As the days come and go...

[SeeShell]

*sigh*

I have been feeling particularly lonely and engagement-crazed today. I have never really shared my whole story with you ladies before, so I thought today would be my day to vent a little bit.

I am driving myself crazy. My boyfriend and I have been together for over four years, and I feel that I’ve been waiting forever. We first seriously brought up marriage after dating for 4 months. We began looking for rings together online after 1.5 years. Then, in November 2006, we went to a mall store to get an idea of what various settings looked like on my hand. After that trip, I felt certain that a proposal would come within the next half of a year. We did some more shopping around online, and I found a setting that I really like. I figured that it wouldn’t be too long to go.

He said that he wanted to wait until he graduated to propose.
He graduated a year ago…no proposal.

Then he said that he wanted to wait until I graduated.
I graduated this past spring…no proposal.

Last year, he told me that we would be engaged by this July 30….no proposal.

Well, he then really wanted to wait until I found a job. Proposing before getting a job would really complicate things, he said.
I found a good job in August…no proposal.

Then, I was getting optimistic about Labor Day weekend, as we would be having a weekend away after not seeing each other for a few weeks, and we would be going to the place where we met four years ago.
The weekend came, we had a good time…no proposal.

Then he said that he would buy a ring sometime this fall, and as of Thanksgiving, there was no ring purchased and apparently not had a heck of a lot of thought about it either.

When we were apart over Thanksgiving, he told me that he’d like to wait to propose until he moved closer to me. And then he proceeded to tell me that he’d be lucky if he found a new job anytime soon – he’s even renewing his apartment lease until late next summer and since it’s so expensive, he probably won’t be moving up here before then. But, during a heart-to-heart, I told him how hurt it makes me to see the time pass with no momentum on the engagement front. He then alluded to a possible “extra” Christmas present for me, but I’m not even excited anymore. So many of his previous landmarks have come and gone, and I don’t want to set myself up for any more disappointments.

Meanwhile, it seems that high school friends and college friends are getting engaged left and right. In my obsessiveness, I counted 37 people that I knew from high school or college who are now engaged or married. BF and I have the same group of college friends. Some of our closest friends are in serious relationships and have gotten engaged within the past few months...and they were only dating for 1/5 to 1/3 of the time that BF and I have been together. That really feels like a kick to the stomach. One of the couples that we are good friends with set their wedding date for this coming summer, on a date that BF and I talked about in the past as being a perfect date for our own wedding. However, now, that special date is lost for us.

Being BF’s fiancée is something I want so badly. I want to run around town to tell everyone what he means to me, and how he chose me to be his future wife. BF loves me; I know that he does. We tell each other very often about how we are going to get married one day. We both truly feel that have won the relationship lottery! So, it’s not a matter of ‘if’, it’s a matter of ‘when’, but it is taking longer than I would have ever thought.

Money shouldn''t be the issue either. We have discussed my tastes in jewelry, and he knows that I want a modest ring, nothing extravagant or expensive – probably about 3-4 weeks’ salary for him.

The fact that we are so far apart right now tears my heart out. I recently was fortunate enough to get a fabulous job – probably one of the best available in my field in this area of the country. Now, BF must search for a job here. He has told me several times before that he is not happy in the area where he lives, and believes that the area where I am now is a much better place to settle. However, he is in a very specific technical field, and it probably won’t be easy for him to find a job he wants. Being able to live with him, or at least close to him, is something I yearn for everyday. It’s just yet another thing that is out of my hands at the moment. Not being in control on so many issues makes me feel so helpless.


He knows how I feel. We do have conversations about our future often. He is emotionally ready to be engaged – he even told me that he’d marry me tomorrow if he could. It’s just the distance factor right now…We’ve been long distance for a year, and it’s possible it might be another year until we are closer. Part of me agrees with him that we should have all of our ducks in a row and at least be in the same state, but the other half of me wants the proposal to happen sooner rather than later.


