becca05201
Rough_Rock
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Age,and the length you''ve known someone matter?
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Mara
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omc makes a good point re: past experiences being what you know.
i used to always think i'd be married and settled by age 25. well by age 25 i was still changing and not even remotely mature enough to be a wife. i couldn't even imagine being married at a young age in my early 20's. i was such a different person in my early 20's, my mid-20's etc. it wasn't until my late 20's that i could really start to envision a future with someone, maybe it was just that i had found the right person. i guess if you are lucky enough to find the right person at a young age where you are both willing to grow together and mature together, it's one thing, but i think many times people don't find that right person at a young age anymore.
i wouldn't have had it any other way except for it would have been nice to have met greg earlier so we could have had kids (if we decided to) earlier in life rather than later. but in terms of life experiences and everything that i have gone through alone have made me what i am today and i think i'd be a hugely different person if i had gotten married young or similar. so i wouldn't change anything.
i have friends who met and married in college and are very happy together. but they are dependent on each other for happiness, having been together for so long, they do everything together. it's kind of sweet in a way but kind of too much! from my independent having done it on my own for many years kind of perspective.
anyway each person and relationship is different but i tend to think that alot of young people will find it hard to be mature enough to enter a marriage together as it's alot of hard work and you have to have lived through enough to figure it out together and not be rash or immature about insignificant things which many younger people tend to do (myself included when i was younger!). but then again some people, like my friends, have been married longer than many others. so go figure!
i used to always think i'd be married and settled by age 25. well by age 25 i was still changing and not even remotely mature enough to be a wife. i couldn't even imagine being married at a young age in my early 20's. i was such a different person in my early 20's, my mid-20's etc. it wasn't until my late 20's that i could really start to envision a future with someone, maybe it was just that i had found the right person. i guess if you are lucky enough to find the right person at a young age where you are both willing to grow together and mature together, it's one thing, but i think many times people don't find that right person at a young age anymore.
i wouldn't have had it any other way except for it would have been nice to have met greg earlier so we could have had kids (if we decided to) earlier in life rather than later. but in terms of life experiences and everything that i have gone through alone have made me what i am today and i think i'd be a hugely different person if i had gotten married young or similar. so i wouldn't change anything.
i have friends who met and married in college and are very happy together. but they are dependent on each other for happiness, having been together for so long, they do everything together. it's kind of sweet in a way but kind of too much! from my independent having done it on my own for many years kind of perspective.
anyway each person and relationship is different but i tend to think that alot of young people will find it hard to be mature enough to enter a marriage together as it's alot of hard work and you have to have lived through enough to figure it out together and not be rash or immature about insignificant things which many younger people tend to do (myself included when i was younger!). but then again some people, like my friends, have been married longer than many others. so go figure!
Tybee
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omc and Mara are quite correct.
when I was younger, I didn''t like hearing stuff like that from older peoplel either.
I am 37, just preparing for my (first) wedding. After being part of many different relationships and living many different lives, I''ve finally found someone (never the person I''d imagined he''d be) that I intend to spend the rest of my life with.
I haven''t been waiting around all these years. I''ve been in and out of relationships, I"ve been in love, been alive, been living. I wouldn''t change those years for anything, because they''ve made me the person that I am today, I''m just glad that I didn''t end up marrying the person that I was with when I was 21, the person that I was with when I was 25, or even the person that I was with when I was 30. Each relationship was real and had potential, but for some reason each one had an ending.
This one is different, in many many many ways.
Becky, no one knows really. Like omc says, they just base things on their own experiences.
when I was younger, I didn''t like hearing stuff like that from older peoplel either.
I am 37, just preparing for my (first) wedding. After being part of many different relationships and living many different lives, I''ve finally found someone (never the person I''d imagined he''d be) that I intend to spend the rest of my life with.
I haven''t been waiting around all these years. I''ve been in and out of relationships, I"ve been in love, been alive, been living. I wouldn''t change those years for anything, because they''ve made me the person that I am today, I''m just glad that I didn''t end up marrying the person that I was with when I was 21, the person that I was with when I was 25, or even the person that I was with when I was 30. Each relationship was real and had potential, but for some reason each one had an ending.
This one is different, in many many many ways.
