B&M (Tiffany) vs PS Vendor... BUT for an Aussie, and in context of declining FX rate

[sydney80]

Ok, I've been umming and aahing for a while now but I'd like to propose to my girlfriend this summer (Aussie summer, that is) and for that I need an e-ring! Thanks to PS I'm pretty well versed and would like to open up my buying plans for comment. I'm the kind of consumer that over-analyses - but there are probably things I've missed. All two cents welcome...

To start off:
- My budget is around AUD $15k total (diamond, ring, taxes). This equates to ~USD $10k
- I'm after a RB, best possible cut, G-H colour, VS2-SI1 as long as eyeclean, ~1.0-1.3 carat on a platinum setting

A little history:
So I was all ready to go with a WF ACA a few months ago - and damn I'm wishing I had taken the plunge. I could have got the diamond and ring I was after, but I procrastinated... I guess hindsight is 20/20. Back then our dollar was worth 95 US Cents - today it's more like 65 cents (and may decrease further as a 75-100 point interest rate cut is on the cards for next week, slowing demand for Aussie resources, etc etc)

Today, the incentive to buy online from a PS Vendor has been greatly reduced as the gap between buying from WF, GoG etc and buying at a B&M from Sydney is now relatively small, at least compared to what it was 4 months ago.

Here's how I see the pros and cons:

U.S PS Vendor (WF, GoG etc)
Pros:
- Best diamond money can buy
- Highly regarded jewellers for product, service etc
- Excellent diamond information
- Lifetime upgrade, but this isn't really important to me
Cons:
- Have to purchase sight unseen (physical sight, that is)
- Have to pay additional ~16.5% tax to bring into Australia (10% GST, 5% Customs Duty)
- Unsecure payment methods, inherent risk in purchasing online (Many don't accept o/s credit cards, though Paypal is a work around - but then I pay an additional fee)
- Could be issues if i choose the wrong ring size - will have to ship back o/s or pay additional for a local jeweler to rework.
- The setting will be a replica, and I prefer original design in most instances (I'd be after the Tiffany style 6-prong)

Working backwards, AUD $15,000 equals US $10k. Minusing GST and Customs Duty, I'm left with around US$8k. Minus $1k for a decent setting, and I'm looking for a diamond at the $7k mark. This would get me around a 1 carat H/VS2 ACA from WF. eg.
http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-1466986.htm


Aussie B&M (probably Tiffany)
Pros:
- the brand, the box etc
- Can re-size, service without a hassle (I believe free?)
- Can see the ring before purchase
- Can pay with credit card - secure, plus points will equate to $200 gift voucher
- Can claim 10% off due to the Tourist Refund Scheme (I always have friends/family heading o/s)
- quite a few friends are now engaged but as far as I know none have a Tiffany ring
Cons:
- Expensive for the diamond you get

From what I can tell - $16,500 at Tiffany (remember I can minus 10% tax) will get me a 1 carat RB. I can't quite remember the specs, as the last time I went in was a while ago. But I believe it would be an ideal cut, with decent colour, clarity and set in the classic Tiffany platinum setting


So are there any holes in my analysis? As mentioned, when our dollar was worth 95 cents, a PS vendor would've been a no-brainer. At 80 cents - incentive would still have been strong. But at 65 cents - The B&M's in Australia are looking much more attractive, and our dollar isn't likely to rise significantly in the next 6 months.

Ps - I have viewed other options in Australia both online (Jogia - not much stock of Crossfire diamonds over 1 carat, Diamond exchange - not a great cost saving) and B&M's (Holloway diamonds - not in my city, plus they look to be about the same price as Tiffany without the brand cachet (no offense), Cartier Sydney didn't have much stock)... but when it comes down to it - if I'm buying from a store, it might as well be Tiffanys.

 

[MissDimity]

Hey I''m an Aussie too how come you can get 10% back with tax?

If you are talking about doing this thru customs as part of the Tourist Refund Scheme note the limit on goods from which you can get tax back is $900 if you are returning to Australia. So if it''s more than this (which it definately is) you are expected to pay gst for the good''s at customs on your return back into Australia.