I just feel that I’m ready to start my life with him. I can honestly say that within 4 months of meeting him, I was sure that he was the one for me for the rest of my life. Four years later, I’m still sure, and I am more than ready to settle down. Since we will likely be long-distance for at least next 8 months, I would like to look down at my hand every now and then and have this beautiful reminder of his love and the promise we made to each other. The constant parade of newly engaged couples in my life stings. Every time I hear of a new engagement, I feel like crying, and often do. I’ve gotten good at putting on the happy face to be supportive of the joyful couple, but then retreating to be alone so I can come to Pricescope and mope.

I know what some responses will be….
Just to enjoy this time ahead
Getting engaged isn’t a competition or race
Etc…


I know, but just needed to blow off some steam. I wanted to share this with you ladies for quite some time, but feel so ashamed that I even feel this way. It feels good to get it off of my chest though. Hearing every one else’s stories is like group therapy. Thanks for letting me vent.

If you made it through this novel of a post, I salute you!

 

[princesss]

First off, let me start with a big *hug*.

Please take a good, long look at what you posted. Look at all the dates gone by and broken promises. Look at what steps he''s taken towards starting a life together: he''s told you he wants to. Every time he misses a deadline, he gives an excuse and a new timeline. Has he ever actually followed through? Has he started a savings account for it? Has he honestly looked at ways to be closer to you? Or has he been content to leave things as they are but tell you that he''s working on it/wants to get married. If he wants to marry you tomorrow, why doesn''t he?

I was talking with a friend of mine the other day about the ways guys approach things: when they want something, they go for it. Guys that want something badly are on a mission, and won''t stop until they get what they want or are denied it. Your BF, though he does love you, doesn''t seem to really *want* to get married right now.

Talk to him. Have an open, honest conversation about where you see your life going, and if he sees your lives going in the same place. I know it''s nearly impossible to step outside your emotions at this point, but try to think of the advice the lovely PS-ers have given other women in your situation. There have been a few threads recently on here about similar situations.

*hug* I''m sorry you''re in such a rough situation, and I hope this post wasn''t too harsh. Please know that I meant this post to help, not hurt.

 

[gwendolyn]

The number of times he has set deadlines and come up with new excuses worries me. I didn't talk about it on here, but I had a conversation just before I flew back to the US for the holidays (my boyfriend is in the UK, which is where I am going to grad school, although it is still 200 miles from him), and I almost broke up with him because he was doing the same thing--not about getting engaged, but about getting a job. We'd been talking about it since June, and nothing has happened. He has just been coasting--things are ok with him, so he hasn't gotten out of his comfort zone to follow through on his promises to me. So we talked, and I said that if I didn't see any effort (not just talk, action) during the 2 weeks I was at home, I wasn't going to fly back to the UK to spend the holidays with him. Relationships are a partnership, and if you have a verbal contract with your partner (as both of us have had with ours) and they don't follow through, there's a bit of trust and hope that dies out every time. Everyone has their breaking point, and I found mine two weeks ago.

He can keep putting it off forever. There are always excuses NOT to do things; it's when they mean enough TO do them that you really know someone means it. I think you need to seriously think about whether or not you think he will be ready to stop giving you empty promises and actually follow through on what he's said he will do. It is extremely hard to do, especially when you can see yourself 10 years in the future being happily married to your man. But what if in 10 years he is still making excuses? Still just coasting? Will that be ok with you? Maybe it will be; to some people the symbol of marriage means nothing as long as they feel committed. However, it sounds like that wouldn't be ok with you (it wouldn't be ok with me).

So talk to him again. Tell him your concerns. Even if you've said it before, say it again. Your concerns are important. Let him know how disappointed you are over all the broken promises. Maybe he doesn't understand how much it means to you, or maybe he doesn't realize how many times he's put it off. Do you just go along with what he wants in terms of the engagement, or do you tell him what you want? Does he know you want to be engaged now, even if you are far apart?

I feel for you, honey. It's a very difficult situation because you love him so much. Corny as it may sound, you need to remember to love yourself too, and to make sure you are getting what you need from this relationship.