Becky, no one knows really. Like omc says, they just base things on their own experiences.
anchor31
Ideal_Rock
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People shouldn''t judge others only based on their age. I''ve known some people who were very mature and ready for marriage at 20, and I''ve known some people who were still not mature enough for marriage at 31. Some couples marry young and early and divorce early too, but some others are still happily together after over 30 years. Some couples meet later in life, live together and wait for years "just to make sure" before they get married, but divorce five years into the marriage; some others will be happy together for the rest of their lives... Dating, engagement and marriage is a very individual thing, and if someone judges you on your age only, s/he probably isn''t the best person to go to for advice.
I agree that people change a lot between 20 and 25. I certainly do. But I know I''ll keep changing between 25 and 30, and then between 30 and 35, etc. People constantly grow and change and that''s a good thing. If you and your boyfriend know each other and love each other and are going in the same direction in your lives (values, children, etc.); if you are ready to get married and start your life together, I don''t believe there are any "standards" to follow. I believe that having a relationship with someone, whether it''s marriage or friendship or anything else, is growing together. If both of you work towards that, it can work.
It''s not always easy to find a place you can go to for advice where you''re not judged only on your age. But here, as you can see, nobody will. Good luck!
I agree that people change a lot between 20 and 25. I certainly do. But I know I''ll keep changing between 25 and 30, and then between 30 and 35, etc. People constantly grow and change and that''s a good thing. If you and your boyfriend know each other and love each other and are going in the same direction in your lives (values, children, etc.); if you are ready to get married and start your life together, I don''t believe there are any "standards" to follow. I believe that having a relationship with someone, whether it''s marriage or friendship or anything else, is growing together. If both of you work towards that, it can work.
It''s not always easy to find a place you can go to for advice where you''re not judged only on your age. But here, as you can see, nobody will. Good luck!
MissAva
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Who you are has alot to do with it. So does how you have lived your life and how you have reacted to things that were beyond your control. I am 22, I do not think I am too young to be getting married but then I have had alot in my life go right and wrong. My parents worried becuase they were married at 20 (both were out of college and Dad was in Med School) that my sister and I would get married young and possibly to the wrong person. She is 2 years older then I am and is not ready to married, she just is not there yet. The family jokes that the 4 year old will get married before she does. There is nothing wrong with that. I am ready, I have been dating the same person for nearly 5 years. But in that time we have had to deal with things.
This is going to sound like a harsh thing to say but it is advice my grandfather gave me and I take it seriously. "Never marry a man until you can look him in the eye and say $%# you." He was a fighter pilot were still working on swearing.
What he means is that you should be able to live alone, be happy with yourself first and who you are. Be able to support yourself finacially and emotionally before getting married. You need to be your own person first.
I have lived alone for the last three years and had just tons of fun
paying bills, taxes, and balancing work, and friends.
Marriage is a partnership and to be a partner you need to be able to be alone.
JMO
This is going to sound like a harsh thing to say but it is advice my grandfather gave me and I take it seriously. "Never marry a man until you can look him in the eye and say $%# you." He was a fighter pilot were still working on swearing.
I have lived alone for the last three years and had just tons of fun
Marriage is a partnership and to be a partner you need to be able to be alone.
JMO
MissAva
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Oh and on the flip side I think it is foolish to rush into things at any age. For the first 18 months in a relationship chemicals are released in your brain to make you feel happy when you get around that person. I would not want to risk chemistry being part of things.
How old are you? How long have you been with your BF?
How old are you? How long have you been with your BF?
MissAva
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"Ugh where to start I''m 21.i''ve been with my boyfriend for almost a yr,It''ll be november 23rd.He''s leaving for tempe,arizona in january 2006.for college for 2 1/2 yrs.He''ll be back once a yr for x-mas.We''ve discussed marriage and etc.But how long should I wait?welll I''ll also be in New york back with my parents when he leaves,we''ve also been living together for the past,10 months.I''m just not really sure if it''ll work out in the end.His mom is a strick catholic she doesn''t believe we shoud be living together,that we should be married before doing what we''re doing.Can anyone please help?
