Diamond Experts - advice needed on choosing a diamond

[fmp21]

Hello!

I’m new on here and I was hoping to get some advice on two stones. I’m updating my engagement ring and I’m debating between 2 options.. there is a huge price difference as well. The 1.8 is around 14, whereas the 2.0 is around 20. It’s a big investment so I want to make sure I make a smart decision- I have a huge hesitation with the 2.0 due to the cut being a Very Good as opposed to a Excellent as I hear is more highly recommended, but enough blabbing - here the are, all and any input is much appreciated:

https://www.gia.edu/report-check?reportno=15036308

https://www.gia.edu/report-check?reportno=3315336995

Thank you in advance! And yes, I do know the second diamond is visually smaller

 

[lovedogs]

I dont think either of these stones are a good choice, unfortunately. GIA XXX is a minimum, but much more has to be considered, since GIA XXX does not guarantee an excellent cut. Have you seen either of these in real life? Are you open to alternatives that are better cut?

 

[sledge]

Agree with @lovedogs, I would not recommend nor buy either of these stones.

The 1.80 stone was cut for weight, not beauty. Consequently, it's carrying extra weight in the vertical plane (depth) and creating a stone that looks visually smaller than it should for a 1.80 carat stone. So the diameter (aka "spread") of this particular 1.80 is smaller (~7.70mm) than an ideal cut 1.80mm (~7.90mm).

In other words, you are paying for a 1.80 but getting the size "benefit" of a SMALLER stone. Not to mention the crown/pavilion relationship is not the best. Too steep of a crown coupled with too steep of a pavilion.

The 2.00 stone is more of a 60/60 style with a flat top that will produce lots of white light return, but not as much rainbow light. Unlike the 1.80, this stone has a shallow depth with large table so the weight is being pushed out in the horizontal plane. Consequently the spread is a little larger for the carat weight than an ideal cut stone. The trade-off is a stone that isn't as lively & fiery as an ideal cut stone.

 

[sledge]

With the above said, let's put things in perspective. You could spend your money & buy either of those stones and each of them has their own trade-off's.

Alternatively, for the same money you could buy one of these super ideal options that are cream of the crop ideal cut stones and have all the pedigree to go with them. Plus amazing customer service & a killer lifetime upgrade policy (simply spend $1 more and trade how you want, no other strings).

WF ACA 1.948 I-VS2 @ $17,791 wire

Diamond | 1.948 ct I VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 3980389

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.948 carat I color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 3980389

www.whiteflash.com

My favorite of the group. Amazing proportions with hearts & arrow (H&A) symmetry. Just slides in under the 2 carat magic weight yet still gives you an 8mm spread! Oh yeah, and it's about $2k under your max budget. What's not to love?


WF ACA 1.838 I-SI1@ $14,553 wire

Diamond | 1.838 ct I SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4369230

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.838 carat I color SI1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4369230

www.whiteflash.com

Basically a smaller version of the 1.948, and right near the lower end of your budget range. Again, an ideal cut H&A stone that is absolutely gorgeous. Despite the small price, you are still squeezing out a 7.90mm spread. An excellent bang for the buck!


WF ACA 2.021 I-SI1 @ $17,924 wire

Diamond | 2.021 ct I SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4389127

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 2.021 carat I color SI1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4389127

www.whiteflash.com

An option to get 2+ carats on a deal. Ideal cut. H&A. Amazing proportions. No issues with cut & performance. Looking at the lab report, the inclusions have me a bit concerned. It appears lots of feathers, although they are listed as the second inclusion. WF reports the stone as eye clean. I would just wait some warm fuzzies about the clarity before moving forward with a purchase on this one.

WF ES 2.016 H-SI1 @ $19,973 wire

Diamond | 2.016 ct H SI1 Expert Selection Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4384096

This fabulous 2.016 carat Round Ideal cut diamond has a clarity grade of SI1 and color grade of H.It is an excellent choice for engagement rings. | 4384096

www.whiteflash.com

Gets you 2+ carats and a color bump to H but maxes your budget. Technically a "near miss" to the prestigious ACA line; however, it comes with all the same great trade perks, images, etc as an ACA stone. The differences I am seeing between this expert select (ES) and a cut above (ACA) is very minimal, and wouldn't have a meaningful impact to the performance the naked eye will see.


WF ACA 2.062 I-VS2 @ $20,300 wire

Diamond | 2.062 ct I VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4384642

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 2.062 carat I color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4384642

www.whiteflash.com

Gets you 2+ carats using your full budget and a little better clarity. Proportions are great and as evidenced in the video, it throws amazing fire.

 

[fmp21]

Wow, thank you all so much! I appreciate the feedback.

