White flash service?!?!

[gingerBcookie]

So based on the fab info from ps and our own preferences, my bf and I bought a rock (which I love love love! I''ll post the specs later if anyone is interested) and he contacted Whiteflash to get started on the ring making/designing process. I''ve heard som many great things about them here but his experience so far has been very very VERY disappointing. The sales rep is not working with him on the design, but rather continues to quote prices and push for a credit card number on rings that I honestly don''t know where he got from cuz WE haven''t even decided on a final design. He doesn''t ask any questions to clarify what we want. For example, we sent him a pic from her of a ring that had an element I liked, not the entire ring. The e-mail explicitly explained that I like that part only. He gave us a quote on the exact ring, then when we said no not that one, he said ok, i''ll get you another quote tomorrow morning, but never even asked what our ring looked like! I don''t understand!! His 2nd qoute was much more expensive than what I''ve seen on comparable rings here (I know it can''t be exact) and when asked to explain, he said he can''t work with us on price because if we paid less we would get lower quality work from them. Now we''re afraid to continue working with him because of the obvious lack of desire to communicate on his side and the threat of shoddy work if we try to bargain with the price. I was really hoping to work with WF since they are based in Houston (where we live), but personally, this is unacceptable service, esp for a purchase this important and expensive. Is it because we didn''t buy the diamond from them?

sorry for the long post, just dazed and confused about our WF experience thus far. what should we do?

 

[chrono]

I'm sorry to hear this. I've never bought anything from WF although I have dealt with Denise and Henry. Perhaps you can contact the manager at WF and lodge an official complaint. I think she sometimes visits PS too. I've seem to have forgotten her name. Give me a bit of time to find it.

 

[aljdewey]

The "manager" Chrono speaks of us actually the president, Debi Wexler.

From your post above, it sounds as though you aren't working directly with Brian Gavin. If I'm right on this, I'd suggest you go straight to Brian and discuss the ring project with him. He's the one that makes things happen.

 

[chrono]

Thanks for the reminder, Aljdewey. Isn't Brian Gavin the cutter? How can he help with the design?

GingerBcookie didn't buy a WF diamond; she's just having WF do the setting.

 

[LesleyH]

Ginger:

Please give me a call at 1-877-612-6770 so that we can figure out what is going wrong with this process and make it right for you ASAP. I would call you but can't identify you from your screen name.

Thanks,

LesleyH
www.whiteflash.com

 

[noobie]

----------------
On 9/22/2004 3:05:09 PM gingerBcookie wrote:




Is it because we didn't buy the diamond from them?

sorry for the long post, just dazed and confused about our WF experience thus far. what should we do?
----------------

Well Ginger, sorry to hear about a disappointing experience. There are really two things you can do. Call Lesley and talk to her and decide if you want to give them another chance. If you do, I would recommend that you visit their office since you are local and sit with them through the design of your ring. I know some have sucessfully done it by phone and e-mail, but having recently made two custom rings, there's nothing like a face to face discussion to make sure they truly understand what you want.

The other thing is to go somewhere else. There are many fine affordable custom jewelers around. If you need help finding one, contact an indepenedent appraiser in your area listed above and ask them about the work they have seen and if they can recommend one or two you can talk to.

Either way make sure you get exactly what you want at the price you are willing to pay. There is plenty of competition around.

Good luck.

 

[aljdewey]

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On 9/22/2004 3:37:45 PM chrono wrote:

Isn't Brian Gavin the cutter? How can he help with the design? ----------------

LOL.....he's at least as qualified as a customer service rep, isn't he?

Kidding aside, it was Brian that I talked to about my ring design. It was he that helped me realize my ring. I told him all the things I wanted to see and how I wanted them to go together. He brought up issues about durability and comfort in the collaboration.

He has a TREMENDOUS amount of knowledge, and it is Brian that communicates the instructions on design to the benchman.

 

[gingerBcookie]

sorry to bump an old and dead topic. I just wanted to thank Lesley for your prompt response and to let you know i gave your number to my BF and he will call you hen he has his stuff ready. Your reply made us feel more comfortable with working with WF and I really hope this all works out well!

Thanks to every one else also for their advice and help!

 

[synth19]

I've also been dealing with Lesley and she has been terrific to work with and I HIGHLY recommend White Flash.

 

[Dancing Fire]

ginger,

since you bring up the subject, when i was looking to buy a stone a few months ago, i called WF and a secretary answer the phone, she said all the sale representatives is out of the office. so i left my phone # and they never called back. i ended up buying from GOG.This sure don't sound like WF,because they have so many happy customers .another thing i don't understand is why they refuse to post a h&a picture from their expert selections.

 

[aljdewey]

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On 9/28/2004 8:31:34 PM vtigger86 wrote:





another thing i don't understand is why they refuse to post a h&a picture from their expert selections.
----------------

This has been explained repeatedly.

The expert selection diamonds aren't being sold as H&A diamonds. Therefore, there is no need to post H&A images.

Whiteflash works extremely hard to protect their brand, and part of that brand is meeting exacting standards of H&A. Posting H&A images for non-H&A diamonds could potentially dilute that brand.

Simply put: H&A pictures are useful for one thing and one thing only.....showing the presence of (or lack of) a crisp, viable H&A pattern, and that ONLY matters if the diamond is being represented/sold as an H&A. Any other meaningful piece of information can be obtained from the IdealScope, etc.....which they DO provide.

