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2 Carats Under 8K: Doable or Bad Idea?

Honestly, having seen some diamonds that people have bought for size rather than the important things, like cut, colour and clarity, I can truthfully say that I'd would rather have a beautiful bright sparkly smaller ring on my finger, than a lump of frozen spit.

Your GF might think that the size of the diamond is the most important thing, but after a while, a dull lump on her finger won't be so appealing.
 
HDer
FYI...When it comes to diamonds...'there ain't no filet mignon for hamburger price"...:mrgreen2:
 
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HDer said:
For what it's worth, she never asked me for a carat size. I'm sure I'd be fine even with a 1.5 or even a 1 carat stone. She did hint that she might want a "really big one, like 2 or 3 carats" in the future if we had more money, so if anything, this is more of a preemptive move to forestall future requests for upgrades. Plus, I like bargain hunting, so it's kind of fun. But yeah, if I strike out on these other ones, I'll probably go with the 1.77 or a stone similar to it.

Also, I just checked the links I put up yesterday in the original post and 2 out of the 3 stones are already sold, so I'm not the only one (gullible enough to be) buying cheaper 2 carat stones.
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If you are likely to upgrade to a bigger stone in the future then make sure you buy from a vendor with a great upgrade policy. Also bear in mind that a stone with a great cut would be easier for you to sell on yourself if that would ever be an option.
 
HDer said:
For what it's worth, she never asked me for a carat size. I'm sure I'd be fine even with a 1.5 or even a 1 carat stone. She did hint that she might want a "really big one, like 2 or 3 carats" in the future if we had more money, so if anything, this is more of a preemptive move to forestall future requests for upgrades. Plus, I like bargain hunting, so it's kind of fun. But yeah, if I strike out on these other ones, I'll probably go with the 1.77 or a stone similar to it.
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Good Woman !

I had not seen it comming that you'd want her to - innapropriatedly - flount a 2 carat, for the sake of your being cheap re. upgrade. ROFLMAO !

Get a Fine stone - fresh off the polishing wheel of a great cutter - to serve as benchmark for the three (five?) carat marker of your ten year annyversary. See @Wink for thoroughbred round brilliants (all-set).

-------


And, perhaps, show her these from my part: also fresh diamonds beyond white, beyond oval, round & princess ... Their author WWW makes interesting things - worth keeping in mind that such exist, IHMO. It is a small diamond club, accepting part of 'dues' ,-) in immagination rather than any other currency.

over & out
 
Are you into cars? This strikes me like someone buying a Mazda RX8 and then stuffing that into a Ferrari body.

If you buy a diamond below I (maybe J), you will get almost nothing on the secondary market should you wish to sell the diamond. Most buyers of diamonds have little knowledge beyond the 4C and have a perceptive barrier below J as 'not white'....true or not. They are looking for a bargain and will not be looking at anything with actual or perceived visible inclusions. So, you will eat most of the cost of this diamond associated with any future purchase or if you buy from even a reputable vendor without any upgrade policy. On the pre-owned market, you will be lucky to get a few thousand for the color stone you are focused on in the search of a size goal. If you buy from JA, the next diamond must be $16k to trade in. Are you prepared for that? Maybe that is cool. Personally, if I was buying a modern round, I'd want to keep my upgrade/trade options wide open. You pay for the future flexibility and superior cut (thus the higher per carat price for WF, HPD and BGD). HPD actually has a buy-back policy that is beyond the other.
 
Thank you for all of your responses!

To answer some of the things you've brought up: I'm not concerned about resale values or upgrade policies at this time. I understand there's a big gap between wholesale and retail prices for diamonds in general, so I'm not buying something as an "investment" per se.

Similarly, I'm not looking to buy a AGS/GIA certificate to hang on the wall, but I'm not looking to buy a "lump of frozen spit" either. If it sparkles 10% or even 20% less than the "hearts and arrows AG0 HCA 1.0" reference diamond so be it, but I don't want something that looks obviously dull (say only has 30% the sparkle) to the non-expert eye. As for clarity and color, there's only one magnification level this stone will be seen at, and that's 1x. It will also only ever be seen in the setting. I doubt any of our friends are on here, but if they are and they want to examine it from the side for 2 minutes and tell us that it's yellower than it should be, then so be it. But once again, within reason. Don't want a big black blob of carbon in the middle.

So to use the car analogy, I'm not looking for a Ferrari. I'm looking for a BMW 3 series. You see many of them on the road every day; most of their owners drive them like a Camry; they're probably overpriced; but the BMW logo makes a lot of people happy.
 