Becky* "
Okay you have not even been together a year, and you are living together....you edited your post but if you are worried about not making becuase of distance maybe that is why everyone seems so down about the idea of you getting married now. Also your boyfriend going off to school is NOT a reason to get married. You need to both be okay and adults on your own first. That his mother is Catholic is not the whole issue, there are alot of people who think living together before getting married is a poor choice. Are you in school now? Have you ever lived on your own? This is not an age/time issue IMO.
Becky* "
Okay you have not even been together a year, and you are living together....you edited your post but if you are worried about not making becuase of distance maybe that is why everyone seems so down about the idea of you getting married now. Also your boyfriend going off to school is NOT a reason to get married. You need to both be okay and adults on your own first. That his mother is Catholic is not the whole issue, there are alot of people who think living together before getting married is a poor choice. Are you in school now? Have you ever lived on your own? This is not an age/time issue IMO.
Caribou
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I agree with everyone about age....it depends on the person. When I was in my twenties I never wanted to get married I felt too young, I was engaged at 26 but am very glad that didn''t worked out. I''m 33 now and am ready and thankfully I found the person I want to spend the rest of my life with.
I always thought, and still do to some extent, that being in your early twenties is too young (although there are always exceptions) marriage is hard work and I think we do soooooooo much changing in our life during out 20''s, most people are still ''finding'' themselves in their 20''s. I wasn''t the person I was 10 years ago and I probably won''t be the same person 10 years from now but I feel that I''m mature enough in life now to be able to handle those changes and the changes of my then husband, I certainly wasn''t mature enough 10 years ago. Now, I feel I know myself and care enough about myself that I don''t need my BF but he makes my life more complete, make sense?? Again, there are always exceptions.
As far far as your situation, I agree with Matatora, getting married because he''s going off to school is not a good idea. I''m not too keen on the long distance relationship...but I have known people who made them work. This would be a good ''test'' for the relationship....if you can make through a long-ditance type thing you will be able to make it through alot...however, if it doesn''t work than the relationship was not meant to be....which in the long run you would see that it made you grow and become a stronger person for the next relationship or life sitution and so on...
I always thought, and still do to some extent, that being in your early twenties is too young (although there are always exceptions) marriage is hard work and I think we do soooooooo much changing in our life during out 20''s, most people are still ''finding'' themselves in their 20''s. I wasn''t the person I was 10 years ago and I probably won''t be the same person 10 years from now but I feel that I''m mature enough in life now to be able to handle those changes and the changes of my then husband, I certainly wasn''t mature enough 10 years ago. Now, I feel I know myself and care enough about myself that I don''t need my BF but he makes my life more complete, make sense?? Again, there are always exceptions.
As far far as your situation, I agree with Matatora, getting married because he''s going off to school is not a good idea. I''m not too keen on the long distance relationship...but I have known people who made them work. This would be a good ''test'' for the relationship....if you can make through a long-ditance type thing you will be able to make it through alot...however, if it doesn''t work than the relationship was not meant to be....which in the long run you would see that it made you grow and become a stronger person for the next relationship or life sitution and so on...
Mara
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I totally agree about there being exceptions, but in terms of people being ready for marriage, I guess I view it somewhat as marriage can have alot of ups and downs. I don't know when I was 20 or 22 or 24 or 26 that I was ready to deal with issues head-on in a mature manner and really with a clear head. I would have acted impulsively or been immature about things and it probably wasn't the best recipe for a long-term happy marriage. I'm so much more easygoing (HAH!) now than I was before, able to view things with a more detached view at times, less impulsive, less emotional, more sure of myself etc etc. I look back at my relationships at those ages, and I am so happy I didn't get married younger. Sure we probably would have been happy for a spell but not long-term, it just wasn't the right time or the right person nor was I at the right point in my life.
To the original poster, getting married because someone is leaving to me is not the right reason to enter into what should be a lifelong committment. Sounds like you both have alot going on in your lives, as is normal when you are younger and still in school or figuring out your path in life. Why not just stay together and see where things take you? I'm a firm believer in if you are still together after a few more years of life's ups and downs and time apart then it was really meant to be. But if your relationship can't handle the strain of what life will throw at it, do you really want to be married when you find that out? I think that marriage should be entered into VERY SERIOUSLY and not as a side-effect of something else. My two cents.
