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how is marriage different?

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Rhapsody

Rhapsody

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Sep 23, 2005
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391
At dinner about a week ago I asked my boyfriend if he had any ideas for our wedding; time, date, location, basic stuff. Typical male response: "I don''t really care". After a little bit of probing into his blase attitude he says that he thinks marriage is nothing more than a social convention and the only reason he entertains the idea is that it''s important to me. He doesn''t think a relationshop does or should change after being married and that he doesn''t believe in doing things just because society dictates that to be the appropriate action.

Although I''m glad he''s willing to put my feeling above his by getting married even if he doesn''t feel it important I was surprised by how much I was hurt by the thought that he didn''t see any value in the act of marrying someone.

I''ve been thinking about it since then and still cant cement how I really feel about it. So I need your help ladies, both the LIW and those already married, how does the relationship change after marriage? I''d really appreciate anyone stories and thoughts

Ali
 
I think this depends on the couple, but I can tell you how it differed for us.

When we were dating and even living together before marriage, we were committed to each other, but there wasn''t a sense of everything being "ours" prior to marriage. We had kept separate finances, checkbooks, bills, etc. There was a feeling of separateness (this probably isn''t making sense, but I''ll run with it). After we got married, we became a true union...more than just finances (although we did merge our finances after the wedding), but the merging of families, traditions, learning to really balance each other needs so we both get what we need from each other and the relationship.

There''s a deeper level of commitment to each other...at the first sign of an argument, the thought of leaving doesn''t come to our mind (not that it ever did, but for some people, there''s always a need to find a possible "out"). We want to work hard to make the relationship work and place our priorities first with one another. For us, we''ve been married 10 years, so we''ve gone in and out of the "honeymoon" phase. But with each time we leave that phase, there''s a deeper kind of love that takes over and reinforces the "honeymoon" phase when it reappears.

I don''t know if this is making sense, but it''s the best way I can describe it...maybe someone else will be able to provide another experience that makes it more clear.
 
Well, first of all, the parents don''t rag on me for living in sin anymore.
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You just name the place and I''ve been there by guilt trip.
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As far as how it''s dif, for us it isn''t. Our relationship is the same in a lot of ways as it was before. We try to treat each other with respect, and he and I go out of our way to remember that the other is not a mind reader. Communication is what keeps us going. He works evenings. We talk on the phone at least twice a day. We talk even longer after the kids are in bed. It helps to reconnect our day to each other.

The main difference that I see in before and after is how people treat me. I am now "respectable" since we are married. At my age, people just didn''t know how to introduce me when it came to our relationship. I even had to point out to his mother when she introduced me to a neighbor as um Kev''s um, girlfriend um live-in?
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that I was actually wearing a ring and was engaged to her son. I usually don''t care what other people think (not that I am insensitive of other''s feelings), but it was hard to deal with being treated by some as something they would wipe off their shoe.

Just my .02

shay
 
I know how completely unromantic this sounds but....here''s a legal perspective. My FH and I went round about whether or not we wanted to get married or cohabitate. In the end we decided that marriage provided better security for both of us.
 
Well it looks like you''re going to have to type the addy in the search engine. It''s a nice chart that has the pros and cons of marriage/cohabitation.
 
Wow, that''s... oh... *hugs*

I would be hurt too if my boyfriend told me that for him marriage is nothing but a social convention, because for me it''s much more than that. It''s full of meaning and love and joy.
For me, marriage is a promise to love each other and support each other and respect each other for the rest of your lives, for better or for worse. The wedding is a celebration of your love and devotion to each other with your family and friends. When you wear that ring it means "Look everyone! I love and I''m loved by the most wonderful man in the world and we''re going to spend the rest of our days together as husband and wife!"

Maybe you should try to find out why he sees it that way? Have you shared your views on the matter with him? I think that would be a very important thing to do before you get married! Make sure you''re on the same level when it comes to the important issues of your lives...

*hugs again*
 
I appreciate everyone sharing their thoughts with me. This has been an interesting train of thought for me.

I know he doesn''t feel the pressure and *disdain* from people who don''t view a cohabiting relationship as being as meaningful and stable as a marriage. I for one am tired of people who have been together much longer than my boyfriend and I saying "but we''re *married*". It''s so frustrating. He knows that for me the social and legal officialness is important but I find the symbolism and spiritual nature of the wedding ceremony to be important, and I do think it somehow shifts your perception of the relationship after the ritual joining of two people. He on the other hand is less sentimental and feels marriage is just a piece of paper that confirms something that should already exist and views it an entirely unneccessary.

