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How to proceed with vintage diamond for new e-ring

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wright44

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 14, 2010
Messages
3
Hi everyone,

I have decided to purchase a vintage ring to take the center diamond out of instead of buying a new diamond (the current setting is wayy too large to consider salvaging). The ring (according to the seller) has a ~0.75 carat center diamond with a 6mm diameter, G-H color, and VS - SI1 clarity.

A few questions...

1) Is this a modern round brilliant cut or is it a transitional cut or something else entirely? The crown seems somewhat high to my eyes, but I am no expert.

2) Assuming that the picture is accurate, do the stats of the diamond seem plausible? (The width of the shank is 5mm and the actual ring size is >9)

3) Is it worth it to have the diamond repolished considering its age? I would like to get it GIA certified and am afraid that it may score lower if it is slightly scratched...is that a possibility? Also, do you think it could improve its general appearance?


Pics:

93olddiaernick1.jpg

93olddiaernick2.jpg
 
wright44 said:
1) Is this a modern round brilliant cut or is it a transitional cut or something else entirely? The crown seems somewhat high to my eyes, but I am no expert.
Click to expand...

It's hard to tell from the pix -- perhaps one of the experts will chime in on this.

wright44 said:
2) Assuming that the picture is accurate, do the stats of the diamond seem plausible? (The width of the shank is 5mm and the actual ring size is >9)
Click to expand...

The color looks to be lower (could be the lighting), but the clarity seems plausible. The ct weight is a total crapshoot, but the diameter looks about right (if the shank width is 5mm as you say).

wright44 said:
3) Is it worth it to have the diamond repolished considering its age? I would like to get it GIA certified and am afraid that it may score lower if it is slightly scratched...is that a possibility? Also, do you think it could improve its general appearance?
Click to expand...

If it's scratched, GIA will give it a lower score on the "polish" category, but the scratches should not affect the color, clarity, carat weight, or symmetry criteria. Just keep in mind that repolishing generally removes weight.

Recutting (If you can find someone to work on a diamond of this size) would really improve the performance. It looks like it will be dark and leaky (based on the face up photo). Alternatively, is a modern diamond not a possibility? What is your budget?

Btw, I really like the setting! Too bad I don't wear a 9.
 
yeah I guess I am with antelope-why not just get a modern diamond? are you looking for a vintage diamond specifically?
 
Yes, I am looking specifically for an older diamond.

I'm in an interesting situation because my girlfriend does not want me to spend a lot of money on a diamond (the whole overpriced bit - although obviously that is a personal valuation) but still wants a traditional diamond ring. Initially I was going to just buy a cheaper (~$2000) modern round in the 0.75 carat range but she has recently expressed interest in having a vintage/antique diamond.

I am not interested in recutting...just the possibility of repolishing.

Antelope, the leakage you mention worries me a bit, although I hear that older diamonds are more prone to leakage. Is there a best way to minimize leakage (closed bezel?).
 
wright44 said:
Yes, I am looking specifically for an older diamond.

I'm in an interesting situation because my girlfriend does not want me to spend a lot of money on a diamond (the whole overpriced bit - although obviously that is a personal valuation) but still wants a traditional diamond ring. Initially I was going to just buy a cheaper (~$2000) modern round in the 0.75 carat range but she has recently expressed interest in having a vintage/antique diamond.

I am not interested in recutting...just the possibility of repolishing.

Antelope, the leakage you mention worries me a bit, although I hear that older diamonds are more prone to leakage. Is there a best way to minimize leakage (closed bezel?).
Click to expand...
Glad you're not planning to recut the diamond. Doesn't make sense to buy a vintage diamond to have it recut. . .takes the charm out of the stone.

A closed bezel on a stone with leakage won't minimize it. The brilliance of a stone is from the light going through the top of the diamond. If you're concerned about the light return of that diamond, then maybe look around more!
 
Its hard to tell from the pics but from my eyes it looks like a round brilliant. I *think* I see arrow shafts. Can you get any more
pics?
 
Looks to be an early modern brilliant. I say this because the table seems smaller than a modern RB.

Do you see a culet? Kinda hard to tell from the photos.
 
Beautiful ring! However, if your really going to change the setting and aren't sure about the stone, I would consider searching some more. There are great places to buy vintage stones/settings for great prices. If your budget is 2-3k you (I'm guessing because you you'd need to buy a new setting) can buy from
http://antiqueengagementrings.com/shopping/shopdisplayproducts.asp?page=8

and
http://jewelsbyericagrace.com/antique_vintage_and_reproductions_rings

Also, there is www.rubylane.com to check but it requires a bit more searching.

