Giving it another shot after a break...

[WeightLifterChick]

Hello LIWs!

It has been a super long time since I''ve posted on these boards. A lot has transpired since then. Mainly, I split up with my boyfriend of six years in March, after many heated arguments about marriage, commitment, family issues, etc. When I would bring up the subject of engagement or wanting to take our relationship further, I received the "It''s just a piece of paper" line, along with that he wanted to wait "a few more years." I took matters into my own hands and moved out. I felt as if I was being taken for granted, and that after six years of being together (and living together for five of them), that he should know if he wanted to spend the rest of his life with me as husband and wife. I really started to feel that whole saying, "Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?"

There was also a large issue that had to do with family. Family is extremely important to me, and he rarely spent any time with my family. I went to all family holidays, dinners, etc., alone. He would always say he didn''t want to go. When I would let him know it was important to me, he still wouldn''t go. Eventually I would just backpedal to avoid an argument and would let him know that it wasn''t a big deal. I began to resent him and felt as if I didn''t have a partner

Everything built up inside of me and I pretty much exploded.

The split came as a shock to everyone, and it was painful for not only he and I, but for our families and friends too, because we all got along so well. I immediately threw myself into my work, taking classes for my master''s degree, training for a half marathon and spending quality time with friends and family. He pretty much begged me to come back, said that we would get married, etc. But as much as it hurt seeing him like this (it killed me), I wasn''t sure if I could believe him. I truly felt that we needed time apart to evaluate our lives and grow a bit as individuals, rather than just "Cristina and Brandon" (our real names), who had been dating for six years.

We would go for periods of time without contact. It hurt experiencing things and not being able to tell him about it, but I stayed strong. I went to counseling to try and rid myself of the guilt of leaving. Sometimes it felt that my heart was being repeatedly ripped out of my chest, over and over. I went mountain biking in the Orlando area in April, where he and I went to college together. It was so strange being there, in our old haunts, without him, and I just came home and cried

He called me the other day, about two weeks ago. I burst into tears when we started talking, because I missed him. Since then, we have seen each other twice. Nothing romantic, just exchanging of hugs and a lot of talking. A lot of "I''m sorry" and explaining. Everything is coming out now. When we''re together, it feels as if we''re just picking up where we left off.


I guess - I am just so confused where we go from here. If we decide to give it another shot, I want to take baby steps. I want to date. I will continue living in my condo and we can see each other a few times a week. Intimacy in bed will be left out of the equation for the time being, because I don''t think my heart and head can take it. A coworker of mine and a good friend advised us to just spend time together, reconnecting and letting things naturally take their course.

Has anyone experienced this with their SO, with a favorable outcome? I truly love him and feel that he deserves a chance to, along with me, make things right for us. How should I bring up topics of importance to me, such as family and marriage/further commitment? I want to let him know that yes, I do love him, but that these issues remain important to me and need to be brought out into the open.

Any advice would be appreciated. TIA

 

[vita*dolce]

1. congratulations on knowing what you want and taking care of yourself! it shows such courage and self-respect to walk away from a relationship that made you feel under-valued.

2. after 6 years and a break-up, if there are things you need to make this relationship work, NOW is the time to lay all your cards on the table. don''t think about how to tell him you want him to develop a deeper relationship with your family and join you at family functions without argument, just tell him. tell him that you don''t feel like you have a partner and make sure he understands that that''s what a relationship is all about, being partners! he should be willing to join you at family functions without any complaint, holiday or not. don''t back-pedal, don''t tell him it''s not a big deal. if it''s important to you, tell him so!

3. ask him whether his feelings about marriage have changed and find out what his bottom line is. if he sees it in your future, immediate or otherwise, is that something you still want? is that something you''d be willing to wait for?

4. you tell your story in a way that shows a healthy perspective on your relationship, which is completely invaluable and so rare since you''re right in the middle of it. you know your relationship and your SO, probably better than anyone, do YOU think he''s going to change? trust your instincts!!


good luck!

 

[WeightLifterChick]

Thanks for that great reply, vita. I appreciate your input

During the initial split, I told him many times how I felt about family and how I felt that because he was never with me for holidays, etc., that I felt as if I didn't have a partner. At first he would explain his reasons why he never went, saying, "You said it wasn't a big deal," or, "I guess it just wasn't that important to me." Now, the last couple of times that we have talked about it, he said, "I now realize that it's important to you, and I'll go with you." On my part, I have to realize that he probably will not want to stay hours on end at my aunt's house for Christmas (I'm Cuban-American and it takes us hours longer to do something than normal, we run on Cuban time), but the fact that if he were to go and hang out for a while, it would make me very happy for him to be actively involved in my family life. I loved his family very much and enjoyed spending time with them, so it was never an issue to me to attend family events on his part.