To the original poster, getting married because someone is leaving to me is not the right reason to enter into what should be a lifelong committment. Sounds like you both have alot going on in your lives, as is normal when you are younger and still in school or figuring out your path in life. Why not just stay together and see where things take you? I'm a firm believer in if you are still together after a few more years of life's ups and downs and time apart then it was really meant to be. But if your relationship can't handle the strain of what life will throw at it, do you really want to be married when you find that out? I think that marriage should be entered into VERY SERIOUSLY and not as a side-effect of something else. My two cents.
Caribou
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MissAva
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Tacori E-ring
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Becky I responded to your post about long-distance relationships. They do take work. Even more work when you are younger. What is your rush? You are young AND haven''t even been together for a year. Kind of two strikes against marriage if you ask me. Part of being in a relationship is to make sure you grow together (not apart which distance tends to do), timing is important IMHO, and the experiences you have been through (which I doubt much in only a year) are good tests whether you are a strong couple. If people are saying you are crazy for thinking you are ready for marriage with your current BF you probably are. Sometimes it is easier for other people to see the truth. I know this isn''t what you want to hear and I have no doubt it will effect any decision you make but marriage is a SERIOUS step. Playing house is completely different. I think you should let time tell if you are meant to be together.
ame
Super_Ideal_Rock
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Depends on the age spread on whether age bothers me. But I do generally think that nowdays anything younger than 23 is too young. People aren''t really as "mature" as they used to be by that age. As far as length of dating I know folks who married on their first date and are still together many many years later and folks who waited 5 years to get engaged who got divorced within a year IF they made it to the wedding at all.
decodelighted
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Say whaaaa? I disagree with this statement completely. (And I''m 38 BTW - so it''s not ''cause I''m 23 & peeved). I actually think 23 year olds have NEVER been "mature". I''m under no misconceptions that I was mature at 23, nor were my parents, nor their parents - in their own opinions. IMO it''s generally a very life-changing, growth-filled, searching, finding out what the "real world" is all about time. At least for folks that attended college and delayed that entering the "real world" til early twenties.
As for marrying early or late - advisability is completly based on the people involved. Some folks have the stuff to make it work even if they met during a turbulent time. Some folks grow together. I''ve heard marraiges that work long term are kind of like a series of different relationships that all work in different ways, rather than one long "same" relationship. It''s like you marry each other over and over again, or recommit to slightly different versions of yourselves again & again over the course of your lives. I don''t know that it''s true - having not been in a successful marraige yet ... just something I''ve heard from wise older folks (yes there are folks older than 38
..)
AChiOAlumna
Brilliant_Rock
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Date: 10/27/2005 1:33:11 AM
Author:becca05201
and why is it people look down on people between the ages of 21-23..to not get married your too young type of stuff?I mean why can''t people look past that and,look at it for whats its worth,Look at the love the two people share and not their ages???
I think that if you look statistically at the divorce-rate data, you''ll see that across the nation, those who wait for marriage until their late-20''s tend to have a lower divorce rate than those who get married in their early 20''s. Does this mean that there are exceptions to this?? Of course!! Does it mean that those who get married later will never be divorced? Of course not!
As result of the data, many people are discouraged to get married at "such a young age." However, if you and your partner know that this is the right decision for you, then only you can possibly know!
icekid
Ideal_Rock
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Yeah, the age thing is always an interesting topic...
I am only 24 now, but my FI and I will be 27 and 26, respectively, when we get married and I don''t think that''s TOO bad. However, I changed SO much in college... and as I continue to become a physician (HUGE changes!!!) I continue to change. But I think at this point in my life I have the maturity level that is required to change WITH my fiance. I really feel that I know myself quite well now. I know what is important to me and what I am looking for in a life partner and in friends as well.
As has been stated ad nauseum, it really depends on the person. One of my friends is a 2nd year med student in my class, and is only about to turn 20 in the next couple months! But you would never know. She is just as, if not more mature, than a lot of others in my class. By and large, I don''t think 21 yr olds should get married though.
