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99.2% of recent US Covid deaths were unvaccinated people

I have not read all the posts in detail.

However, part of UK's justification to delay further lifting of Covid 19 restrictions in England was due to significant increase of C19 cases in the younger unvaccinated population.

Hence the drive to vaccinate as many of the younger people above the age of 18 before 19 July 2021, to give them at least one of the two doses by that date.

I agree wholeheartedly with this strategy, even though I do not agree with every decision our government has made with regard to Covid 19 to date.

Personal opinion and all that jazz.

DK :))
 
Snowdrop13 said:
I’m very pro vaccine myself and my teenager has had the first dose but I understand why some people can’t take the vaccine (and also why some won’t).

I just want to say that I don’t agree at all that the negative effects of the vaccine are not being noted. Here in the U.K., at least, there is a “yellow card” system where anyone, doctors and patients alike can report side effects of any drug. That is how they are collecting the data and when anything of significance shows up, it is acted on.
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Indeed, post-authorisation/marketing surveillance and monitoring is of paramount importance, especially for new entities/drugs.

I have every faith in MHRA to do the right thing - based on my own interactions with this agency as a HCP.

DK =)2
 
Queenie60 said:
Many have died from the "vaccine" and have had sever side effects from the "vaccine" - however, we don't hear about this. And social media is censoring and removing information that goes against the "vaccine" - why not allow opinions and debate?
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www.abc4.com

Teen dies days after getting COVID-19 vaccine, officials investigating

(ABC4) – The death of a Michigan teenager just days after he received his second dose of the COVID-19 vaccine is now under investigation. Health officials say a 13-year-old from Saginaw Count…
www.abc4.com www.abc4.com
 
kenny said:
So, according to your way of thinking I, and nearly all the other selfless vaccine-taking liberals here on PS, have risked our lives to save yours, and the lives of your grandchildren.

You're welcome.
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Thanks Kenny for saving my life. I love you, without the PS liberals we all be dead by now.
 
icy_jade said:
There is a difference between “cannot” and “will not”. Don’t think anyone is judging those that “cannot”.
Click to expand...

This. No one is judging those who cannot get vaccinated. Those who can get vaccinated should get vaccinated not just to protect themselves but to protect others who *cannot* get vaccinated. We should protect those who need it most. Why is that such a difficult concept to grasp? I don't understand the selfishness some people exhibit. :(

voce said:
There's always people who care about themselves more than society at large, and they can usually afford to do so.
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Yes and it became painfully clear as to who these people are during Covid. The people who didn't want to "stop living their lives" and who didn't believe what was happening right in front of them. Who called this a hoax. It still is surreal to me how divided and broken the pandemic showed us to be.

kenny said:
But by refusing vaccination they invite the virus to use their bodies as petrie dishes to breed new mutant strains that more-effectively kill people who are vaccinated.
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Bingo. This is the reason everyone who can get vaccinated should. I am not advocating that those who cannot get vaccinated get vaccinated. Absolutely not. But for those individuals who can medically get vaccinated- not to can be dangerous for everyone. That is the reality of why we should get vaccinated (if we can).

All I can say is "Time makes more converts than reason"
Let's hope it isn't too late by the time that happens.
 
Queenie60 said:
And to add to my comments - how do you know for sure that 99.2% of COVID deaths were unvaccinated? This is what big mainstream media is telling you - do you believe everything they say? Maybe do a little research prior to repeating what the fake news is telling you. Just a CNN repeat in my opinion. I find your comments to be quite offensive and uncalled for.
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I have not seen any real data from the US, its probably still being collected. This weekend I was on call for Infectious disease, 8 out of 11 consults for COVID were unvaccinated. 1 was on a medication that is known to decrease response to Vaccine. This has been the pattern with the recent uptick in numbers.
 
Liink to reported adverse reactions to the vaccines. Government can't force people to report adverse reactions. Government can't force people to get the vaccine. People who rely on their opinions rather than data have no credibility. Questioning data and sources of information without providing alternate data and sources of information in refutation is a logical fallacy used by those who know they do not have a legitimate argument.

www.cdc.gov

COVID-19 Vaccination

COVID-19 vaccines protect against COVID-19. Get safety info and more.
www.cdc.gov www.cdc.gov
 
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icy_jade said:
And so, you are welcome too.

89BC42AF-1CDD-4472-A660-ED90A520F41F.jpeg



There is a difference between “cannot” and “will not”. Don’t think anyone is judging those that “cannot”. Let’s not confuse the issue. We are discussing the “will not” people.




Well said
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Thanks for the clarification. The statements previously made did not address the difference, and frankly feel judgmental and unkind.

Edited to say that I don't feel I'm "confusing the issue" to bring up this point.
 
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kenny said:
Ugh!

214f.png
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Oh how lovely life would be if I could just ignore all of the chaos and sh**t that I don’t want to hear. Especially if I took it upon myself to make asinine comments and to then turn the other cheek. Seems to be the norm throughout social media these days.
 