We will definitely have to discuss marriage and if his views have changed. I am not asking for an insta-proposal. In fact, that is the exact opposite of what I want. That is why I refused him right after we broke up, because I felt he was saying "Marry me, Cristina," just to get me back. I knew that there was not a "bad" motive behind it, but that is all he knew how to say, that is all he thought I wanted, and at the time he thought getting married right away would fix our relationship. I do want to discuss the fact that yes, I still want marriage. It doesn't have to be now, six months from now, but it is still something I want. I'll let the romantic in me come out and say that I have always envisioned being married to him. I just cannot see myself being married to anyone else.

Okay, romantic moment over

Seriously, though - you are completely right that I have to find out what his feelings are toward marriage and what the bottom line is, whether or not he sees it in the future for us.

As far as him changing, at first I thought that he never would. He and I are the same age and as we all know, men mature a tad (okay, a lot) slower than women do

However, my mindset has changed, based on the conversations we've been having. I think that by taking baby steps toward hopefully having a strong, solid relationship again and communicating like two mature adults about what we want and need out of our relationship, we can lay a foundation again for what we had, that eventually became "overcooked", like an article I read on the Web once said.

 

[trillionaire]

Guys definitely tend to mature at a slower pace, and often, being in a relationship stifles growth by coddling, and taking things for granted. I really commend you for walking away like you did. I think you should put it all out there, and tell him what your needs are, concretely. If he is not willing to make those changes, then you can''t do it again. You should also be open to things that he needs you to do differently this time around.

Good luck!

 

[KatM]

your situation sounds a bit similar to mine, though not exactly. for us, he became afraid of committment and broke things off because of that. we didn''t speak for several months, and then began talking sporadically for a couple of months. he really changed a lot in those months, and in the end i''m glad that everything happened as it did. i wish we had communicated more effectively prior to everything going down, but we didn''t and it was as though we needed that major breakdown to bring the issues to light.

we''ve only been back together for a couple of months, so i don''t have a long term success story to share. however, i truly believe that we are better off for having had this happen. we were forced to open up and to listen to one another.

i think these things can definitely work, but you have to be completely honest. at this point you have nothing to lose, really, by being honest. if you left because you were unhappy with things, then jumping back into the same exact relationship will only temporarily numb the pain of the breakup. eventually you''ll be right back where you were when you ended things.

i wish you the best of luck, i know it can be so painful.

 

[wishful]

Wow... well first off I commend you on being strong enough to do what a lot of women can't which is stay true to your heart and move on when you realize things aren't right and you've tried everything you can.

You know, sometimes things do work out for the best when you stand up for yourself by taking ACTION and DOING instead of talking the talk but never acting on it. It really shows the man that you are willing and able to make the choice and go and live your own life.

Obviously you are a very giving person, you stayed in the relationship and compromised for all that time, continually making up for his shortcomings (like not showing up for family gatherings) so there does come a time when you have to do what's right for you rather than what's right for making the relationship work.

A relationship is a two way street and it sounds like you were doing most of the work. I've been in your shoes and I did not get back together with my ex.
But by leaving and taking some time for yourself it gives your ex some time to see what life is like with out you and it also gives him a reality check not just a "threat check" (whcih men typically pay no attention to).

Good for you!

Hold your ground, don't get back together until he can meet your needs as you have met his. Don't settle.
I hope it works out.

 

[Hera]

OK, so hear me out, I get where your friend is coming from, to start slow and see where it goes, but I think that you would just be reinvesting time into an overcooked relationship. I mean you already know him, you''ve lived with him for 5 years! I would give him maybe 3 months and then he would have to at least propose (no moving in again, though). I think you should set up a wedding date you both can agree on hopefully within the years time.

About your family situation, don''t tell him that it''s not a big deal because it is! However, maybe a compromise is in order if he really hates it the that much but only if you''re willing to negotiate.


Seriously, though, you''ve waited for him for 5 years, gathered up the strength to leave and now you should see if he''s serious! Stay strong!

 

[bee*]

Date: 8/28/2008 4:17:26 AM
Author: heraanderson
OK, so hear me out, I get where your friend is coming from, to start slow and see where it goes, but I think that you would just be reinvesting time into an overcooked relationship. I mean you already know him, you''ve lived with him for 5 years! I would give him maybe 3 months and then he would have to at least propose (no moving in again, though). I think you should set up a wedding date you both can agree on hopefully within the years time.


About your family situation, don''t tell him that it''s not a big deal because it is! However, maybe a compromise is in order if he really hates it the that much but only if you''re willing to negotiate.



Seriously, though, you''ve waited for him for 5 years, gathered up the strength to leave and now you should see if he''s serious! Stay strong!

I''d agree. I do understand the whole starting off slow thing, but you guys have been dating for years. I would give it a few months and see how things are then-I wouldn''t invest too much time again if he''s still not sure about things. Best of luck and well done for taking care of yourself!