 

[SeeShell]

PrincessS and Gwendolyn, thank you both for your responses. The hugs cheered me up a bit.

I appreciate your words of advice. I suppose I have a tad of clearing up to do. When I went back and really analyzed what I had written, I think I come off as being much more critical of our relationship than I should be. It would be far too difficult to describe through a forum, but please know that our relationship is so wonderful (even from a distance!) that I would rather wait for as many years as he needs to get his life and career moved around, even if he is a slowpoke, rather than move on without him.

Also, I know that I read into the ''deadlines'' more than I should have. It''s something that I think many of us Ladies in Waiting are guilty of doing. A passing comment, such as "maybe I''ll propose by the time you find a job" becomes nearly written in stone. Suffice it to say, none of these were actual promises of engagement timeline.

As for a savings account, I know he is saving. As for moving up here, I know he has begun to look, but admittedly not as much as I would have hoped. I imagine that changing careers is a daunting task. I am hoping that once March rolls around (and he is no longer under contract to remain at his current job), the search will become much more aggressive.

We have had the future talk many times. It all sounds perfect when we talk about it - we both like this area, and he is serious about moving here...it''s just the act of doing it that is hard. I understand - it''s a big deal to pick up everything you have only a year into starting there. We talk several times a day, and this distance thing is hard on him as well.

As for engagement over the distance, I do have mixed feelings about it. I am a practical person, and I completely understand why he would want to be closer to me first, before proposing. It''s just the non-practical part of me (a part I am not used to seeing very often), has been a little more vocal since I''ve been living alone.

Again, it''s so difficult to phrase things correctly on an online forum where all you have is text. I am more sure of him than I am of anything else in my life. I know he will come to me and we will a good future together. I just felt particularly lonely today and sad that it will be taking a while longer before we can be closer. It was more of a vent of frustration - long distance is hard. Gwendolyn, I think you know this better than most!

Gwendoyln, I hope things are working out for you and your boyfriend. It sounds like you found a good guy! Keep us updated on how things are going.

Again, ladies, thank you for your words of wisdom and for your support. I''m sure I''ll feel like a million bucks again the next time I get to see him.

 

[NewEnglandLady]

I agree with the other posters, the number of times he''s set a deadline and not followed through is discouraging. The bottom line is that if he wanted to be engaged, he would propose.
I realize that sounds simplistic, but I think it''s the truth.

For the longest time my then-boyfriend, now-husband set little goals for himself. When he made $xx money, then he might be ready to propose. When we moved to xx city, then he might be ready to propose, when he had $xx saved, then he might be ready to propose. He never told me any of these goals, still, each time he reached a goal he still didn''t feel ready. I started questioning his intentions to marry and he assured me it was what he wanted, yet there was always a reason to wait.

When my internal deadline came and went, I told him I was leaving. Yet again, he asked for more time. He wanted a month, but in the end it didn''t work out. In all honesty, he wanted to want marriage, but he just wasn''t there.

Long story short, I left, he got over his fears and when he realized without any doubts that he wanted to marry me, nothing was going to stop him from proposing. Only after we were engaged did he admit that he kept pushing the proposal back because he really was not ready at all.

It''s obvious that your boyfriend isn''t ready for marriage, which puts more pressure on you to decide how long you can wait. It''s tough when they keep asking for more time, because you want to be able to wait for them, but at some point you just don''t have the energy anymore. I wish nothing but the best for you, I know how tough it is!

