Advice needed on this green sapphire please

[cloud_less]

Hi everyone! Let me preface this by saying that I don't know much about sapphires and don't own any, so I would love some advice from you all
So I was randomly browsing PS the other day and saw someone mentioned Adamant gems (https://www.adamantgems.com/sapphire/). They seem to have a good reputation so I went to their website and checked it out. I want some RHRs but wasn't searching for anything in particular. I love blue and green gems and this 2.43ct (8.07 x 6.75 x 5.35) bluish-green sapphire showed up:

They described the color as pine green (intense bluish green of a medium to medium-dark tone) and I absolutely love how it looks in photos on their website. Reminds me of the forests of the Pacific northwest. It's also unheated which is great.

My first concern was that sapphires can be very shifty so it might end up being too dark indoors. I email Ivan and they were super helpful and sent me lots of videos (will add screenshots in a follow-up post).
Another concern of mine is the price at 3.7k (1.5k/ct). It's stretching my budget a bit and I might have to scratch other plans for CS for now (eg. a tiny cobalt spinel) if I pull the trigger. I'm fine with this if I end up with a great stone though.

I would love to hear what you think about this stone and thank you in advance for all your much more experienced opinions!

 

[cloud_less]

In diffused, dim indoor light (screenshots of vendor's video)

vs outdoor light on a cloudy day

I was suprised by how extra shifty it is.

 

[lovedogs]

I wouldn't personally buy it, because I dont like stones that look "muddy" indoors (which this appears to). I've had good experiences with this company when I've asked them questions about stones, etc, so I wouldnt worry about dishonesty. It just isn't worth the cost TO ME, but you might feel differently.

 

[cloud_less]

I also went looking for similar stones for comparison. They have a 1.77ct unheated listed that's but only one-third of the price. I asked for comparison videos and here they are:
Indoors they look almost the same (1.77 on the right)

outdoors the 1.77 on the left has zoning across the long axis and is less "open" in terms of color.

I also searched Gemfix and Earth's Treasury, both seems to carry a lot green-blue sapphires especially Montana and Australian ones. The closest I found was this one https://gemfix.com/gems/sapphire-fancy-15-1424?# , but it was sold so I have no way to compare the price

 

[cloud_less]

I wouldn't personally buy it, because I dont like stones that look "muddy" indoors (which this appears to). I've had good experiences with this company when I've asked them questions about stones, etc, so I wouldnt worry about dishonesty. It just isn't worth the cost TO ME, but you might feel differently.

Thank you @lovedogs for chiming in! For me so far the experience with them was very pleasant as well. I have little knowledge about the price of sapphires so I have no idea if it is worth the cost. Re it looking muddy indoors: I'm pretty torn on this, I think it is because of the extinction pattern? I don't hate it but it is definitely very different from what I expected. Gives me the feeling of a deep forest. I did ask for comparisons with some lighter-toned stones and I found them too washed out and less interesting to my taste. Perhaps that's a tradeoff I have to consider.

 

[lovedogs]

If I were looking for something blue/green, here are some options I personally prefer:

Teal Gray Oval Montana Sapphire "Luminaire" Cut | 1.19cts | #12-2022 - Gemfix

Teal Blue Green Gray Oval Montana Sapphire Brilliant Cut

gemfix.com

Blue Green Montana Sapphire Round "Roulette" Cut | 1.91cts | #12-2306 - Gemfix

Brilliant Cut Round Natural Blue Green Montana Sapphire, Ethical Fair Trade Natural American Cut Sapphire from Gemfix

gemfix.com

Round Blue Green Montana Sapphire Portuguese Cut | 1.14cts | #12-329 - Gemfix

Round Green Blue Montana Sapphire Brilliant Cut 1 cts, Ethical Fair Trade Natural American Cut Sapphire from Gemfix

gemfix.com

This one is $$ but its sooo pretty: https://gemfix.com/gems/sapphire-montana-12-2390

If you prefer a richer color: https://gemfix.com/gems/sapphire-montana-12-2382

 

[CaseyLouLou]

I’m not loving it. It seems to have some grey tones. I think you want something brighter. I have had good luck searching on Etsy and finding gems that some dealers would charge a lot more for. Prices are all over the place and I think you can find something that color but better for a lot less.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

I also went looking for similar stones for comparison. They have a 1.77ct unheated listed that's but only one-third of the price. I asked for comparison videos and here they are:
Indoors they look almost the same (1.77 on the right)

outdoors the 1.77 on the left has zoning across the long axis and is less "open" in terms of color.