HDer said:
Thank you for all of your responses!

To answer some of the things you've brought up: I'm not concerned about resale values or upgrade policies at this time. I understand there's a big gap between wholesale and retail prices for diamonds in general, so I'm not buying something as an "investment" per se.

Similarly, I'm not looking to buy a AGS/GIA certificate to hang on the wall, but I'm not looking to buy a "lump of frozen spit" either. If it sparkles 10% or even 20% less than the "hearts and arrows AG0 HCA 1.0" reference diamond so be it, but I don't want something that looks obviously dull (say only has 30% the sparkle) to the non-expert eye. As for clarity and color, there's only one magnification level this stone will be seen at, and that's 1x. It will also only ever be seen in the setting. I doubt any of our friends are on here, but if they are and they want to examine it from the side for 2 minutes and tell us that it's yellower than it should be, then so be it. But once again, within reason. Don't want a big black blob of carbon in the middle.

So to use the car analogy, I'm not looking for a Ferrari. I'm looking for a BMW 3 series. You see many of them on the road every day; most of their owners drive them like a Camry; they're probably overpriced, but the BMW logo makes a lot of people happy.
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What size is her finger? Some of the folks here are very good at showing the combo of diamond and halo, which is actually really critical to consider.

Great feedback. But, I think what you are hearing on this thread is that the K posted earlier is the best option for size with good performance and eye-clean clarity, but it will be tinted to most. I posted a list of super-ideas in the 1.4c range that will be sparkle-bombs, but smaller. There is just not much that can be found between these options right now if pre-owned is out, although I hold out hope for some of the fancy shape pros. .WIs there a Hearts On Fire, Crafted By Infinity or other super-ideal dealer you can visit? It would be good to have her look at a sparkle-bomb and see if she would like that over size (as the two are pushing you compromises in different directions). One thing to keep in mind is that exceptional cut both hides more color, but makes the stone look bigger. Add a well-constructed halo and you've got a girl's dream.

1.406 K VS2, https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3568734.htm

Hopefully, more dimaonds will be come available as we enter September with the lag from wholesale end of things coming back from holiday and options entering.

I'm not sure anyone suggested it, but give Yuketiel at ID Jewelery in New York a call. He's been very good at finding unicorn SI1 on budgets. Maybe he can find a few we've missed. I would strongly advise staying at a J or higher. I find K's very clearly tinted.

https://idjewelry.com/

For visual refeerence, to PP note about size. On a size 6, this is the 7.18 mm, 1.4 C WF above by itself (left) and with a halo (right; assumes 1 mm wide halo).

upload_2017-8-22_10-23-43.png
 
HDer said:
Thank you for all of your responses!

To answer some of the things you've brought up: I'm not concerned about resale values or upgrade policies at this time. I understand there's a big gap between wholesale and retail prices for diamonds in general, so I'm not buying something as an "investment" per se.

Similarly, I'm not looking to buy a AGS/GIA certificate to hang on the wall, but I'm not looking to buy a "lump of frozen spit" either. If it sparkles 10% or even 20% less than the "hearts and arrows AG0 HCA 1.0" reference diamond so be it, but I don't want something that looks obviously dull (say only has 30% the sparkle) to the non-expert eye. As for clarity and color, there's only one magnification level this stone will be seen at, and that's 1x. It will also only ever be seen in the setting. I doubt any of our friends are on here, but if they are and they want to examine it from the side for 2 minutes and tell us that it's yellower than it should be, then so be it. But once again, within reason. Don't want a big black blob of carbon in the middle.

So to use the car analogy, I'm not looking for a Ferrari. I'm looking for a BMW 3 series. You see many of them on the road every day; most of their owners drive them like a Camry; they're probably overpriced; but the BMW logo makes a lot of people happy.
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Call diamods by lauren and see what he has.
 
rockysalamander said:
What size is her finger? Some of the folks here are very good at showing the combo of diamond and halo, which is actually really critical to consider.

Great feedback. But, I think what you are hearing on this thread is that the K posted earlier is the best option for size with good performance and eye-clean clarity, but it will be tinted to most. I posted a list of super-ideas in the 1.4c range that will be sparkle-bombs, but smaller. There is just not much that can be found between these options right now if pre-owned is out, although I hold out hope for some of the fancy shape pros. .WIs there a Hearts On Fire, Crafted By Infinity or other super-ideal dealer you can visit? It would be good to have her look at a sparkle-bomb and see if she would like that over size (as the two are pushing you compromises in different directions). One thing to keep in mind is that exceptional cut both hides more color, but makes the stone look bigger. Add a well-constructed halo and you've got a girl's dream.

