Estella''s ring

[lislaz]

The Bachelor''s Estella Gardinier is auctioning off the engagement ring that Bob Guiney gave her.


Here''s the link -- http://www.shopintuition.com/Auction/index.html


Bob Guiney gave it to Estella Gardinier. Now it can be yours. 2.07 karat cushion cut diamond ring in a platinum setting by Harry Winston. Appraised value is $42,000. The ring is size 6.5 and can be made smaller.

Estella will use the money to help her mother buy a home and to give to her favorite charities. Please note: Intuition is acting as the auction venue and will not receive any proceeds from the sale.

The auction will end at 9 p.m. PDT June 10, 2004. Estella will personally deliver the ring to the winning buyer!

 

[Hest88]

What's wrong with doing it on eBay? Isn't that what the last Bachelor woman did?

 

[Mara]

Last I read it was going to be eBay and it was going to buy Estella and her mom a trip to some tropical locale and a new car or something...but now it's a house for her mom. Eh. Bob is also newly engaged to his girlfriend Rebecca Budig from All My Children.




Shop Intuition is a popular etailer that sells Hollywood popular items, stuff you see the stars wearing. An awesome online boutique actually.

 

[moremoremore]

I heard that too re: the house. She's clearly not from ny...

That's even gonna get you a healthy down payment? I don't think so...

 

[fire&ice]

I don't follow the batchelor - but - does any of these people *actually* marry? Or are still together?

 

[Hest88]

Wait, you're right! This was on eBay once! Did they get no bids?

F&I, so far all of them have broken up. The gals who've been the Bachelorettes have so far fared better with their chosen guys.

 

[sumi]

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On 6/3/2004 10:14:00 AM moremoremore wrote:

I heard that too re: the house. She's clearly not from ny...

That's even gonna get you a healthy down payment? I don't think so...

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I thought they lived in Beverly Hills. It's not even enough for a down payment in Los Angeles. Maybe the mother is moving out of state?

Well, in all fairness, it does say "HELP buy a home". Maybe there's going to use it toward a down payment. Believe me, I'm house shopping right now and Southern California prices are crazy. You CAN NOT get anything decent in a decent area for less than 600k (and that's just for a very small, nothing-special house). Even townhomes and condos start around 400k. It's insane.

 

[Mara]

Sounds like here in the SF Bay, sumi..We are so glad we didn't wait til we got married to buy our townhouse, it has already gone up in value. There are new townhouses behind us being built, nowhere as nice as ours (theirs are smaller and pre-manuf) for $70k more than we paid for ours and they are actually selling! Ridiculous, and I feel bad for people just entering the market now (we have 2 friends looking), but of course Greg is happy because the rise means good things for us.

 

[luckyhonu]

I've pretty much given up hope at buying a place here in the Bay Area, hence my money goes into acquiring more sparklies! Thanks to PS that's not such a hard thing to do. Maybe I'll take my chances and buy a lotto ticket. It almost looks like the odds are better.

 

[headlight]

Back to the rings...
The one being auctioned now is NOT the same one that was auctioned on eBay; the one on eBay was an oval flanked by trillions that was given by Bachelor Aaron to Helene. This cushion, flanked by baguettes is the ring Bachelor Bob gave to Estella.
I believe the only couples still together are Trista and Ryan, who got married on TV, Meridith and Ian, and possibly Jesse and Jessica who were the couple from the last series that wrapped up a few weeks ago.

 

[moremoremore]

someones been watching the bachelor!

As for homes, well, at least mortgage rates are still FAIRLY low...so it's not necessarily a bad time to buy...On the other hand, it's a seller's market now so prices are high. So, you just wan't win.

 

[headlight]

Yes, you can tell I'm addicted to The Bachelor series, I have to admit it!

 

[foundnemo]

I'm surprised the store said "karat" and not "carat".

No wonder HW declined to provide any more rings for the show, all these auctions are hurting their reputation!

If the BACHELOR couples don't get married, why do the girls get to keep the rings? Perhaps the guys are generous enough to not request the ring back, but I thought CA. contractual law states that the ring belongs to the giver if marriage does not happen.

 

[Mara]

well in all the instances (except i think aaron?), the show pays for the rings ...not the guys. so in essence, by giving the ring back to the guy, the gal gives them potential $$ to spend if THEY auction the ring. i think aaron and helene split the winnings. which would be appropriate IMO if the guy didn't pay for it since obviously the show doesn't want it back. but since aaron paid for it, i kind of felt like he should have gotten it back...it WAS his money in the first place!