I was in a serious relationship at 21, but I was changing in a way that he was not... I was moving on to a career in medicine, while he wanted to continue to party and drink. It just didn''t fit anymore, even though we had been so right for each other previously. But that was my experience! Yours may be different
I am only 24 now, but my FI and I will be 27 and 26, respectively, when we get married and I don''t think that''s TOO bad. However, I changed SO much in college... and as I continue to become a physician (HUGE changes!!!) I continue to change. But I think at this point in my life I have the maturity level that is required to change WITH my fiance. I really feel that I know myself quite well now. I know what is important to me and what I am looking for in a life partner and in friends as well.
As has been stated ad nauseum, it really depends on the person. One of my friends is a 2nd year med student in my class, and is only about to turn 20 in the next couple months! But you would never know. She is just as, if not more mature, than a lot of others in my class. By and large, I don''t think 21 yr olds should get married though.
I was in a serious relationship at 21, but I was changing in a way that he was not... I was moving on to a career in medicine, while he wanted to continue to party and drink. It just didn''t fit anymore, even though we had been so right for each other previously. But that was my experience! Yours may be different
goldengirl
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Becca, a couple of thoughts:
People generally make assumptions about a person''s maturity based on their age (and, FYI, their ability to communicate). Studies indicate that people who choose to marry later generally do not divorce as often, and that is attributed to increased maturity/life experience. While I believe that successful marriages can come from any age group, I do agree that younger brides tend to focus more on the immediate aspects ("ohmigod I''m going to have a big poofy wedding") as well as a sense of timeline appropriateness ("well we''ve been together since eighth grade, it''s time we moved forward") and not so much on the stuff which cements a marriage (like similar goals, values, aspirations, and communication styles). I also think young brides are more inclined to rush into something on a "chemistry high."
I think your desire for people to look past your age and see "the love [you] share" for "what its worth" is idealistic but not necessarily conducive to a long-term relationship. Because, after all, successful marriage often has very little to do with love and much more to do with two people''s mutual commitment to a relationship with all its ups, downs, highs, lows, fights, compromises, life changing experiences, and love, or lack thereof (at times).
The LIW have given you some very good perspective about how different people react to their 20s. I changed a little, but my drastic period of change was between the ages of 15-18. By 19, I was pretty close to the person I am today. Maybe I will change again, but Kyle and I are committed to changing together, and because we are compatible at the most fundamental levels, I believe we will be able to do so.
More than your words, your actions will tell your friends and family if you are mature enough for marriage, if that matters to you. Given your other thread, you may be engaged in December 06. At that time, perhaps their opinion will have changed. In the meantime, just enjoy your relationship.
People generally make assumptions about a person''s maturity based on their age (and, FYI, their ability to communicate). Studies indicate that people who choose to marry later generally do not divorce as often, and that is attributed to increased maturity/life experience. While I believe that successful marriages can come from any age group, I do agree that younger brides tend to focus more on the immediate aspects ("ohmigod I''m going to have a big poofy wedding") as well as a sense of timeline appropriateness ("well we''ve been together since eighth grade, it''s time we moved forward") and not so much on the stuff which cements a marriage (like similar goals, values, aspirations, and communication styles). I also think young brides are more inclined to rush into something on a "chemistry high."
I think your desire for people to look past your age and see "the love [you] share" for "what its worth" is idealistic but not necessarily conducive to a long-term relationship. Because, after all, successful marriage often has very little to do with love and much more to do with two people''s mutual commitment to a relationship with all its ups, downs, highs, lows, fights, compromises, life changing experiences, and love, or lack thereof (at times).
The LIW have given you some very good perspective about how different people react to their 20s. I changed a little, but my drastic period of change was between the ages of 15-18. By 19, I was pretty close to the person I am today. Maybe I will change again, but Kyle and I are committed to changing together, and because we are compatible at the most fundamental levels, I believe we will be able to do so.
More than your words, your actions will tell your friends and family if you are mature enough for marriage, if that matters to you. Given your other thread, you may be engaged in December 06. At that time, perhaps their opinion will have changed. In the meantime, just enjoy your relationship.
peonygirl
Brilliant_Rock
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Those who advocate delaying marriage until you''re older, how specifically have you matured since your early 20s? I''m always hearing people say how much they changed in their teens and 20s, but this surprises me because two years out of college, at 22, I feel like my personality/life philosophy is almost the same as when I started college at 17.