He told me that he has no issues with the idea of a wedding, that if he had a problem with standing in front of our friends and family and affirming our commitment that something would be seriously wrong with our relationship. He''s willing to get married and doesn''t act like I''m making him do something he doesn''t want to. He just doesn''t think it''s important. I feel like I may be asking too much but I just feel like it should be something more than just a legal action.

Thanks again ladies!

Ali
 
Marriage is about committment to make it work. Their are also legal things involved. Without the marriage a guy (or gal) is free to leave with no real conseqences if something tics them off. In the event of major medical issues, marriage guarantees you the right to intervien (over other family memebers) and gives you legal standing in regards to the estate should a death occur.

I personally would not want a long term relationship to the kinds of things I wish to persue without marriage involved.

Perry
 
Perhaps he meant he does not care for a white dress and bouquet, a cake, and champagne toasts. It's not that the symbolism of marriage isn't important, but he thinks the excesses of weddings are just a way to show how rich/well-connected one and to fulfill social obligations. This is what my beau thinks, so I thought I would share. He does think being married is important, but won't care about the fuss and the frills. He's just happy to be excited because I am excited.
 
Date: 11/3/2005 7:36:34 PM
Author:Rhapsody
At dinner about a week ago I asked my boyfriend if he had any ideas for our wedding; time, date, location, basic stuff. Typical male response: ''I don''t really care''. After a little bit of probing into his blase attitude he says that he thinks marriage is nothing more than a social convention and the only reason he entertains the idea is that it''s important to me. He doesn''t think a relationshop does or should change after being married and that he doesn''t believe in doing things just because society dictates that to be the appropriate action.

Although I''m glad he''s willing to put my feeling above his by getting married even if he doesn''t feel it important I was surprised by how much I was hurt by the thought that he didn''t see any value in the act of marrying someone.

I''ve been thinking about it since then and still cant cement how I really feel about it. So I need your help ladies, both the LIW and those already married, how does the relationship change after marriage? I''d really appreciate anyone stories and thoughts

Ali
Click to expand...
I have to second what has already been said here on top of a few things or views I can contribute...Marriage isn''t for wimps. After the shopping for the wedding dress is over, the cake is cut, the honeymoon has been taken, the real work begins...but so does the fun
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...

One of the best moments for me was one day shortly after we were married and I just looked over at my then-new hubby at some family or social event and thought, "that''s MY husband!...he chose ME!...This is incredible...I get to wake up every day to this guy and I am so happy." That feeling has reoccurred a few times over and over in the 24 1/2 years we have been married. Have we had rough times? Oh yea...really rough, but together we are committed to get through it and because of a legal piece of paper that says we are husband and wife, when we have both been stubborn about things, it brings things into perspective.

For me, living together was not an option. For me, having kids together w/o marriage also was not an option. If I was to have that in my life with someone, it had to be with marriage or it wasn''t on the agenda. Remember, I said--for me. I know alot of my friends chose differently and that is their choice and I have seen not so great results from it. Fortunately, that has not been the case for me.

I married young, though at the time I didn''t think so. I got married one month and 1 week from turning 21 years old. I was a mature 20 yr old, but still just 20. My husband and I have been through what would have torn other couples apart in our time as a married couple--9 kids being born (we love them each, but its alot of work and challenging in more ways than I want to take the time to get into in this thread or post!--and I don''t regret loving them
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), 1 child born early due to birth defects with his kidneys that required successive surgeries after birth, 3 of our kids have ADD, and its plain hard on any marriage when you have kids close together in age. I know the next question or comment from most is, "Did you plan on having 9 kids? or Do you know what causes that?" Of course we do! And 3 of our kids were "bonus" babies--not planned on in advance but loved anyways.

I came from an extremely stoic family with a mom that is highly dramatic and I have a brother that has mental and emotional issues. I was the oldest and only girl and was expected to succeed and carve the way for her brothers, to care for them and be there for them or any of the family in any event. That is alot to put on a kid, any kid, but that was my life. You fail, you fail not just yourself, but the family. My father expected me to honor the family ways and loyalities and I did...most of the time. I changed faiths and that shook the entire family tree. It was right for me. The family tree let me know it was not approved of. I became a sort of outsider. It was hard, but I still tried to honor my parents and family.

