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Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigger!!!

N

nforster

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 10, 2013
Messages
5
I have been stalking these boards for a while now and finally worked up the courage to post. I hope that this post isn't too wordy or annying... I am no good at this sort of thing. Anyway, I am looking for a round, blue sapphire for an engagement ring.

I read the colored stone FYI by LD (which was awesome and taught me pretty much everything I know about sapphires, though I still feel like I am a bit clueless), and originally was looking to buy the sapphire from the jewelry store that I was going to buy the setting from, but was super disappointed with what they had to offer, and they are considered to be a quality jewelry store here in Atlanta. The only stone they offered that was halfway nice was priced at about $8,000, and wasn't a huge stone (6.6 mm). I would post a picture of it, but I think that would involve me signing up for some picture hosting site.

Anyway, I moved on to the web vendors...
gemsny - seemed pretty awesome at first until I learned a little about sapphires and realized they aren't cut well and apparently don't have a good rep with gem aficionados
brilliantearth - I really like their motto and they seem to be ethical, but they are a little too cookie cutter and don't show the individual gems
thenaturalsapphirecompany - I know nothing about gems, and knew even less then, and even I could tell their cuts are bad
angara - don't see the actual gem, and they have some bad reviews out there
and a couple others...

Then I found this site and learned a bit more about sapphires and found gemfix and a couple other recommend vendors that you guys have. I really like gemfix, and I think I screwed myself by not pulling the trigger sooner on the stone that I really liked, and it wound up getting sold. I was waiting on purchasing the sapphire because when I told my jeweler that I was going to buy the stone elsewhere, I was no longer going to get a "discount" on the setting. In addition to that, the setting that my fiance liked was only offered in white gold, and we wanted platinum, so the manufacturer would have to custom make it, bringing the price just too high for the setting. So I was waiting because I was shopping around for a better price on the setting so I could fit the whole purchase into my budget. I should have just bought the sapphire!
Currently it is the first stone on the page of this link: http://www.gemfix.com/sapphire_blue.html - sapphire_blue_1145). Anyway, that is pretty much the color that i am looking for.

To sum it up, here are the details on the ideal stone I would like to get:

Color - what you see in the link above
Cut - I really feel like the gemfix cut is among the best I have seen - I don't really know anything about cut, but their stones seem to sparkle
Size - 7mm to 7.5mm (the one in the link is 6.8mm, but I was willing to make a concession their due to the color)
Price range - $3,000 to $4,500 (though I really wanted to keep it under $4,000)

Anyway, I don't see anything on their site that I like as much as the one I should have bought, but I was hoping that someone here may have some direction for me. I have been scouring the internet for the last 2 months, and I finally found the one I wanted and didn't pull the trigger! Any help would be so much appreciated!!!
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

call them.
tell them if the sale falls through you'll buy it.
ask them if they have anything "in the vault" that is not on the website that is the "equivalent" of the stone you missed out on.

you are not the first to find out that stones just don't wait around to be purchased. many of us have lost out. i still bemoan the fact that i lost out on a rather large and lovely amethyst some years back. sigh.

oh, and Welcome! glad you found pricescope! lots of good info here.
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

Thanks for the responses. Movie Zombie, I have let gemfix know I want it. I was actually in contact with them about buying it but told them I had to wait to get a better price on the setting. I actually made them a slightly lower ($3500) offer to try to offset the increase in price of the setting, but I suppose they don't accept offers because they never responded back to me, I just checked a couple days later on their website and it was pending sale.

Niel, I checked the link you gave... there are definitely some nice sapphires, but I am not sure I found any that fit what I am looking for.

This one (http://www.mastercutgems.com/viewgem.php?gemid=6916&id=26210) seems ok, though it is a bit larger than what I want, but it seems the cut is pretty off in the side cut. Does this matter? These are the things I don't really understand. Also I have a hard time looking at a stone a being able to tell if it has windows or other issues.

