Fact check: Why "ruby" has remained ruby?

[John Pollard]

Hello brain trust.

I'm asked to address why "ruby" has continued to be called ruby instead of being classified as red sapphire (sic).

We all know the origin stories: Ruby descended from Latin "ruber" (red), and sapphire descended from Greek “sáppheiros (blue), aka "saphirus" in Latin. The questions are (1) When did gemologists first deduce they were the same mineral? (2) Why wasn't one or the other (or both) renamed to be uniform with each other?

Prevailing notion: In 1783 gemologists learned to differentiate between ruby and red spinel and - over time - formerly-thought-rubies were reclassified as red spinel.

Thus: When ruby and sapphire were found to be the same mineral was there any movement to unify their names? Or was ruby's place in history, from the days of the ancients, so connected with its separate distinction as ruby that it was left alone?

 

[VividRed]

We will need the likes of Richard Wise or Richard Hughes to chip in

 

[vintageinjune]

My initial (and completely un-informed) reaction is that it is mostly due to our own laziness- why use two words, "red sapphire", when the one, "ruby", gets the job done? Especially if it was already being used.

 

[musicloveranthony]

My guess is the prestige of the name "ruby." Ruby is such a well-known name that carries so much weight and significance

 

[John Pollard]

My guess is the prestige of the name "ruby." Ruby is such a prestigious name

Absent another explanation that’s my supposition, as well.

The prestige you mention also informs value. A fine quality ruby is generally more expensive than a sapphire (or emerald) of same pedigree which - to me - also gives @vintageinjune ‘s “path of least resistance” notion momentum.

If anyone else has info or guesses I’d love to hear them.

 

[Karl_K]

better question is why do some people continue to incorrectly call a pink sapphire a ruby..
Oh yea same reason $$$$
The other reason the name ruby hangs around is history and momentum.
Now for some fun, what other gemstone material is called different names based on color?

 

[musicloveranthony]

Now for some fun, what other gemstone material is called different names based on color?

Zoisite (Tanzanite vs fancy zoisite)
All the beryl family (emerald, aquamarine, Morganite, etc)
The quartz family (amethyst, citrine, prasiolite, etc)

 

[Ibrakeforpossums]

Isn't there a biblical phrase about a virtuous woman's price being above rubies?
(not that I would know anything about that.)

 

[T L]

It’s a marketing name, and marketing names help value, otherwise these gems, whether sapphire or ruby, would be called blue or red corundum.

 

[qubitasaurus]

As a marketing term I believe red sapphire is the term given to beryllium diffused conundrum (also called sunset Ruby). Everything is always assigned a slightly overinflated title when it gets marketed, so it's no surprise that Ruby and red diffused sapphire both got fancy names

Red Sapphire: Sunset Ruby or Orange-Red Sapphire - GemSelect

Is there such a thing as red sapphire? Sapphire can be any color but red corundum is defined as ruby in the world of gems. However, there are exceptions, l...

www.gemselect.com

Beryllium Diffusion in Orange Sapphire • The Skin Game

The discovery of beryllium diffusion in sapphire is detailed. This treatment appeared in 2001 and turns pink sapphires into rare "padparadscha" sapphire

www.lotusgemology.com

 

[LilAlex]

It's more descriptive. There was no push to re-name (blue) sapphire corundum, either, AFAIK. Why resort to a less descriptive name?

 

[natasha-cupcake]

The names "ruby" and "sapphire" are so much more mellifluous and romantic than "red/blue corundum", or "red sapphire". The love of beauty is integral to the love of gems, therefore a beautiful name for a beautiful object makes sense.

 

[John Pollard]

Thanks to all for the above.

There's no doubt ruby/sapphire are more romantic. Point of order, however. "Ruby and Sapphire" are not marketing terms. Those names are ancient - the Latin/Greek words stuck. They are far older than the mineral name corundum.

No one has touched on this question:
(1) When did gemologists first deduce they were the same mineral?

As mentioned, many rubies were reclassified as red spinel after tech advanced in 1783. When was it, and what gemologists in what country had the "aha" moment - realizing ruby and sapphire are identical materially, minus details involving chromium?

 

[LilAlex]

No one has touched on this question:
(1) When did gemologists first deduce they were the same mineral?

That's because I do not know the answer . Easy to find out -- I just don't know how because it's not in the literature I have access to, professionally. But it must be in some "Royal Society Transactions" or other from many years ago!

 

[Bron357]

I just want to know when a pink sapphire becomes a ruby?
It seems to be a long long long argument / discussion.
If a seller there is more $$$ in the word “ruby” than there is in pink sapphire so it does matter. Yet in some Asian cultures, just to confuse matters, they call all pink, rose and red toned corundum Ruby.

 

[John Pollard]

That's because I do not know the answer . Easy to find out -- I just don't know how because it's not in the literature I have access to, professionally. But it must be in some "Royal Society Transactions" or other from many years ago!

We may have different definitions of easy.

But you're pointing down the same path I've been walking.

It's clear that "aha" moment happened sometime after Pliny the Elder's development of crystallography and prior to 1802, when the Royal Society of London published a journal article identifying "Oriental Ruby & Sapphire" as corundum, debunking their identification as other minerals. That article gives credit to French minerologist and Abbé Rene Hauy, who wrote about it in his treatise one year earlier.

Politics may have figured into the "non-event" in London. In normal times, the unmasking of two ancient iconic royal gemstones as identical minerals may have made a bigger splash - especially in England, the country of Kings and Queens - but the advance work was done by (gasp) a Frenchman - and one who had been imprisoned not long before during the French revolution. Ireland and Great Britain were also in the process of uniting in 1801, so the crown had bigger fish to fry at the time. Perhaps no one wanted to bother Mad King George with the news that his family's royal rubies were red sapphires in disguise.

 

[John Pollard]

I just want to know when a pink sapphire becomes a ruby?
It seems to be a long long long argument / discussion.
If a seller there is more $$$ in the word “ruby” than there is in pink sapphire so it does matter. Yet in some Asian cultures, just to confuse matters, they call all pink, rose and red toned corundum Ruby.

I've seen this in stores in HK - even when the (western) colored stone ID report states "sapphire." At the most basic level it's an ESL thing. At another level I am sure it's a $$$ thing, indeed.

 

[Wink]

I am coming late to the party, but my first thought upon reading the first question from John was that Ruby is more costly than sapphire...

I still think that is the primary reason, although I am sure some scholar will have a more complicated answer...