I mean, this is how I take this news:
1625671179429.png

Lol. The anti-vaxx machine is strong with some people. As soon as one starts spouting off about "MSM" and "experimental drug" it's pretty obvious. I hope the FDA approvals come quick to at least shut that sh!t down.

icy_jade said:
In other countries, we tend not to politicize vaccination. I’m glad as it saves lives.
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It's really unfortunate that it's gone this way :(
 
telephone89 said:
I hope the FDA approvals come quick to at least shut that sh!t down.
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I doubt shutting the shit down will happen. Among the element who choose not to believe anything, it will be just another dose of fake news, hidden bad results, government/CDC/all doctors and scientists can't be trusted, continued paranoia.
 
I guess if you are not getting your children vaccinated you don't care if they get COVID. I understand, kids usually bounce back after sickness.

Recently my son contracted RSV (Respiratory syncytial virus) which is in "outbreak" mode in different parts of our country. He was pretty sick and had a temp. of 103. He is fully vaccinated so I did not have to run any "what if" scenarios through my mind. Peace of mind is great.
 
Queenie60 said:
why such a harsh statement? You don't know the reasons why some of us refuse to vax. My husband and I had the COVID virus in February and both have ati-bodies. Therefore, we are more "vaccinated" than those who got the jab.
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Yep, The best vaccine on earth! :clap:
 
voce said:
Misinformation from the medically ignorant, stated in a manner to stir the pot. The world would be better with less of this.
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So you don't believe in antibodies?
 
Dancing Fire said:
True, but none of these drugs came into market within 1 yr. The avg time is like 6 yrs?
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This argument is so tiresome. Other clinical trials are different for many reasons some of which they can’t get enough people for the studies because it’s not an urgent situation. If you’re trying to study a new treatment for migraine headaches you might have trouble making your quota number for example. The urgency is not there to get it done quickly. Covid is completely different as it was so serious that all resources, all people devoted their time to this vaccine so imagine that it is six or eight years of work into a quick time period. They had no trouble filling the studies (I was a study patient in fact). And the vaccine is so good and so effective that there are now efforts to apply the MRNA technology to existing vaccines.

It is frustrating that people who can get vaxxed refuse to do so because it not only prevents herd immunity to protect those who cannot be vaccinated for other reasons, but also because it gives the variants a chance to strengthen.
 
Dancing Fire said:
Yep, The best vaccine on earth! :clap:
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For @Dancing Fire and anyone else who thinks getting Covid is a better defense and produces better antibodies against future infection vs getting a vaccine against Covid.

The answer is No.

The better/best way to get antibodies and protection from Covid and its variants is through vaccination and not by getting infected with Covid.

These latest findings come from Jesse Bloom, Allison Greaney, and their team at Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center, Seattle.

How Immunity Generated from COVID-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection

A key issue as we move closer to ending the pandemic is determining more precisely how long people exposed to SARS-CoV-2, the COVID-19 virus, will make neutralizing antibodies against this dangerous coronavirus. Finding the answer is also potentially complicated with new SARS-CoV-2 “variants of...
www.nih.gov www.nih.gov

"The new evidence shows that protective antibodies generated in response to an mRNA vaccine will target a broader range of SARS-CoV-2 variants carrying “single letter” changes in a key portion of their spike protein compared to antibodies acquired from an infection."

"Natural immunity and vaccine-generated immunity to SARS-CoV-2 will differ in how they recognize new viral variants. What’s more, antibodies acquired with the help of a vaccine may be more likely to target new SARS-CoV-2 variants potently, even when the variants carry new mutations in the RBD."

Getting the vaccine is the best defense.

"Our best hope of winning this contest with the virus is to get as many people immunized now as possible. That will save lives, and reduce the likelihood of even more variants appearing that might evade protection from the current vaccines."
 
Dancing Fire said:
So you don't believe in antibodies?
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Don't confuse the cause and effect.

Antibodies are what you need to fight COVID, but you come by them in one of two ways:

1) survive a disease; or
2) take an effective vaccine.

Antibodies are RESULTS from one of the above two triggering causes. They themselves do not make good vaccines.
 
There was an erroneous paper, now retracted, that claimed widespread death due to covid vaccine. I doubt news of the retraction spread as quickly and widely as the info in the flawed report.

www.factcheck.org

Flawed Paper on COVID-19 Vaccines, Deaths Spreads Widely Before Retraction - FactCheck.org

The COVID-19 vaccines have been shown in trials and real-world application to be safe and effective. But a paper shared widely online claimed that vaccines cause two deaths for every three lives saved. Experts say the analysis misinterpreted data and was flawed -- and it has now been retracted...
www.factcheck.org www.factcheck.org
 
@DF, did you read the article you posted above? It supports that idea that the vaccines are effective. And those deaths are not from the vaccine, they are from covid infection. LOL. You've been hoisted by your own petard.
 
I wish those Americans and Brits who don't want the vacine could send their's to me
or more importantly to a poorer country like Fiji which is really struggling with covid right now

i do however pity the loved ones, of these anti vax covid fatalities- they give their family and freinds who mourn their passings such loss and pain
 
There is a lot of ignorance and untruth being spewed in this thread. I'm grateful that so many have shown up to refute it, and have done a great job doing so. I'll address just a bit of it.

