Help me decide: Ruby or Mahenge?

[Upgradable]

I can only forsee one more project for the year, and I'm really going back and forth and back again! I would love to hear your opinion.

I've found a beautiful unheated, untreated ruby in a size that is ideal for me. I love the shape, I love the look, but the price is at the high, high end of what I was planning.

On the other hand I've been drooling over these amazingly vibrant Mahenge spinels. I know I can get a color I'd love in a good size within my price range. The only thing I'm still sorting through are acceptable inclusions. I know these stones are rare and may not be available forever.

So, I'm really torn on going for the ruby that is just about $200 out of my $$, or keeping looking for the right Mahenge and have a stone that will be quite unlike anything found around here.

(In the picture the top row is the specific ruby I'm looking at. The bottom row shows a selection of spinels.)

 

[T L]

Okay, I am going to repeat what I said if that's okay since the other thread is gone.

The ruby you picked out is very similar in color to a pinkish red Mahenge. I wouldn't consider it a red ruby.

Mahenges tend to go more watermelon colored in artificial lighting from my own experience and what I've seen and have been told. The more pure pink ones don't as much. This might bug you. Does the ruby hold it's color?

Ask Tan if he can go through his inventory to pick out a Mahenge the color of that ruby. Make sure it has UV fluor as well. AJS has lots of Mahenges, but so does Tan. I would ask Tan since he has the ruby available to him. He can AIGS certify any Mahenge. You should ask AJS as well, but know they have to rely on Tan's video for accuracy.

If you're truly smitten with the ruby no matter what, I would go for that. It seems you are. Tan is very good about refunds IMO.

If it were me, I would go with the Mahenge because the ruby you picked out looks like a pink sapphire. It's pretty, but I think you can find a similar look for less $$ in a spinel. Mahenges are going up in value, so the rarity/ruby thing isn't so much an issue unless you're talking about a fine Burmese ruby.

ETA: Be leary of Mahenge spinels that also look more like rhodolite garnets than a neon pink stone. Not all Mahenge spinels are neon.

 

[innerkitten]

I wasn''t sure which way to vote because I''m not sure which I''d go if I could afford both. Both are rare these days. With a spinel you can probably get better clarity and it won''t be heated or treated. So if you can get the perfect spinel go for it. But if you found an amazing ruby with good clarity and color I''d consider that too.

Of course the money you saved buying a spinel could go towards your setting.

 

[Upgradable]

Shoot! I can''t see the results of my own poll unless I vote. That''s kinda dumb.

Based on TL and innerkitten''s comments I''m leaning toward mahenge. Anyone else care to give me a shove?

 

[VapidLapid]

I voted spinel
BUT I wouldnt limit the choices to these ones that would be for me far too included. With the money saved passing on the ruby for now I would look for cleaner spinel. Gene has a very few pieces of mahenge left. IMLO a precision cut combined with mahenge takes a gemstone to a special and unique place. I would contact him to see what he has and can to. The Gem Trader has a mahenge, may be worth looking at. Finewater too may have a piece. You should be able to have your mahenge and still reach for the stars.

 

[ma re]

If it were me (and I'm really not into anything pinkish...) I'd go with a spinel. Cause if I were to buy a ruby, I'd either get something as red as possible (I'd probably have to steal that from somewhere considering the prices) or nothing at all, so I'd rather opt for a hot pink spinel, since it certainly looks like you're looking for something very pink. I also like better clarity usually found in spinels (compared to rubies) as well as their sharper brilliance with these kinds of colors. So I voted spinel, but it's your preference that matters, I'm just stating my opinion here. Good luck with your project!

 

[Upgradable]

Vapid, can you give me a link to Gene''s site? Oddly enough, I tend to prefer good "native" cut stones to most overly regular precision cuts.

 

[chrono]

I’d go with the spinel only because the ruby isn’t red enough. As to which spinel, you seem to be bothered by the clarity so why not see if Tan has any other Mahenges with decent cutting, colour like that ruby you like that is also eye clean?

 

[colorluvr]

I voted spinel also.