If you give me a budget and ideas for a setting I can see what I can pull up for you if your interested!

BTW: I'm in the same boat as your gf. I didn't want my bf to pay the mark up when I know I can get something just as beautiful for less than half the price. I managed to find a 1.64 transitional (almost ideal cut) diamond in a vintage setting for 4500.00 (H VVS1). For the same amount I can't even get a new, 1 carat J SI1 ideal cut diamond on the market today. So, she's doesn't have a bad idea there! :tongue:
 
yeah I would maybe pass on this one or try to get more pics then-it doesn't seem to be the best example of an antique stone out there.
 
slg47 said:
yeah I would maybe pass on this one or try to get more pics then-it doesn't seem to be the best example of an antique stone out there.
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Sig47, I totally agree.

Antique Engagement Rings (http://antiqueengagementrings.com/shopping/shopdisplayproducts.asp?page=12) has a bunch at that price point (or less) that are already set. If you go higher in page number, they get even less expensive. I really like their stuff, personally.
 
It's really hard to tell from the pics. I am pretty confident, though, that it is not an OEC. It may be a later transitional or an early round brilliant, I would guess round brilliant if I had to though. The facet structure looks very splintery and not chunky at all, which is what I'm basing that on.

I'd keep looking. If your GF wants a good example of an antique cut, I don't know that this type of cut is what she would have in mind. It appears (from the photos) that it is going to mostly act like a modern RB with not so fabulous proportions and symmetry. It isn't quite old enough to have the chunky facets that most antique cut lovers enjoy. At least from what I can tell with the slightly blurry photos, of course.

Also with antique stones, definitely look for chips around the girdle. Many, many, many of them have chips and bearding- girdles were cut razor thin fairly often which made them really easy to chip. Basically my rule of thumb is, if I can see the chip with my naked eye then the price had better be ridiculously low for me to consider the stone. If it's only visible through a loupe, that's much better. Often chips are the clarity graders in older stones, in fact. You don't often see VVS stones in antique cuts- wear & tear will lower the clarity quite a bit.

There are quite a lot of great vintage pieces in this size range. I'd keep looking. Ebay, local pawnshops, and antique stores can be good places to check out. And a lot of smaller modern jewelry stores carry a few vintage pieces on occasion too.

ETA: Also, I think you would do best to find a complete ring to go with. Antique settings are a killer value- you simply can't get that type of workmanship (die struck, pierced, hand engraved etc.) in a modern setting without spending many, many, many thousands with Van Craeynest. (They're the *only* place still using those technqiues). And vintage settings can be super cheap even with the amazing workmanship they represent. It's not unusual to find antique rings, especially in the size range you're looking in, that are priced as basically what either the diamond only or the setting only would cost if bought new. So yeah- more shopping is my vote! :twirl:
 
Great advice LGK :appl:
 
Yes, I agree with the others, not loving that diamond, it may be old but it is not vintage to my eye!
 
It looks like an early RB to me. Maybe 1950s? Singlestone repolishes stones starting at $350 a carat but unless you see chips I don't know why it would be necessary. Also I would not spend the money to go to GIA. You either like it for what it is or you don't. It defeats the purpose of saving money and is mostly done to enhance resale value which you don't sound like you are planning to do. You should get the completed ring appraised for insurance purposes which will let you know the specs.
 
Hi LGK, great idea! :) Will put up (something like) a general guide later on.
 
MC said:
redrose229 said:
I was searching for a wedding band for myself and came this set and thought it was beautiful. If she doesn't like YG you can plate it!
http://cgi.ebay.com/1-3ctH-VS1-Vintage-antique-art-deco-diamond-wedding-set-/200530595163?pt=Vintage_Fine_Jewelry&hash=item2eb08e0d5b

Great price too!
Click to expand...
Does this one have a fisheye or is the center on older cuts darker like that?
Click to expand...
Well cut ones don't have a dark center. It's probably fairly deep, hence the nailhead-y look. (That's the usual reason for a dark center like that- too deep of a cut... fisheye actually is the opposite, too shallow combined w/a big table; it's usually transitionals that are prone to the fisheye.) Might be not so noticeable in person, but I'm picky about old cuts and would probably pass on it because of that effect. Still, it's pretty white and the price is good, at least... if a person doesn't mind quirky-ness in old cuts, it could be a good one.
 
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