire diamond, including the bezel setting to be raised higher than the halo, exactly how the inspiration shows the bezel sitting higher than the halo on the profile shot. You can clearly see the difference of the two profiles, inspo vs custom. In my custom build so far, you can't even see the bezel on the profile view. You and I have made similar images for David! I have also sent him images with lines drawn on them trying to explain what changes I would like. I actually have already asked him to make the shank thinner, but he suggested not to as platinum is soft. I do think there is definitely some room to be flexible though to make the shank a bit smaller! Have you got images of your rings made by David to share?

 

[kb1gra]

I do, but the pricescope image attachment thing is really annoying, let me see if I can get it to work...

One of my rings isn't helpful for this discussion, it's a plain platinum 3 stone, but this is the halo ring he made for me.

 

[hidingpearl]

I do, but the pricescope image attachment thing is really annoying, let me see if I can get it to work...

One of my rings isn't helpful for this discussion, it's a plain platinum 3 stone, but this is the halo ring he made for me.

Oh wow, that ring looks gorgeous! It looks exactly like the Tacori 2620 setting. Was his quote a fair price for that setting? If my design doesn't work out I could consider something like your one, it's beautiful. Thank you for posting.

 

[yssie]

DK has been creating some beautiful custom pieces lately! It seems that multiple iterations of revision are the norm when working with him - and I think it's fantastic that he allows his clients to be so involved in the process, that way there are no unpleasant surprises at the end! - so as PPs have said I wouldn't throw in the towel just yet. I do agree with calling in as well as emailing; you have very specific thoughts on what you want to see and sometimes things that might get lost in translation in one medium are highlighted in conversation through another

Other comment removed.

 

[kb1gra]

I do, but the pricescope image attachment thing is really annoying, let me see if I can get it to work...

One of my rings isn't helpful for this discussion, it's a plain platinum 3 stone, but this is the halo ring he made for me.

Oh wow, that ring looks gorgeous! It looks exactly like the Tacori 2620 setting. Was his quote a fair price for that setting? If my design doesn't work out I could consider something like your one, it's beautiful. Thank you for posting.

Thematically it's similar to the 2620, but there's a number of changes-- the basket is more open, the halo is wider and more substantial, and the shoulders are tapered and quite a bit steeper than the Tacori ring. It's overall quite a bit more substantial than the Tacori ring, with quite a bit more diamond weight (I believe the tcw of the setting alone for my ring was .70 in melee diamonds).

I'm sure David still has the CADs he used for it. About 18 months ago I paid $1400 in 14k gold with G/H VS melee.

 

[hidingpearl]

Thematically it's similar to the 2620, but there's a number of changes-- the basket is more open, the halo is wider and more substantial, and the shoulders are tapered and quite a bit steeper than the Tacori ring. It's overall quite a bit more substantial than the Tacori ring, with quite a bit more diamond weight (I believe the tcw of the setting alone for my ring was .70 in melee diamonds).

I'm sure David still has the CADs he used for it. About 18 months ago I paid $1400 in 14k gold with G/H VS melee.

Well he did a great job. I do like the look of the halo on your one, some of the 2620's I've seen seem almost to have a hidden halo underneath the centre diamond. Thank you for sharing that info!

 

[retrogamer]

David made me an excellent and very delicate halo previously. I think he is fully capable of doing that kind of work.

I think it's really interesting that in one breath people say you have to use someone like singlestone, then says David doesn't do delicate well-- he shares a bench with singlestone, the person who did the milgrain work on my (very delicate) halo from him is the same person who does the milgraining for singlestone. This ring was made about a year and a half ago, so maybe that's changed, but that was the case then.

.

I never indicated that he doesn't do delicate well-- however I have had experience with the other vendors mentioned and was very happy with the outcomes. It's just you have to micromanage DK with the CADs and the overall design in order to get the final product you want, this was not something I was willing to do as I am not familiar with CADs in comparison to the final product. I also was on a strict timeline and could not afford another 2-4 weeks of perhaps another iteration that I would be unahppy with, so I went with what I had in my budget in order to make my wife happy (happy wife equals a happy life after all). Brilliantly Engaged has done fantastic work and has done similar delicate tacori halo settings (Pandabee's comes to mind).

 

[lorrissey]

I've worked with DK a few times and I think he could absolutely execute the design you want. I think seeing the ring with no stones or milgrain is throwing you off. But if you're truly unhappy, then I would definitely wait until you're 100% sure of design and stone size. Sounds like you're leaning towards going bigger.

 

[Resonance.Of.Life]

There's still a lot of finishing to be done, this may account for the "excessive" metal you see. Polishing takes quite a bit out. He's put out some rather delicate settings lately.

