feeling a bit down

[akw94]

All these posts about timeframes and such have gotten me thinking. Lately, I have been talking to my bf more about rings and other proposal/wedding related stuff. We had the timeline talk a few months ago and both agreed that we wanted to get married before we moved out of state, which would be somewhere around summer of 2008. He, of course, said he''d like to propose/marry/move all in a short period of time. I said that I don''t want to rush and need time in between each and time to enjoy each stage. He said he understood and here we are. Bringing us to the present, as I said, we''ve been talking more about things. I actually try not to say too much but still want to be able to express my thoughts to him. I had made a decision not to bring things up for at least a month or so, but it was inadvertently discussed when PS came into our discussion. The next day, I had some pending thoughts so sent him an email and also wanted to talk a little more about budget. Well, he called that night and said that he wanted to respond to me but didn''t have too much to say on the subject and didn''t want to send an email. He said that he didn''t want to talk about this quite so much, that it is a bit much for him. Well, actually I was/am ok w/that. I don''t need us to be engaged today or even tomorrow... That was part of the email that I originally sent him. So then he sent me an email. He said that he hopes that I understand his comments but he''s just not ready to be engaged so it''s kind of difficult for him to talk about the specifics right now.

Well, I do get that. I guess i''m just a little saddened by it. I''m not even sure why i''m so sad. I am ok w/not being engaged right now. We are moving in together in the summer and i''m fine w/it happening late this year or even next year. We haven''t even been together a full 2 yrs yet so I don''t feel as though it''s been forever or as though he''s not serious. He''s made it clear that he wouldn''t want to move in unless marriage was something real in the future.
Maybe i''m just a little upset that he feels he''s not ready. What does that mean? How does he know he will be ready w/in a year or so? We did talk about this when we talked about timelines. Maybe i''m just worried that by "not ready" he really means *not sure*. He was specific when we talked about timelines that they weren''t the same thing and he was sure. I''m not sure if it''s PS''s influence or what, but it''s sure hard not to focus on a proposal once we started talking about it/I started researching rings. I kind of wish he wouldn''t have asked me about the ring style that I liked until he was *ready*. And since we had the timeline discussion, 2 years seems so close to me and when I think about a proposal, wedding and major move, I go a little crazy. If it all started a little sooner, then perhaps I could calm down...who knows???!!!

Any help/thoughts?

 

[Caribou]

Awe Amy.

It''s okay to be sad. I would be. As long as his ''not ready'' means that his intentions of marriage are still there, try and turn the frown up side down.

Try not to pressure him too much....

I remember my FI saying to me that he wasn''t sure that we would be able to get married until late next year

and talking about how he just didn''t know how we were going to do it. This was before we were engaged and I took it to mean that the engaged was being postponed. What the real issue was is that he was putting a chunk of money down on my ring and spending that much money stressed him out. So in that sense I understand. Maybe your BF is just stressing about that. Remember that you both are moving in together, and that he said he would only do that if this was forever (meaning leading to marriage).

 

[snuga]

I agree with Caribou! I can totally understand why you are sad! Just take some time for yourself and pamper your own needs for a while. Do something that you really enjoy, whether that be shopping, hiking, or sleeping. It will get your mind off of everything and will probably make you feel a lot better. I know that I feel down sometimes about not being engaged and I just focus on the greater joys in life like my family and my wonderful boyfriend. It will happen and when it does, I''m sure it will be perfect for the two of you! Hang in there! Hugs!!