Mara mentioned some things I though were interesting, like being able to approach disagreements calmly and maturely.
Perhaps those of us in our early 20s can examine the changes you''ve undergone and determine whether we still have areas we need to work on.
Mara mentioned some things I though were interesting, like being able to approach disagreements calmly and maturely.
Perhaps those of us in our early 20s can examine the changes you''ve undergone and determine whether we still have areas we need to work on.
Mara
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I honestly think I did most of my changing in my 20's. I think part of it is life experiences. aka from 17-21 in college is one experience, but after that you are out on your own. Making your own life, figuring out what you want to do with your life, what type of people you want to hang out with or continue to hang out with, etc. It seems like everything is a new experience.
In terms of specifics, it's hard to pin down honestly, but one example IS being able to handle things maturely and seeing things from other perspectives. My sister is 22 and she is so young at heart. She's very naiive because of how sheltered she was raised. She is just figuring out what she wants to do with her life, her job, her future career. She has a long-term boyfriend she lives with but we just hope she does not marry him. She's too young to make any sort of decision past what job she wants to have next. She's just not mentally there. I was the same way at that age. Many of us were.
One example that comes to mind sometimes when reading the LIW posts on here is how to handle things like disagreements or spats. Someone on here was saying the other day that after something happened, she hung up on her BF. Then she was saying something about how while he was gone somewhere else she would go hang out with her friends including some cute guy that was visiting. So while her BF was out doing X and upsetting her then she'd be doing Y and maybe getting some small measure of mental revenge. I just remember thinking that was such a young way to look at things.
Sure there are times that I get upset with Greg or vice versa. But we approach it in a different way than say I would have approached it when I was younger. Or how I mentally think about things like fights etc. When I was younger, a fight was a big deal, oh my god what did it mean. Now it's just a fight. We get over it..and move on. I think that's kind of how I have changed the most, the maturity to know what is important and how to discuss it or fight for it but also know when to let things go and move on. The people in my life I have chosen for a reason, and they are special to me. I don't mess up our time together with alot of drama. Whereas when you are younger half the time it's all about drama. I don't let little stupid things get me down. Boyfriend/husband didn't call when he said he would? I handle it differently now than I did at a younger age...then I would have worried about it or brooded about it or gotten mad.
Now of course this kind of stuff does not apply to EVERYONE, some people are matured far earlier than they should have because of experiences in their life or similar. But many kids that are middle class or upper middle class tend to be pretty sheltered and naiive when they start something like college and from then onto maybe 25 or so is where I really view them as formative years. I see my sister at age 22 and know that I was like that when I was that age. Just figuring stuff out at my own pace. Couldn't even imagine meeting someone and getting married.
Bottom line for me is that it's not just about LOVE. It's easy to love someone. I loved lots of people in my life. But if I got married every time I fell in love, I'd probably have a bunch of divorces under my belt. Some felt more right than others, some didn't. It wasn't until I was older and had had enough experiences in life, is when I could realize exactly WHAT I was looking for in love and a long-term partner. It's not just about two people loving each other, it's about other things too IMO.
In terms of specifics, it's hard to pin down honestly, but one example IS being able to handle things maturely and seeing things from other perspectives. My sister is 22 and she is so young at heart. She's very naiive because of how sheltered she was raised. She is just figuring out what she wants to do with her life, her job, her future career. She has a long-term boyfriend she lives with but we just hope she does not marry him. She's too young to make any sort of decision past what job she wants to have next. She's just not mentally there. I was the same way at that age. Many of us were.
One example that comes to mind sometimes when reading the LIW posts on here is how to handle things like disagreements or spats. Someone on here was saying the other day that after something happened, she hung up on her BF. Then she was saying something about how while he was gone somewhere else she would go hang out with her friends including some cute guy that was visiting. So while her BF was out doing X and upsetting her then she'd be doing Y and maybe getting some small measure of mental revenge. I just remember thinking that was such a young way to look at things.
