loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? depth?

[rose_red]

Hi everyone,

There is so much good information on here, and I'm really glad to have found this site with input from so many experts. My time on it hasn't turned up info on my topic, or perhaps I wasn't using adequate keywords to find it, so here goes with my questions.

I've asked a B&M store to put together a ring for me which involves a fairly typical setting and with a ruby. The jeweler is going to bring in some stones for me to select from, but I was wondering if I could get a better deal buying the stone myself. Some of the loose stone vendors require tax ID for log-in and only sell to the trade. My thinking is that gemstone dealers will want to sell to anyone who will buy their goods, so they won't all lock down their buying process and will offer individuals like myself wholesale prices. Is this the case?

Also, how important is the depth of the stone if already cut if the jeweler will be putting together the ring? It is to be worn with another ring which I already have and to complement it, so am I more or less ok if I get a stone with the same length and width measurements?

Sites I am seriously considering (so far) are AJS Select, Gemselect and GemRockAuctions. (If you have any feedback on these too, I'll take it.) Many of these came from discussion in this forum.

I'm not GIA certified, nor have I ever worked in the jewelry industry, rather I have a strong interest in gemstones. I've spent countless hours online, including this forum (very helpful!) on trying to figure out reputable vendors, learning about grading rubies, treatments, etc, so am not completely ignorant but I also know there are disreputable people everywhere so won't buy anywhere without a return policy, but if you have any advice, e.g. "just go with the professional jeweler choices" or "go for it online", then don't hesitate to offer it.

Thanks in advance!

 

[sparkleismyfavcolor]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

Hello and welcome!

I would definitely start here (if you haven't already):

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/new-to-coloured-gemstone-buying-read-this-first.174284/

and here:
[url=https://www.pricescope.com/co...-new-thread-with-respected-cs-vendors.169561/[/URL][/url]

I'm sure some of the pros will weigh in on stone depth etc.

Good luck!

 

[chrono]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

You are more likely able to find a nicer ruby, get a larger selection, and a better price if you buy the ruby yourself. The only true wholesaler only sells to those in the trade who have a tax ID. If a "wholesaler" is selling to a regular folk like you and I, then he/she isn't a true wholesaler. I would not worry about the depth, you will have enough issues with the colour, clarity, treatment and budget. I would not purchase rubies from GemSelect or GemRockAuctions if you are looking for a quality ruby.

Do you mind sharing your specifications?
Carat weight and mm size
Shape
Treatment
Colour
Approximate budget

 

[rose_red]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

Thanks for those links. I've been reading the info there avidly!

 

[rose_red]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

Hi Chrono,

Here are my responses:

Carat weight and mm size: flexible on carat size but stone needs to be approx 7mm x 5mm
Shape: oval
Treatment: heat is ok, synthetic or glass-filled is not
Colour: less pink and more purple or maybe even orange-red (it needs to go with a middle-of-the-road tanzanite the same size)
Approximate budget: ??? I have champagne taste but don't work on Wall Street, so am going to have to figure out how to temper my tastes with a realistic budget. I can't see myself paying more than $1100 or so considering the setting and 2 diamonds on the side (not important to me at all) are going to add cost. This is a birthstone ring in honor of my new son, so I plan to wear it everyday and want to do it right.

Thank you all so much. This forum is great!

 

[chrono]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

How much flux healing is acceptable to you? Based on budget and size, it would have to be fairly significant. Give me a day or so to look around.

 

[pregcurious]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

Before you buy a stone, you should consider who you will get to set it. If you would want your local B&M store to set it, it may or may not be an issue. Some vendors will not set outside stones, and if they do, you should ask what their policies are if a stone is damaged during setting.

 

[chrono]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

Any possibility of a spinel over a ruby since they are untreated, cleaner and less expensive, yet can be everyday wear within reason, especially if you are open to orange reds?

A bit smaller than you want but heated and under budget. There is a 20% off sale going on right now until the end of August if you pay by wire transfer.
http://www.ajsgem.com/ruby/burma-ruby/burma-ruby-1.03-carats.html-1
http://www.ajsgem.com/ruby/burma-ruby/burma-ruby-1-carats.html-0

Item 505 is a bit over budget and smaller than the size you are looking for, and a bit hazy. Scroll almost all the way down.
http://www.gemfix.com/ruby.html

 

[rose_red]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

Chrono: I'm traditional when it comes to well tradition (birthstones) so would rather a ruby than spinel, and am not set on color other than *not* overly pink. I would rather see the options and then pick the one I like the best. My skin tone is cool, so it would need to look ok on me and with the tanzanite ring.