 

[Upgradable]

Here''s the mahenge that REALLY has me tingling! I love the size, the color, and the cut! It''s just those darned crystal inclusions that I don''t know if I could get past.

 

[T L]

You seem to prefer the more pink stones than the more red ones, and sleepy stones. I would point you to a couple I like, but last time I did that, it got sold right away. I just bought this one not too long ago. It has a window, but I liked the color for the price. I'm awaiting it's arrival.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330423490627&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT

 

[dzop]

Maybe I''m misreading the market, but it seems to me that clean mahenges with good color and cut are going for $750+ a carat these days... is that really that much cheaper than pink "ruby"?

(Obviously unheated or ordinary heat red ruby is way, way way more expensive than that.)

 

[VapidLapid]

http://www.precisiongem.com/

http://www.thegemtrader.com/Jan%2010%20MSpinel%20Page.htm

 

[Barrett]

Think of all the millons of people who have rubies..mostly just your run-of-the-mill average consumer..been around for thousands of years..now how many folks have the "new" mahenges? Pretty much just the "in the know" folks when it comes to gemstones..a select group of people who know a good thing when they see it. Mahenge all the way, baby!

 

[Upgradable]

Date: 4/27/2010 12:29:15 PM
Author: amethystguy
Think of all the millons of people who have rubies..mostly just your run-of-the-mill average consumer..been around for thousands of years..now how many folks have the ''new'' mahenges? Pretty much just the ''in the know'' folks when it comes to gemstones..a select group of people who know a good thing when they see it. Mahenge all the way, baby!

Good Lord, I love this board!!

 

[T L]

Date: 4/27/2010 12:27:36 PM
Author: dzop
Maybe I''m misreading the market, but it seems to me that clean mahenges with good color and cut are going for $750+ a carat these days... is that really that much cheaper than pink ''ruby''?

(Obviously unheated or ordinary heat red ruby is way, way way more expensive than that.)

Dzop,
Mahenges are increasingly on the rise, so the time to get one is now. Untreated pink sapphires in a hot pink color are still more expensive, but I feel the prices of Mahenges will attain those levels. Heated pink sapphires are less per carat of course. On Odysseygem''s and AJS, I feel you can get some great deals on Mahenges, but I have noticed the prices going up as well on good clean material.

 

[chrono]

Uppy, the Mahenge you linked to is more of a hot pink with a touch of sleepiness.

 

[VapidLapid]

and a bay window

 

[ma re]

Date: 4/27/2010 12:33:16 PM
Author: Uppy
Good Lord, I love this board!!

You even started rhyming, LOL

 

[T L]

Vapid,
With Mahenges, color is the most important factor IMO. I know people are very much against windows on this board, and that's fine, but for me, and others, the most important thing to consider is the quality of color on a Mahenge. Fine colored Mahenges are rare, and sometimes we have to forgo exceptional cutting to get a good color. On other gems, I think the cutting factor is much more important, like aquas, and greyish blue spinels for example. I much rather have a poorly cut fine colored Mahenge than a well cut rhodolite color Mahenge. JMO.

 

[Upgradable]

Okay, I love the color and shape of this one, but the windowing could be a huge distraction. Even though the videos help a lot, not being able to see a full tilt view can leave unanswered questions.

 

[Barrett]

Not the dreaded "bay window"..lol..Vapid!!! cue music...[dun]..[dun]...[duuuuuu] bay window
TL makes a great point..price are still good for those mahenges..they will go up..up..up..now is the time to buy..

 

[T L]

Date: 4/27/2010 12:56:19 PM
Author: Uppy
Okay, I love the color and shape of this one, but the windowing could be a huge distraction. Even though the videos help a lot, not being able to see a full tilt view can leave unanswered questions.

That is not a Mahenge, and has a distinct orange color to it. It was also a return from someone who spoke in detail about it. I need to find the thread. He/she did say it''s a pure red, but what is pure red to one person might not be to another.

The reason he/she returned it was the window. The gut feeling I got out of that particular thread was that if the color was exceptional, he/she would have kept it, but the window was an excuse to return it. I could be wrong.

