Australians, need your help...

[TravelingGal]

OK, I have to ask (and there is a reason I am not asking TGuy)...

What is a "dummy" when it comes to sports? I''m googling it, and it seems that it has to do something with rugby or footy, but I don''t understand the articles I am reading. It''s greek to me.

Can anyone help with this weird request? I know there are a few of you around on PS....

 

[neatfreak]

Not Australian, but are you referring to the dummy-half? This is the person (but can be any person on the team) that receives the ball after it is kicked backwards after a tackle.

If that isn''t it, I''m not sure!

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 11/5/2007 7:12:11 PM
Author: neatfreak
Not Australian, but are you referring to the dummy-half? This is the person (but can be any person on the team) that receives the ball after it is kicked backwards after a tackle.

If that isn't it, I'm not sure!

Yes, I think that is what I am referring to. So this is a POSITION on a team, correct?

So would it be a derogatory thing to call an athlete, a dummy?

ETA, not sure what I mean by "position" but it's a person, or a move, right?

 

[neatfreak]

Date: 11/5/2007 7:14:57 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Date: 11/5/2007 7:12:11 PM

Author: neatfreak

Not Australian, but are you referring to the dummy-half? This is the person (but can be any person on the team) that receives the ball after it is kicked backwards after a tackle.


If that isn''t it, I''m not sure!

Yes, I think that is what I am referring to. So this is a POSITION on a team, correct?


So would it be a derogatory thing to call an athlete, a dummy?


ETA, not sure what I mean by ''position'' but it''s a person, or a move, right?

It''s a person, but not a permanent position if that makes sense. It''s kind of a temporary position, because in a game more than one person can do the "tasK'' that gets them assigned the name.

As far as I know it isn''t derogatory...but I am sure no rugby expert! The only thing I can think of is that the hooker often does this role nowadays...could taht have something to do with it?

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 11/5/2007 7:21:22 PM
Author: neatfreak

Date: 11/5/2007 7:14:57 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Date: 11/5/2007 7:12:11 PM

Author: neatfreak

Not Australian, but are you referring to the dummy-half? This is the person (but can be any person on the team) that receives the ball after it is kicked backwards after a tackle.


If that isn''t it, I''m not sure!

Yes, I think that is what I am referring to. So this is a POSITION on a team, correct?


So would it be a derogatory thing to call an athlete, a dummy?


ETA, not sure what I mean by ''position'' but it''s a person, or a move, right?

It''s a person, but not a permanent position if that makes sense. It''s kind of a temporary position, because in a game more than one person can do the ''tasK'' that gets them assigned the name.

As far as I know it isn''t derogatory...but I am sure no rugby expert! The only thing I can think of is that the hooker often does this role nowadays...could taht have something to do with it?

Hookers, dummies! No wonder TGuy can''t communicate with people around here.

OK, so here''s the question, and neatfreak, I''m imagining that the Aussies are going to have to chime in here. Is there any reason why you would call a black athlete in this (or any other) sport, a dummy?

 

[neatfreak]

No idea on that one Tgal! Sorry! All I can help with is the rugby terms...

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 11/5/2007 7:26:37 PM
Author: neatfreak
No idea on that one Tgal! Sorry! All I can help with is the rugby terms...

Thanks neatfreak...that helped quite a bit. I''m trying to get to the bottom of a mystery here...

 

[TravelingGal]

Hm. OK, I''m still sitting here thinking. Would you call a dummy someone who is in the "back"? i.e. a "back athlete?"

I''m reaching for straws here...

 

[Munchkin]

It has been many a year since I've played rugby, and I played in the States, so I don't know if our terms are different...

It makes sense that a dummy half would be a back. When I played we broke down the players on the team into catagories (if you will)

The "pack" was made up by the women who were in the scrum (the big pushing mass of bodies inside of which a ball was being fought over.)

The "backs" stood outside the the pack awaiting a pass from the scrum half (the person who tries to pick up the ball as soon as someone in the pack kicks it free of the mass of bodies - akin to a quarterback in american football) The backs were the players who were most likely to run the field passing the ball back and forth to score. If the other team got the ball out of the scrum, the backs would tackle or "pull down" the runner.

I wonder if the Aussie term "dummy" half is a synonym for our "scrum half?" A scrum half is definitely considered a "back" rather than a part of the "pack."

I hope I haven't confused you!

ETA: I just ran a quick google search. It appears that a "dummy half" is neither a specific person nor position. Rather, it is a term for any player who picks up a ball from a tackled teammate to keep it in play. The dummy half then passes off the ball. I suppose it could be referred to as a back.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 11/5/2007 9:48:05 PM
Author: Munchkin
It has been many a year since I've played rugby, and I played in the States, so I don't know if our terms are different...

It makes sense that a dummy half would be a back. When I played we broke down the players on the team into catagories (if you will)

The 'pack' was made up by the women who were in the scrum (the big pushing mass of bodies inside of which a ball was being fought over.)

The 'backs' stood outside the the pack awaiting a pass from the scrum half (the person who tries to pick up the ball as soon as someone in the pack kicks it free of the mass of bodies - akin to a quarterback in american football) The backs were the players who were most likely to run the field passing the ball back and forth to score. If the other team got the ball out of the scrum, the backs would tackle or 'pull down' the runner.

I wonder if the Aussie term 'dummy' half is a synonym for our 'scrum half?' A scrum half is definitely considered a 'back' rather than a part of the 'pack.'

I hope I haven't confused you!