 

[katebar]

Sydney 80 waht about Canturi jewellers. They get rave reviews and you may get more banng for your buck without the Tiffany hype.
Also Cerrone jewellers did Laura Bingle/Michael Clark kick ars**** 5 ct pear that looks amazing too

 

[arjunajane]

There are other options than Tiff''s. I am also Australian and feel your pain re the exchange rate

Are you actually in Sydney? After wk today I can post some options for you, I have a great book at home with all the premium Aussie jewellers/designers.

Please post some description or pics of what setting style you''re after (design, metal etc) and also your ct, colour etc preferences..?

The other good thing about WF, GOG is the lifetime upgrade policies - I don''t think many places here have caught onto this concept yet.

 

[neatfreak]

Instead of doing general analysis I would email WF/GOG and Tiffany''s and find out exactly how much diamond your budget will buy you at today''s rate. Then, whichever place can give you the better diamond is where I would buy personally.

 

[sydney80]

Hey guys,

Thanks for the quick replies. In response:

Hey I'm an Aussie too how come you can get 10% back with tax?

If you are talking about doing this thru customs as part of the Tourist Refund Scheme note the limit on goods from which you can get tax back is $900 if you are returning to Australia. So if it's more than this (which it definately is) you are expected to pay gst for the good's at customs on your return back into Australia.


Strictly speaking, yes... but if someone wears the ring back, and mails the packaging...


Sydney 80 waht about Canturi jewellers. They get rave reviews and you may get more banng for your buck without the Tiffany hype.
Also Cerrone jewellers did Laura Bingle/Michael Clark kick ars**** 5 ct pear that looks amazing too


I have visited Canturi and Cerrone - but their prices are quite similar to Tiffany and I figure if you're going to spend that kind of money at a B&M - you might as well go for the brand thats best known.


There are other options than Tiff's. I am also Australian and feel your pain re the exchange rate

Are you actually in Sydney? After wk today I can post some options for you, I have a great book at home with all the premium Aussie jewellers/designers.

Please post some description or pics of what setting style you're after (design, metal etc) and also your ct, colour etc preferences..?

The other good thing about WF, GOG is the lifetime upgrade policies - I don't think many places here have caught onto this concept yet.


Yep, its a pain isn't it? And everyone predicting further falls - today BNP Paribas are guesstimating a drop to 47c by mid next year. Oh and I am in Sydney. As for:
Design: I really do like the classic 6 prong Tiffany setting
Metal: Platinum
Cut, colour etc - In my original post, about 7 lines down
Overall: A classic, elegant piece
With regard to lifetime upgrade policy - this isn't too important to me as we're both quite sentimental, and I don't envision my girlfriend ever wanting to upgrade our engagement ring. I'm sure she'll be wishing for a new necklace or something instead!


Instead of doing general analysis I would email WF/GOG and Tiffany's and find out exactly how much diamond your budget will buy you at today's rate. Then, whichever place can give you the better diamond is where I would buy personally.


I have contacted both WF and GoG previously and the $7k for the diamond is about as accurate as you can get as our dollar fluctuates by about 5-10% week on week. A diamond from WF/GoG will still be better on paper - but there are other factors to consider as well when purchasing from halfway around the world.


Thanks all

 

[kat6]

Date: 11/26/2008 9:16:42 PM
Author: sydney80


Sydney 80 waht about Canturi jewellers. They get rave reviews and you may get more banng for your buck without the Tiffany hype.

Also Cerrone jewellers did Laura Bingle/Michael Clark kick ars**** 5 ct pear that looks amazing too



I have visited Canturi and Cerrone - but their prices are quite similar to Tiffany and I figure if you''re going to spend that kind of money at a B&M - you might as well go for the brand thats best known.

I wouldn''t decide based on brand, I''d make my choice based on style. I loved Cerrone''s rings - mine will be custom but it''s based on one of their designs. I (and my boyfriend as well) much preferred Cerrone''s selection to Tiffany''s. I may be the only person who has ever hated the way the Tiffany setting looked on her hand.