As to flux healing, I would like to pursue heat-only treatments for rubies. Some inclusions (to slightly included) is obviously ok too given my budget.

Thanks for the advice on where to obtain the ruby and for the links. I had actually been eyeing (A LOT) the ones from AJS. Are those good prices? I've been reading a lot on here about cut and so it seems that might be the hardest aspect to ascertain online (from photos) but maybe in a ruby is not so important as in a lighter stone?

Pregcurious: Thanks for the caveats. I hadn't considered that, so your advice is very helpful.

 

[chrono]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

You mentioned that this is to be worn together with another tanzanite ring. I'm not sure if you know this but tanzanite is a special occasion wear stone only in a ring. If you want heat without any flux, I am sorry to tell you that this is not possible for a 7 x 5 mm ruby. Most vendors will state that it is heated but not disclose how much flux healing it has undergone. With rubies, unfortunately, one does not have many options and trying to select the best colour and not horrible cut is difficult enough.

Second item, 118 (sleepy and a fair amount of extinction)
http://www.mineralminers.com/html/rbygems.stm

Gary is usually able to find me very budget friendly stones too, once he knows I understand the trade-offs.
http://www.diamondexpert.com/index.html

 

[rose_red]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

Chrono: Thanks for all the info and the links. I am learning so much! I'd not realized all that goes on with the flux heating. It definitely was not disclosed anywhere that I have checked, so it's great to learn about the pitfalls of the industry.

I was aware that tanzanite was a softer stone, but not that it was one which was inadvisable for daily wear. If it makes any difference, it's bezel set.I have read what others posted about not wearing it for cleaning, etc which makes a lot of sense. Actually, I was talked out of an emerald engagement ring by a jeweler given my formerly active lifestyle. (Two kids under 3 and a full-time job later not so much. )

 

[rose_red]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

This quest for information on rubies has prompted other queries which are:

1. Are gemstone and jewelry fairs/expos are a good place to get gems at great rates? They seem like they might be better than online since you can actually see the product, but I wonder if the vendors would offer return guarantees and worthwhile certificates.

2. How is the labor market for becoming a gemologist? I've been fascinated by what I've learned about gems and looked over the certification program from GIA. It seems interesting but would be a complete career change and I don't have any experience, so don't have a work history to offer. My interests lie more toward estate jewelry and the business of procuring gemstones and factors which affect their availability and demand, etc.

Thanks so much for bearing with a novice like me.

 

[chrono]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

This quest for information on rubies has prompted other queries which are:

1. Are gemstone and jewelry fairs/expos are a good place to get gems at great rates? They seem like they might be better than online since you can actually see the product, but I wonder if the vendors would offer return guarantees and worthwhile certificates.
To see, yes. To buy, not unless it comes with an AGL/GIA/Gubelin/SSEF lab report showing the type of treatment and level of treatment AND allows returns with a full refund.

2. How is the labor market for becoming a gemologist? I've been fascinated by what I've learned about gems and looked over the certification program from GIA. It seems interesting but would be a complete career change and I don't have any experience, so don't have a work history to offer. My interests lie more toward estate jewelry and the business of procuring gemstones and factors which affect their availability and demand, etc.
Not good. The pay isn't great and the hours are long so make sure you LOVE the work and are in for the long haul.

Thanks so much for bearing with a novice like me.

 

[rose_red]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

Thanks again, Chrono. You're a wealth of information!

 

[lelser]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

"My thinking is that gemstone dealers will want to sell to anyone who will buy their goods, so they won't all lock down their buying process and will offer individuals like myself wholesale prices. Is this the case? "

Some will. Most won't. For most of us our trade clients are the people who keep our lights on. You're buying one gem and will go away (we hope) happy. My jewellers buy from me month on month, year after year. I offer a discount to non-trade people on my mailing list but to be a wholesale client, you need to have a full-time jewellery business.

Cheers,

Lisa
www.lisaelser.com

 

[rose_red]

Re: loose stones - good rates possible if not a jeweler? dep

Lisa,

Thanks for providing the supplier perspective.