My husband came from a more layback, touchy, feely sort of family with a father that was more physically gone then there due to the Navy and/or working sometimes 2 or 3 jobs for the family. He was not a participatory father per se, but he tried his best with what he knew to do: provide for the family. He wasn''t emotionally available for his 4 sons so that had an effect. My mother in law has always been and admits to this day that she is somewhat dense about things. She has always been loving, hugging, kissing and there to a point for her sons. Her parenting abilities included playing ball with her sons, swimming with them and horseing around since their father was absent alot, but her interest in their academics was missing according to my husband and one of my brothers in law. Structure, guidelines, and discipline was lax or all but not there. She felt she could better teach them then to discipline them so they told me they often felt lost.

I share all of this cuz it affects how you are as husbands, as wives, and as parents based on what you see and experience. My husband and I had more arguements or disagreements on parenting or social situations because of our respective homes of orientation. We were raised in such different scenarios and we have had to compromise alot and still are as our family changes. Be open to change. Talk alot and often, but be willing to listen more. Couples therapy has been so amazingly helpful. Without it, we might have already been divorced. Compromise is part of the maturity that usually capsizes alot of relationships due mostly to selfishness. I know because I lived it.

Our eldest son is engaged to be married in May 2006. He and his fiancee are in couples premarital counseling--which we did not suggest but support wholeheartedly. Together, they are talking through issues that often cause young marriages to crumble before they have an opportunity to take root.

I am sorry to have gone on and on, but I felt it was important to do so and that meant sharing a bit more of me than I planned on when I started...
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...

Hope something I have said is helpful...
 
Some people just don''t see the need for the legalities of marriage. I have friends who have been together for 11 years...they were together for 7 when they had their first child ...they bought a house together shortly after. Then their next child came a year later and 2 years later they have a last one. After child #1 everyone was asking when they would get married. They said they didn''t feel the need to, why would they have to? They''d already been together for 7 years....and have a child together. Well after or around child #2 they actually DID get married but never told anyone...I happened to find out when I was out at dinner with a few of the girlfriends and this gal (we all used to work together and get together about 2ce a year to visit and catch up)..and she was talking to me on the side about my rings or something and somehow let it slip about ''city hall'' or something and I was like ''WHAT'' and she was like ''shhh''. So for years the other girls didn''t know either. Kind of funny. Anyway I think they ended up getting married because they had kids and probably something to do with CA tax and also laws about property and estates if something were to happen to them or something. But definitely not because they felt their relationship was lacking or somehow needed that ''committment'' of marriage. She doesn''t even wear a ring nor does he.

Anyway...that is just a story I thought was interesting and relevant to this Q. Some people are outside the ''norm'' and just don''t feel the need for legal trappings to dictate how they are going to live their lives or ''prove their love''..etc etc.

For us...we lived together before we got married for 1+ years and had bought a house 5 months before getting married. It was funny because people would say to us..''well why don''t you wait til you are married to buy a house?'' My joking response was ''Property is alot more legally binding in California than any marriage!''. Well and CA is a community property state.
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But anyway, after we got married, it seemed more ''final''...like it was somehow more important than dating or being engaged. I was his ''wife'' and he was my ''husband''...you know, titles reserved for GROWNUPS or something like that!
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Also , I still get a little thrill when he introduces me as his wife instead of his girlfriend, silly but true. Also, our rings are significant to us, wearing them.

Our relationship changed a bit, in that like AChio mentioned up above, there''s some sort of deeper mental level of committment that you have...and I''m sure not everyone needs that like my friends up above, but I definitely felt it when we would sit down and discuss OUR finances or OUR future plans or goals in terms of RETIREMENT and things that were going to be our future together. Us both being pretty independent in life before we met the other and even right up until marriage...having our own finances and this and that, planning your life and retirement and plans with someone was a new feeling. Somehow dating and planning things is not the same as when you are married and planning things. Like the rest of your life.

Okay now I am rambling. Anyway bottom line is I felt like things changed for us when we got married but none of it was relationship or love stuff, it was more like little details here and there that would remind us that we were no longer dating, but were in it for life!
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Hmmm...good question!