 

[Alexxxx]

There's still a lot of finishing to be done, this may account for the "excessive" metal you see. Polishing takes quite a bit out. He's put out some rather delicate settings lately.

YES. I came to to post, but ROS took the words right out of my mouth (keyboard) --- it will look different when it's finished AND things I've had from a number of jewelers always look very different in hand. I had a wink ring I didn't think I'd like when he sent me pictures, but so delicate in real life. So different once I see them in person, not magnified on a computer screen. I have two projects from DK, very elegant, very refined.

 

[Mikla]

Sometimes you get what you pay for . . . if you are thinking of upgrading the stone, do it now. Don't throw money away on a setting that you will not need in the long run. Just my 2 cents . . .

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I just wanted to say I think it looks gorgeous thus far and is proportioned really well considering it is not finished. I definitely understand the stone height issue, but please know that the light return is coming from the top of the diamond and it doesn't matter whether it is the height it is now or raised. I agree with those who say do not go for an expensive setting if you are planning to upgrade the stone, but his pricing is excellent! Wow! I hope you stick with it because that is one of my favorite ring designs!

kb1gra...yours is gorgeous, too!

 

[Diamondbug]

I think the setting looks very similar to the inspiration ring. The only difference I can see is the height of the bezel to the basket, the rest I struggle to see. I just wanted to add that DK is awesome to work with. He will make changes till you are happy... you just have to work with him. Unless you have the ring in hand, taking minute measurements, you will have some differences......so you just have to be on it till you get it right.

 

[arkieb1]

David made me an excellent and very delicate halo previously. I think he is fully capable of doing that kind of work.

But you have to be clear about what you want. The inspiration pics show a very large stone set extremely low to the hand. What you are describing is wanting the stone higher, but then saying everything is too big and too high. I'm not clear from your description how that would be achievable.

I agree that the shank needs to be thinned down a bit in the profile view, but that also looks completely different once milgrain is added and metal is cut away.

For what it's worth I never saw the wax of either of my rings that he made for me. I approved the CADs and then got final photos.

I think it's really interesting that in one breath people say you have to use someone like singlestone, then says David doesn't do delicate well-- he shares a bench with singlestone, the person who did the milgrain work on my (very delicate) halo from him is the same person who does the milgraining for singlestone. This ring was made about a year and a half ago, so maybe that's changed, but that was the case then.

CVB is in a completely different price class from DK, and I think it's interesting that people offer her up as a less expensive alternative when I found her quotes to be quite expensive.

David's bench murdered a piece of mine and they were completely incapable of doing delicate, but I guess we can only go on our own experiences. He also recently copied one of my Victor Canera rings and it was clunky looking and badly done as well.... I agree that I have seen some beautiful pieces come from him so obviously it depends on who (which particularly bench person at the time he pays) does it for him.

I think in this case if you micro-manage the CADs now you will end up with something you are happy with.

 

[Violetphoenix]

Don't get discourage, but be firm with what you want. David is not the most creative jeweler as some others posted here, but he is amazingly patient and he will work with you. Now that you've already seen the cast and just point out to him what you don't like. He will make the adjustments until you're satisfied. Here is a ring he made for me last November

 

[hidingpearl]

Well David has got back to me and he is a very kind man indeed. It's clear he wants to make sure the ring is made to exactly how I'm imagining. He's very patient and generous by offering other setting options if necessary. I haven't seen this diamond in person yet, and David offered for me to have a look at the diamond before we go ahead with the custom build, which I think is a great idea. So I'll spend a couple of days with the diamond to get a feel if the diamond will suit the art deco halo setting. Yes this will delay the build, but for a ring that will hopefully last a lifetime, it's a delay that's worth every second!

I'm glad to hear some other PSers good experiences with DK. He really does have some lovely settings. Perhaps it is chance which bench worker casts the ring, but hopefully my eventual ring will have the delicate appeal I am after.

David's bench murdered a piece of mine and they were completely incapable of doing delicate, but I guess we can only go on our own experiences. He also recently copied one of my Victor Canera rings and it was clunky looking and badly done as well.... I agree that I have seen some beautiful pieces come from him so obviously it depends on who (which particularly bench person at the time he pays) does it for him.

I think in this case if you micro-manage the CADs now you will end up with something you are happy with.

This frightens me, but hopefully your experience was an anomaly.

Thank you to all for your encouragement and wise words! I'll keep you updated with diamond and pics of course.

 

[Violetphoenix]

I should explain the above pictures...the first picture was the first cast he made. I didn't like how it turned out. I explained to him what i didn't like about it and asked him to make the cutouts larger and the prongs smaller. He re-cast and made the second ring. It turned out perfect. Exactly how I had wanted. Hope this help