 

[mimzy]

first off, i think you are handing this all so well, good for you! big time. also, i think it''s wise to start out slow - you''ve re-established a life and HE needs to have time to lay a good foundation of equal partnership that was never laid six years ago. i think that if you jump head first back in then the chances of him reverting to his old ways are much higher - that the whole thing was just a ''scare'' and now things are back to normal, you know what i mean? plus, since you''ve taken to being more independent, i''m guessing you aren''t in the same hurry that you were to get engaged? you guys need time to repair and reconnect and whether it''s weeks or months, you''ll know what feels like and when, if at all, and judging from your attitude about it all it sounds like you are smart enough to figure out if it is something that you want to continue pursuing. good luck!

 

[WeightLifterChick]

I knew I''d be glad for posting here. Thanks, ladies, for sharing your thoughts.

I 100 percent plan to lay my cards on the table and tell him what my needs are. When we first broke up, he said he would change, etc. However, I knew that I needed space and time to think things through. The last thing I want us to do is to jump back into the same relationship, like KatM said. That only sweeps problems under the rug, and it doesn''t bring them out into the open.

I have had a lot of time to think and search inside myself for what I want from him regarding our relationship. As much as it hurts to think about it, if he can''t meet my needs, then a second chance won''t work. You all are right.

So here is my question. How do I let him "prove himself" to me? Let''s say we talk about things, and that I express how important family functions are to me, and that he attend with me - which, BTW, I am never downplaying again, whether it''s this relationship or another. heraanderson, damn right it''s a big deal to me! Do I just begin asking him to attend family events and see if he comes along? I could use some advice on how to approach this. Ha, I can imagine it would be a bit awkward with my family at first. However, I have spoken to them and my mom, dad, etc., just want me to be happy, no matter what.

Yes, I absolutely agree about not letting things go too long without a proposal. In no way do I plan on waiting a long time, or sitting and twiddling my thumbs while he makes a decision. He either wants to marry me, or he doesn''t. By taking things slow, I meant not jumping right back into the old relationship, like KatM mentioned, and also holding back on intimacy, if you know what I mean. And I am firm in my decision to not live with him until the date is set and the invitations are mailed - heck, I may even wait until we''re married

Whether it''s with him or someone else, I am never living with anyone again until I''m engaged or married. Period!

 

[Italiahaircolor]

First of all, kudos to you for being proactive about the relationship and knowing what was best your mental health.

Now, here is my best advice AND my own story (its a long one!)...

Several years ago, I was in a very unhealthy relationship. We lived together and were engaged without any firm plans to wed. He was incredibly abusive mentally. He would cheat on me, lie to me, brings girls into our home when I was working to support us both--while he was in school. He spent my money freely, like on a brand new car, but would berate me when I spent money on myself. All and all, he was a major Jerk with a capital J. But, I loved him. When he would foul up (like he so often did) I would try to rally and kick him out, but my pain and heartache got the best of me and I always wound up forgiving him or just ignoring the underlying issue. I would then enter in this vicious cycle of trying to make myself more lovable. In the end, we'd just end up back where we started...me hysterical, pleading for him to stay...and him holding all the cards.

Until one day...

I had just come home from doing work out of state, and walked into a pigsty. It looked like our home had imploded. So, I skipped a much needed nap (I was on the brink of exhustion) and went to work cleaning up. He, on the other hand, was at school. I finally ended up in the den, where he had carelessly left his email box open...and it was FILLED with suggestive emails from his GIRLFRIEND! She waxed-poetic about their Romeo and Juliet love affair...blah blah blah...I was sick, s-i-c-k, sick. Not only was he cheating on me, in the home I was paying for, but it was serious...they "loved" each other. And apparently, from what I was able to gather, she had been visiting while I was away on business, and had left to go home to PA (we lived in Chicago). So...to recap...she was long distance, and had stayed at our home!

When he walked thru the door, after class, he came into a spotless home, with his bags neatly arranged for him just inside the door. I was done. He was OUT, and I didn't care where he went. He began begging, pleading, sobbing...it broke my heart, and I wanted to just forget it and wrap my arms around him...yes, I still loved him and I was just to tired to fight, and I was easily manipulated. But then, he made a fatal mistake, in his fit of "passion" he picked up a laundry basket of freshly folded clothes and literally dumped them all over the floor and broke the basket over his head (LOL, now!). That was my "it clicked" moment. This man KNEW how he left our home, he KNEW how long it must have taken to fix it up, and yet he didn't respect me or my hardwork enough to NOT distroy it. So, I stood firm...he left...and that was that.

But about 2 years later, he called me. He had apparently moved to PA with his then part-time lover (now his full time nag) and was missing me...and wanted to chat. He wanted to come out and see me, to see if there was anything left between us.

We chatted for a few months via phone and email (I know what you're thinking, she's pretty lame to even consider it). And he kept telling me how he'd changed, how he wasnt the same person, and how he just missed me so much and wants "us" again. I finally gave in and agreed to meet him, in Chicago, in April. When he arrived, I was elated...it was good to see him, and he looked really good too. We spent about two days together, laughing and joking, and revisiting "our" haunts...It felt good to be with him, but we did not sleep together--since I wanted him to get tested before we took it to that level. He seemed reformed, but there were things that seemed like he was coming from a place of half-truthes...like still answering his current GF's phone calls, and stuff. However, when he left I felt a dull saddness and longing for him to come back full time.