 

[anchor31]

Date: 3/30/2006 10:09:31 AM
Author:amy94
All these posts about timeframes and such have gotten me thinking. Lately, I have been talking to my bf more about rings and other proposal/wedding related stuff. We had the timeline talk a few months ago and both agreed that we wanted to get married before we moved out of state, which would be somewhere around summer of 2008. He, of course, said he''d like to propose/marry/move all in a short period of time. I said that I don''t want to rush and need time in between each and time to enjoy each stage. He said he understood and here we are. Bringing us to the present, as I said, we''ve been talking more about things. I actually try not to say too much but still want to be able to express my thoughts to him. I had made a decision not to bring things up for at least a month or so, but it was inadvertently discussed when PS came into our discussion. The next day, I had some pending thoughts so sent him an email and also wanted to talk a little more about budget. Well, he called that night and said that he wanted to respond to me but didn''t have too much to say on the subject and didn''t want to send an email. He said that he didn''t want to talk about this quite so much, that it is a bit much for him. Well, actually I was/am ok w/that. I don''t need us to be engaged today or even tomorrow... That was part of the email that I originally sent him. So then he sent me an email. He said that he hopes that I understand his comments but he''s just not ready to be engaged so it''s kind of difficult for him to talk about the specifics right now.

Well, I do get that. I guess i''m just a little saddened by it. I''m not even sure why i''m so sad. I am ok w/not being engaged right now. We are moving in together in the summer and i''m fine w/it happening late this year or even next year. We haven''t even been together a full 2 yrs yet so I don''t feel as though it''s been forever or as though he''s not serious. He''s made it clear that he wouldn''t want to move in unless marriage was something real in the future.
Maybe i''m just a little upset that he feels he''s not ready. What does that mean? How does he know he will be ready w/in a year or so? We did talk about this when we talked about timelines. Maybe i''m just worried that by ''not ready'' he really means *not sure*. He was specific when we talked about timelines that they weren''t the same thing and he was sure. I''m not sure if it''s PS''s influence or what, but it''s sure hard not to focus on a proposal once we started talking about it/I started researching rings. I kind of wish he wouldn''t have asked me about the ring style that I liked until he was *ready*. And since we had the timeline discussion, 2 years seems so close to me and when I think about a proposal, wedding and major move, I go a little crazy. If it all started a little sooner, then perhaps I could calm down...who knows???!!!

Any help/thoughts?

I know how you feel, as my boyfriend did the same to me. Window shopping with me and saying "you never know" and not planning to propose for another 2 years. I don''t think they realize what it does to us...

Try to take care of yourself and do fun stuff you haven''t done in a while. I''m not sure there''s much you can do *right now*. He knows how you feel and knows that you want to have time between each event. If he really wants to marry you he''ll respect that, so it''ll be fine.

Hang on in there! *hugs*

 

[blodthecat]

Not ready to get engaged yet!

The important thing is that ''relationships'' need to progress, in order to survive.

If you are definitely planning to get married somewhere down the line, why can''t you have some bling now?

It would kinda seal the deal and give you both something to plan for in the future.

But...it does involve communicating this to him!

good luck

 

[sumbride]

Oh Amy, I know that feeling well. This is the "I raced ahead and he''s dragging behind" thing... You have to sort of mark time and wait for him to catch up.

I haven''t gone through this (YET) on the engagement thing, though I could see myself writing this in a month or two, but I went through this about a year and a half ago when I asked him if he was ready to move in together. He wasn''t, and he was certainly not ready for me to ask him, but it did help sort of put the idea in his brain, and less than 6 months later, he caught up. I imagine it will be the same with the engagement. We''ll see.

As for how I coped last time, I had to distance myself from it because it seriously made me question the relationship. Why wasn''t he where I was? What was wrong with us? would he EVER be ready? In my case, I knew I had to move, and I knew that he would be ready eventually... and I really didn''t want to have to move two years in a row... but I had to suck it up and do it. I found a great apartment, moved in, and barely spent any time there because all of a sudden he wanted me to stay over at his place more. You know, so he could see what it would be like if we lived together. Of course, I had to do this without having my life around, which drove me nuts. Plus I missed my cats! It worked out though because once he was ready, he was ready, and I ended up breaking my lease, though they let me out of the fees, thankfully. Then I had to spend a lot more money to move AGAIN in less than a year. My friends said I used up my moving privileges! So now we live together, just like I wanted, only this time it was "His Idea and Timeframe". Of course, a month into it, he said "we should have done this last year. Well, DUH.