 

[Upgradable]

Date: 4/27/2010 12:56:38 PM
Author: amethystguy
Not the dreaded ''bay window''..lol..Vapid!!! cue music...[dun]..[dun]...[duuuuuu] bay window
TL makes a great point..price are still good for those mahenges..they will go up..up..up..now is the time to buy..

It made me laugh too!! Keep posting Vapid. We need the humor to keep us grounded!!

TL, thanks for the head up on the round. I am drawn to the more pinky/watermelon colors. I know I need to choose the color I love most, but if the more red are more valuable I don''t want to discount checking them out.

 

[T L]

Date: 4/27/2010 1:12:20 PM
Author: Uppy

Date: 4/27/2010 12:56:38 PM
Author: amethystguy
Not the dreaded 'bay window'..lol..Vapid!!! cue music...[dun]..[dun]...[duuuuuu] bay window
TL makes a great point..price are still good for those mahenges..they will go up..up..up..now is the time to buy..

It made me laugh too!! Keep posting Vapid. We need the humor to keep us grounded!!

TL, thanks for the head up on the round. I am drawn to the more pinky/watermelon colors. I know I need to choose the color I love most, but if the more red are more valuable I don't want to discount checking them out.

Well, there's flame spinels, which are an orangey red, but I believe those mainly come from Burma. You may want to check those out, but if you're like me, and you don't care for orange red stones, you might want to stick with Mahenges. Some Mahenges have a distinct orange secondary, and I don't find that as attractive, but many people do. It's a matter of taste. To find a pure red spinel, well I'm not sure if that exists. This is a fun thread by the way.

ETA: I could have sworn the origninal listing for that returned gem stated that the stone was from Burma.

 

[LD]

Looks like I''m out on my own here ................ Ruby!!!!

To find a Ruby, in budget (almost) that has a colour you love and is unheated/untreated etc., is much more difficult to find at the moment than a Mahenge. HOWEVER if there is ANY chance of you being able to get both I''d definitely do that. First the Ruby and then the Mahenge.

Is the Ruby from Tan? If so, I would make the sale dependent on the AIGS cert coming back as unheated/untreated and as a Ruby rather than pink sapphire. The first two pics of it make it look a tad too pink (for me). The last shot shows more red and a touch of purple.

 

[Indylady]

Oh dear, I think I might be the only one...but I scream RUBY!

One of the biggest reasons that people seem to be saying spinel over ruby is that the ruby isn''t red enough. Personally, I do think its red enough to be a ruby. However, I think that it doesn''t really make that much of a difference (unless you''re making some sort of premium for it to be called a ruby instead of a pink sapphire, but as far as I''ve seen, Tan''s prices are pretty competitive, even between pink sapphires and rubies).

Tan, Gary Dutton, Africa Gems, Multicolour, and Richard Wise are the few places that I''ve actually seen more than one ruby listed at a time. Other than that, Gene and Jeff White might have one or two precision cut rubies. So if you do want to look for a redder ruby, these would be places to check out.

In my opinion, rubies are classic and untreated, and also unique and rare. Finding a nice ruby is h-a-r-d. Finding a nice spinel is hard as well, but I can name a quite a few vendors off the top of my head that have Mahenges, even fine Mahenges. The vendors that carry rubies, especially bright rubies, seem few and far in between. Millions do have rubies, but it doesn''t mean they have good rubies. Millions have sapphires too, and diamonds, and even spinels, but it doesn''t mean they all have fine gems.

I love the romanticism behind gems, and I''m especially drawn to rubies. I really like a touch of purple in my reds, and though the ruby you posted is fairly pink, I do still like it and would love to see it with a halo of OEC''s or OMC''s, or rosecuts, especially around a native cut stone.

The only deal breaker for me, would be if you found a precision cut Mahenge. I love Flygirl''s oval Mahenge from Gene...

 

[Indylady]

LD, I hadn''t seen your post before I posted! I''m glad to find another ruby advocate on this thread!!

 

[Upgradable]

LovingDiamonds, thanks for being brave!! AIGS does identify it as ruby.

 

[Upgradable]

Here are some more pictures of the ruby. Top row is in bright light. Bottom are in ambient indoor light.