OEC''s, OMC''s, open culets and kozibe - thoughts please!

[arjunajane]

Ok,
so this poll is following on from the discussion about GOG''s new signature OEC diamonds in this thread - link.

Here also is a link to the GOG video of these new diamonds for those who have not seen it OEC video

Basically, the question at hand is whether people prefer to have the kozibe effect present in these newly cut OEC''s or not. I will also include questions about the GOG new signature cushions - which will be referred to in the poll at OMC''s.

For those that are not sure about what kozibe is, I will post a number of photo examples below

I''m sorry I don''t have a technical explanation, but basically it is when a diamond has an open culet (medium to large I believe), which reflects throughout the stone, creating an effect which looks like a bunch of tiny circles in the outer facets.
From my experience reading on this site, I have found posters opinions on kozibe often divided - either you love it or hate it.

From my discussion with Jon at GOG, depending on client preference and feedback, he will decide to order the new Signature OEC''s to be cut either with or without a kozibe effect. The current ones in the video have no culet - hence no kozibe.
My hope is that this poll will assist in that decision.

I''ve tried to think through the poll questions - hopefully it covers all the options..

if you vote (or even if you don''t), a comment explaining your choice is always appreciated!

thankyou!

 

[arjunajane]

Now, I sincerely hope the owners of the following images do not mind them being used for the purposes of education in this poll..
I just wanted to use examples of very attractive diamonds to make the comparison as fair as possible, and these were the prettiest pics I could find with kozibe.

(if the owners do mind, pls do contact admin and I will find some replacement photos to use) - thankyou!

Also, if any posters would like to see comparison photos of vintage diamonds without kozibe, no probs - just ask

first, an OEC with quite strong kozibe effect:

 

[arjunajane]

one that we are all familiar with, Boston Jeff''s awesome cushion (OMC):

 

[arjunajane]

another of Jeff''s - I thought this was useful, as we can see the effect is really not that noticeable from a distance.

 

[arjunajane]

another OEC..


okay, well I hope those photos helped people - remember the potential kozibe effect on GOG's stones will vary with the size of the culet, and may be a bit different in appearance from the diamonds pictured as these are actual vintage stones.
That stuff, I don't have actual info on - perhaps just ask Jon if you're really curious.

I hope lots of people vote, as I think this will be really interesting,
thankyou in advance!

AJ.

 

[Ellen]

I really like the affect in OMC''s, but not so much in OEC''s. So that''s my vote.

And aj, small thread deviation. I still have not heard back from Jon on that video. If I haven''t heard by Tues., I''ll try jogging his momory in case he forgot.

 

[HeartingDiamonds]

I voted

Great poll, AJ! I am very curious to see the results as well.

ps: And no worries about using our photos - please feel free!

 

[beaujolais]

Oh, and you put up great photo examples, too !!

Thanks so much !

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 6/7/2009 9:34:44 AM
Author: Ellen
I really like the affect in OMC''s, but not so much in OEC''s. So that''s my vote.

And aj, small thread deviation. I still have not heard back from Jon on that video. If I haven''t heard by Tues., I''ll try jogging his momory in case he forgot.

Hey Ellen,
was that the one where you wanted to see a cushion and OEC on the hand at the same time? If so, yep I''m very keen to see that too, you should remind him.
At the end of the second video on oec''s Jon did (where the new ones are compared to actual vintage ones in stock), he does some shots of the 1ct, but it is next to his man-hand - so maybe not as useful

- but did you see that?





Thankyou Grace hon for being gracious about the photos - I knew you''d take it as a compliment

 

[oldminer]

I''d suggest cutting all of them without a culet facet. It is very easy to put a small to medium culet facet on any pointed culet diamond if someone really wants it that way. It does not require any re-engineering of the diamond, just a fast, single facet process. A faceted culet looks authentic on a cushion shape and is more necessary to the original design, but does lttile to nothing positive for round oec''s.

