I just thought I would give an update on things, and the more I research things, the more snobbery I suspect. I think that there are those individuals who are there to keep certain business interests in place than they are being truthful in things.
My family went to this other place for an appraiser. I figured I would take my item in case I decided to leave it. I figured show the first one first and take it from there unlike the last time. The guy started to become a little rude and said where ever you bought it online, and I said it didn''t come from online and I thought where I bought it at was not particularly relevent to appraising it. He looked at me and said, "You don''t have to tell me, I know."
I didn''t buy it online, nor did my mother. So that told me right there, this guy was jumping to conclusions and wasn''t objective.
Just to give you an idea, this was a place where you have to press the buzzer to get in. It was one of those places.
The first thing, he looks at the label and said the wording was misused that identified the stone, etc. So automatically, he''s going to go there with pet names being technical names as opposed to identifying the stone more properly.
He takes the stone, goes to the back, looks at some chart and says almost the same thing as the first woman who saw both items said. It''s of this species, but it''s not of this variety (based on the logic of saying it can''t be this pet name). So I pointed out the inclusion, and this guy looked. He said based on that observation, it does appear to be what the technical name of the stone is. Great! Finally, I got this guy to look.
So now the magic question, what would it cost to replace that single item in a retail environment?
He refused to say, and said he wanted a lab report and wanted to send it to AGTA. Despite the fact that based on his observation (that he wouldn''t have seen since he didn''t look before hand), he identified it as being what it was presented as (minus the pet name). He also changed his tune when we told him that origin was disclosed, and had he understood the abbreviation on the back, that would have cleared that up. Then he changed his demeanor really fast.
He refused to appraise it as "there''s no way to really tell". He did mention other labs such as Tokyo, Gubelin, etc.
We were looking for some other items, and we dealt with another woman who realized we knew a little bit about these things. When I started rattling of technical specs on 2 sapphires she bought out, I think at that point she knew I wasn''t some run of the mill...whoever. She realized we were all enthusiasts. So I asked her if they had ever sent anything to Gubelin in specific.
She said that they had dealt with them on a few occassions. So I asked her if she knew anything about the customs stuff and so forth, I was willing to have my stone sent to there from them. I knew more about these things than she did when we were discussing logistics and such. That suprised me. So apparently, they don''t like to deal with anyone besides AGTA. I guess they get that 25% discount as being members (if they are members) and tack on a premium.
I guess sending the thing off to Gubelin is no good because they can''t make any money off that, so therefore they don''t know.
So anyways, we go off to the jeweler who told us to go to this place for an appraisal to begin with. We told him what the appraiser said. The manager asked us, "He told you based on observation what it was but send it to a lab and didn''t appraise it? He doesn''t know what he''s doing and he''s playing this game with the insurance and such."
This same jeweler also told us a very interesting story. The guy sent a diamond over to this same appraiser. He wasn''t too thrilled when it appraised for less than wholesale only because he stated it was a G color/VS1 stone. The jeweler didn''t tell the appraiser that he had a GIA cert that said D color and VVS1.
So the jeweler basically said that this other guy is playing this name game, and he knows this game, and what it boils down to is make a load of money for a lab report that you don''t need, and unless you pay for it, we won''t appraise it so they could put some overinflated price or something to keep the insurance company happy.
So Mom shows her stone to the jeweler for a mounting. He thought it was really nice. No, we didn''t buy it from him, and yes this jeweler is based out of Europe. In the meantime, the rest of the family and myself are looking at a parcel of sapphires. I took my stone, and I flashed it. The managers eyes lit up. After a minute or so, he did a double take, looked at me and said, "Let me see that one again." He was quite impressed with it.
He opens up the case, he looks at it with the tweezers and all. The first thing he said was that the stone was brilliant. In that store, yeah. Come in my house and I''ll show you the window. In that store though, whoa. The managers wife comes in. She liked my mothers better, and her jaw dropped when I pointed out the particular inclusion. She also said the same thing about mine (despite the slightly eye visible healed fracture near the crown). It''s brilliant. Though my mother''s is smaller, we both agreed that hers is probably worth more.
Sadly enough, this store doesn''t do appraisals and they don''t send anything out other than their own merchandise. However, the manager and his wife both agreed with the presence of that one inclusion. It identifies the specific variety, and the wife even thought it to be quite desireable. I think the manager preferred mine, but such is everything. Everything boils down to preference.
In short, I still have no appraisal on my item. Mom doesn''t have one either, but we do have supporting evidence to say it is what it was stated to be. The problem is that nobody wants to put a price on it without a lab report, and I know more or less what the lab report might say (pending on the lab), and pending that, they still won''t appraise it!
I have never EVER imagined that someone who is a "gemologist" and an "independent" appraiser not be as objective as they ought to be, and be as insulting as the last 2 we''ve dealt with. The last one gave the impression that we couldn''t possibly afford the 2 stones that we acquired if they were what they were sold as.
Based on the tests of refractivity (I am guessing these have been done), and the evidence of the particular inclusion in question, supporting statements from another GG (who is also a dealer for that same exact type of stone) stating that the inclusion is a very good indicator of the specific variety, an inquiry to someone at GIA (in general). The origins of the items were disclosed, and we have no reason to discredit that disclosure or question it. In this instance, even if the origin was mistaken, it is not of great importance to us.