ETA: I just ran a quick google search. It appears that a 'dummy half' is neither a specific person nor position. Rather, it is a term for any player who picks up a ball from a tackled teammate to keep it in play. The dummy half then passes off the ball. I suppose it could be referred to as a back.

Thanks Munchkin.

Honestly, if that we the case, the mystery that happened would make sense...if not be downright funny.

TGuy was invited to a football game by my best friend's husband a couple of weeks ago. They live up north and have season raider tickets. Let's call him M.

M's best friend also has season tickets (let's call him J). J invited a friend, and let's call him T.

M is Korean. T is half black and white. J is black. And of course TGuy is a white Australian. So a black guy, a half black guy, an asian guy and a TGuy all go up a Raiders Game...(sounds like a bad joke already).

During the game, TGuy shouts repeatedly to certain players "Go you dummy!" T notices this and asks, why are you calling him a dummy? TGuy simply says, "Oh, that's what we call black athletes in Australia."

T is shocked. He's half black but LOOKS white and believes that TGuy is saying this because he thinks T is white. T later tells J that TGuy said this. J thinks it's weird but shrugs it off.

Soon, J notices TGuy is again shouting the dummy line. He asks the loaded question, "why are you calling him a dummy?" J thinks that since J is obviously black, TGuy will backtrack and make up some non-racial comment. TGuy simply says again "That's what we call black athletes in Australia."

J is surprised that TGuy would be so frank and say the same answer nonchalantly. He's offended, but chalks it up to cultural differences between the countries.
It's not until my friend calls me today to tell me what happened (she just found out) that I get wind of this. She is concerned and has defended TGuy and says he is not malicious like that. Even IF there was a reason for calling someone a dummy (which they assume meant "stupid") she thinks it's best for me to tell TGuy so he doesn't get killed around L.A. for saying something stupid.

I know my husband, and I know he wouldn't insult someone with a horrible comment like that. He's not racist, or he wouldn't have married me! I am thinking it HAD to be some kind of misunderstanding...especially since he had no problem saying what he did to J. So I started digging around to see if "dummy" had to do with any kind of Australian sport, and I think I'm onto something. And WHAT IF, he said "back athlete" and was misunderstood? His accent is misunderstood here all the time, poor guy. I'm trying to understand how this would correlate to American Football.

Today is TGuy's first day on the job and I know he's tired and a bit stressed about the new gig, so I don't want to ask him about all this. Especially *if* there was some kind of horrible meaning in what he said, but he was too inebriated to notice who he was talking to.

So there's the reason for the weirdo line of questioning....

 

[nomissjane]

Hi from an Aussie, ''down under''.....

I grew up in a veeerrryyyy rugby oriented town, both Rugby League and Rugby Union....there is a position called ''Dummy Half'' and there is a play known as the ''Dummy Pass''....but I have never heard anyone or known of anyone referring to a ''black player'' by any nickname or colloquial term, let alone ''dummy''.

A quick explanation of a Dummy Pass is.....

STEP ONE
Run towards the defender holding the ball in both hands.
Look towards the person you are feigning the pass to and make the passing motion - but do not release the ball.
Again, timing is important if you are going to sell the dummy pass to the defender.
STEP TWO
The defender will be drawn to your team-mate - the target of the intended "pass".
Take advantage of this by drawing the ball back into your chest and accelerate into the space created.
STEP THREE
Sprint into the space you have just created.
Keep looking around for any players in support who are in a better position than you are.

I think your going to have to ask him, it may turn out that it''s a saying that''s particular to the school he went to or team he played with....but there''s probably a very silly and very funny explanation to it.

 

[TravelingGal]

Thanks nomissjane! Yes, I will ask him, but he is busy studying for his new job at the moment, and one thing I have learned in my short marriage is that there is a time and a place. Your explanation helped a lot. I'm pretty curious as to what this hubbub is really about.

ETA, it does sound like something you could do in American football....

 

[nomissjane]

I''ve just reread your last post TGal and I think that your on to something.... I have a feeling that he has said ''Back Athlete''....cause ultimately that''s what it is....and that your friends haven''t understood his accent.

I know that the last few times that I''ve been to the US or had US friends out here, people have sometimes found it tricky to work out my accent....

 

[iwannaprettyone]

Sounds like the equivelent of a running back and the dummy part being a capable of a fake?

 

[katebar]

Tgal I just posted a reply and it did'nt send urg!!!
Anyhoo I'm frrom Adelaide like Tguy and have never ever heard this used. We play Aussie rules down there but up here in Queensland dummy is used in rugby as others have said to refer to a postion/player tactic thing (you can see how thrilled i am about rugby ha ha).
I too think it may have been a accent thing back/black.
I will ask some of my Adelaide friends who are members of the Stobie Club which are expat groups for SA people. SA' s has a very vernaculartype of speech hence the name of the club Stobie. This refers to the power poles which in SA are called stobie and are made of concrete and steel and kill people when you hit them! No other state in Australia has them (ask Tguy about them for a giggle).

 

[TravelingGal]

Thanks ladies...I did talk to TGuy and it was a horrible, horrible misunderstanding. I'll post more about it later, as I have to actually write a my friend a letter explaining the whole thing. As good as my theory was, it had nothing to do with dummy halves, passes, back athletes or what not.

I appreciate you all trying to help me solve the mystery! I'll be back with the resolution as soon as I get this letter written this week!

ETA Katebar, I already know about stobie poles! TGuy's friend did a great job of painting theirs!