We continued our phone/email rekindling...and slowly but surely he started to show his @$$. He'd ignore me for a few days and finally get back to me with a lame excuse...he admitted to cheating often on his "then" girlfriend--and even admitted they weren't "totally" broken up

. And it was like little bells going off all over the place...he was a scumbag when we were together, and the only thing he'd managed to change in our time apart was his freaking zip code.

Needless to say, I cut ties. A month after offically releasing him, I met my now-husband.

So, the moral is...sometimes breaking up hurts more than you'd ever imagine. And even if it would feel good to just "go back" and have a perfect relationship...sometimes you just can't. He is who he is. When you forgive someone, it's like saying "what happened is okay"...but it also means that next time, you're giving him premission to do the same thing, and one thing more.

If you're okay with the guy who didn't want to spend time with you family, then you should go back. Because chances are...even if he's great intially...he'll slip back into old habits, and you'll find yourself eatting Thanksgiving dinner alone. If you're okay being in a LTR without a ring, then jump in with both feet. Because. just as your feelings about marriage are valid, so are his....and if he doesn't want it, you can't force him into it.

If you're in a relationship that doesn't feel right, then it's not right. Pain is a sign that something is wrong. I suggest you go buy and the book "It's Called A Breakup Because It's Broken"....it'll help, I think.

 

[absolut_blonde]

Date: 8/28/2008 10:01:43 AM
Author: Italiahaircolor
Needless to say, I cut ties. A month after offically releasing him, I met my now-husband.

So, the moral is...sometimes breaking up hurts more than you'd ever imagine. And even if it would feel good to just 'go back' and have a perfect relationship...sometimes you just can't. He is who he is. When you forgive someone, it's like saying 'what happened is okay'...but it also means that next time, you're giving him premission to do the same thing, and one thing more.

If you're okay with the guy who didn't want to spend time with you family, then you should go back. Because chances are...even if he's great intially...he'll slip back into old habits, and you'll find yourself eatting Thanksgiving dinner alone. If you're okay being in a LTR without a ring, then jump in with both feet. Because. just as your feelings about marriage are valid, so are his....and if he doesn't want it, you can't force him into it.

If you're in a relationship that doesn't feel right, then it's not right. Pain is a sign that something is wrong. I suggest you go buy and the book 'It's Called A Breakup Because It's Broken'....it'll help, I think.

You know, I tend to agree. I was afraid I would be the only one who had this perspective. I have a similar story. Prior to meeting SO, I was on & off with someone for years. I can't even count how many times we broke up and I did have a few relationships in between while we were 'off'. He always came crawling back, crying, begging and promising to change. I believed him over and over - even getting back together with him numerous times after telling myself and all of my friends that I would never.

We had been friends for a few years before that and we just sort of stumbled into dating. It wasn't the greatest relationship from the start -- he was insanely jealous. I wasn't in the best place mentally and I was vulnerable. Somehow, he always knew how to 'get' to me, in both good and bad ways.

This guy had no interest in spending time with my family. In fact, he showed ZERO respect for my family by doing things like phoning my private line at 4am repeatedly and even showing up at my house in the middle of the night when broken up. The whole relationship was very high school, which pains me to admit because I was several years out. Did I mention he had a coke problem? He lived a double life for months. He was emotionally/psychologically and verbally abusive. He never took me out on dates, never once bought me any presents and actually broke up with me on my birthday one year! What. a. LOSER.
I don't have a specific moment where things ended. I just reached the end of my rope. I had nothing left inside of me. I was mentally worn out, beaten down and had next to no self-esteem. He got physically abusive one night and that wasn't the exact point at which things ended but it was the beginning of the end.

We'd been broken up for awhile when he kept trying to contact me. At this point, I was done. I wanted him to leave me alone. Shortly after I finally managed to rid of my life of him, I met SO. It was almost like a sign. SO is the complete opposite of the ex. He is kind, loving, fun, patient, he does nice things for me, he tries to make me happy, he never yells at me, he never calls me names, he spends time with my family (even chats on the phone with my mom when she calls, which is pretty darn cute). Once we started dating, it was like "Oh. THIS is how it's supposed to be."

My ex STILL tries to contact me and we haven't spoken in over a year. He sends me texts at 2am saying he loves me, he just wishes I would talk to him and he's so sorry. But he's done that before and it's just a lure to get me to talk to him so that he can instigate drama. Just the other day, he left a creepy comment on my Facebook by using a mutual friend's account. I can say with full confidence that he willl never, EVER change.


Maybe the ex in question isn't as bad as this. But I believe that the fundamental aspects of who a person is do not change. But as an example: your ex might very well be sorry for the way he was about family events. But for him to carry on doing that to you for so long in the past indicates that somehow, he found a way to justify that behaviour to himself. He had reasons for believing that his behaviour was ok. Often those reasons and internal justifications - the way they think - do not change.