 

[strmrdr]

I would go med. at most on the oec and offer the option to have a larger one added.
This will have to be researched to see if this can safely be done.
The omc needs one to look right in my opinion.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 6/7/2009 10:30:34 AM
Author: arjunajane


Hey Ellen,
was that the one where you wanted to see a cushion and OEC on the hand at the same time? If so, yep I''m very keen to see that too, you should remind him.
At the end of the second video on oec''s Jon did (where the new ones are compared to actual vintage ones in stock), he does some shots of the 1ct, but it is next to his man-hand - so maybe not as useful

- but did you see that?

No, I haven''t seen it. I had asked him to put one of the new OEC''s in a ring holder on someones hand to try and get a more realistic view on the amount of contast that shows.

 

[Skippy123]

Date: 6/7/2009 10:32:24 AM
Author: oldminer
I'd suggest cutting all of them without a culet facet. It is very easy to put a small to medium culet facet on any pointed culet diamond if someone really wants it that way. It does not require any re-engineering of the diamond, just a fast, single facet process. A faceted culet looks authentic on a cushion shape and is more necessary to the original design, but does lttile to nothing positive for round oec's.

Wow, that sounds like a great idea!!!

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 6/7/2009 11:01:23 AM
Author: Ellen

Date: 6/7/2009 10:30:34 AM

Author: arjunajane



Hey Ellen,

was that the one where you wanted to see a cushion and OEC on the hand at the same time? If so, yep I''m very keen to see that too, you should remind him.

At the end of the second video on oec''s Jon did (where the new ones are compared to actual vintage ones in stock), he does some shots of the 1ct, but it is next to his man-hand - so maybe not as useful

- but did you see that?

No, I haven''t seen it. I had asked him to put one of the new OEC''s in a ring holder on someones hand to try and get a more realistic view on the amount of contast that shows.

here ya go Ellen vimeo
Just at the end - I believe he is addressing your requests.

For my own research, I am going to request both an OEC and OMC in ring holders on a female hand - so hopefully keep your eye out for that one soon

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 6/7/2009 10:52:19 AM
Author: strmrdr
I would go med. at most on the oec and offer the option to have a larger one added.

This will have to be researched to see if this can safely be done.

The omc needs one to look right in my opinion.

Agree with all of these statements Strm, and also think Dave has made a very interesting suggestion.
Thankyou everyone for giving your thoughts on this, keep em coming !

 

[Ellen]

Date: 6/7/2009 11:21:28 AM
Author: arjunajane

here ya go Ellen vimeo
Just at the end - I believe he is addressing your requests.

For my own research, I am going to request both an OEC and OMC in ring holders on a female hand - so hopefully keep your eye out for that one soon

Yes, it seems he did. I had assumed he would give me a heads up when it was done (and I was really busy the last few days and didn''t ask him about it), but that''s what I get for assuming.

Thanks for posting it aj, that definitely helps get a better idea. I look foward to your request as well!

 

[HeartingDiamonds]

Ditto on Dave''s and Karl''s suggestions.

IMHO, if the purpose is to mimic the look and charm of old cuts, culets are a must - along with the chunky, blocky faceting, and their other unique characteristics.


Perhaps offer them with medium culets, Jon, and then after purchase, if the customer wants a bigger culet, offer than option?

 

[jstarfireb]

Ditto. I voted to keep it on the OMCs but nix it on the OECs, but it''s nice to have the option to cut a culet if someone wants it. But once it''s done, you can''t go back, you know?

 

[jet2ks]

Add one more vote for the idea of without and the option for the buyer to have the larger culet cut after purchase.

 

[DiamondFlame]

I voted to have them in OMCs but not OECs. Just personal preference really.

 

[Rhea]

I voted for some cut with and some cut without. I personally like it and always look for it in antique stones. At the size stones I''ve seen, it''s not that noticable but I''ve always thought it was beautiful.

 

[Rhino]

Date: 6/7/2009 11:21:28 AM
Author: arjunajane

Date: 6/7/2009 11:01:23 AM

Author: Ellen

Date: 6/7/2009 10:30:34 AM


Author: arjunajane




Hey Ellen,


was that the one where you wanted to see a cushion and OEC on the hand at the same time? If so, yep I''m very keen to see that too, you should remind him.

At the end of the second video on oec''s Jon did (where the new ones are compared to actual vintage ones in stock), he does some shots of the 1ct, but it is next to his man-hand - so maybe not as useful

- but did you see that?