While it was true that children, teens, and very young adults were far, far less likely to experience severe illness, hospitalization, and death from the native and UK (Alpha) variants, that is less true with the Delta variant, which has officially become the dominant strain in the US and has been the dominant strain for a little while now in several other countries. It is far more transmissible (with an R0 of 6) and has been much harder on children and young people than the prior strains.

Even though children have a lower risk of death from COVID than older people, they are just as at-risk for becoming long-haulers and/or developing organ damage from infection, which could, and likely would, shorten their lifespans and render them essentially disabled to some extent for a long time, and possibly the rest of their lives. I would never take that risk with my child - my job would be to protect not just their life now, but their future as well.

Even fully-vaccinated people can get and transmit the Delta variant. They are still unlikely to need hospitalization or die, but they're getting sick with it and passing it on. In Israel, they're seeing approximately half of their cases in their recent surge being in vaccinated people. So: fully-vaccinated people, you need to keep wearing those masks, especially indoors, particular considering the next two points. There is still substantial improvement in odds of transmission with the vaccines, though, so they're absolutely worth it.

Fully-vaccinated people are still getting hospitalized and dying, particularly among the immune-suppressed and the elderly, as their bodies cannot mount a full and robust response to the vaccines. That group isn't just a "rare few" - it's actually a LOT of people. Eventually, researchers will come up with an advanced dosing/dose schedule regimen for those people, as they have for years with the flu vaccine and others, but we are not yet at that point, so those people are still very vulnerable and need the rest of us to "have their backs." There is still substantial improvement in odds of severe illness and death with the vaccines, though, so they're absolutely worth it.

Fully-vaccinated people who get infected can, and have, become long-haulers, even if they had just mild symptoms or were asymptomatic. They also can end up with their lives threatened by just a mild breakthrough infection if they already had some kinds of pre-existing conditions. For example - DH has kidneys that were damaged years ago by a medication error. He only has about 40-45% remaining kidney function, and it is a normal part of aging to lose some kidney function as one becomes elderly, so at age 60, he has long enough to go that it's essential that we preserve as much of his function now as possible so that normal aging doesn't plunge him into dialysis. For someone 60 with normal kidneys for their age, a little of the kidney damage that comes with COVID is likely no big deal, and probably unnoticed, as they'll have enough reserve left for aging, but for him, that could send him into dialysis and onto the transplant list right there. Similar things would be true for people with pre-existing damage or impairment in the lungs or the heart as well. There is still substantial improvement in odds of these events with the vaccines, though, so they're absolutely worth it.

As others have mentioned, each person who becomes infected is a potential mutation factory. Each mutation runs the risk of becoming resistant to vaccines. Each mutation also runs the risk of being MUCH more deadly to people - including to kids and teens. Is that what it will take - for innocent kids, unable to make their own medical decisions and relying on their parents and other adults to keep them safe, to start dropping like flies? There is still substantial improvement in odds of new infections with the vaccines, though, so they're absolutely worth it.

@Dancing Fire, I looked at the posted article. Here's what is known: a teen got a vaccine, and a few days later died in his sleep. It is being investigated as to whether his death can be attributed to the vaccine or not. There is no evidence for or against that at this point in time, so to "blame it on the vaccine" is utterly specious. EVEN IF - and frankly, given their record, it's a big IF - it IS due to the vaccine, more teens have died from COVID than from the vaccine. By a lot. @Queenie60, the heart inflammation that some young people have experienced after the vaccine is extremely rare, treatable, temporary, and being watched for, and similar to the incidence of heart inflammation and enlargement that occurs idiopathically in that age group. The incidence and risk of heart inflammation and damage from COVID infection is much higher, even in that age group.

As far as "all the deaths" attributed to the vaccine - I see anti-vaxxers refer to these all the time, but never, ever cite any kind of a trustworthy or reputable source. Ever. I've looked for any credible evidence, and I'm just not finding it, so I say to any that want to tout that line: put up or shut up. Show the credible evidence. I DO see people try to claim that any time anyone who happened to receive the vaccine happened to die, that "it MUST be the vaccine!" but that's, well......cr@p. There are people that would claim that if I'd been hit by a bus a week after getting mine, that it was a "vaccine death." This includes the reports to the VAERS - those reports are supposed to be made by medical personnel if anyone reports any medical occurrence, up to and including death, within a certain time span of receiving a vaccine. That's ALL IT IS - it is the jumping-off point to start an investigation to see if the event was related to the vaccine, not evidence that it was. Patient who had a vaccine shows up with broken arm or leg after falling? Has to be recorded in VAERS. There's also no checks on the system to make sure that reports are actually made by verified medical personnel, so I could get on there right now and report that the vaccine caused me to be abducted by aliens. We have no idea how many of those reports are made by real medical people or are of actual events that occurred, rather than posted by propagandists.

Now, I don't have the slightest hope in you-know-where that the people posting the nonsense in this thread will be even remotely swayed by anything I've posted here - in fact, I'm quite sure that they will cling even harder to their views - but my hope is to reason with other people reading this thread who are perhaps on the fence or unsure what to believe.
 
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