So now, about 8 months after we moved in together, he''s sort of talking about the next step... I''m REALLY ready, but I''m not sure how ready he is. I''m trying to keep my mind off it, because at least I learned from the last issue that I know he''ll catch up... but it''s hard when I''m standing there, tapping my foot, and he''s meandering around, smelling the flowers.

 

[JenStone]

Amy,

I understand what you are going through and I know how frustrating your situation can be. However, if I were in your situation, I would be more direct with him. I would ask him questions such as, "why do you feel you''re not ready yet?" He may be a bit put off by the question, but if he does open up, you can see what his concerns are.

Have you made it very clear to him that you think 2 years is too rushed for moving & engagement & wedding? (Because sometimes, men can''t get the message unless we''re very direct with them

) If so, does he know how much this bothers you? I''m not saying he should give in to your wishes, but at the same time, I also don''t think you should be left unhappy.

Lastly, he says that he''s not ready yet. Is getting married later (say, a 3 year timeline intead of 2) an option?

Best of luck to you!

 

[squeaksluv]

You have every reason to feel confused and sad about his saying ''he''s not ready yet''. But I don''t think he means that he''s not sure, just that why think about engagement and such if he just isn''t ready to go there yet. He knows you are the one for him (living together is the first step) so he probably just wants to take things one step at a time. As anchor31 said, I dont'' think they really know what it does to us to have them ''window shop'' for rings with you when in all reality the actual engagement isn''t for another year or so. How would they like it if you say you''ll buy them a car of their choice in a few years, you better beleive they''d get all excited and want to start researching and shopping immediately! And imagine their letdown if they come to you with all their research and you say ''I''m not ready yet''...talk about the letdown!

 

[FireGoddess]

I think it''s just hearing the words ''I''m not ready yet'' that are hurtful. It''s different than thinking he''s ready but that you''re just not engaged yet. I think it also has to do with the way you interpret his ''I''m not ready.'' Try not to take it that he''s not sure he wants to spend the rest of his life with you, or marry you, but more that he''s not ready for this huge production/entity that he takes getting engaged to be. I think men look at it as this huge thing that changes *everything*, have to plunk down lots of money for a ring, plan a wedding, and that can just send them into *overwhelm*. Try to not take it hard, and continue with the plans you guys have put forth...he''ll become ready.

 

[Cailet]

Amy! I know how you feel too!! (seems like a lot of us do) -- My BF and I have been dating forever but only just decided marriage was where we both wanted to be heading. Well - we had that conversation late last year (was is Sept Oct? I don''t even remember!) and I definitely RACED right ahead. Like Harry said in when harry met sally - when you finally figure out what you want to do for the rest of your life you want the rest of your life to start RIGHT NOW!!!

I mean really - if he didn''t constantly make remarks about "when we are married", "when our kids do this...." or other comments about weddings (we saw a wedding getting set up in Illinois last weekend -- outside! -- he says "We definitely don''t want to have our wedding outside if it is this cold out!") I wouldn''t be NEARLY as obsessed as I currently am. On one hand it is nice to be able to chat about our future -- but on the other hand the more we chat about the more I want it to happen NOW!! I know our timeline is 2006 so I feel a little better knowing it won''t be forever to wait but still - it makes it very difficult to concentrate on anything else....

 

[akw94]

Thank you ALL so, so much! I really appreciate everything that was said.

Caribou, I am going to try not to pressure him. I really am going to try not to bring anything up for awhile. My personal goal is to wait until this antique show (which is late april) and then only ask if he still wants to go. I am trying to keep all the good stuff in mind and focus on today. Thanks for all the suggestions to focus on ME

, I will have to do that!!