Only you know what is right, but just because you are hurt and just because you miss someone does not mean you should be with them. Trust me, I KNOW how good it can feel to be with someone you are comfortable with, who you think 'gets' you, who knows you. But those feelings aren't enough to make a relationship work.

Think of it this way - I can't take credit for this but I can't remember where I heard/read it - if someone broke your arm, you wouldn't go to a doctor to have it fixed, right? You wouldn't go back to the person who broke it and expect them to make it better. Sometimes it is the same way with a broken heart.

 

[jcarlylew]

i think everyone here is offering great advice - from take it slow to see if it is what you want, dont take it too slow, to watch out for the warning signs. all very good points.

But, you will know what is best for you and your relationship. The only key word i am going to offer is RESPECT. it''s easy to say that someone "respects" you, but do they show it in their actions? It sounded like before, your guy loved you, you has a great relationship EXCEPT he didnt respect the part about how much family means to you. That is a big part of your life, and he needs to respect it. He doesnt have to like it (my guy doesnt like going over to my family either, we too take a LONG time to do anything -- southern families!) but he will still go over. So, in turn, i respect him by setting timelines with my family, and letting them know we have to head home at a certain time. That way, we''re both happy.

I truely hope everything works out for the best, for you!

 

[jcarlylew]

oh yeah, where is your charm from? its the same quote as a ship/bar in the bvi

 

[Bliss]

Hi Cristina! Big hugs to you.

Reading your posts, it sounds like your bf was basically a good guy. Your best friend. Not a jerk or a cheater or a liar... To me, it sounds like you two didn't get to put in the hard work to communicate. Truly communicate -- beyond, "I don't feel like going to your family's house for Christmas." Communicating would be digging together more deeply to reveal why. Maybe it reminds him of feeling like an outsider or something painful from his past. Maybe big social gatherings make him feel uncomfortable and he likes to spend those times tucked away at home. That wouldn't make him a bad man incapable of a relationship. Maybe you also need to tell him how sad it makes you to go to family events alone and how deeply it hurts you. See, I feel that if you two got down to the deeper feelings and how it affects you and why, you could come to a resolution together. Marriage is, after all, about compromise and no one party is right. We're all strange and have quirks about certain things. Can you come to a place where you both can work together? No glaring problems? Is 80-90% of him a really good person and the other part just quirks?

I know family is really important to me, too. When I was younger, I would have jumped to the conclusion that he didn't care about family as much. And when we had a family together, would he abandon us during the holidays??? Would he ever "get" how important to me that this is? Are our values dissimilar? But now, I would look into his head as well. Maybe family IS really important to him. Maybe he is doing this because he feels uncomfortable... or on the outside... or it reminds him that he is not close to his own family. Maybe there is a family member who always hurts his feelings at these gatherings. But he needs to TALK about them. And he needs to help you understand why. And you need to help him understand why this scares and hurts you so much. Once this is clearly revealed, you both can make compromises... so that it works uniquely for you as a couple. So what about societal norms? It's about you two when you get married and how to navigate those choppy seas together! Is he WILLING to explore these issues hand in hand with you?

The marriage thing would cause me concern, too. I can't speculate any further... but what you write is fixable and the wounds you have created together can be healed. IT WILL TAKE A LOT OF WORK. But marriage TAKES A LOT OF WORK no matter WHO you marry. So it might as well be with your best friend. You were together all that time because you loved and enjoyed each others' company, not for fear of being alone. You proved that when you cut ties and explored the world on your own two feet. (MAJOR KUDOS FOR THAT, BY THE WAY!) GIRRRRRL, you ROCK!

FI and I were together for years and I broke up with him because I was not ready to be married. I needed to be on my own two feet and be my own whole person first. I had been so sheltered growing up and I wanted to be independent before I got married. I wanted to find my voice and be true to who I was. And I think also my soul hungered to discover all the things I longed to know about the world, myself, the people in it, ideas and spirituality... without outside influence. I wanted freedom!

So that is what I did. FI is such an amazing person. He is at heart, so so good. He is brilliant, he is kind and he is the best man I could hope to marry. Thank God he always had faith in us and he waited for me. And he kept in touch with my family to see how I was doing and he respected my decision to see the world as an independent woman and let me do that. That is true love. Not selfish scared-to-be-alone love, but deep understanding and love. Can you do this for each other? Respect each others' needs even though it hurts? Can you dissect your old hurts and go fearlessly into discussing your pain and fears? And yes, it's going to HURT A LOT to probe into some old wounds. But you have to clean it out for it to heal.

What we did immediately after getting together is, we went to couples counseling. It is FUN! It is truly a luxury to set aside an hour each week to talk to each other openly before a kind and caring person who asks key questions. We laugh, we bicker sometimes about semantics (LOL) and we talk talk talk. It reveals so much about our childhoods, our families and our deepest fears and hopes. I have learned so much about him and I see him truly as he was as a boy, a teenager, a young man. And now, we go forward together. We give each other our futures and trust that we will be able to work it out, no matter what. There are no guarantees. Only hope and you have to trust in that. Play to win, girl! Otherwise, it's not worth doing, you know? Let God take care of the rest.