 

[arjunajane]

sydney,
There is a vendor in Perth (where I am) called Jogia Diamonds. We have had a number of Aussie mbrs purchase from them just recently and be very happy.
They have access to mostly the same databases as the US vendors and can call diamonds in, they also have their own branded name of H&A rounds - I think they're called Crossfire.

If it were me, that would be my choice if buying in Australia. I purchased from GOG (diamond) and WF (setting), and couldn't be happier with both product and service. But as you say, this was earlier in the year when the rate was ~95c (boy am I glad we bought then!

)..

I agree with NF to research who has what in your needs, but I belive Jogia also does quite a nice Tiff replica setting - best of all they are competitive with diamons pricing. You will no doubt get a larger stone than if you go to Tiff's (and quite possibly a better cut one).

You can do a search here for ppl's threads about them, Mr Jogia is also a mbr and occasionally posts in RT, and here is their site.

I could still tell you the names of a nbr of upper-class jewellers in sydney, but imho if you aren't after anything really different in the setting, best to just buy a high quality stock replica, no need to pay through the nose to reinvent the wheel, KWIM..?

hope that helps a bit

ETA: here is a recent thread where a mbr Haklin purchased from Jogia last mth and was very happy - although warning, it quickly degenerates into somewhat of an Aussie PS mbr party, lol !

 

[kmci]

We bought my diamond from Jogia (got a GREAT price for it I might add), as I wanted to see it before I bought, they sent it to an appraiser in Sydney (for a small price) and after we bought it, got it set at a jeweller that both Mr Jogia and the appraiser recommended. I can''t praise any of these people highly enough.

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 11/27/2008 6:11:24 AM
Author: kmci
We bought my diamond from Jogia (got a GREAT price for it I might add), as I wanted to see it before I bought, they sent it to an appraiser in Sydney (for a small price) and after we bought it, got it set at a jeweller that both Mr Jogia and the appraiser recommended. I can''t praise any of these people highly enough.

Thats right, I knew there was another Aussie very recently,my apologies I didn''t remember kmci !

 

[LaraOnline]

This is a subject close to my heart as well. I am interested in the concept of Jogia diamonds, particularly as I also am based in the West, but online I find their ring designs a bit too ... chunky for me. I feel confused. Perhaps I should see them in person...
I can remember the day - nay, the moment - I found out the Australian dollar had fallen through the floor.

 

[honey22]

I''m an Aussie too, bought from WF at 68 cents in the dollar so didn''t do too badly. But, I wouldn''t go the Tiff route, you are not guaranteed a well cut stone there, you can do better without the massive pricetag.

I don''t mean to offend here, but if you are going to drop $15k, it''s probably worth it to spend $200 dollars on a return flight to Melbourne to check out Garry Holloways store. I am sure they could give you ballpark prices over the phone if you explain your situation. I have been there before and I am telling you, they are not as expensive as Tiffany''s, no way! If you give Gary a call and explain that you would like an idea of pricerange and availability before you get on a plane, if he can''t do that, then you can look elsewhere.

I would also suggest you give Jogia diamonds a call and give them your budget and requirements, they may have crossfire stones available that aren''t on the site yet.

Then, if both those avenues fail, you can start looking OS. Yes, you will get a stunning ring from GOG or WF but do you want to pay the exchange rate at the moment? I did, because I wanted an ACA and I didn''t want to settle. But, you may find that you can get a killer stone (Gary knows his stuff) at a good price. His prices may be a bit more, but if you take into account the exchange rate and taxes (+ flight to melbourne) it may be around the same amount.

Please don''t pay for the blue box - it''s just too expensive!

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 11/27/2008 8:28:15 AM
Author: LaraOnline
This is a subject close to my heart as well. I am interested in the concept of Jogia diamonds, particularly as I also am based in the West, but online I find their ring designs a bit too ... chunky for me. I feel confused. Perhaps I should see them in person...
I can remember the day - nay, the moment - I found out the Australian dollar had fallen through the floor.