First, Are you sure he wasn't just in a bad mood or perhaps annoyed with something during that conversation? Were you droning on and on about wedding-related stuff to a boy??? I know for a fact there were several times when my husband would have loved to see the wedding just over and done with and for us to just be married and calm! He was very helpful throughout the 11 months that we were engaged...but come on, he's a guy, he'd rather be on the golf course than listening to me as I explain the importance of the bridesmaid's dresses matching the ink color on our invitations! He'd often look at me with that puzzled "Who stole my girlfriend?" stare...But, when when all the plans were made and the festivities were held...you've never seen a happier groom!!!

But...here are a few things that I think changed...and we lived together for a while...

The waiting for the next great thing feeling disappears...in a good way. The waiting to be boyfriend/girlfriend is over, the waiting to be engaged thing is over, the wedding is over...it is so nice to simply relax.

You're no longer worried that he might just break up with you. It's replaced with a sense of calmness and contendedness that's hard to explain.

My money becomes our money.

People treat you more like grownups...like before you weren't quite as legit as a couple.

And the main thing that has changed for me is that it's not all about me anymore...it's about the family we've created!!! If I had been pregnant before our weeding last summer, I would not have been at all happy. The fact that we are now expecting our first child in May has become the amazing and beautiful thing in the world to both of us!!!

klr
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prongs
 
Congrats on your upcoming blessing, Heart Prongs.

shay
 
I totally second everything that AChioAlumna said above!!
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I have only been married just over 2.5 years. Prior to that, I was "dating" my husband for 6 years. The two years prior to getting married, we moved in together. But like it was mentioned above, before marriage, things just seemed "separate". I knew he had my back and I his, but I knew that if the going got tough, either one of us could just simply....leave. Now it''s not that easy. Now we are truly a team. I cannot express the sense of committment you have to one another in a marriage. What a unit it is. It''s almost an "us against the world" type of feeling! I absolutely adore being married! I love knowing that we are going to be there for each other, through thick and thin, for the rest of our lives. I love that he is there for me every morning and night, and I for him. I have a medical condition that puts me in the hospital frequently. He is always there, the first one there. He helps me when I''m ill. He helps me when I''m depressed and can''t get out of bed. and I do the same for him. It''s just a team. In a marriage, you are each other''s best friends. You are each other''s confidants. You''re each other''s biggest supporter and biggest fan.
My husband and I are both in the military and have been deployed overseas. We have seen some of the worst situations on Earth. We know just how horrible this world can be. And for that, we are lucky, because we realize how important it is to cherish the one you love, everyday, no matter what. And that is what our marriage is based on - loving one another and fighthing to keep the marriage alive and well. We just realize that nothing else makes us happier and NOTHING - not a career, money, etc - is worth our marriage falling by the wayside. Of course we work and need cash (doesn''t everyone?!), but we make it a priority to let our marriage come first, no matter what.
What I''ve learned so far is that communication is absolutely the most important thing, followed immediately by compromise. Lucky for me, I have a hubby that is very open and expressive of his feelings and wants and needs. But we are constantly talking and communicating how we feel and what we expect of each other and what we see in the future for us. Some people may roll their eyes at that, but that''s just what works for us. Everyone is different, as is every couple.
I''m sorry your bf feels that way about marriage. Honestly, he may come around as he "matures" . But he may not. Either way, I hope that someday you get to experience the joys ( and sometimes the heartaches) of marriage. There truly isn''t any other union like it on Earth. It''s a such a blissful feeling to find the one you want to spend each and every day with - and then spend it with them!!
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That''s beautiful, IrishEyes! Thanks for sharing!
 