If you have the time and the money for it, I can't tell you how wonderful couples counseling is. So many times, if we're starting to disagree -- we'll laugh and say, "Save it for the couch!" And we'll talk about it, too. Be proactive about it. Explore now. Don't wait until you are like so many other couples we see in the office sitting miles apart, arms crossed and hurt beyond repair. Garden, garden and garden! Yank those baby weeds out as soon as you see 'em! Make it fun! We always have dinner and ice cream afterward and talk about what we've learned. We both look forward to it, actually.

Hearing FI open up so much to me and to discover and "learn" another human being is a fascinating journey. It never ever ends and it only gets deeper with time. I wish you all the best from the bottom of my heart and hope you both find this elusive happiness that you so deserve. It isn't so much like a butterfly that alights on you from time to time, but you will find it is as deep as the ocean.

So many times, the most hurtful thing is miscommunication. Now, when something comes up, we don't bat the issue around on the surface level. We go deeper and get to the root of the problem. No more, "You don't want to go here, you don't care about me!" Instead it is, "I feel anxious about going to these places alone. It reminds me of a painful time when I didn't have anyone and I feel scared I won't be able to depend on you when I really need your support." Be raw. Be open. If you can't to each other, who can you do it with? And you will also be more honest with yourself. And you will be stronger for it in the long run. To be honest with ourselves and to put words to unnamed fears and bring them out into the light is the greatest thing a human being can do... to change, in the name of love. It is a lifelong journey.

Take it slow. Talk now, honestly... ask questions. This could be the greatest blessing to you both. Or you could both learn that this is not the right relationship. Either way, you will learn a lot about each other, yourselves and get the answer to the question that your heart asks.

 

[WeightLifterChick]

jcarlylew - My avatar is from Google LOL! I have a rather large tattoo of an old school style anchor, rope and sparrows across my upper back, and found the anchor and the saying on it fitting Thanks for your advice. I agree that respect is key and I did feel that he did not respect my views on family and marriage. We come from different backgrounds. Whereas I have 3249576 cousins, aunts and uncles, his family unit is pretty much four members (mom, dad, grandparents). I can understand that he feels overwhelmed, but that was still not an excuse for him to at least try and go. The family issue is big, and as much as I love him and care for him, it is a dealbreaker for me (obviously!). So this is an issue we will discuss at length and work on, should we move forward with giving our relationship another chance.

Bliss - Thanks for sharing your experience! You''re right about the lack of communication. Honestly, we didn''t put in the hard work to communicate because until these issues rose to importance and real discussion for us, we got along well. No tiffs about who takes out the garbage or does the dishes, etc. It was when I began to really mature and think about the long term, that I realized these issues needed to be brought into the open.

I know a main reason of why he didn''t want to be involved with my family is because he and my dad had issues at the beginning of our relationship

I lived with my dad and stepmom when we first began dating in 2002 (we were both 20), and my dad, being the overprotective dad he is, started showing his temper and eventually made Brandon and I extremely upset, and destroyed something that Brandon had given me for my birthday. It''s a long story, but it ended my dad throwing me out of the house and I moved back in with my mom and stepdad, an hour away from where I was going to community college. After I earned my AA degree, Brandon and I moved to the Orlando area and moved in together, attended college together, etc. I didn''t speak with my dad for almost two years. In 2003, my dad reached out to me and we rekindled our relationship. It has its moments, but we spend time together often.

Phew. That was long. So, after that happened, Brandon felt uncomfortable being involved with family functions and events on my dad''s side. I understood, but up to a point. I figured that if he began coming around to family things with me, little by little, like I did after patching things up with my dad, that he would realize that my family will accept him, because they know he loves me and that I am happy with him.

Bliss, you''re right - I think he and I need to get down to the deeper feelings and how these things affect us. Such as, "When you do or say X, I feel Y," and just opening up to him. I have tried this approach in our recent conversations, and have had good results so far. That is something I had problems with before. I would do anything to avoid a discussion or argument, and just suppress my feelings. Talk about communication issues on both sides.

"Take it slow. Talk now, honestly... ask questions. This could be the greatest blessing to you both. Or you could both learn that this is not the right relationship. Either way, you will learn a lot about each other, yourselves and get the answer to the question that your heart asks." - You''re right.

 

[Aloros]

I''m going to agree with those who said that taking it slow at first is wise. Because even though you''ve been with him for six years, and you know him so well, this is the time you really find out the kind of person he is - can he change once he''s said he will? Everyone says that you must be happy with your man the way he is, and not to expect him to change (wise advice!), but the truth is, people can and do change if they sincerely want to.