I actually saw the 1.8 carat in person and thought I was nice, but jewelry stores always have the nice lights and when comparing to what I previously had, it was considerably better. My dilemma with my options is that my engagement ring was purchased from a local jeweler and I have the ability to upgrade and they will give me whatever was paid towards my original stone (which honestly was a terrible quality stone) back towards my new diamond just as long as i upgrade in size, and color. With that $4500 hanging over my head, I feel stuck.

 

[lovedogs]

Wow, thank you all so much! I appreciate the feedback.

I actually saw the 1.8 carat in person and thought I was nice, but jewelry stores always have the nice lights and when comparing to what I previously had, it was considerably better. My dilemma with my options is that my engagement ring was purchased from a local jeweler and I have the ability to upgrade and they will give me whatever was paid towards my original stone (which honestly was a terrible quality stone) back towards my new diamond just as long as i upgrade in size, and color. With that $4500 hanging over my head, I feel stuck.

Honestly, I would not worry about 4500 in the scheme of a 17-20k purchase. You can get something amazing for 13-15k (removing the 4500 from your budget), and buy with a company who has a $1 upgrade policy. Dont throw good money after bad seems to apply here.

 

[sledge]

Again, wise words & advice by @lovedogs.

I might add to dig a little deeper into their pricing. Normally super ideals are a little more expensive than a GIA 3X stone due to the precision level cutting, additional labor & extra diamond rough wasted to make a super ideal.

Yet I was able to easily find you nearly half a dozen super ideals to compete or beat your local jeweler. IMO he is price gouging you a bit. And I am sure some of this has to do with the fact he has different expenses as a B&M retailer vs an internet retailer.

I personally think he might be about $2k high on his prices for the new stones. That means he’s really giving you about $2,500 for the existing stone. If you feel stuck now, imagine adding $20k to the problem. It’s cheaper &’easier to cut the losses now and move on.

Also, getting about 1/2 value for your existing ring might change your perspective about trading it. You could keep and have reset as a pendant or pass down to children. If you aren’t happy with the current cut you could explore a recut. Costs are normally minimal and can yield a big change on cut quality. The risks are it normally comes at some reduction of weight/size and anytime a stone is cut there can be risk of a break. Still, it’s an option.

Alas, you might be able to toss up for sale locally or on Loupe Troop and get 60-70% of the retail price.

If you want to stay with him, then let us guide you with some proportions, etc to help steer you towards the best cut and use some pricing data to hopefully make him cut you a better deal.

 

[aisa901]

With the above said, let's put things in perspective. You could spend your money & buy either of those stones and each of them has their own trade-off's.

Alternatively, for the same money you could buy one of these super ideal options that are cream of the crop ideal cut stones and have all the pedigree to go with them. Plus amazing customer service & a killer lifetime upgrade policy (simply spend $1 more and trade how you want, no other strings).

WF ACA 1.948 I-VS2 @ $17,791 wire

Diamond | 1.948 ct I VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 3980389

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.948 carat I color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 3980389

www.whiteflash.com

My favorite of the group. Amazing proportions with hearts & arrow (H&A) symmetry. Just slides in under the 2 carat magic weight yet still gives you an 8mm spread! Oh yeah, and it's about $2k under your max budget. What's not to love?


WF ACA 1.838 I-SI1@ $14,553 wire

Diamond | 1.838 ct I SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4369230

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.838 carat I color SI1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4369230

www.whiteflash.com

Basically a smaller version of the 1.948, and right near the lower end of your budget range. Again, an ideal cut H&A stone that is absolutely gorgeous. Despite the small price, you are still squeezing out a 7.90mm spread. An excellent bang for the buck!


WF ACA 2.021 I-SI1 @ $17,924 wire

Diamond | 2.021 ct I SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4389127

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 2.021 carat I color SI1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4389127

www.whiteflash.com

An option to get 2+ carats on a deal. Ideal cut. H&A. Amazing proportions. No issues with cut & performance. Looking at the lab report, the inclusions have me a bit concerned. It appears lots of feathers, although they are listed as the second inclusion. WF reports the stone as eye clean. I would just wait some warm fuzzies about the clarity before moving forward with a purchase on this one.

WF ES 2.016 H-SI1 @ $19,973 wire

Diamond | 2.016 ct H SI1 Expert Selection Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4384096

This fabulous 2.016 carat Round Ideal cut diamond has a clarity grade of SI1 and color grade of H.It is an excellent choice for engagement rings. | 4384096

www.whiteflash.com

Gets you 2+ carats and a color bump to H but maxes your budget. Technically a "near miss" to the prestigious ACA line; however, it comes with all the same great trade perks, images, etc as an ACA stone. The differences I am seeing between this expert select (ES) and a cut above (ACA) is very minimal, and wouldn't have a meaningful impact to the performance the naked eye will see.