Well, when you are not married, it''s just about you as a couple. You are both separate entities, and at the same time, you are a couple. But it''s all about the two of you. It''s the FUN time, where things are not so serious and permanent and you get to focus on romance and being together. You only have to be terribly concerned with HIS feelings, needs, etc. When you are married, you become part of each other''s families and you have to consider them, plus your family as well. INLAWS! Oh, dear. His family will feel (perhaps) more free to meddle in your business, and also to welcome you as part of their family -- permanently if the relationship has a solid foundation. Your family will also become his, and they may feel more entitled to voice opinions about what you do as well. Your religious beliefs will become more important in the ways they affect your life as a married couple. How will you raise your children, if you have any. What will you name them -- you have no idea how charged this issue can become if there are "traditions" about this in one or both families. The families, at first, will jockey into position and vie for favor, possibly. If both families are in town, be prepared for a struggle over holiday get togethers. it is not at all uncommon for the hostess in each family to pick the exact same serving time as the other, and they will both be hurt if you are not there to eat the food! Get those arrangements set ahead of time, before marriage, if possible, as in do you switch families so that it''s one family''s year and the other''s the next, or what. The two of you may also have little power struggles. I have to say that the first year of my sixteen (so far) year marriage was the hardest. Even though we had already discussed our expectations as far as division of household duties, children, etc., the reality of being very accountable to each other for what we spent money on, time on, etc., was stressful for me. Decorating the house and buying home furnishings was a struggle because we had different tastes, so who gets their way on which lamp, rug, sofa, etc.? How do you work it out so no one feels dominated? Who has the most control over these decisions in the marriage? Then once children come into the picture, there is a whole new dimension to this. Men''s lives tend to be much less affected by the addition of children, but our''s change drastically. Do we still work? Do we stay at home? All the final decisions about childcare usually fall on Mom''s shoulders. New babies are hard on new moms, especially if Dad thinks it''s mostly Mom''s job. Don''t say that won''t happen to you -- you truly don''t know until you are the one up every two hours with a baby at your breast. But I digress....

Sounds like a horrible thing to do, marriage, but actually, if you are on strong, solid ground, it''s also very comforting to know that the man you have married intends to be there growing old with you through all the good and bad times. Having someone to care for you when you have the flu, sympathize with you when you''ve had a bad day, and help you decide what to do when you don''t know. Having someone to take care of the car and do some of the "man" things is wonderful. I love how my husband likes to make sure my tires are aired up and there is enough fluid in all the right places -- and all of that stuff (mowing the lawn!). He takes care of me. I take care of and nurture him, too. It''s a very good, healthy, loving thing.

But whoever said it above is absolutely correct. Marriage is not for wimps. It''s hard work, but well worth the rewards if you are willing to put forth the effort.
 
Lumpkin...there''s a lot of wisdom and experience in what you just wrote. Thanks!!!

klr
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prongs
 
Hey Ali,

I think that different people have differnt views on marriage. I've been with my boyfriend for 10 years and although I come from ultra conservative family, I don't think marriage is going to make anything that different for us. We feel as though everything is "ours" anyways.

So for me personally, I feel the following things about marriage:

a) It's a promise you make in front of your family and friends
b)I feel that to some extent, marriage is a social convention
c) and a reason to have a party and wear a white dress

Ok now that being said, I don't think that it changes how much I love my boyfriend (A LOT
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) or the fact that I want to spend the rest of my life with him. I don't think I could possibly love him MORE. Married or not it has no bearing on my feelings for him.

Maybe the flip side will make it better? Coming from a girl. For me, a wedding is a nice symbol, I would like to have a wedding (so we can live together and my parents not kill me) but it has little bearing on my feelings for him. Although I sure won't agree to marry someone that I DIDN'T want to spend the rest of my life with
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Date: 11/6/2005 8:55:59 PM
Author: allycat0303
Hey Ali,

I think that different people have differnt views on marriage. I've been with my boyfriend for 10 years and although I come from ultra conservative family, I don't think marriage is going to make anything that different for us. We feel as though everything is 'ours' anyways.

So for me personally, I feel the following things about marriage:

a) It's a promise you make in front of your family and friends
b)I feel that to some extent, marriage is a social convention
c) and a reason to have a party and wear a white dress

Ok now that being said, I don't think that it changes how much I love my boyfriend (A LOT
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) or the fact that I want to spend the rest of my life with him. I don't think I could possibly love him MORE. Married or not it has no bearing on my feelings for him.

