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Lawyers and Wills

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Independent Gal

Independent Gal

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 12, 2006
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Can you have one without the other? Well, I suppose you could have a lawyer without a will. But say you wanted to make or redraft a will, for instance, because you happen to be getting married in 8 weeks
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, could you do this without hiring a lawyer? Can you do this in the US, e.g., just using a book of forms from a bookstore, or on-line?

Even if it can be done lawyerless, is it stupid?
 
I''m certainly not a lawyer but I would think the most secure way to have this done it to go through one. Depending on what you want to change, and the laws in your state, I''d be afraid of someone trying to contest it and the aftermath and grief that could cause depending on the situation.
 
Well - I don''t know about US laws and whether they require you to have a lawyer, but assuming that isn''t the case (seems a bit onerous if you ask me!), I''d think you could get away with one of those DIY will kits IF you don''t really have any assets at this point.

But if you have assets (above just a bank account etc), or kids, or both, or kids from previous marriage etc, I would DEFINITELY get a lawyer.

Just isn''t worth the hassel in my mind.
 
Yes you can. Write what you want to write in a word document, then have it signed by 2 witnesses and then have it notorized.

It is then a legally binding document. However, make sure the person that you are having witness it is not someone who will be receiving anything as far as property.
 
I don't know of any state where a lawyer is required for the drafting of a will. If it's a question between a DIY will or no will, absolutely draft your own and follow the directions very very carefully. I think any Borders or Barnes & Noble carries books that give you forms and instructions. But a professionally-drafted will gives you an added layer of protection.

I don't know where you live, but unless it's in a big city, it usually doesn't cost too much for a basic will. If you call your local bar association, they should be able to point you in the right direction. They should also be able to tell you whether it's best to draft it before or after the wedding -- the language used will probably be different, even if the overall effect of the will isn't.
 
Yes you can. You need to review the rules in your state regarding witnesses, notary requirements, etc. You can even handwrite your will, so called "holographic will" in some states, but not all.

The main thing is, will your DIY will be adequate to be admitted to probate court, sufficient to stave off any greedy contestants and will it cover your particular needs. If you have a complex situation, own your own business, have numerous dependents, etc, then you really should have a lawyer do it for you.
 
No business. No dependents. No greedy relatives. I do have assets (like my home), but nothing too complicated I think. So I think it should be pretty straightforward then! I''ll got to Barnes and Noble and check it all out.
 
The biggest problem with do it yourself is no referee and guide.
2 people no kids is simple on the surface...
I leave everything to . (convert too legal mumbo jumbo)
but what if both of you pass away at he same time, then what....?

hint: educational trust fund for nieces and nephews is a nice idea but spell it out in detail!

That is where a lot of couples need help.
 
ARGGHHH.....Here is my thought...

on the way home from doing this make your own document...you get hit by a bus...

"and it is Syanora for you (...not to be confused with cyanide which is goodbye in any language...)"

and you forgot to add your middle name or spell his right or cross a t or dot an i...now what?

Pay a professional when it comes to wills/legal documents-protect the ones you love...cause when you are gone...you can''t be consulted on your intentions any longer.
 
DKS you''re scaring me.
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But you may well be right.
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I''m going to look into how much it costs. If it''s $200, I''m down. If it''s $500, I may think twice.

Can you put a will on a wedding registry?
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HI IG

In Australia, entering in a marriage can void any current wills. I do not know if this is the case where you live, but if so, I would recommend drafting a will after you get married.
 
Darlin....I bet you won''t think twice about hiring a party or wedding planner and paying them $1500.

But when it comes to the most valuable asset you have-your home & your new husband...you are pinching your pennies like a miser?

There is a reason a law degree takes four years and costs a gazillion to earn. They actually leave knowing what you what to. Pay the man. Pay the man what he knows. Let the man watch your back. If my cyanide post scared you into thinking twice it was worth it. Here''s another ....BOO!
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Actually DKS, I would never hire a wedding planner for $1500. I wouldn't spend $500 on that. I probably wouldn't even spend $200 on that! Our whole wedding is super on the cheap, second hand dress, home made invitations, a friend as the photographer, with the exception of serving a good meal which is going to cost a good chunk of change. Our TWO wedding parties will cost about 1/2 of the average cost for where I live, and that's not because we're cheap. It's because we're (comparatively) poor! Maybe you got some other idea because of where my mom lives? Well that place doesn't belong to her. She just gets to live there. My place is tiny (think 800 sq ft, two rooms) and we want kids. Every penny of our fairly meagre salaries that doesn't go to the wedding goes to saving for a bigger place.