 

[mimzy]

I totally feel for you seeshell, i really really do

i went through over a year of "when ______ happens we''ll be engaged" and "I''m just waiting for ____________". i took those statements to heart too, when i really shouldn''t have (nobody''s fault, just different mindsets). and just like you i was so constantly disappointed that i really felt that by the time it did happen i wouldn''t even really care anymore because my spirits were so broken over it. i figured out just a little too late that even though he set those pseudo-timelines, that it was all really contingent on him being really ready.......which he wasn''t. you mentioned that he is 100% emotionally ready to get engaged - if that is the case then i would suggest busting out some excel spreadsheets and convincing him that engagement sooner than later is really in both of your best interest (mine was titled "happiness vs. stress over time") and that should take care of that. but i have to agree with the other girls that it sounds like he just isn''t in that spot yet. gwendolyn is right - there will always be "something" that could be a reason to put it off. (he needs a new job.....he needs a raise.....he wants to save for a downpayment on a house....etc)

you need to make it clear to him that engagement is at the top of your priority list - above all other reasoning that tells you it makes sense to wait. there''s nothing wrong with that! let him know that it is worth it to you to sacrifice some other things (i.e. waiting until you are in the same city) in order to move on with your relationship. because if you are this unhappy now.....how are you going to feel in a year and still being told "soon"? that kind of strain can have some very serious consequences

. there is always the option of getting engaged with the understanding that wedding planning will only begin once you two are living closer together.

 

[bee*]

I agree with the other girls in that you need to have a proper sit down with him and discuss it properly and see where he''s at. From the number of times he''s broken his promise, he''s probably not ready to do it yet, but at least if you discuss it you will know where you stand in terms of a timeline. I can see from your second post, that you''re going to wait for him to be ready anyway, so at least if you know it won''t be a year or two, you can try and put it to the back of your mind a bit. How come he''s renewing his lease and not moving down to be nearer to you if that''s what he wants? There just seems to be a lot of reasons why he''s avoiding it which would really annoy me.

 

[gwendolyn]

Date: 12/16/2007 2:56:23 AM
Author: mimzy
i would suggest busting out some excel spreadsheets and convincing him that engagement sooner than later is really in both of your best interest (mine was titled 'happiness vs. stress over time')

That is one of the most adorable things I've ever heard. I love it!!

SeeShell, I know how it can be frustrating to try to encapsulate your relationship in a couple of posts on an internet forum. There are millions of things you know better than us, so please remember to take our suggestions with (at least) a grain of salt. However, I think your first post has legit concerns in it--I think maybe they are voicing some fears you have, that he will keep saying he is ready but will keep acting like he isn't. It sounds like you haven't gotten to that point yet, but at some time the actions will come through louder than the words--it is true that if he really was ready, he would find a way. Even if he didn't expressly say, "I promise that by (insert date) we will be engaged," if you had conversations where these ideas were mentioned casually, they were still voicing his intentions which, for whatever reason, were ignored when the time came.

I posted in another thread (don't remember which one) about a friend of mine who's been with her boyfriend for 7 years, and she's wanted to get engaged for 6 of those years. She is in a different situation to you in that her boyfriend refuses to even talk about it, but he has been saying that he will buy a house (himself) and they will move out of their apartment to the house for 3 years. None of the times he said he would do this, he's found a reason not to. Although there are literally dozens of things he's both said and done to make it sound like they will never get married, she still makes excuses for him because she loves him. I keep hoping she will take a hard look at their relationship, but she is determined to stay with him. I think she is staying with him out of fear, fear of starting over, fear that if she pushes him to get engaged that he will break up with her, fear that she has wasted 7 years on someone who will never marry her. And she'd rather bide her time than stick up for herself and her wants.

I'm not trying to sound mean or harsh, but it almost sounds to me like you are making excuses for him as to why he isn't doing the things you'd like him to do. Clearly you are not ready to walk away from this relationship, like my friend, but there may come a time when you look back and see things that frighten you, give you doubts about how he really feels about you. If you get these fears, please talk to him about them. You are entitled to be happy and to have your relationship move in the direction you want it to (maybe slower than you like, but moving in the right direction; I'm not sure it sounds like it is moving that way).

Obviously you know your relationship and your boyfriend and none of us do, so please remember that we are only going on what you have told us. I don't think that's a reason to push aside our comments, though, because there's a good reason why you felt the need to tell us all about your frustrations in the first place. I hope it works out for you, and I totally feel your pain about the long-distance!!