I had a rocky relationship with my ex. Close to six years together, in all. He was a good man, and intelligent, but he slacked off in school and couldn''t make the grades. He was kicked out a few times, always managing to barely squeeze his way back in. And then he was out for good. This work ethic was reflected in other parts of his life, leaving me to feel like a last priority to him. He''d always promise to change, that this time things would be different. Things would go well for maybe a month, and then we''d be back to same ''ol, same ''ol.

My FI is so much different. If I have any concern about his behavior, he doesn''t get whiny or defensive. He will sincerely listen to me, no interruptions. He doesn''t make me feel wrong for having these concerns, or make me feel silly for the things that I feel are important. If he agrees with my assessments, he takes some very real and lasting steps to change his behavior. I think this is one of his greatest qualities, and I admire him for it.

That said, I do believe in second chances. If I hadn''t, I wouldn''t be engaged to a man who says he will do almost anything to make me happy, and proves it to me day after day.

BUT, I no longer believe in third, fourth, or fifth chances.

 

[NewEnglandLady]

I haven''t read everybody else''s response, but my initial thought was that this is why it''s SO important to stick to no contact. It''s the only way to heal. Staying in contact keeps the wound open for both of you. There is the period of tiime where you feel loss and it''s hard, but when you get over that part of the breakup the real growth starts happening...neither of you can gain perspective when you''re still hurting.

I only say this because I''ve watched many women leave their boyfriends because of commitment issues, only to get sucked back into the relationship when they feel the most lonely. It''s so easy--the relationship is safe, it''s comforting, it''s inviting. I completely understand--there was a brief period about 2 months after I left my relationship where I considered trying "light" contact. I really missed him, as a friend, as my partner...but I knew that contact would dismantle all of my healing.

I think the key to getting back into a relatoinship is judging for yourself if there has been any REAL change. I spent days discussing the change with D even after he had the ring and had planned the proposal trip. I wanted to hear about his therapy, what had happened to him internally that made him embrace marriage...I needed to see definite change in him before I even considered marrying him.

I don''t think taking it slow is wise. You''ve been with this man for 6 years, you already know him inside and out. This is where you evaluate if he can meet your needs. You know what your needs are: you need marriage, you need a commitment to him investing more in your family, you need a PARTNER. Taking it slow won''t prove anything to you, having him prove to you that he has changed will.

I wish you luck! I know exactly how you feel, I''ve definitely been there. Ask my husband...he showed up on my doorstep twice trying to win me back (no ring, no change) and I escorted him back to his vehicle both times.

 

[Amzizzle]

Hi WLF,

I''m sorry you are going through all this,but I do have a similar story.

I had this old boyfriend who would one day "want to be with me together" and the next be afraid of commitment. We has been together a couple years and it was what seemed like to be the "little things" that were making our relationship fail.
He never wanted to go out with our friends,or spend time with my family,he would yell if I came in late. He would break-up with me and then meet me out at the bar (the only time he would come out with me) and then proceed to get jealous if any guy even looked in my direction.
The big kicker was that he was moving to Boston and had asked me to come,so stupidly I DID. He then broke-up with me yet again pretty much as soon as my plane landed. I had to realize that He didn''t want family,he didn''t want to commit,and truly even though it was back and forth he didn''t really want me either. I hurt so much after all that but I had to stop doing it to myself. I have now been in a really healthy and happy relationship for over 3 years. I have run into him since and the only thing he said was "I''m jealous that we never had,what you have with him now". It''s just a story and a bit of advice,but don''t waste time on something that isn''t working when there is something out there that will.

 

[WeightLifterChick]

I'm really enjoying reading these responses. Thank you all very much for the input.

I also escorted Brandon to his car or asked him to leave a couple of times after we split up. He showed up at work, on my doorstep and at the gym. But since it was so fresh, I wanted to stick to my guns and stay strong. I wanted (and still want) him to know that I meant business. It was a lot of stress for me to handle!

Actually, when he called the other day, we actually hadn't talked since Memorial Day. It has been three months.

Right now, my mindset is this. I have my own place and my independence. I have a good job, friends and family. I'm traveling a lot, training for a half marathon and hopefully a triathlon after the half, and taking classes to earn my master's degree. Whatever happens in my life, I have these things to fall back on. The more I think about it, I have re-established a life, like mimzy said. I do love him and want to be with him. However, I have to do a lot of soul searching to figure out whether or not I am in the same hurry to get engaged. He knows that I want marriage. Whether or not it's with him, he will have to prove that to me.

But whether or not I marry him, or someone else - I am not living with anyone until I am engaged (or more than likely, until I'm married). I have a life, I am independent. Whether or not it's Brandon or someone else - if a man wants to see me everyday, he can get his knee dirty, put a sparkly ring on my finger and ask me to marry him.

Someone told me a while ago, "You're the jewel!" I need to remember that.

 

[Hera]

Date: 8/29/2008 3:46:58 PM
Author: NewEnglandLady
I haven''t read everybody else''s response, but my initial thought was that this is why it''s SO important to stick to no contact. It''s the only way to heal. Staying in contact keeps the wound open for both of you. There is the period of tiime where you feel loss and it''s hard, but when you get over that part of the breakup the real growth starts happening...neither of you can gain perspective when you''re still hurting.