No, I haven''t seen it. I had asked him to put one of the new OEC''s in a ring holder on someones hand to try and get a more realistic view on the amount of contast that shows.

here ya go Ellen vimeo

Just at the end - I believe he is addressing your requests.


For my own research, I am going to request both an OEC and OMC in ring holders on a female hand - so hopefully keep your eye out for that one soon

Haha... ok ok ... I guess my "man hands" didn''t do it. I''ll get one of the ladies after the weekend.

 

[Rhino]

Date: 6/7/2009 10:32:24 AM
Author: oldminer
I''d suggest cutting all of them without a culet facet. It is very easy to put a small to medium culet facet on any pointed culet diamond if someone really wants it that way. It does not require any re-engineering of the diamond, just a fast, single facet process. A faceted culet looks authentic on a cushion shape and is more necessary to the original design, but does lttile to nothing positive for round oec''s.

You were reading my mind. Much easier to give them none or as Karl suggest no more than medium and add upon request.

 

[icekid]

I have a little .55 ct OEC with kozibe and I think it is so cool! But I also like the less cluttered look of the stones without

Culets... I also like them open and closed. (Can I have them all??)

 

[chrono]

The OMCs MUST have an open culet. Without the faceted culet, it just doesn''t have the complete old stone look, KWIM? On OECs, I prefer them smaller because I like the mosiac effect or "flower" pattern and I would be concerned the kozibe effect might break that look. I like the suggestions of having a small or pointed culet offered as standard with the option of making it larger.

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 6/7/2009 4:52:40 PM
Author: Rhino

Date: 6/7/2009 11:21:28 AM

Author: arjunajane

Date: 6/7/2009 11:01:23 AM


Author: Ellen

Date: 6/7/2009 10:30:34 AM



Author: arjunajane





Hey Ellen,



was that the one where you wanted to see a cushion and OEC on the hand at the same time? If so, yep I''m very keen to see that too, you should remind him.


At the end of the second video on oec''s Jon did (where the new ones are compared to actual vintage ones in stock), he does some shots of the 1ct, but it is next to his man-hand - so maybe not as useful

- but did you see that?

No, I haven''t seen it. I had asked him to put one of the new OEC''s in a ring holder on someones hand to try and get a more realistic view on the amount of contast that shows.

here ya go Ellen vimeo


Just at the end - I believe he is addressing your requests.



For my own research, I am going to request both an OEC and OMC in ring holders on a female hand - so hopefully keep your eye out for that one soon

Haha... ok ok ... I guess my ''man hands'' didn''t do it. I''ll get one of the ladies after the weekend.

ROFL!
Oh no, Jon you have lovely man-hands - you know I was just being silly, ha!
But yes, for us girls it might be nicer to see on one of the girls wearing them

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 6/7/2009 10:07:41 PM
Author: Chrono
The OMCs MUST have an open culet. Without the faceted culet, it just doesn''t have the complete old stone look, KWIM? On OECs, I prefer them smaller because I like the mosiac effect or ''flower'' pattern and I would be concerned the kozibe effect might break that look. I like the suggestions of having a small or pointed culet offered as standard with the option of making it larger.

My thoughts exactly on the patterns issue C. I adore the flower look, and now that Jon''s OEC''s also look like they exhibit chunky arrow heads in the outer facets, personally I feel like that is enough pattern for one diamond, KWIM?




It seems like many are keen on the idea of leaving them pointed on all, but having the option of adding the open one before buying. Whoops, didn''t think of that before starting the poll, sorry!

 

[beaujolais]

So, how do you view the results of this poll?

Thanks.

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 6/8/2009 3:16:06 PM
Author: sonomacounty
So, how do you view the results of this poll?


Thanks.

Hi Sonoma - if you''ve voted and you''re logged in, you should see the results alongside my questions.
But you need to vote first.

If you do, a commentary on your vote and the suggestions above would be appreciated too

 

[beaujolais]

Thanks AJ. I voted the first day and saw the results when just four people had voted. Do you only get to see results once, when you vote?

Thanks, again.