Anchor, you are right, I guess they don''t get how it affects someone to talk about something but have no intention of moving forward in the near future. Weird... It''s funny, he and I were talking the other day about past relationships and he said that he''d been in one where he was just about to propose, knew what ring, everything. So i''m thinking, wow... Then I thought to ask *when* he was going to propose. Well, he *knew* around January but wasn''t planning to ask until the END of the year!! What??? That is not being just about to propose. I let him carry on w/that delusion and it just helped me to realize that we think very differently about this issue.

Sumbride, i''m trying hard not to let this question our relationship. I am really trying.

But it does make me sad. I try to take what he says literally and not analyze it to death. I do believe that he means what he says and is serious. But how does one come upon that magic moment when they will be ready? For me, it was an evolving process, not some sort of magical aha moment. Now, he has been married before so I know he''s a bit hesitant due to that.

Jen, we did talk about timeframes and I made it clear (at least i''m pretty sure I did

) that I don''t want to be rushed. I don''t think 2 years isn''t enough time, I just don''t want him proposing in Jan 08, expecting a marriage 3 mo. after and a move a few mo. after that. I think if he proposes this year or early next, that still gives us enough time. We''d have at least 6 mo. or so between each thing. Yes, i''d like more but i''m willing to compromise to some extent. I did say that to him. I think he knows how much it bothers me but if he hasn''t made a move by the end of the year, i''ll have to talk to him again. I want to give him time and the space he needs, but I would have to delay moving if everything is too soon together. He said clearly that he wants me to be happy w/everything. He doesn''t want me to feel rushed or concerned. So we''ll see, I guess... I don''t know if a 3yr timeline is an option, only b/c of our moving plans. But obviously if we''re not married, we won''t be moving together. I guess i''ll see how things work themselves out.

FireGoddess, you''re right, hearing those words were hurtful. I am trying not to take it in a negative way. I just wish he felt as I did. But I know we''re not the same. We had that discussion too. It was tough but good to remember.

Cailet, I agree. Hearing the comments makes it soooo much harder. Why bring up something if you''re not ready for it?? I know it''s probably on his mind too but it really makes it harder for me.

Thanks again ladies! It''s very helpful to have a place to vent and know that others understand.

 

[Mara]

gosh men are just soo different!!! every time i read one of these posts from the LIW's i am reminded of just how clueless and otherworldly they can be!

i have a friend who is somewhat close to getting engaged and her bf keeps talking about their kids and this and that and she is like DUDE we are not even engaged yet and unless you get off your ass and do it, we will never have kids. he's been doing this for 3 months now and has not done a thing about a ring or anything (he is required to contact me as she does not want him going off on his own and shopping at 'joes jewelers and fish n'chips'). she's also 36 and he is 34 and she is a take charge kinda gal and knows she wants kids and her eggs are not getting any younger, so she has already told him if he's not ready to commit at some point soon, to let her know. tee hee. she knows what she wants. and if he doesn't want it too, then he's outta there!!

she's bringing him over to our house this weekend for the 'diamond education talk'...he was surprisingly open to it. so we'll try not to scare him and ply him with lots of wine first.

anyway sometimes i think women are too easygoing about this stuff. i mean sure don't pressure the guy or be a stalker about it, but be firm about what you want especially since you should know you deserve to have the happy ending with the man you love! i think if someone told me they weren't ready, i would be like okay lets sit down for a sec. what does ready mean? when do you feel you will be ready? because guess what? i'm ready! or very close to being ready. so i need to know if you are close to being ready too and if so i can leave you alone, but if your ready is 2 years and my ready is 6 months, we need to talk.

there's nothing wrong with putting the cards out on the table ladies...i know every relationship is different, and amy this is not really focused on you, just in general since we see so many of the similar situation kind of posts, like what is he thinking, here's what im thinking, what do i do, what do i say, should we talk, should i stop obsessing, etc. what's wrong with having an old fashioned heart to heart and laying down some guidelines for getting to where you both hopefully want to be? nothing IMO. the lines of communication should always be very open.

anyway just my two cents, hang in there!!