I only say this because I''ve watched many women leave their boyfriends because of commitment issues, only to get sucked back into the relationship when they feel the most lonely. It''s so easy--the relationship is safe, it''s comforting, it''s inviting. I completely understand--there was a brief period about 2 months after I left my relationship where I considered trying ''light'' contact. I really missed him, as a friend, as my partner...but I knew that contact would dismantle all of my healing.

I think the key to getting back into a relatoinship is judging for yourself if there has been any REAL change. I spent days discussing the change with D even after he had the ring and had planned the proposal trip. I wanted to hear about his therapy, what had happened to him internally that made him embrace marriage...I needed to see definite change in him before I even considered marrying him.

I don''t think taking it slow is wise. You''ve been with this man for 6 years, you already know him inside and out. This is where you evaluate if he can meet your needs. You know what your needs are: you need marriage, you need a commitment to him investing more in your family, you need a PARTNER. Taking it slow won''t prove anything to you, having him prove to you that he has changed will.

I wish you luck! I know exactly how you feel, I''ve definitely been there. Ask my husband...he showed up on my doorstep twice trying to win me back (no ring, no change) and I escorted him back to his vehicle both times.

So, New England Lady, did your husband come back and immediately propose then?

 

[NewEnglandLady]

Date: 8/30/2008 3:45:48 AM
Author: heraanderson

Date: 8/29/2008 3:46:58 PM
Author: NewEnglandLady
I haven''t read everybody else''s response, but my initial thought was that this is why it''s SO important to stick to no contact. It''s the only way to heal. Staying in contact keeps the wound open for both of you. There is the period of tiime where you feel loss and it''s hard, but when you get over that part of the breakup the real growth starts happening...neither of you can gain perspective when you''re still hurting.

I only say this because I''ve watched many women leave their boyfriends because of commitment issues, only to get sucked back into the relationship when they feel the most lonely. It''s so easy--the relationship is safe, it''s comforting, it''s inviting. I completely understand--there was a brief period about 2 months after I left my relationship where I considered trying ''light'' contact. I really missed him, as a friend, as my partner...but I knew that contact would dismantle all of my healing.

I think the key to getting back into a relatoinship is judging for yourself if there has been any REAL change. I spent days discussing the change with D even after he had the ring and had planned the proposal trip. I wanted to hear about his therapy, what had happened to him internally that made him embrace marriage...I needed to see definite change in him before I even considered marrying him.

I don''t think taking it slow is wise. You''ve been with this man for 6 years, you already know him inside and out. This is where you evaluate if he can meet your needs. You know what your needs are: you need marriage, you need a commitment to him investing more in your family, you need a PARTNER. Taking it slow won''t prove anything to you, having him prove to you that he has changed will.

I wish you luck! I know exactly how you feel, I''ve definitely been there. Ask my husband...he showed up on my doorstep twice trying to win me back (no ring, no change) and I escorted him back to his vehicle both times.

So, New England Lady, did your husband come back and immediately propose then?

No, it took him about three months--I moved back to the midwest in Nov. and he didn''t propose until February. I shouldn''t say that there was no ring or no change, he did buy the ring about a half of an hour after I left him, but he did so as a knee-jerk reaction to me leaving. Nothing had actually changed except the stakes to keep the relationship. He showed up on my doorstep twice because I would not take his calls/answer his emails, but I knew he was just trying to keep me at that point. You know when a man is ready for marriage and he wasn''t. Finally he stopped reaching out to me and went to therapy to address his real fears and two months later he was finally ready. Throughout the engagement and our first year of marriage he''s completley embraced marriage...more than me, even!

I do think men can overcome their fears whether they just have a case of cold feet or if they are commitmentphobes, but it doesn''t happen overnight, nor does it happen without some work.

 

[risingsun]

If things do move forward with Brandon, I have a question about the family issues. How does Brandon get along with your mother and her side of the family? It seems as if your Dad has some work to do to repair the relationship with Brandon. Perhaps you could speak with him about it. If the two of them could resolve their past issues, you might have an improvement in the family situation.

 

[WeightLifterChick]

risingsun - He gets along just fine with my mom''s side of the family. Things were always fine. His mother and mine got along very well - when we were in college, they would take "Mothers'' Trips" up to Orlando to visit, take us to Sam''s Club or BJs to stock up on necessities and the like

His family came to my mother''s wedding last year, etc.

You''re right about my dad and he having to do some relationship repair. My dad, however, is so stubborn and always refuses to admit he''s wrong, no matter what. Truthfully, he never apologized for the kicking-out-of-house incident that happened years ago. I''m over it now, but he''s not the type to come forward with sappy apologies.

Still, if B and I decide to move forward with giving our relationship another chance, I think their strained relationship could possibly be repaired. Or at least B has said throughout all of this breakup mess that he''d go with me to family events on my dad''s side, no matter what. We will see.

Short post, but I''ve gotta run!