1.406 K VS2, https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3568734.htm

Hopefully, more dimaonds will be come available as we enter September with the lag from wholesale end of things coming back from holiday and options entering.

I'm not sure anyone suggested it, but give Yuketiel at ID Jewelery in New York a call. He's been very good at finding unicorn SI1 on budgets. Maybe he can find a few we've missed. I would strongly advise staying at a J or higher. I find K's very clearly tinted.

https://idjewelry.com/

For visual refeerence, to PP note about size. On a size 6, this is the 7.18 mm, 1.4 C WF above by itself (left) and with a halo (right; assumes 1 mm wide halo).

upload_2017-8-22_10-23-43.png
Click to expand...

Thank you! Will give Yuketiel a call. Martin from USA Certed has not gotten back to me yet. I do appreciate ALL of the feedback. Learned a ton over the last two days. Please keep it coming!
 
HDer said:
Thank you! Will give Yuketiel a call. Martin from USA Certed has not gotten back to me yet. I do appreciate ALL of the feedback. Learned a ton over the last two days. Please keep it coming!
Click to expand...
Great. Tell him PS sent you. You can post any options he suggests here...:wavey:
 
whitewave said:
Don't email Martin. Call him.
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I called him a couple of times yesterday and just called him now, but it's gone to voicemail every time.
 
One more thing worth mentioning. If you put an off color stone in a halo with relatively white stones - which most preset halos do - it will accentuate the color of the center stone. Better to have a balance between the center stone and halo.
 
HDer said:
Thank you for all of your responses!

So to use the car analogy, I'm not looking for a Ferrari. I'm looking for a BMW 3 series. You see many of them on the road every day; most of their owners drive them like a Camry; they're probably overpriced; but the BMW logo makes a lot of people happy.
Click to expand...

I found the BMW 3 series you are going to get with this budget!
IMG_3481.jpg

:lol: I had to do it, sorry.
 
Forgive me, but I think dear OP that you need to take a step back with all the information you have received and learned and maybe re-evaluate with your dear GF what you really want. You clearly want to make her happy and you think that includes a big 2 carat rock, which depending on the particular rock, she may or may not agree. I would definitely recommend NOT rushing into a purchase and let all these suggestions and options simmmer for a bit. Go back. Look at lots of videos. Go see lots of K colored MRBs in real life with you GF and decide together what makes her MOST happy with her active input and with her evaluating the stone and ring options. Then come back and maybe restart the search. Many times, we all can change our opinions when we become better educated. And really sit back and rethink your priorities (BMW example on Toyota budget may not be the wisest idea.) after you have become more acquainted with the realities of diamond ring shopping. Best of luck to you both.
 
I had a ,47 carat super ideal diamond in a semi bezel, and more than one person asked me if it was a carat. What I'm saying, people are not just going by size but by visual performance. You want her to be wowed by the stone, right? Mesmerized. No friend is going to be able to tell the difference between a 1.7 carat and a 2.0, esp in a Halo. It is worth getting to me the better cut stone, and for me j or higher color. I would honestly shoot for 1.5 carat, which is bigger than 90% or more of the solitaire out there.
 
So, HDer,
Does that mean that fat-faceted, chunky 1.91ct, beautiful OEC is up for grabs?!? cuz I'm in LOVE! :love:
CRM
 
LLJsmom said:
Forgive me, but I think dear OP that you need to take a step back with all the information you have received and learned and maybe re-evaluate with your dear GF what you really want. You clearly want to make her happy and you think that includes a big 2 carat rock, which depending on the particular rock, she may or may not agree. I would definitely recommend NOT rushing into a purchase and let all these suggestions and options simmmer for a bit. Go back. Look at lots of videos. Go see lots of K colored MRBs in real life with you GF and decide together what makes her MOST happy with her active input and with her evaluating the stone and ring options. Then come back and maybe restart the search. Many times, we all can change our opinions when we become better educated. And really sit back and rethink your priorities (BMW example on Toyota budget may not be the wisest idea.) after you have become more acquainted with the realities of diamond ring shopping. Best of luck to you both.
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HDer, please read LLJsmom's post several times!