 

[akw94]

Kali, Blod, and Squeaks: thank you for your comments yesterday. I was soooo busy at work yesterday that I barely got to read anything

Kali, I agree about focusing on other things. Sometimes I get a bit wrapped up in the proposal talk and since I truly am ok w/not being engaged quite yet, I forget to just be happy and enjoy life.
Blod, I know that for him, the proposal is very important so if he''s not ready for marriage, he''s not ready for the proposal. I can understand that, but it''s hard to hear. He does know how I feel though so if something doesn''t happen w/in the year, I will definitely talk to him further.
Squeaks, I know that you are right! He does need to take one step at a time. In fact, we started talking about living together a year before we decided to do it. I feel good about moving slowly also, but I guess I wish this was one area where he would move a bit quicker.

Mara, I agree about the communication. It can be tough but so, so important. I think we did have a pretty open conversation when we talked about timelines. I think it''s just been hard for me to handle what was said and how different we think about things. But I realize that we both want the same things. I don''t doubt that he wants marriage. I also know he wants the proposal to be a total surprise (why, I can''t figure out??). So I think w/those 2 things in mind and knowing that we''re planning on moving in a couple years and I need time in between each big step, I think he thinks/hopes that is enough for me. I would like it to be. Maybe it is, i''m just not sure. When he said he wasn''t ready when we talked before, he did talk a little more about it. I don''t feel right asking, "when will you be ready?" But I do have my own timeline in mind, based on our conversation and won''t be hesitant about bringing it up again if I feel like time is passing and no conversations or no actions.

I guess it really is a waiting game... Part of the problem is that I''m pretty impatient! And really am a bit opposed to giving over total control to him about when/where/how we get engaged. Aren''t we both getting engaged?? Kinda annoying but i''m working on getting over that.

 

[meepcat]

One thing at a time.

Move.

Propose.

Then marry.

But there really should be a reasonable amount of time in between each of those actions, to seriously consider if you''re pushing yourselves into marriage for any particular reason (obligation has an origin), or if it represents something to you that has significance you do/not share, and if you both have images of your commitment to each other, and if they match the reality of what you''re living?

I know that sounds weird, but, I recall doing this in my last relationship: I would throw in the idea of marriage, and he would viciously complain about it, which prompted me to forego it completely. It wasn''t until I packed my things for my trip back home (6000 miles away), for him to tell me that we could get married, if I stayed.

But really, there''s so many obstacles in a single day alone. If you have to move in together, that has a lot of working-through to do, before making a permanent commitment, which could break up for the same reasons you or he may have doubts.

 

[jesterjigger]

I understand exactly what''s going through your head Amy. And you NEED to have time between each step to adjust, relish the moment, and make the emotional changes that they require. Just hang in there, I know it''s tough, but he probably has no idea the effect what he said had on you. ::hugs::

 

[swt_acacia]

Date: 3/30/2006 10:09:31 AM
Author:amy94

Maybe i''m just a little upset that he feels he''s not ready. What does that mean? How does he know he will be ready w/in a year or so? We did talk about this when we talked about timelines. Maybe i''m just worried that by ''not ready'' he really means *not sure*.

Any help/thoughts?

Hi Amy - (I was out of town and missed this thread when it first came around!) Just wanted to say that I completely understand where you are coming from with not understanding why your boyfriend feels "not ready". I am in a very similar situation to yours (we will also be moving out of state in summer 2008, and I want to be married or very very close to it before that happens), and I worry about what will happen if he stays "not ready" too long. I mean, if I don''t even understand why he''s "not ready" now, how can I figure out whether it''s likely to change in the next year or two?