This one (http://www.mastercutgems.com/viewgem.php?gemid=6918&id=26228)is probably my fav on that page, but it is too large and def out of my price range.

This one (http://www.mastercutgems.com/viewgem.php?gemid=6916&id=26209) seems pretty decent, but I noticed it is off in the measurements (.11mm off). Does this matter? Also, is Mastercuts a good name?

Thanks,

Nick
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

gemfix is NOT eBay!
it wouldn't even cross my mind to "offer" less......they have a showroom and office in San Diego and therefore have store expenses.

you have your budget. you can find a stone in that budget.
stating the obvious and perhaps rudely: that you need to offset the price of the stone to offset the price of the setting is, well, your problem not a vendor's.
you are correct to look at stones that are less expensive.
and you will find something in that budget.

personally, and this is only for me, the stone is the star of the show. a setting not so much. one can always have the stone reset at a later date. but getting the right stone as you found out is the hard part.

you are smart to be looking now! as the holidays approach there will be a lot more competition for sapphires.....and it may happen that the one you want may get sold out from you once again. we see it here on pricescope every holiday season.....heck, it even happens to us as well. the good news is that you really do know what color you want. some don't have a clue.

rwwise.com is going out of business and may still have some sapphires.
everything is 1/2 off listed price. however, his last day is October 13.

and I can't blame your jeweler for deciding the setting would be more if you were to source your own stone.....he too has a storefront and has to pay the rent. there are some jewelers that won't do the work unless they source the stone themselves.

oh, and I just thought of palagems.com
you'll have to go through a jeweler.
definitely high end quality color stones.
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

Personally, I don't see anything posted so far that rivals the stone you saw at Gemfix. Unfortunately, these sapphires are not precision cut and they do not rival the GF stone in terms of saturation. Neither of the specific MC stones suggested by other posters would make my short list. The first is lacking in saturation and appears darker in tone. The second, the one the poster indicated might be silky, looks almost opaque and will lack sparkle. In addition, as you can see from the profile shot, the crown is quite flat. Its a deep stone, which means you are paying for weight that you don't see.

I agree with MoZo that the best thing to do is to start a dialogue with GF as they have a huge inventory and many more stones that are not on their website. I would also contact Roger Dery of Spectral Gems as he specializes in sapphires. Lisa Elser, Custom Cut Gems, has some great rough from her regular trips to Africa so it is worth contacting her regarding her sapphire inventory (though be advised that she is in Canada).

I think you have a good eye when it comes to color, as it appears from the pics that the sapphire you chose has a lovely hue and excellent saturation. The one thing I have heard, however, is that sometimes their stones are darker in hand than they are in their photos; their recent addition of hand shots seems to have helped this problem.
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

Unread post by movie zombie » 10 Oct 2013 21:07
gemfix is NOT eBay!
it wouldn't even cross my mind to "offer" less......they have a showroom and office in San Diego and therefore have store expenses.
Click to expand...

This is not my experience at all. I've heard tell of people on this board successfully haggling with Gary Braun and Dana Reynolds and the Natural Sapphire Company specifically, and I've made lower offers to some non-ebay recommended vendors that have been accepted, and I see absolutely no reason why you couldn't make a lower offer to gemfix. They can say "no" or say that all prices are final, but I see no harm in politely making an offer. I'm sure people make them lower offers all the time, and I'd be pretty confident that they accept those offers sometimes, particularly with respect to inventory that's been sitting around for a while. So I wouldn't be worried that you did anything wrong in your dealings (except that you hesitated and someone bought it from under you at full price. I'm very sorry about that.)