On page one, you said this:

HDer said:
For what it's worth, she never asked me for a carat size. I'm sure I'd be fine even with a 1.5 or even a 1 carat stone. She did hint that she might want a "really big one, like 2 or 3 carats" in the future if we had more money, so if anything, this is more of a preemptive move to forestall future requests for upgrades. Plus, I like bargain hunting, so it's kind of fun.
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Do you really think that getting a big but not so beautiful diamond is what she wants?

Based on your comments above, I'd suggest a beautiful diamond, as large as your budget allows, from a vendor with a good upgrade policy. Definitely, a vendor with a good upgrade policy! Discuss the solitaire/halo thing with your GF; if she's happy with either setting, then go for a solitaire to increase the money available for the diamond.

Do not prioritize size over cut quality unless she has told you that is what she wants.
 
HDer said:
For what it's worth, she never asked me for a carat size. I'm sure I'd be fine even with a 1.5 or even a 1 carat stone. She did hint that she might want a "really big one, like 2 or 3 carats" in the future if we had more money, so if anything, this is more of a preemptive move to forestall future requests for upgrades. Plus, I like bargain hunting, so it's kind of fun. But yeah, if I strike out on these other ones, I'll probably go with the 1.77 or a stone similar to it.
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This changes a lot!! There are several points I want to make.

1. She has expressed that she likes big rocks and will likely want a larger one later. Have you heard of "DSS" diamond shrinkage syndrome? It's a tongue-in-cheek way of saying that we get used to the size rock we have, and end up wanting bigger. If you get her a 1.5 now, she may want a 2 down the road. But, if you get her the 2 now, she will want a 2.5 down the road, given her attraction to large stones. So you're probably looking at an upgrade down the line regardless.

2. Since an upgrade is in your future, I would say that your primary considerations should be resale value and/or the vendor's upgrade policy. If you buy preloved now, you can probably recoup most of the cost of it down the line. If you buy "new" from a vendor with a poor or no upgrade policy, then you may be forced to sell the diamond later, and you'll lose about 30-60% of the price you paid (you'll get better value back for a good stone, cut being most important). Or you can buy from a vendor with a good upgrade policy, and use that down the road.

My recommendation to you: Buy a stunning ~1.5 ct now from a vendor with a great upgrade policy (i.e. who credits you the amount you paid, with no restriction on how much you spend on the upgrade. At James Allen you'll have to spend double next time, so this is not great) and upgrade in a few years. Then you'll only have to drop an extra few thousand to get a much bigger and well-cut stone once her DSS sets in.
 
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HDer said:
Also, I just checked the links I put up yesterday in the original post and 2 out of the 3 stones are already sold, so I'm not the only one (gullible enough to be) buying cheaper 2 carat stones.
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I don't think people are gullible for buyer these gems; for some people carat is the most important thing they look for when buying a diamond and contrary to what people say here on pricescope, there's nothing wrong with that. No, it won't sparkle like a super ideal cut, but to the average person they probably won't notice the difference. Here people go on and on about cut, but to most people it's not such a big deal - the diamonds you linked to initially are much nicer than what people who shop at shopping centre jewellery stores would find.

If you want to get her a 2ct stone because that's most important to you both, then do it and enjoy your diamond! And shame on the people here who are mocking you for it.
 
OP, as others have said, if she hasn't specified that she wants a 2ct stone I would go slightly smaller and get a beautiful stone that you can upgrade later if you want. As others have said I don't think you will get a nice stone in the 2ct range with your budget and it makes no sense to get a larger worse cut diamond if that isn't even what your gf wants.
 
Katesimone said:
I don't think people are gullible for buyer these gems; for some people carat is the most important thing they look for when buying a diamond and contrary to what people say here on pricescope, there's nothing wrong with that. No, it won't sparkle like a super ideal cut, but to the average person they probably won't notice the difference. Here people go on and on about cut, but to most people it's not such a big deal - the diamonds you linked to initially are much nicer than what people who shop at shopping centre jewellery stores would find.

If you want to get her a 2ct stone because that's most important to you both, then do it and enjoy your diamond! And shame on the people here who are mocking you for it.
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Thank you. :-) Yes, I agree that people on here are all about cut, cut, cut, whereas people in the other 99% of the world are all about carats, carats, carats. (poor color and clarity; so underappreciated). I'm still trying to figure out where my personal feelings are on the matter, although my g/f is in the other 99%.

That said, whatever people's opinions are, thank you for posting them. Whether or not I agree I've read all of them, and have learned a lot.
 
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