 

[sumi]

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On 6/3/2004 7:48:33 PM foundnemo wrote:

I'm surprised the store said 'karat' and not 'carat'.



If the BACHELOR couples don't get married, why do the girls get to keep the rings? Perhaps the guys are generous enough to not request the ring back, but I thought CA. contractual law states that the ring belongs to the giver if marriage does not happen.

----------------

not necessarily. it depends on how the engagement was ended (who decided to end it). also, if I was their lawyer, the first thing i would argue is that the ring wasn't really given with a promise to marry. I mean, does anyone REALLY believe it's a valid engagement (or in other words, a promise to marry in the future)? There's a lot of ways to get around it.

 

[foundnemo]

Oh yeah, if the ring is paid for by the show then keeping it makes more sense.

Aaron probably didn't want Helene to whine about how he dumped her so he let her keep half!

 

[foundnemo]

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On 6/3/2004 7:57:27 PM sumi wrote:


not necessarily. it depends on how the engagement was ended (who decided to end it).

That's what people think but state laws don't follow that logic. Some states even stipulate that you have to be married a certain years to keep the ring! Stupid, but laws are laws.

also, if I was their lawyer, the first thing i would argue is that the ring wasn't really given with a promise to marry. I mean, does anyone REALLY believe it's a valid engagement (or in other words, a promise to marry in the future)? There's a lot of ways to get around it.

Didn't they propose on the show? No one really believe the show's validity but that's the premise of the show, right? -- to find the one you'll marry. The rings are engagement rings after all...
----------------

 

[sumi]

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On 6/3/2004 8:05:40 PM foundnemo wrote:

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On 6/3/2004 7:57:27 PM sumi wrote:


not necessarily. it depends on how the engagement was ended (who decided to end it).

That's what people think but state laws don't follow that logic. Some states even stipulate that you have to be married a certain years to keep the ring! Stupid, but laws are laws.

also, if I was their lawyer, the first thing i would argue is that the ring wasn't really given with a promise to marry. I mean, does anyone REALLY believe it's a valid engagement (or in other words, a promise to marry in the future)? There's a lot of ways to get around it.

Didn't they propose on the show? No one really believe the show's validity but that's the premise of the show, right? -- to find the one you'll marry. The rings are engagement rings after all...
----------------

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Well, as a lawyer practicing in CA, I really think that I know what I'm talking about.

Regardless of the premise of the show, there is definitely an argument to be made that the ring was not given with a promise to marry. At any rate, in Estella's case, the ring was NOT given with a promise to marry in the future. He placed it on her left hand with a promise to continue seeing each other and see where things go. (yes, I am a Bachelor fan...I guess I gave that away)

 

[moremoremore]

Yeah! Lawyer in NY sumi!!!! Isn't life just GRAND. Ugh. Note to self: in next life become a teacher!

 

[sumi]

note to self: in next life become a super-rich heiress who doesn't have to work and can sit around buying diamonds all day.

 

[foundnemo]

Since Mara brought up a valid point that the ring is indeed purchased by the show, I agree that these "Bachelor" women (with the exception of Helene, since Aaron bought her ring) get to keep their rings.

I'm not a lawyer, but I'd be more inclined to believe actual case outcomes from lawyers who practice marital law than personal opinions from just any lawyer.

There are some more info here.

 

[sumi]

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On 6/3/2004 11:06:55 PM foundnemo wrote:

Since Mara brought up a valid point that the ring is indeed purchased by the show, I agree that these 'Bachelor' women (with the exception of Helene, since Aaron bought her ring) get to keep their rings.


I'm not a lawyer, but I'd be more inclined to believe actual case outcomes from lawyers who practice marital law than personal opinions from just any lawyer.


There are some more info here. ----------------

Not to get too technical on you, but most lawyers would refer to that as FAMILY LAW. (By the way, I clerked in a family law firm during law school.) Also, you say you want "actual case outcomes" but I didn't see any cites on that link. It looked more like a cute antecdotal story. Anyway, what's your beef? I'm just saying that I think I have a better understanding of the law than you. I DID graduate law school, pass the nation's toughest bar exam, and am currently practicing in the state we're talking about. I don't think that's an unreasonable assumption on my part.

Anyhow, for my own good, I'd better stop this line of discussion. There's a very fine line between chit chatting about something and actually dispensing legal advice. I'd rather not jeopardize my license over something so trivial. you'd be surprised how easy it is to create an att'y-client relationship. In an over-abundance of caution, I'll just stop right here.

BACK TO THE REAL QUESTION IN THIS THREAD...... anyone know what the ring is currently selling for?