Maybe the flip side will make it better? Coming from a girl. For me, a wedding is a nice symbol, I would like to have a wedding (so we can live together and my parents not kill me) but it has little bearing on my feelings for him. Although I sure won't agree to marry someone that I DIDN'T want to spend the rest of my life with
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Click to expand...
I agree with Allycat. My fiance and I have lived together for seven years. We got engaged last December and are getting married next year. To be totally honest, the only reason I feel the NEED to marry is:

1. It's expected in our society.
2. It offers us legal rights and protection.

The truth is we already share so much. We have our own traditions. We're already close to each other's families. Hell, my family would rather talk to him than me! Even after we marry, we plan to keep so many things the same. I'm not changing my name and we're hanging on to our separate checking accounts (although we'll probably get a joint savings account before the wedding.) We'll also keep up our wacky way of splitting the bills because it's just easier right now. However, when we buy a house, we'll probably revisit that. However, what we do just works for us. Marriage is different for different people. And I do feel it's unfair for outsiders to judge relationships and feel that you're not "worthy" unless you're married. Nor do I feel marriage makes everything so hunky-dory, either. For example, I have a friend who got married last year. The truth is she basically pushed her boyfriend into the marriage and seemed oblivious to the problems in their relationship, which so many of us could plainly see. I think she just got wrapped up in the "marriage, house, baby" image that is pushed on couples. Anyway, a year later, they are having major problems, and while you want to be sympathetic, you just want to yell "you KNEW that before you married!" I think she was under the illusion that saying "I do" makes everything better.

Sorry to go off on a tangent. I guess my basic answer is this, I love my fiance so much. After all the time we've invested in our relationship, I find it hard to believe us breaking up before marriage would somehow be less devastating than after marriage. I think it's insulting to our relationship, no matter what our marital status. Maybe that's what your boyfriend is thinking.
 
A lot of the difference is in how OTHERS see you as a couple. That can''t be overlooked. Even if you don''t care about other people''s perceptions, they do affect you, how you are treated, and how your families regard you. Once you are married, you are a unit, as one person put it, and people treat you that way. As a couple living together, even though it''s serious, people still see you as individuals, which has both good and bad points.

Getting married also affects your friendships. I noticed it more as a single woman whose friends were getting married. You change "clubs" when you get married. My friends were MY FRIENDS and then they got married. After that they became "Jeff''s wife" (for example) and a lot less MY FRIEND. So as you get married, don''t be surprised if the dynamics of your friendships change, too. Somewhere in the traditional vows, one pledges one''s loyalty to their new spouse above loyalty to all other people, and those vows DO change us, and our relationship to our friends. Your single friends may feel a little "betrayed" after all they were there FIRST, LOL! But loyalty to our spouse is necessary -- we have to be a united force as a couple and as parents, and probably a variety of other ways.
 
Date: 11/7/2005 8:39:52 AM
Author: lumpkin
A lot of the difference is in how OTHERS see you as a couple. That can''t be overlooked. Even if you don''t care about other people''s perceptions, they do affect you, how you are treated, and how your families regard you. Once you are married, you are a unit, as one person put it, and people treat you that way. As a couple living together, even though it''s serious, people still see you as individuals, which has both good and bad points.

Getting married also affects your friendships. I noticed it more as a single woman whose friends were getting married. You change ''clubs'' when you get married. My friends were MY FRIENDS and then they got married. After that they became ''Jeff''s wife'' (for example) and a lot less MY FRIEND. So as you get married, don''t be surprised if the dynamics of your friendships change, too. Somewhere in the traditional vows, one pledges one''s loyalty to their new spouse above loyalty to all other people, and those vows DO change us, and our relationship to our friends. Your single friends may feel a little ''betrayed'' after all they were there FIRST, LOL! But loyalty to our spouse is necessary -- we have to be a united force as a couple and as parents, and probably a variety of other ways.
Click to expand...
This is very true and worth pointing out. Not only does society, your surrounding friends & family view you in a different light - you view yourself in a different light. The finality of marriage allows future planning on a very concrete level.

And, legally it could be very important - inheritance tax, joint property rights, medical judgements, social security benefits, etc.
 
For us little changed after the wedding but the engagement seemed to be a more important turning point in the relationship. After we got engaged, we merged our finances and started planning for the distant future and freely discussing the subject of children. That feeling of certainty also really came with the engagement, not the wedding. The wedding ceremony to us was about celebrating what we already had but there were some subtle and welcome changes afterwards as well. Like all of a sudden being able to say, "my nephews" when they were prevously "my boyfriend's/fiance's nephews." And I still get a kick out of calling Scott "my husband". On the other hand, I do agree that marriage is not for everybody and you don't need to be legally married to be fully committed. I know a few perfectly happy, committed couples who only got married because of legal/insurance issues after having kids. It's not like their relationships were any less serious before they got their marriage certificates.
 