 

[bee*]

Date: 12/16/2007 9:39:06 AM
Author: gwendolyn


I''m not trying to sound mean or harsh, but it almost sounds to me like you are making excuses for him as to why he isn''t doing the things you''d like him to do. Clearly you are not ready to walk away from this relationship, like my friend, but there may come a time when you look back and see things that frighten you, give you doubts about how he really feels about you. If you get these fears, please talk to him about them. You are entitled to be happy and to have your relationship move in the direction you want it to (maybe slower than you like, but moving in the right direction; I''m not sure it sounds like it is moving that way).


Obviously you know your relationship and your boyfriend and none of us do, so please remember that we are only going on what you have told us. I don''t think that''s a reason to push aside our comments, though, because there''s a good reason why you felt the need to tell us all about your frustrations in the first place. I hope it works out for you, and I totally feel your pain about the long-distance!!

Totally agree with this.

 

[iheartscience]

Date: 12/16/2007 9:43:56 AM
Author: bee*

Date: 12/16/2007 9:39:06 AM

Author: gwendolyn

I''m not trying to sound mean or harsh, but it almost sounds to me like you are making excuses for him as to why he isn''t doing the things you''d like him to do. Clearly you are not ready to walk away from this relationship, like my friend, but there may come a time when you look back and see things that frighten you, give you doubts about how he really feels about you. If you get these fears, please talk to him about them. You are entitled to be happy and to have your relationship move in the direction you want it to (maybe slower than you like, but moving in the right direction; I''m not sure it sounds like it is moving that way).

Obviously you know your relationship and your boyfriend and none of us do, so please remember that we are only going on what you have told us. I don''t think that''s a reason to push aside our comments, though, because there''s a good reason why you felt the need to tell us all about your frustrations in the first place. I hope it works out for you, and I totally feel your pain about the long-distance!!

Totally agree with this.

I agree with this also. It seems like he''s given you several quasi-deadlines and then just let them go by. To me, that''s worrisome. There will always be something that comes up, you know? You want to be engaged and apparently so does he. So...why aren''t you engaged, then?

I think you should have a serious conversation with your boyfriend and tell him you want to be engaged, he has given you several deadlines and let them go by, and you need to know if he is on the same page as you regarding your relationship.

 

[MoonWater]

Date: 12/15/2007 7:42:00 PM
Author:SeeShell

I know what some responses will be….

Just to enjoy this time ahead

Getting engaged isn’t a competition or race

Actually, that''s not my response at all. I find it disturbing that he kept promising a proposal to you by a specific time and keeps canceling. If my bf ever did that to me he would be knocked up the head, HARD. I wouldn''t even speak to him to be honest. Not saying this is what you should do, but you need to find out why he keeps promising and not following through. It seems as if he''s constantly looking for excuses.

 

[decodelighted]

Here''s what I want to say, but I know you won''t listen: Start Dating Other People. Right now, you''re just dating ... long distance dating. You''re NOT engaged even though you''re living as if you are. Who knows? Maybe the NEXT guy will be a better fit/more "ready" ... or maybe the fact that you SUGGEST the dating other people if he''s not ready to commit will make your current fella suddenly feel ready. I''m not saying break up -- I''m saying SHAKE UP the status quo. Take your power back. REQUIRE MORE than vague promise-ish statements to get your full attention/commitment.

So many folks end up in these long term boyfriend/girlfriend relationships without progression. I''d say out of the folks I''ve known only a very, very small percentage end up actually together. Hesitation is hesitation -- there ARE reasons for it -- though they might not be the named ones.

Good luck!

 

[tberube]

He sounds like my ex-boyfriend. Five more years from now, he''ll be telling you that you need to buy a house together first, then buy a new car, then pay off his credit cards, then his student loans, then he needs to turn 30 first, etc. etc. etc.

 

[SeeShell]

Again, thank you all for your responses. I read each one. Again, I feel that I may have described his actions harshly. It sickens me a bit to know that I have criticized the man I love with all of my heart on such a public forum. I suppose the worst comes out when I am cranky.