I also searched Gemfix and Earth's Treasury, both seems to carry a lot green-blue sapphires especially Montana and Australian ones. The closest I found was this one https://gemfix.com/gems/sapphire-fancy-15-1424?# , but it was sold so I have no way to compare the price

Take this with a grain of salt

i really love it
but i love that dark forrest green colour (matches my eyes)

I love the colour variation in this stone
The outside colour looks gorgouse on my phone

But i would worry once its set it might go darker inside (i am the Queen of too dark saphires)

 

[Autumn in New England]

I think with these fancy colored sapphires, everyone will have a different opinion. Aspects like clarity and cut are a bit more objective. It sounds like you're really loving the stone, so maybe it's worth seeing in person? We had another member a month or so back who was specifically looking for a "moody" and "earthy" sapphire. Some folks didn't care for the shade of green she chose, because it had some brown in it. But it was precisely what she was after, and she was over the moon about it! So you never can tell. Anyway, I also wanted to extend a belated welcome to the forum!!

 

[cloud_less]

@lovedogs Thank you for the links! These are indeed very pretty especially the $$$$ one! I looked at Montana sapphires and a lot of them have a silvery to steely cast which I'm not really into. Also unheated is hard to find

@CaseyLouLou The vendor mentioned that the stone I'm looking at has no grey overtone or brown/black undertone and it might be part of the reason why it is pricey. I'm not sure if that's really the case though.

 

[cloud_less]

@Daisys and Diamonds You got me!! I have a soft spot for forest/pine green. The outside color draws me in - such a saturated pure hue I think it's something special. But I'm also worried that it will be darker when mounted. I'm going to ask for photos with its bottom wrapped in tin foil to see how dark it will go.

@Autumn in New England Thank you for your warm welcome!! I'm not looking for a particular shade but once I saw it the color took my heart. I'm unsure about how dark it will go and you are absolutely right that it might be worth seeing in person. The vendor is in Sri Lanka, it might cost me $300+ in shipping and insurance if I ever decide to return...

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

@Daisys and Diamonds You got me!! I have a soft spot for forest/pine green. The outside color draws me in - such a saturated pure hue I think it's something special. But I'm also worried that it will be darker when mounted. I'm going to ask for photos with its bottom wrapped in tin foil to see how dark it will go.

@Autumn in New England Thank you for your warm welcome!! I'm not looking for a particular shade but once I saw it the color took my heart. I'm unsure about how dark it will go and you are absolutely right that it might be worth seeing in person. The vendor is in Sri Lanka, it might cost me $300+ in shipping and insurance if I ever decide to return...

I realise you're new (and welcome - we always need more green saphire lovers )
But have you read the threads about buying from Sri Lanka ?

Can someone help me here please with some links ?

returns seem very problematic

 

[Autumn in New England]

The vendor is in Sri Lanka, it might cost me $300+ in shipping and insurance if I ever decide to return...

Ahh I see... then you definitely want to do your due diligence before making a commitment. It's my understanding that it's not only costly to return something to Sri Lanka, but also complicated. If after browsing a bit more and asking additional questions, you still find yourself returning to this stone, maybe that will be the deciding factor for you. Good luck!

 

[Autumn in New England]

I realise your new (and welcome - we always need more green saphire lovers )
But have you read the threads about buying from Sri Lanka ?

Can someone help me here please

returns seem very problematic

Yep, we just posted the same thing!

 

[cloud_less]

I realise your new (and welcome - we always need more green saphire lovers )
But have you read the threads about buying from Sri Lanka ?

Can someone help me here please

returns seem very problematic

Ahh I see... then you definitely want to do your due diligence before making a commitment. It's my understanding that it's not only costly to return something to Sri Lanka, but also complicated. If after browsing a bit more and asking additional questions, you still find yourself returning to this stone, maybe that will be the deciding factor for you. Good luck!

Thank you both! I was lurking for a while and finally decided to make an account
Yes I read that thread (by Frost?) which says importing gems into Sri Lanka is relatively easy. But I saw other people saying returning was virtually impossible. The vendor's website says they don't charge import and restock fees which seems nice. However I have no idea what paperwork might be involved.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

Thank you both! I was lurking for a while and finally decided to make an account
Yes I read that thread (by Frost?) which says importing gems into Sri Lanka is relatively easy. But I saw other people saying returning was virtually impossible. The vendor's website says they don't charge import and restock fees which seems nice. However I have no idea what paperwork might be involved.

We have had a couple of threads this year
one i remenber exposed a cultural difference
The Sri Lankan vendor said yes no problem because thats their polite way of saying things
Rather than thats a huge PITA and is basically too hard and complicated like we might say in a more Western English speaking culture

 

[CaseyLouLou]

I have purchased from this vendor before.