I think the one Niel posted is the only one that is even somewhat close to as good a color as the one you missed out on. And its unheated, which I prefer. It is sleepy which will mean it will be somewhat more "glowy" looking than "sparkly," but I love that glowy look, and so do many sapphire connoisseurs. Also its sleepy quality might mean it will hold color better in low light. I would check it out were I in your shoes, especially if you didn't want to spend several more months looking. Dana Reynolds of Mastercutgems is a very nice guy, and in my experience, very trustworthy in his assessment. And he has a 10-day return policy.
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

I should add that Minou's and MZ's advice is always great, and I would of course get on a waiting list for that exceptional gemfix stone. But also be aware that finding a stone of equivalent quality will likely take many months, and that's not always a luxury everyone has. And settling for a beautiful sapphire, albeit not an absolutely immaculate specimen, would still hardly be settling. Okay, off my soapbox. Best of luck.
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

corundum_conundrum|1381474036|3535746 said:
I should add that Minou's and MZ's advice is always great, and I would of course get on a waiting list for that exceptional gemfix stone. But also be aware that finding a stone of equivalent quality will likely take many months, and that's not always a luxury everyone has. And settling for a beautiful sapphire, albeit not an absolutely immaculate specimen, would still hardly be settling. Okay, off my soapbox. Best of luck.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I didn't want to say it, but I'm afraid I have to agree with CC - not that I mind agreeing with CC ( :lol: ), just that its depressing news.

But then I thought of another source who has been posting many sapphires lately. I don't know if this video is accurate for color, but if it is, this latest batch is truly of stunning color: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFZFX-8PRV4&feature=youtu.be If you are interested, I would ask him if he has any rounds or whether he has any more rough from which he can cut one, and then ask here if anyone has bought sapphires from him and whether they were satisfied. Good luck!
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

I see why you are upset about missing out on that Gemfix Sapphire, goodness gracious. :eek:
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

GregS|1381500109|3535809 said:
I see why you are upset about missing out on that Gemfix Sapphire, goodness gracious. :eek:
Click to expand...

amen to that! for being new to color stones the OP sure has a good eye!
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

Thanks for all the responses... though I feel like even an even bigger jack ass for letting that sapphire slip through my fingers after GregS and MZ's last post! I really didn't realize until maybe right now (after reading corundum conundrum's post) how rare a truly beautiful blue sapphire of the quality of the one I was looking at from GF really was, and that it might be months before I see something similar again. AHHHHHHH!!!!!

MZ, I am a self admitted noob when it comes to purchasing colored stones, but I have purchased highish dollar jewelry before (I was previously engaged years ago) and paid $2,500 less than the asking price, and this isn't from "Ebay" type stores, but rather high quality jewelry stores (and I am not talking about Kay's or one of the other chains). I understand that you won't get a discount when buying a $300 pair of earrings, but when purchasing an $8,000 to $10,000+ piece of jewelry, it never crossed my mind not to make an offer. I realize that purchasing though GF, I am buying the stone only, which cuts that in half, but I don't feel my offer was insulting (offered $3,500 on a stone that was listed at $4,200). It sounds like I may have been wrong in my assumption that I could make an offer, but based on my previous experience and knowledge, I believed this to be common practice. I also have never paid list price for a car. I will of course defer to you and others on this site when it comes to purchasing colored stones, as you have much far more knowledge than I in this area, but in no way did I mean to be rude or lack class. Also, I have no problem with the jewelry store or GF making a profit, it is how they stay in business. However, as a consumer, I have to protect myself from overpaying.

Thanks for the links to Pala and rwwise. Rwwise has some beautiful gems, but none that are the size I am looking for are currently left. I wish I would have looked there earlier. In particular there is a really nice cushion cut that was sold, but unfortunately we are looking for a round stone. I will have to look further into Pala.

Niel, that sapphire (http://www.mastercutgems.com/preview.php?cat=301&id=7042) you last sent is very nice, but I think it is out of my price range and we really are looking for a round cut.

minousbijoux, that sapphire in the youtube clip really did have a nice color. I will see about contacting him to see if he has anything in the size and shape I am looking for.

Regarding my eye for color, I am actually a bit color blind (mostly reds and greens, though purples give me issues as well), but blue has been the one color that I have been able to see well, which may be why I gravitated towards blue sapphires. I wouldn't say I have a good eye for color but rather, blue is a color that I can actually see vividly. My only concern is sometimes I have an issue being able to tell if a blue has traces of purple in it, and I really wanted to try to get a stone that is blue only (if possible).