Date: 11/7/2005 11:51:52 AM
Author: fire&ice

Date: 11/7/2005 8:39:52 AM
Author: lumpkin
A lot of the difference is in how OTHERS see you as a couple. That can''t be overlooked. Even if you don''t care about other people''s perceptions, they do affect you, how you are treated, and how your families regard you. Once you are married, you are a unit, as one person put it, and people treat you that way. As a couple living together, even though it''s serious, people still see you as individuals, which has both good and bad points.

Getting married also affects your friendships. I noticed it more as a single woman whose friends were getting married. You change ''clubs'' when you get married. My friends were MY FRIENDS and then they got married. After that they became ''Jeff''s wife'' (for example) and a lot less MY FRIEND. So as you get married, don''t be surprised if the dynamics of your friendships change, too. Somewhere in the traditional vows, one pledges one''s loyalty to their new spouse above loyalty to all other people, and those vows DO change us, and our relationship to our friends. Your single friends may feel a little ''betrayed'' after all they were there FIRST, LOL! But loyalty to our spouse is necessary -- we have to be a united force as a couple and as parents, and probably a variety of other ways.
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This is very true and worth pointing out. Not only does society, your surrounding friends & family view you in a different light - you view yourself in a different light. The finality of marriage allows future planning on a very concrete level.

And, legally it could be very important - inheritance tax, joint property rights, medical judgements, social security benefits, etc.
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I second all of this that has been said...You are perceived differently by society. Its not a right or wrong...its just the way it is. Legally, if one of you are in the hospital for medical care, that is when for sure the perception of husband and wife vs. boyfriend and girlfriend really comes into play. Unfortunatley for those who are committed and living together but not married, when it comes down to making life and death decisions, your options are highly limited. Most hospitals, doctors, etc., want a spouse or another family member to make such decisions and are almost deaf to those who are not married but committed and living together. I had a friend that this very situation affected and it was so hard for them. When they did get married it was after this episode, realizing that they didn''t want others involved in making such personal choices for them(like a mom, dad, brother, sister)...just each other.
Being married for me meant I had a committed partner who was there for me, could speak for me if necessary, and was going to hang around through the rough patches of life. Signing our names on the paper didn''t make us more committed...we already were. Making things legally binding was for our own protection and it was a major relief knowing we both felt this was the right thing for us at the right time.
Irregardless of anyone''s views on whether one should or should not live together b4 marriage, you need to be at that place where you are 100% ready to stick by that person through whatever when you do marry. Too many people get married with the mindset that if it doesn''t work out in the first couple of years, they are out of there. That''s pathetic!
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Selfishness is the #1 reason marriages end up failing. When you are truly unselfish, you recognize as each problem or situation comes up that maybe a little more compromise will be needed to get through this...but you don''t quit!
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I have always said and will always say that marriage is not for wimps or cowards. If you aren''t sure you want to go through alot of growth as individuals and as a couple--for the long haul--don''t do it. Save yourself and your family and friends alot of headaches, but most importantly, use the time you aren''t "hooked up" to anyone to re-evaluate you. Make you as full, as whole a person as you can hope to be to draw to you the person who will be a signficant part of your life...whether it ends up in marriage or not.
I advised my soon to be 24 year old daughter of this and she is going to school, working 3 jobs and is helping to find out who she is...and for her, that is fine. My 22 1/2 year old son is engaged and he and his fiancee are in premarital counseling which I think is incredibly helpful to them as seperate individuals and as a couple.
When I was younger, I was so caught up in doing what others felt was right for me to do...and I was not happy, not really. Now, in my 40''s, I am SO much better off!
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I really could care less if my choices for me or my family don''t sit well with someone else...its my business and that''s where the buck stops.

Just my 0.2 cents...
 
Before I talked to my boyfriend I spent some more time considering how I felt about marriage. And honestly, except for the legal/property/insurance/health care issue I don''t care about the paper work. I''m not religious and we don''t want children so theres no pressure to marry there. And as Lumpkin mentioned, family is a big deal, but unfortunately my family is not a factor in my life for myriad reasons, his family (his moms family at least) has made it quite clear they dont like me (by gossiping about me like a bunch of children) and the boy has stood up and told them if they dont come around they wont be a factor in our life either so for the most part it is only us we have to worry about. We''d both love to have loving supportive families, but it wasn''t in the cards it seems.