This item is unavailable - Etsy

Find the perfect handmade gift, vintage & on-trend clothes, unique jewelry, and more… lots more.

www.etsy.com

 

[Cerulean]

To be honest, I’d not buy a Sri Lanka sapphire without being certain you can’t return it. To me, this is also quite expensive. You’re incurring many of the inconveniences of an international purchase without benefiting from the price for a stone that’s “closer to the source”

I’d also prepare for the fact that the bright, beautiful green you see in the bright daylight photos will be a fleeting appearance - unless you spend most of your time outdoors, what you’ll see is the “muddier” color or something in between most often

Given the price and inability to easily return, I’d pass

Green for whatever reason is a very tricky color for sapphires. It frequently goes grey / muddy. I think the ones @lovedogs linked to are really pretty - that $4k stone is actually the one I suggested for my sister’s engagement ring - she went for something else, but it’s just gorgeous

Have you checked out these guys? I have never purchased from them but they seem to have a nice selection of teals

Choice Gems Co (@cgemsco) • Instagram photos and videos

instagram.com

 

[MollyMalone]

Think this is a useful FYI -- for those of us who live in a latitude that doesn't approximate Sri Lanka -- from fredflintstone, who used to be "in the trade" but is now retired.

The closer to the equator, the more vivid the stones looks outside. All to do with longer direct color wave lengths from the sun. That is why many are a tad disappointed when they buy from a dealer in the tropics with the pictures and video taken in their natural sunlight as compared to say NYC. That is why many times I want to see both indoor and outdoor pictures, before buying and what light the indoor pictures were taken in. All about the light.

The reality is, though, that even if you and the vendor are located in the same approximate latitude. you can't be certain that what you see online is what you'll get. Even when the vendor is super conscientious about posting pics-videos that faithfully duplicate what they see in real life, odds are slim to none that your display is color-calibrated in sync with theirs. Plus, we don't all "see" colors in exactly the same way. E.g., I'm keenly aware of nuances in whites and beiges, but am far less perceptive about reds.

But we also have varying comfort levels. I know I'm not a good candidate for an overseas purchase of a gemstone or jewelry that would be a hassle to return & priced higher than I'd care to forfeit. Others are not as risk-adverse, and so give themselves more options to choose from. I kinda envy them

 

[FL_runner]

Take this with a grain of salt

i really love it
but i love that dark forrest green colour (matches my eyes)

I love the colour variation in this stone
The outside colour looks gorgouse on my phone

But i would worry once its set it might go darker inside (i am the Queen of too dark saphires)

I agree! I personally like a dark sapphire and think this one is pretty , but it is going to be dark indoors when set.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

I always follow these green saphire threads with great interest as one day i will be replacing the ugly green saphire i got from the mall jewler

 

[cloud_less]

You’re incurring many of the inconveniences of an international purchase without benefiting from the price for a stone that’s “closer to the source”
...
Have you checked out these guys? I have never purchased from them but they seem to have a nice selection of teals

Choice Gems Co (@cgemsco) • Instagram photos and videos

instagram.com

I agree. The vendor said the no treatment + clarity + rare color was the reason the price was a lot higher than the other stones they have. They also paid a premium to buy it, which they then recut.

(Semi-related to this, I heard anecdotally that local sellers of rough / roughly cut gems will bundle lower quality stones with one or two higher quality ones to sell for a higher price, so part of the markup could also come from that.)

I also checked some ig vendors including Choice Gems Co and Caleb B. Quashen (they charge $150 retstock fee for return). I found the most common ones they carry are teal (greenish-blue) or yellowish-green, which are also pretty but not exactly the same as the bluish-green I liked in the one I was looking at. For anyone else that's interested they have this in stock atm: https://www.instagram.com/p/CeStxyQuI3s/

 

[MollyMalone]

* * * I also searched Gemfix and Earth's Treasury, both seems to carry a lot green-blue sapphires especially Montana and Australian ones. The closest I found was this one https://gemfix.com/gems/sapphire-fancy-15-1424?# , but it was sold so I have no way to compare the price

From what little I could find via a Google Images search, it seems that Gemfix 2.86 sapphire was priced at $3995, or $1397/carat (price included GIA report).

What would you consider to be your minimum requirement for face-up size; any particular shape you're hoping for -- or definitely do not want?

 

[FL_runner]

3.09 ct Unheated Blue-Green Sapphire

3.09 ct Unheated Blue-Green Sapphire

www.finewatergems.com

I love my sapphire from Finewater maybe this one speaks to you?

 

[cloud_less]

Think this is a useful FYI -- for those of us who live in a latitude that doesn't approximate Sri Lanka -- from fredflintstone, who used to be "in the trade" but is now retired.