 

[foundnemo]

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On 6/4/2004 1:04:54 AM sumi wrote:


Not to get too technical on you, but most lawyers would refer to that as FAMILY LAW. Also, you say you want 'actual case outcomes' but I didn't see any cites on that link. It looked more like a cute antecdotal story. Anyway, what's your beef? I'm just saying that I think I have a better understanding of the law than you. I DID graduate law school, pass the nation's toughest bar exam, and am currently practicing in the state we're talking about. I don't think that's an unreasonable assumption on my part.

Anyhow, for my own good, I'd better stop this line of discussion. There's a very fine line between chit chatting about something and actually dispensing legal advice. I'd rather not jeopardize my license over something so trivial. you'd be surprised how easy it is to create an att'y-client relationship. In an over-abundance of caution, I'll just stop right here.

BACK TO THE REAL QUESTION IN THIS THREAD...... anyone know what the ring is currently selling for?----------------

I don't have any beef, sounds like you're more excited. I don't believe I have to take *your words* just because *you* said those links are just stories. I've never claimed to understand law better than anyone, just what I've learned in the past about e-rings. I have many lawyer friends but they don't claim to know these things because it's not in their field.

And there isn't a REAL QUESTION that started this thread. If you really must know, since you've passed such a tough exam you can find for yourself the current bid price in the link provided in the first post.

 

[lislaz]

They've now added a gem report.

 

[fire&ice]

Regarding the return of the engagement ring - simply put - it's not cut and dry. I've seen lawyer bills in excess of the ring. In the end, that's why the wife ends up with his golf clubs & the husband her jewelry.

IMHO, some things should fall under descency & common sense - law ulitmately being irrelavent. And, each case is different.

But, maybe I'm a dinosaur. I believe in doing what is right not because the law dictates to me - but because it is right.

We have had quite a few threads on this subject. And, some heated discussion. One thing I do remember is that the law varies from State to State.

 

[Jaded Gem]

Gosh, Fire & Ice, you're very succint and wise. You remind me of a very wise aunt who doesn't get heated in an arguement, but is tactful at all costs. It's amazing how you can voice the opinions of probably many with very well choosen words. Yeah, what is the real issue for guys who give rings to girls. Who decides to keep what, auction what, and return what items. It's all trivial. Yes, there are many outcomes that one can decide upon this point on what is the right and wrong thing to do. Sometimes I read these threads and wonder if people get much more heated up just so that they can be right and have the last word. And then I read about what the actual poster did in the end and sometimes they do the exact opposite of what everyone had suggested. Anyway, I guess it's really up to the said parties to decide at the end. I hope they do find the true loves that they've been searching for. I'm sure being on a reality show fawning over one guy or girl is a dream for some and with that much baggage also comes along.

 

[foundnemo]

Is this not a public forum for people to participate in threads? Believe what you will, but I don't post to have the last word. Rather, I post in response to other posts, is that not what make a discussion?

I don't mind heated discussions with people exchanging ideas and knowledge. What irks me is the pompous tone when people start to bring out their occupation to tell me that I don't understand what I'm talking about.

F&I, I agree that common sense and decency should rule the world but we know that that doesn't always happen.

JadedGem, if this thread is so trivial why post here? I don't think this is any more trivial than the majority of posts in this forum (e.g., why T&C is not the best place to get a diamond ring or if people buying D VVS is really for their ego...).

I'm posting my thoughts, and if they're not welcomed here just let me know.

TGIF!

 

[mwkidd1]

Any news on what Estella's ring sold for or to whom?

 

[lislaz]

Didn't see it on the site. Last time I looked, it was still at $21,000.

 

[Nicrez]

Nemo, to let you know, I also worked within a Family Law practice for 2 years. As such I had seen cases (in NY) where the gift was given as a gift (on a birthday or a gift giving holiday) and thus was not considered a promise to marry, but a GIFT and was kept by the woman.

Some cases also determined that the ring became a joint asset, which at some point was sold and the profits/and or the losses of such a ring were to be split jointly by both parties.

In other cases, the enagement ring went right back to the man, based on a promise made, and based on who did what to end the marriage. If in good faith the ring was given, but there was adultery or another impropriety by the woman, the court may find in favor of the man, and return the ring as a broken promise collateral.

It depends on every case, and each of the circumstances of the breakups. Sumi may be a lawyer in CA for something else, but her answer was as true in CA as it is in NY.

Actually, you can tell she's a laywer. Her response was true, concise, contingent, answered your question, but left with with twice as many more questions...

Way to go Sumi, spoken like a true attorney.

Sorry to say, but consult a Family lawyer and you'll get Sumi's same response.