I just have a hard time phathoming the snobbery with some individuals, and I am starting to see some other things first hand that are specific to this particular material.
My family went to this other place for an appraiser. I figured I would take my item in case I decided to leave it. I figured show the first one first and take it from there unlike the last time. The guy started to become a little rude and said where ever you bought it online, and I said it didn''t come from online and I thought where I bought it at was not particularly relevent to appraising it. He looked at me and said, "You don''t have to tell me, I know."
Just to give you an idea, this was a place where you have to press the buzzer to get in. It was one of those places.
The first thing, he looks at the label and said the wording was misused that identified the stone, etc. So automatically, he''s going to go there with pet names being technical names as opposed to identifying the stone more properly.
He takes the stone, goes to the back, looks at some chart and says almost the same thing as the first woman who saw both items said. It''s of this species, but it''s not of this variety (based on the logic of saying it can''t be this pet name). So I pointed out the inclusion, and this guy looked. He said based on that observation, it does appear to be what the technical name of the stone is. Great! Finally, I got this guy to look.
So now the magic question, what would it cost to replace that single item in a retail environment?
He refused to say, and said he wanted a lab report and wanted to send it to AGTA. Despite the fact that based on his observation (that he wouldn''t have seen since he didn''t look before hand), he identified it as being what it was presented as (minus the pet name). He also changed his tune when we told him that origin was disclosed, and had he understood the abbreviation on the back, that would have cleared that up. Then he changed his demeanor really fast.
He refused to appraise it as "there''s no way to really tell". He did mention other labs such as Tokyo, Gubelin, etc.
We were looking for some other items, and we dealt with another woman who realized we knew a little bit about these things. When I started rattling of technical specs on 2 sapphires she bought out, I think at that point she knew I wasn''t some run of the mill...whoever. She realized we were all enthusiasts. So I asked her if they had ever sent anything to Gubelin in specific.
She said that they had dealt with them on a few occassions. So I asked her if she knew anything about the customs stuff and so forth, I was willing to have my stone sent to there from them. I knew more about these things than she did when we were discussing logistics and such. That suprised me. So apparently, they don''t like to deal with anyone besides AGTA. I guess they get that 25% discount as being members (if they are members) and tack on a premium.
I guess sending the thing off to Gubelin is no good because they can''t make any money off that, so therefore they don''t know.
So anyways, we go off to the jeweler who told us to go to this place for an appraisal to begin with. We told him what the appraiser said. The manager asked us, "He told you based on observation what it was but send it to a lab and didn''t appraise it? He doesn''t know what he''s doing and he''s playing this game with the insurance and such."
This same jeweler also told us a very interesting story. The guy sent a diamond over to this same appraiser. He wasn''t too thrilled when it appraised for less than wholesale only because he stated it was a G color/VS1 stone. The jeweler didn''t tell the appraiser that he had a GIA cert that said D color and VVS1.
So the jeweler basically said that this other guy is playing this name game, and he knows this game, and what it boils down to is make a load of money for a lab report that you don''t need, and unless you pay for it, we won''t appraise it so they could put some overinflated price or something to keep the insurance company happy.
So Mom shows her stone to the jeweler for a mounting. He thought it was really nice. No, we didn''t buy it from him, and yes this jeweler is based out of Europe. In the meantime, the rest of the family and myself are looking at a parcel of sapphires. I took my stone, and I flashed it. The managers eyes lit up. After a minute or so, he did a double take, looked at me and said, "Let me see that one again." He was quite impressed with it.
He opens up the case, he looks at it with the tweezers and all. The first thing he said was that the stone was brilliant. In that store, yeah. Come in my house and I''ll show you the window. In that store though, whoa. The managers wife comes in. She liked my mothers better, and her jaw dropped when I pointed out the particular inclusion. She also said the same thing about mine (despite the slightly eye visible healed fracture near the crown). It''s brilliant. Though my mother''s is smaller, we both agreed that hers is probably worth more.
Sadly enough, this store doesn''t do appraisals and they don''t send anything out other than their own merchandise. However, the manager and his wife both agreed with the presence of that one inclusion. It identifies the specific variety, and the wife even thought it to be quite desireable. I think the manager preferred mine, but such is everything. Everything boils down to preference.
In short, I still have no appraisal on my item. Mom doesn''t have one either, but we do have supporting evidence to say it is what it was stated to be. The problem is that nobody wants to put a price on it without a lab report, and I know more or less what the lab report might say (pending on the lab), and pending that, they still won''t appraise it!
I have never EVER imagined that someone who is a "gemologist" and an "independent" appraiser not be as objective as they ought to be, and be as insulting as the last 2 we''ve dealt with. The last one gave the impression that we couldn''t possibly afford the 2 stones that we acquired if they were what they were sold as.
Based on the tests of refractivity (I am guessing these have been done), and the evidence of the particular inclusion in question, supporting statements from another GG (who is also a dealer for that same exact type of stone) stating that the inclusion is a very good indicator of the specific variety, an inquiry to someone at GIA (in general). The origins of the items were disclosed, and we have no reason to discredit that disclosure or question it. In this instance, even if the origin was mistaken, it is not of great importance to us.
I just have a hard time phathoming the snobbery with some individuals, and I am starting to see some other things first hand that are specific to this particular material.
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