Really Lara?me too!
I won''t be bad and ask what suburb, but would you care to divulge the general area..? We could be neighbours and not even know it yet!

 

[sydney80]

Thanks everyone!

I''ll give Jogia and Holloway diamonds another chance to see if they have anything interesting.

On another note - does anyone know if local diamond prices have increased over the last 6 months to reflect our weakened dollar? Or do the retailers generally absorb some of the cost?

 

[LaraOnline]

Hi arjuna! I live down south, near Bunners.
I have my heart set on the WF laureato half-round...and nothing else seems to measure up, unfortunately!

linky to picture

I was hoping to go shopping at around this time, for delivery in Jan, but my husband cooled me down ... and then bought me a lovely new house, so I can't complain. We're still unpacking, I'm so happy.

Looks like the diamond is off the menu until maybe next year. He told me he'd get me one for our NEXT anniversary... (6th) also it will be the anni following the birth of our third (and 'hopefully' lol final) child...
I did have my heart set on for the fifth - somehow the number of the anni was important, but oh well who cares.

When he sees the cost of what I have in mind, perhaps he'll beg off until the 10th anyway.

 

[LaraOnline]

On topic, I feel Canturi has a very expensive, sexy, modern and cool image, I would adore getting something from there!!
In fact, I would prefer it to Tiffanys, as it seems more sophisticated. But of course, that is just my opinion!
Katebar''s other suggestion of Cerrone, and your original idea of going through Cartier (if they do turn out to have what you want) also sounded very exciting, and in no way inferior to the Tiffany brand!!

 

[Deelight]

Date: 11/28/2008 1:09:11 AM
Author: LaraOnline
On topic, I feel Canturi has a very expensive, sexy, modern and cool image, I would adore getting something from there!!

In fact, I would prefer it to Tiffanys, as it seems more sophisticated. But of course, that is just my opinion!

Katebar''s other suggestion of Cerrone, and your original idea of going through Cartier (if they do turn out to have what you want) also sounded very exciting, and in no way inferior to the Tiffany brand!!

I originally looked at Canturi and I am sure they were cheaper slightly then Tiffs, the service was good and their Gothic design is beautiful. I believe as well they will custom design rings for you as well.

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 11/28/2008 12:38:18 AM
Author: sydney80
Thanks everyone!

I''ll give Jogia and Holloway diamonds another chance to see if they have anything interesting.

On another note - does anyone know if local diamond prices have increased over the last 6 months to reflect our weakened dollar? Or do the retailers generally absorb some of the cost?

Sydney, that is a whole ''nother kettle of fish, as basically prices of current stock may or may not be increased to cover the cost of replacing it with new stock. The policies will also differ between vendors too. I''m not sure how it ties into the strength of the dollar (not a great economic mind here
This has been discussed abit on RT if you feel like searching, and was explained alot more elegantly than I by the experts, lol..


Essentially though, if you think about it, its not really relevant to the consumer - if they''ve increased, tough there''s not much you can do.

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 11/28/2008 1:03:42 AM
Author: LaraOnline

Hi arjuna! I live down south, near Bunners.
I have my heart set on the WF laureato half-round...and nothing else seems to measure up, unfortunately!

linky to picture

I was hoping to go shopping at around this time, for delivery in Jan, but my husband cooled me down ... and then bought me a lovely new house, so I can''t complain. We''re still unpacking, I''m so happy.

Looks like the diamond is off the menu until maybe next year. He told me he''d get me one for our NEXT anniversary... (6th) also it will be the anni following the birth of our third (and ''hopefully'' lol final) child...
I did have my heart set on for the fifth - somehow the number of the anni was important, but oh well who cares.

When he sees the cost of what I have in mind, perhaps he''ll beg off until the 10th anyway.

Hey Lara,

oooo how exciting (and a lil excruciating), you must be busting to start shopping for your ring.!

Thats a gorgeous setting from WF - although if you''re anything like me you may change your mind ten times before the real deal, lol!

You''re right though, who can complain about a new house, I hope you guys are enjoying it there.