We''re young, we''ve been living together through college and so we''ve already covered a lot of the living together issues (e.g. chores, money management, decorating), everything we have is "ours" because we started with nothing as has been mentioned before. We do both maintain separate bank accounts though, so we have our freedom to blow 20 bucks on lip gloss and 180 on a tail light conversion without the other being allowed to complain. We''ve discussed and agree on financial goals and a plan to try and achieve them. We''ve been living together for about 4 years, I can''t imagine too much of the day to day is going to change when we do get married. IrishEyes, I''m glad you have a supportive husband to help you when things are bad. That feeling of being a team is definitely something I want to make sure we have, since as I''ve mentioned we dont have much support from others so we need to count on each other. I wish you good health.

My parents weren''t married until I was about 8 I think and finally did it for insurance, like your friends Mara. I''m sure their attitude influenced my view of marriage. For me what is important is having some sort of ceremony. Just the two of us, in CO you dont need an officiant or even to file the paperwork since common law marriages are legal. But I believe that there is power in ritual, and that focusing your energy on something in a ritual manner does strengthen... something intangible. I do want to file the paperwork so that we are legally covered though. After separating the idea of a "commitment ceremony" from that of marriage my boyfriend seems to like the idea of doing something to celebrate our commitment to each other.

I told the boyfriend this and he told me his exceptions to marriage are 2: 1) You shouldnt need someone else (a priest, rabbi, judge or whatever) to validate your relationship. He thinks its almost condescending to our relationship to stand in front of someone and have them say "ok, NOW it''s real" because to him it always has been. And 2) He doesnt want marriage to ever be a bandaide or have it be the reason we stay together. He looked at me and told me that I''m stuck with him for the rest of his life, marriage or not. I am his family now.
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. He was noticing my frustration about the way people were treating me/us and didn''t want that to be the reason we get married, but he does understand that the way people treat you affects the way you feel and act and does see the value in having people recognize your relationship (even though he finds it sad that they dont recognize it based on its merits but rather a piece of paper).

So I think my boyfriend and I were on the same page the whole time, just weighing a few of the issues differently and focusing on different aspects of the same issue. I feel much better about the situation now, the ring was ordered friday and now I just get to wait. Sorry for the book I wrote. I hope it made it out of my head and into the fray clearly.

AChi, Shay, Matata, Anchor, Perry, Julie, Deanna, Mara, heart prongs, IrishEyes, Lumpkin, Ally, tanyak, fire&ice and elepri thank you for sharing your stories and thoughts with me. Every comment made me think and helped me get to the point in my head where things make sense and I appreciate it greatly
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You''re welcome, Rhapsody!

I''m glad you two have talked things through and are on the same page and agree with each other. If you do, then the rest shouldn''t matter! Everyone has their own reasons to get married, but as long as both of the members of the couples have the same, it can work.

Good luck with your future plans!
 
Anchor, and with so many different reasons to get married it''s hard to sort out what is and isn''t important, and you have no idea how some issues will impact you in the future (which is why I appreciate everyones input so much).

Here''s hoping the wait isn''t too long for either of us
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I think it''s very important to base those reasons on what you believe in and what are your values in life.

Thanks for the wishes, I have to say your waiting time will probably be much shorter than mine!
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I hope everything turns out for the best for you and your SO!
 
Rhapsody - I''m glad our stories helped! It sounds like you are pretty clear with where you and your bf stand in your relationship, and it sounds like you have a very mature outlook on it and your future! Hope things continue to go well!
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Date: 11/3/2005 7:36:34 PM
Author:Rhapsody
At dinner about a week ago I asked my boyfriend if he had any ideas for our wedding; time, date, location, basic stuff. Typical male response: ''I don''t really care''. After a little bit of probing into his blase attitude he says that he thinks marriage is nothing more than a social convention and the only reason he entertains the idea is that it''s important to me. He doesn''t think a relationshop does or should change after being married and that he doesn''t believe in doing things just because society dictates that to be the appropriate action.
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This is exactly how my husband felt/feels. I made him get married anyway. He only had a few things he had opinions on so it was really my decision/my mom''s decision. I don''t think anything is different now versus before we were married other than now people snicker at my last name and not just his, the cable company has still not figured out my married name after 4 attempts to change it, and we are just as broke.
 
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