"The closer to the equator, the more vivid the stones looks outside. All to do with longer direct color wave lengths from the sun. That is why many are a tad disappointed when they buy from a dealer in the tropics with the pictures and video taken in their natural sunlight as compared to say NYC. "

Ohh this is interesting! I love a technical discussion (please ignore the babbling below if you find it too nerdy)
Does "longer direct color wave lengths" mean more red light (longer wavelength is a redshift)? I didn't find any data on the difference in sunlight spectrum between different latitudes to suport this. But I do know that the intensity of UV (shorter wavelength, maybe that's what fredflintstone meant?) and sunlight in general tend to be stronger closer to the equator.
If the gem is fluorescent then more UV would make it looks more vivid. I looked a bit into it and this is the case for corundum containing high chromium (think ruby, padparadscha, pink sapphire). Blue sapphire can also fluoresce due to trace chromium, but high iron content (what gives corundum blue color) quenches fluorescence. This source states "natural green Sapphires in our study show little or no fluorescence due to high iron and low chromium content". Anyways, had some interesting read!

 

[cloud_less]

From what little I could find via a Google Images search, it seems that Gemfix 2.86 sapphire was priced at $3995, or $1397/carat (price included GIA report).

What would you consider to be your minimum requirement for face-up size; any particular shape you're hoping for -- or definitely do not want?

Ohh thank you! Wish I had better search skills . Hmm the price is actually close to what I'm looking at. I wasn't looking for anything in particular to start with (just fell in love with a random sapphire), but now I have a clearer idea of what I want: something elongated in shape (so not round), 6mm - 9mm long?

3.09 ct Unheated Blue-Green Sapphire

3.09 ct Unheated Blue-Green Sapphire

www.finewatergems.com

I love my sapphire from Finewater maybe this one speaks to you?

I just saw this today as well! I can't grasp the color based on the two photos with the second one (looks like its taken outside) being darker and more saturated than the first on my monitor. It seems that Finewater has a good return policy, considering seeing this in person and curious about how dark it goes.

 

[Cerulean]

I agree. The vendor said the no treatment + clarity + rare color was the reason the price was a lot higher than the other stones they have. They also paid a premium to buy it, which they then recut.

(Semi-related to this, I heard anecdotally that local sellers of rough / roughly cut gems will bundle lower quality stones with one or two higher quality ones to sell for a higher price, so part of the markup could also come from that.)

I also checked some ig vendors including Choice Gems Co and Caleb B. Quashen (they charge $150 retstock fee for return). I found the most common ones they carry are teal (greenish-blue) or yellowish-green, which are also pretty but not exactly the same as the bluish-green I liked in the one I was looking at. For anyone else that's interested they have this in stock atm: https://www.instagram.com/p/CeStxyQuI3s/

I will say, the price is worth what you’re willing to pay - if that makes sense. I’ve overpaid for items because they happened to be exactly what I wanted! So take my feedback on pricing with a grain of salt. It’s more than I’d be willing to pay, but that doesn’t mean it’s the same for you.

There are other overseas vendors like First Class Facets, Bayoto, or Multicolor gems, but I’m reluctant to recommend as I’m not sure of your comfort level with buying overseas. I also haven’t bought from many of them.

Also - I did buy my first sapphire from Sri Lanka, and from someone with less protocols in place than Adamant. It was blue, which honestly I think is a much much easier color to buy than green.

Another thing you could do is see if someone like Inken from Enhoerning could source a sapphire for you. She’d be able to suss out the duds, I’m sure.

 

[Double E]

Thank you @lovedogs for chiming in! For me so far the experience with them was very pleasant as well. I have little knowledge about the price of sapphires so I have no idea if it is worth the cost. Re it looking muddy indoors: I'm pretty torn on this, I think it is because of the extinction pattern? I don't hate it but it is definitely very different from what I expected. Gives me the feeling of a deep forest. I did ask for comparisons with some lighter-toned stones and I found them too washed out and less interesting to my taste. Perhaps that's a tradeoff I have to consider.

Hi and welcome

Here in PS you could get different views from the lovely community, so hopefully you will get clearer direction after summarising and analysing the info. and opinion you get~

I agree as already mentioned various posts in the thread, green sapphire is tricky to pick, and largely depends on personal preference. But regarding some of the stones being considered simply black out in door or low light, I will guess it likely is the nature of most sapphires except those light tones. Especially for green, it’s even harder to find one not only with nice and bright colour under diffused daylight, but also in a dim room, if it’s even possible.

This is really down to one’s own taste. If such dramatic change of appearance bugs you, will you consider other stone varieties as you were not having particular target or gem type in mind at the beginning. For example blue green Afghanistan tourmaline, if you’re stilling looking for bluish green, but don’t want it to be too washed out, just an idea

 

[cloud_less]

Not a green sapphire but I saw this 2.7ct round opalescent (900/ct). I think the price is high but I'm so tempted ...

room lighting

shaded indoor (might be what it looks like most of the time)

under artificial light

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

Not a green sapphire but I saw this 2.7ct round opalescent (900/ct). I think the price is high but I'm so tempted ...

room lighting

shaded indoor (might be what it looks like most of the time)

under artificial light

pretty colour