Thanks again for all the responses!
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

hey, it is all part of learning!
there will be another.
might take time to find it but you'll find "it".

you certainly have experience with shopping and I do think that some vendors are more open to negotiating than others.
and i'm also going to bet that some stones have wiggle room and other just do not. and if they had two people interested in that stone, well, they're going to go with the one willing to pay the asking price.

sometimes I find its better to ask if there is wiggle room before I proceed. like you I never pay full price for a car but then I also usually buy used from a private party!

do not underestimate your "eye". perhaps in this instance your color blindness is your friend?!

I would contact gemfix again, this time by phone.
state that you realize there is much competition for stones of quality.
give them your budget.
i'd be willing to go to a smaller size rather than give up quality!
if they had one such stone they may have another or may have one again.

also, if you're not in a hurry, time is your friend.
additionally, the holy grail of color stone get togethers is in Tucson in February.
you could get a vendor that you trust to shop for you there.

again, you're eye re blue sapphires is amazing!
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

Prices of gemstones have gone up across the board, with blue sapphire prices almost double of what it was 5 years ago. This is why you cannot compare the GF sapphire price to what you saw at a B&M store years ago.
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

Both of those look really nice. What is the deal with concave cutting? It it just what it sounds like?
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

No, the stone isn't concave at all. The outline of the gem looks the same as a traditional faceted stone, only that the facet pattern is different. They also don't flash and sparkle the way one is used to seeing; some describe it as shimmering or static.
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

Chrono hit the nail on the head. It boils down to personal taste on what particular faceting subtype one prefers. My personal bias is that I think concave faceting is nice in darker toned stones that don't have much in the way of dispersion. I feel the concave faceting brings life to a dark stone edge to edge. However, in lighter toned stones-or stones with great dispersive properties; I prefer a more traditional faceting approach to accentuate the bright spectrum of colorful flashes or light return. If it helps I'll attach a picture of one of my Richard Homer sapphires (is a much more vibrant pink in real life) front and back so you can see the "concave faceting" on the pavilion. I must also say Richard is a consummate professional and very good at finding a stone of a particular color; he has done it for me on multiple occasions. He is also quite adept at traditional faceting. Good luck!

_10907.jpg

_10908.jpg

_10909.jpg
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

...and I feel compelled to add that I think concave faceted sapphires look great as they are not the most dispersive stones (in my very novice opinion). Additionally, it really brings a darker blue to life by accentuating the color and making it pop in all lighting.
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

There are often two camps when it comes to concave cut stones. I for one, am one that does not tend to like them, as I think it often gives a cheap or fake quality to the stone - can't describe it any better than that; perhaps I was just exposed to too many cheap costume stones cut like that when I was a kid? Dunno...

That said, Xrisus, your stone looks lovely to me - love the color and it looks bright and brilliant in your pics. So yay! :appl:
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

Wow... thanks for the info. That stone is really beautiful...
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

No problem, and thanks (that pink sapphire was set into a pendant as a push present for the birth of my daughter). I really wish you the best of luck finding the right stone. Trust me, I know how tough it can be finding "the one" stone for an engagement ring. It took me a while to find the one for my wife. I really look forward to what you end up doing, please keep us posted!
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

if I were to buy a concave cut stone it would be a Richard Homer......... :love:
 
Re: Blue Sapphire Purchase - I should have pulled the trigge

Xrisus,
That is one gorgeous pink sapphire and the saturation and cut is top notch.

With concave faceting, it is all about the glow, at least the ones I've seen. The other bonus is the edge to edge brilliance and very little extinction. Richard is not only skilled but is able to source good quality rough. Of course it isn't inexpensive for the reasons mentioned prior. He has custom cut traditional flat faceted stones for me and I own a concave cut blue zircon by him.
 
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