You always have to weigh risks and benefits. In this case, the risks are very low, not just of something happening to me and FI in the near future, but also of it being all that complicated if it did, and the assets are comparatively low as well. Let's just say it would definitely not be worth anyone I know's while to fly to America, hire a lawyer and fight a court battle to get ahold of my assets.
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Even if anyone who might have a claim to my estate would DO that, morally speaking, and I'd bet my life they wouldn't.

We can always make a more careful will a little later. But I promise to research carefully whether it really is best to just do it now.

But I'm not stingy. I'm just poor.
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Independent Gal, gosh, isn''t it amazing all the little things that pop up in the last minutes before the wedding?

The answer to your question depends on the jurisdiction; for instance, California DOES allow holographic (self-drawn) wills with certain exacting qualifications, and New York DOES NOT allow them as a general rule and in most circumstances they would be thrown out. It''s about a 60/40 split between the states, so beware of any blanket advice that is appears to be generic to all states. In this realm, the answer is jurisdiction-specific, I''m sorry to share.

For a rough list, see: http://www.lawchek.com/Library1/_books/probate/qanda/holographic.htm , which I''ll link at the bottom of this post.

Do note that even a website named "lawchek" tells you to consult a lawyer; it''s kind of telling. Even in states which do allow hand-drawn wills, they can be thrown out with a shockingly high percentage. If you already have a will, it may be possible to have an attorney draft/execute a "codicil" instead of another full-blown will, which should be less expensive.

In a nutshell, get a local lawyer.

Hope this helps,
f-d-l

Holographic Wills By State
 
Thanks for the link, Fleur.
 
I did see a commercial for Legal Zoom. I think their wills are $69. I know the company my friend works for (national company) uses Legal Zoom all the time. We were just talking about wills over on the preggo board.
 
Indy...I just threw the wedding planner thing in for good measure
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...I know you don''t have one...I have been right here the whole time. The board has been YOUR planner...I mean you have consulted the board on most things you couldn''t decide on...right? I meant in general...
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( I shouldn''t have used the YOU-many would have been more appropriate. The darn site ate my original and I had to retype it again. ARGHHH.)

My point is I am trying to express if it isn''t done right NOW, don''t assume the person you want to receive it will. That is why I am an advocate for hiring it done right while you have use of communication. In the grand scheme of the cost it is cheaper now...than it would be later...

Just because DIY is allowed in a state or what ever, doesn''t mean it is the wisest choice. Right? After all, the state won''t be your advocate. But they will be there with their hand out for probate and taxes. Gimme Gimme Gimme! Just be sure you have your ducks in a row.
 
I don't know nothing about no wills, but I am going to tease you about getting married married married in 8 weeks! How exciting! Yah!! No more independent gal
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, you will be dependent gal! hahah Joking aside that is so cool, the wedding ceremony was the most emotional and meaningful 15 minutes of my life!

Doesn't everything automatically get passed the the hubby or wifey when a spouse dies?

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DD-- aka "married an still and independent gal!!"
 
Tacori wow, legal zoom looks AWESOME. And the price is sure right.
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I'm going to ask a lawyer friend if she thinks it's all kosher and everything.

DKS I hear ya. I promise. Solemnly. To look into all this carefully before deciding which way to go.
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Dreamer I think you're scaring me even more than DKS!
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Yup. 8 weeks. Holy Shmo! I think one of the concerns is taxation? Not sure. Then the other concern is what happens if you both die at the same time. Fun thoughts!
 
Date: 2/5/2008 7:19:29 PM
Author: door knob solitaire
Darlin....I bet you won't think twice about hiring a party or wedding planner and paying them $1500.

But when it comes to the most valuable asset you have-your home & your new husband...you are pinching your pennies like a miser?

There is a reason a law degree takes four years and costs a gazillion to earn. They actually leave knowing what you what to. Pay the man. Pay the man what he knows. Let the man watch your back. If my cyanide post scared you into thinking twice it was worth it. Here's another ....BOO!
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Click to expand...
A mere 3, my friend, but it felt like 300.

IG,
You have me excited. When are you moving here?
 
IG, let me know what she says. The price is right for sure!
 
Hey Harriet, starting in the summer I''m going to be on the east coast for a contract for a few months, and so will often be in NYC, and then I might be moving there... permanently? some months later. Waiting to hear about a job...
 
Check this out.

Ok, this is what I'd do. Call a local attorney and get a referral for an probate attorney, and then check them out using this site (down below). The best attorneys will have an AV rating, second best BV, and third best CV. The ABA/Martindale Hubbell assigns ratings for lawyers by lawyers, in other words, this is how their peers review them. I know that in my dad's office the people who give out the referrals for other states use this as a guide if they don't personally know an attorney that does that kind of law in that state. Does that make sense?