WF ACA 2.062 I-VS2 @ $20,300 wire

Diamond | 2.062 ct I VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4384642

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 2.062 carat I color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4384642

www.whiteflash.com

Gets you 2+ carats using your full budget and a little better clarity. Proportions are great and as evidenced in the video, it throws amazing fire.

I've wanted to make this joke a few times now, but I really hope someone is paying you commission, the amount of time you spend sourcing stones and helping others, you'd have made a small fortune by now!

 

[sledge]

I've wanted to make this joke a few times now, but I really hope someone is paying you commission, the amount of time you spend sourcing stones and helping others, you'd have made a small fortune by now!

No commissions, kick backs, etc. All done for free. I'm not in the trade. I just genuinely helping & educating people. Trying to pay it forward as many of the wonderful people here have helped educate me.

 

[ksluice]

You could keep and have reset as a pendant

This is exactly what I was thinking as I read about your situation @fmp21. I did the same with a stone that had major clarity and cut problems, but was bright enough to live very happily as a pendant. If you can skip the trade in, this is a nice alternative path.

 

[munchee]

Just my 2cents, if you feel $4500 is holding you back and made you stay with your jeweler, you’re rolling much more money into it. If you have 20k budget to get the VG 2ct. I would rather getting the 1.98ct or 1.8ct that sledge posted above. It doesn’t make sense that the VG diamond are priced similarly with super ideals. You’re paying super ideal price but getting VG diamond, it sounds wrong.

 

[AllAboardTheBlingTrain]

Agreed, if the 4500 is holding you back I would rather start afresh with a budget of 15.5k (20k less 4.5k) and go with a super ideal or a vendor that has a great upgrade policy that gets you close to the size you want. Reason for the upgrade policy is that you may want to upgrade again in the future, and having to spend 2x / up the colour and clarity each time will get very expensive very quickly. 20k for the 2ct VG is absurdly high imo. And you can always turn the existing diamond into a different piece of jewelry like a pendant or keep it as a travel/more understated/right hand ring.

 

[DejaWiz]

Agree with the others: either cut your losses (hey, we've all been there!) and get the most for your $20K purchase, or reduce your budget and get the most for your $15-16K budget.

WF ACA is going to be the best place to start since they are amongst the most scrutinized and vetted diamonds available.

Either budget route you choose, you'll have utmost peace of mind with their upgrade policy that comes with it.

Start with looking at your options in the slightly off-size weight range just under your target carats, such as a 1.75 to 1.79 or 1.9 to 1.99 which can save you thousands of dollars while being almost indistinguishable to the naked eye against their respective next rounded weights.

Example:
1.94 I VS2 8.04mm average width - $18400
2.06 I VS2 8.23mm average width - $21000

For a lot of people, a 0.2mm increase is noticable...but usually when two diamonds are sitting next to each other in a viewing tray. Remember, a 0.2mm difference is only 8 thousandths of a inch! When that difference is being viewed in a ready to wear setting, then it becomes harder to discern, especially if there are any halo, accent, or side stones involved.

Alas, some people are way more sensitive to these minute size changes than others.
My teenage daughter and sons *might* be able to tell the difference compared to my older eyes, but there are definitely some folks with older eyes that can spot the difference with ease.

To the casual admirer viewing from a foot or more away for 10-30 seconds, I have extreme doubts that the difference would be noticed.

But it's not about the casual viewer (even though we all love to show it off and hear kind words), it's about your finger, your eyes, and your emotions in regards to that diamond: if a 1.77or 1.99 won't cut it and you have to be right in your own head with a rounded (or slightly heavier than) 1.8 or 2.0, respectively, then by all means don't drop down to the slightly lower off-size.

If you're still not sure, then 100% money back return/exchange policies are there to work in your favor.

 

[LLJsmom]

Honestly, I would not worry about 4500 in the scheme of a 17-20k purchase. You can get something amazing for 13-15k (removing the 4500 from your budget), and buy with a company who has a $1 upgrade policy. Dont throw good money after bad seems to apply here.

Cannot agree more. Keep the big picture in mind.

 

[LLJsmom]

Just my 2cents, if you feel $4500 is holding you back and made you stay with your jeweler, you’re rolling much more money into it. If you have 20k budget to get the VG 2ct. I would rather getting the 1.98ct or 1.8ct that sledge posted above. It doesn’t make sense that the VG diamond are priced similarly with super ideals. You’re paying super ideal price but getting VG diamond, it sounds wrong.

So true!! Astute observation @munchee