Another way of thinking of it: There's no need for me to ask to see your college diploma unless you are claiming to be a college graduate. Even though you may have attended college for 3.5 years, the diploma only becomes relevant if *you* claim to be a graduate.

 

[debi wexler]

Dear Ginger,

I was reading your post and I suppose I would have done the same thing. I regret you had this experience at WF in terms of our response. This is not a typical response and I hope it's not a "repeated" response, but thank you for bringing up your experience to the forum. It's interesting, I probably never would have known about you as a lost customer had you not mentioned anything on the channel.

We always look forward to hearing the good and the not so good so we can strive to make ourselves better for you.

Thanks again

Debi Wexler
CEO
Whiteflash

 

[Mara]

I always work directly with Brian and Lesley...Brian is who I spoke to regarding my new stone, and also the replica of my engagement ring for my wedding band. Probably because he has such an eye for the STONE, it helps with the design of the setting for that very stone. He is great at allaying fears, giving his opinion in terms of what would look right vs wrong. I trust what he says, and I am a huge detail person, 10 calls to confirm what was already said.

Pain in the ass maybe!

Ginger, I would do as Lesley suggested and call her if you are still interested in working with WhiteFlash. Good luck with your project!

 

[marriahlyn]

I have to say this is not the usual for Whiteflash as I've had nothing but great communication and wonderful response time during my 2 projects. They are currently making me a custom ring which is clearly what I want and they've been fabulous and I did not buy my diamond from them. That never was an issue.

I wish you luck with your venture.

PS If you're having them make a custom ring, they have to do mine first LOL

 

[Dancing Fire]

Whiteflash works extremely hard to protect their brand, and part of that brand is meeting exacting standards of H&A. Posting H&A images for non-H&A diamonds could potentially dilute that brand.

Aljdewey,

i would like to compare their ES stones images to their ACA to see if worth the extra premium. maybe some of those just missed ACA stones also have true h&a that's the reason they don't want to show the images.

 

[JohnQuixote]

Hello vtigger,
Expert Selection diamonds are all hand picked by Brian the Cutter. Each stone has the best value for its class and category.

Our definition of true "Hearts & Arrows" is the pattern you see in the A Cut Above line. ES stones may display what could be defined as hearts and arrows elsewhere (Phony H&A). Some ES stones may come close to our definition of "true H&A," but we feel it would be confusing to the casual consumer (and diluting, as aljdewey said) to advertise any diamond not meeting distinct ACA standards as a Whiteflash Hearts & Arrows stone.

Since Brian does select all of the ES stones, you are correct in assuming that there are tremendous values there.

 

[aljdewey]

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On 9/29/2004 3:01:05 AM vtigger86 wrote:


maybe some of those just missed ACA stones also have true h&a that's the reason they don't want to show the images.

----------------

Or maybe they are validly concerned about providing information to customers who may not know how to represent that information later.

This is similar to the soundbite effect. If you are walking by a group of people I'm talking to and you heard me say "I'm the queen of England", you may think I'm claiming to be the Queen of England. You may tell other people that *I* think I'm the queen of england....after all, you heard me say it.

However, because you didn't hear the whole conversation, you took it out of context. What I may have actually said is "If that brand new Mercedes is reeeeeeeeeally being sold for only $20K, then I'm the queen of England!" Meaning I don't believe it's so.

How does this apply to WF and ES stones? A newbie comes here asking about a stone they are considering. Earnest pricescopers ask them to post images they've gotten from the vendor. Newbie posts images, including the H&A image, but NEGLECTS to mention the diamond isn't being sold/represented as an H&A diamond.

Forum participants then proceed to RIP the hearts images....assert how they are NOT true H&A, and in the process, scare the crap out of the buyer who now hears *negative* stuff about a stone. Oh, and also, someone later says "wow, did you see that poor excuse for an H&A stone that Whiteflash was selling?".....when it was never being sold that way.

How to avoid this problem? Don't provide H&A images on stones that aren't being sold as H&A. I don't blame them...I wouldn't do it either.

An aside: If someone buying an ES stone really wanted to know how their stone stacks up, they could always purchase an H&A viewer for themselves. But that's far less risky than the vendor producing pictures that others might misconstrue because they don't know what they are supposed to be representing.

 

[Superidealist]

Maybe someone interested in seeing such images could ask to see "Whiteflash viewer images" instead. I don't see why Whiteflash should send these images since they would be opening themselves up to possible "gotchas" but at least they would not be representing the images as hearts and arrows.

A bigger question for me is why aren't "Classic" and "New Line" A Cut Aboves marked as such? I believe Brian has said that there is a difference in appearance between the two lines, so this seems like something that might be important for the consumer to know. Of course if each diamond were clearly marked as New Line or Classic, they'd have people like me commenting on their standards. So maybe I've answered my own question.

 

[strmrdr]

While were picking on whiteflash a little my biggest problem with them is the use of stock heart and arrow photos on the website and not the real h&a picture of that diamond.
That just isnt right in my book and the excuse that they all look the same dont cut it with me.
But they will provide the real photos on request.

The majority of the time when I fire them off a question the answer is prompt and informative. So thats a plus.
The arent perfect but they are on my top 5 vendor list.
In no order they are:
goodoldgold.com
diamondexpert.com
winkjones.com
niceice.com
whiteflash.com

 

[Superidealist]

I have no problem with the use of stock photos as long as they are clearly marked as such. In the past, the notice that the images were stock photos had been buried in their terms of service. To their credit, Whiteflash now has the disclaimer at the bottom of each diamond's webpage.