Lawyer Locator

Overall, I would have an attorney do it. You need witnesses and all kinds of legal jargon, and as DKS said, you have to make sure that all your Ts are crossed and Is dotted. I know that no matter what my financial situation may be, I will NEVER EVER draft my own legal documents. Thats because I grew up with a lawyer as a father and worked in his office for way too long, and I've seen people financially destroyed by badly drawn up legal documents.

Also Indy, the less you have to distribute the less it should cost to draw up. Lawyers charge by the hour, so the less hours you take up, the less it'll cost. So keep that in mind.
 
PLEASE DO NOT USE WILL KITS! Okay, I got it out. Would you buy your marriage certificate off the internet, and see if it works (oh sorry honey we were never married)? Would you do your own house deal? NO - BUT YOU WILL POTENTIALLY DEAL WITH EVER ASSET YOU HAVE IN A FORM DOCUMENT YOU MADE YOURSELF!!! Yikes!

In Canada, marriage voids a will. Look into this.

It always seems so easy to fill out the form. But then litigators like me get to challenge those pieces of crap, and the litigating fun begins. And trust me, once you start racking up my hourly rate to fight in court, you will be wishing you spent a few hundred bucks on a lawyer to get your will right.

You get an "insurance policy" of sorts by hiring a lawyer. If they get it right (which they will 9 times out of ten), you get a quality will tailored your needs. If they do not, you get to sue them and rely upon their insurance (mandatory in Canada) and your estate will be made whole.
 
Good luck! Hope to see you fairly soon.
 
Oooo LC, now I''m curious as to your hourly rate!! We should put it in bling terms...

20 hours of lawyer hours (@ 350/hr) to sort out the mess your will kit caused = $7,000
Diamond that could buy round 1.11 ct, ideal cut, G, VS2 at bluenile: $6,990

Yikes!

2 hours of lawyer hours to write will: $700 + peace of mind
Diamond that could buy- round .31 cts, ideal cut, D, VS1: $700
 
Date: 2/6/2008 12:56:24 AM
Author: FrekeChild
Oooo LC, now I''m curious as to your hourly rate!! We should put it in bling terms...

20 hours of lawyer hours (@ 350/hr) to sort out the mess your will kit caused = $7,000
Diamond that could buy round 1.11 ct, ideal cut, G, VS2 at bluenile: $6,990

Yikes!

2 hours of lawyer hours to write will: $700 + peace of mind
Diamond that could buy- round .31 cts, ideal cut, D, VS1: $700
Click to expand...
That''s hilarious. I''m a legal secretary so now at the end of every month (billing time!) I will be equating all invoices to bling!
 
IG,

If I recall correctly, most states have statutes that either invalidates (rare) or modifies a previously-valid will upon the marriage of the testator (testatrix, in your case). The presumption is that the deceased would want to leave property to his/her spouse but didn''t get a chance to execute a new will. So, it''s likely that the new spouse wouldn''t be completely left out if there isn''t a new will executed but the disposition of property by operation of the law may not be what you want.

So, I recommend a new will. You can certainly look into some self-help guides to do your homework, but I''d prefer to the leave the actual drafting and execution to a knowledgeable Wills and Estates attorney.

I''m sure you are aware that will and estates law is state-specific and highly technical. If your needs are basic, the cost shouldn''t be exorbitant.

I recommend that you relax and enjoy the wedding planning and wedding and put on your soon-after to-do list the execution of new wills by you and your new husband. Don''t forget that most of the cost of preparing legal documents result from clients who don''t really know what they want done and take up a great deal of lawyer time. So, my recommendation is that you and your DH do a bit of homework, sit down with each other, list all of your respective assets and decide how you want to dispose of them before meeting with a lawyer.

As assets grow and if children are added, then your wills will need updating.

Don''t forget also an irrevocable power of attorney and health care directive.

Best wishes!
 
We are definitely going to wait until after the wedding to do the wills! I''m just plannin'' ahead.
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I''m going to call a few lawyers today to get a ballpark sense of the cost.

Out of curiosity, how often do wills really get contested? I guess I''ve never heard of it "in real life", as in, among anyone I know. But maybe I''m naive!
 
hey there -

I'm a bit late to respond...I'd recommend talking to a lawyer. My guess is that it won't cost you an arm and a leg - particularly if you look for an estates and trusts attorney.


BUT I will say that I worked for a judge and I saw a number of wills that were contested. Mind you, these wills usually involve a situation where the decedent married several times, or had numerous children that were not treated equally, or had numerous will and codicils (addendum to a will)or there were other issues...If you are talking about a simple, well drafted, will, my guess is that it would likely not be contested.

Just my two cents.

ETA - I'm not at all sure that a subsequent marriage cancels a will. If there is no will, there are intestate rules that set forth how property will be distributed, and the wife then gets some, but I am 99% sure that a marriage subsequent to a will does NOT void that will. The parties that got married should update and republish their wills to include the new spouse.
 
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