But, the distance is still an issue and a serious one. He had I had a talk today about the situation again. He told me that he is seriously going to move up here soon. But, he is tied to his current job for another few months...there isn''t much either of us can do about that without significant financial penalty. Some very positive things came out of our discussion today:

-We talked about life goals, and we are very much on the same page.
-He will begin looking for new jobs sooner, beginning after the holidays.
-He has told me the specifics of what type of job he is looking for (he is in a technical field - I don''t know the intricacies of it!), so I can help him find jobs or at least companies to look into.

I know that some of you think that I should be looking for greener pastures. I guess it''s the troubles of the online forum, but please understand that I don''t feel that we are at that point. There may be a time to reevaluate in the future- for instance, if summer comes around and there hasn''t been significant effort made. Or, once we are together for a few months and there is still no sign of progress toward making that commitment. Being in this relationship is 99.9% wonderful. The 0.01% will hopefully be worked out in a few months.

I realize there could be some sacrifices for me too. If he truly, honestly can''t find something at my location within 6-8 months, we can both look somewhere else.

All in all, I felt that our conversation today was productive and positive.

I''ll try to put this craziness of mine aside for the time being and give him a chance to start getting the ball rolling on moving closer to where I am.

Ladies, thanks again for your support. I believe Gwendoyln created a topic on what a strong community we have here - I second that!

Again, thanks for letting me talk about this to you!

 

[gwendolyn]

You talked to him today? Oh honey, that is wonderful! Honestly, this is all about the two of you, and as long as you are both on the same page and happy with things as they are moving at this point in time, that is great! I also think it is good to keep in the back of your head to re-evaluate things if, as you say, you get to the summer and there hasn't been much progress--it's very healthy to be prioritizing your goals like that!

 

[ladypirate]

I know how you feel on the job front.

K also works in a rather specific technical field, which has made job hunting for him really frustrating. The best thing you can do is just be as supportive and understanding as you can be, which it sounds like you are already doing.

You said that you have a fabulous job, but also mentioned looking somewhere else altogether. Do you believe that you''d be able to find something as good somewhere else? One option is to both look at jobs elsewhere and see if there''s anywhere that would have great opportunities for both of you.

It sounds like you''re off to a good start having had that talk--good luck with the job hunting!

 

[SeeShell]

Date: 12/17/2007 4:08:51 PM
Author: ladypirate
I know how you feel on the job front.


K also works in a rather specific technical field, which has made job hunting for him really frustrating. The best thing you can do is just be as supportive and understanding as you can be, which it sounds like you are already doing.


You said that you have a fabulous job, but also mentioned looking somewhere else altogether. Do you believe that you''d be able to find something as good somewhere else? One option is to both look at jobs elsewhere and see if there''s anywhere that would have great opportunities for both of you.


It sounds like you''re off to a good start having had that talk--good luck with the job hunting!

I think finding jobs together will not be an easy task. We both work in very technical fields, that unfortunately, are not related at all. Of course, the bigger cities/suburbs will probably be more likely to have both, but I''m hoping he can find something here - we both prefer a suburbs/rural life as opposed to dense suburb/city life.

Anyway, I just wanted to share some more good news!
When I got home from work today, he had already been looking for jobs! Of course, this is just a very early step, but I was just so happy that he took our talk to heart and was beginning to look NOW instead of MARCH! Also, he has been working on fixing up his resume all night.

Hooray for progress!

 

[sweetjettagirl04]

I just caught up on this now, I read the first post last night and now just read the progress.

That''s great news that you talked with him, and he is taking the initiative to be closer to you. Sometimes, all our men just need a good kick in the pants, especially if they''re as hard headed as mine. I don''t think you were being negative or critical, because I''ve had the same feeling about my relationship for different reasons. But, when it comes down to it, I can sense that you are strong in your relationship with him. Again, congrats on the progress - make sure to keep us updated!