Which comes to my advice for you (advice I need to take myself!): the next time you talk to your boyfriend about this subject, try to get him to talk about WHY he feels not ready. Maybe he needs some time to think about it, maybe he could brainstorm with you then. Is it just that he imagines himself being much older when he marries? Does he have a financial or educational goal he''s always assumed he''d accomplish before getting married? Maybe he has a good reason to postpone marriage, or maybe he just has strong preconceived ideas about how the proposal & marriage will all happen that are getting in the way. It''s possible he formed some expectations for when he''ll marry long ago, and he''s never re-evaluated those ideas in the context of his relationship with you. From the "guy in waiting" thread and talking to some of my male friends lately, I''ve learned that the barrier to two people seeing eye-to-eye on marriage may be real or may be something imagined. Either way, it can be very helpful to both people in the relationship if they are at least aware that a barrier exists and what it is. (like you wouldn''t sit around waiting for rain to fall if you knew there were no clouds in the sky that day, right?)

 

[moon river]

I have a friend that had a boyfriend that was dragging his feet about marriage. She finally brought up the subject when he ask her to move in with him. He said he wasn''t ready to be engaged so she told him SHE wasn''t ready to wash his dirty underwear!!! Furthermore, no ring, no ring a ding ding!!!! They broke up shortly thereafter.

 

[akw94]

Thanks for the new responses!
Meep, I agree about allowing each stage to take its own time. Actually, I do want the time in between each, but sometimes it''s hard to remember that. And sometimes, I do wish he''d propose before we marry although that''s never been something that I wanted before. I think that b/c we started talking about it, now I think about it all the time and I know that if he asked now, i''d accept now. I definitely don''t want to feel the marriage is pushed. Our situation feels a little odd b/c we already have this date for moving out of state set and these other things that need to happen first. That''s why I really want a reasonable amount of time in between the proposal, wedding and out of state move. I don''t want to feel that we''re doing any of those just to get to the next step. I know that he agrees w/that, but he really only sees the marriage and out of state move as the main goals.

Jester, I think you''re right. He doesn''t really understand what affect his words sometimes have on me. I try not to take things too personally b/c I do believe he has a right to how he feels. It is hard though.

Swt_acacia, it is tough when you have this moving goal in 2 years, isn''t it! I do believe him when he says he wants the things that I want, but this determination of "readiness" is very odd. I also worry about what happens if he''s not ready for too long. I have these general timeframes for things and they are important to me. I really want and need time to adjust to each stage of our life together, including time before we move out of state, already being married and just getting ready for the move. I have to worry about career moves, moving my son to a new school, also learning a new language...it''s a lot and I don''t want to be planning a wedding right around that time. It''s only 2 years away!! That drives me a little crazy sometimes b/c he kind of acts like it''s an eternity away but he and I have been together a little under 2 years and that time just flew by. It''s overwhelming sometimes!
I agree that it makes sense to talk more about why he feels he''s not ready. But I also want him to take some time on this on his own. When we talked before, he really didn''t seem to be able to verbalize his why very well. Since he has been married before, I think part of it is going slower and really getting to know the other person. I think that if nothing has happened by winter (since we''ll be living together 5-6 by then), then we''ll have to talk again and be a bit more specific. I try to remind myself that I am ok not being proposed right now. It''s easy to get caught up in everything.
There''s also this antique fair at the end of this month that we talked about attending b/c I''d like to look at the antique style of rings. I''m not sure if we should go though b/c I know i''ll get very caught up in it all and will be upset if he gives little reaction or can only take so much talking about it. I''ve been thinking about asking him if he wants to wait to go, given our recent conversations. It''s hard to think about looking for rings unless he''s really at that stage of proposing. I don''t quite get the point of doing it if he''s not...even though he obviously thinks there''s nothing wrong w/it. Part of it is that he doesn''t want me to have any idea when he will propose..whether it be tomorrow or 2 yrs from now.. Very frustrating!

Moon, I don''t see us breaking up over this.

I really do believe that we want the same things. I mainly think it''s a matter of boy soon vs. girl soon and the fact that it''s very hard for me to just sit by and wait. I''m not really a sit and wait kind of girl! I don''t like to even think about us ending like that!

Thanks again for the responses!! It really helps to have others who understand!