Sure there are times that I get upset with Greg or vice versa. But we approach it in a different way than say I would have approached it when I was younger. Or how I mentally think about things like fights etc. When I was younger, a fight was a big deal, oh my god what did it mean. Now it's just a fight. We get over it..and move on. I think that's kind of how I have changed the most, the maturity to know what is important and how to discuss it or fight for it but also know when to let things go and move on. The people in my life I have chosen for a reason, and they are special to me. I don't mess up our time together with alot of drama. Whereas when you are younger half the time it's all about drama. I don't let little stupid things get me down. Boyfriend/husband didn't call when he said he would? I handle it differently now than I did at a younger age...then I would have worried about it or brooded about it or gotten mad.
Now of course this kind of stuff does not apply to EVERYONE, some people are matured far earlier than they should have because of experiences in their life or similar. But many kids that are middle class or upper middle class tend to be pretty sheltered and naiive when they start something like college and from then onto maybe 25 or so is where I really view them as formative years. I see my sister at age 22 and know that I was like that when I was that age. Just figuring stuff out at my own pace. Couldn't even imagine meeting someone and getting married.
Bottom line for me is that it's not just about LOVE. It's easy to love someone. I loved lots of people in my life. But if I got married every time I fell in love, I'd probably have a bunch of divorces under my belt. Some felt more right than others, some didn't. It wasn't until I was older and had had enough experiences in life, is when I could realize exactly WHAT I was looking for in love and a long-term partner. It's not just about two people loving each other, it's about other things too IMO.
peonygirl
Brilliant_Rock
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Interesting Mara, thanks so much for your opinion. It seems like many of you hold the view that a person must have a fully-formed and stable identity before getting married.
What opinions do you have about the idea that one can grown and change *with* their partner, as long there is love, committment, and a certain amount of essential common viewpoints (like # of kids, spending habits, housework division, religion, in-laws, etc). Or do you think this is too risky a prospect?
What opinions do you have about the idea that one can grown and change *with* their partner, as long there is love, committment, and a certain amount of essential common viewpoints (like # of kids, spending habits, housework division, religion, in-laws, etc). Or do you think this is too risky a prospect?
Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
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Peony for me part of it also is that I would never trade the experiences I had on my own and growing up in my 20's for anything. Sure nothing is perfect and it would have been nice to meet Greg as my better half earlier but on the other hand, it wouldn't have been and we may not have been able to make it work or been right for each other at that point.
re: growing together...I have that set of friends who got together and married in college. They don't have the same issues that us olderinlifemarried's struggle with, aka an example is how to divide or integrate the finances...because they got married when they had no money and they built everything together. Yes I find it impressive and I think they have a great relationship. They have grown together and all their achievements are their own together. But nothing is INDEPENDENT. They are not independent either. I think it's almost like a side-effect. She is dependent on him and vice versa. I would hate to think if they ever ran into a patch of trouble and had to split up or something, I think they'd be lost without each other. Kind of a scary prospect.
I was with a guy when I was 22 until I was 25. He was older, serious, we could have gotten married. We lived together, bought a house together etc. I wanted him to be the one. But he wasn't. I am so glad I didn't decide to marry him just because it was the thing to do or because we were in love. He was not the right one. We had a great, pretty mature relationship. But it just wasn't the right one. I learned alot when with him and CHANGED alot too. Not together and not apart, just into a different person. Felt like I was missing out on living my 20's life and like I was tied down. Like I was living a mature life when I didn't want to be. I was only 25. That is how I could view someone who may enter into marriage when they are younger, aka 21 or 22 and then in a few years realize WOAH what did I do? I felt trapped and we weren't even married, just living together.
Well I met Greg less than a year after we broke up and it turned out to be the right guy at the right time with the right ME and the right situation etc. When I met him I wasn't ready to be married either. It took a few years for us to really think that was where we wanted to go. At that point I felt like I *was* stable enough to want to grow together with Greg, and really make a go of it for better or for worse. And I hadn't felt like that up until that point.
re: growing together...I have that set of friends who got together and married in college. They don't have the same issues that us olderinlifemarried's struggle with, aka an example is how to divide or integrate the finances...because they got married when they had no money and they built everything together. Yes I find it impressive and I think they have a great relationship. They have grown together and all their achievements are their own together. But nothing is INDEPENDENT. They are not independent either. I think it's almost like a side-effect. She is dependent on him and vice versa. I would hate to think if they ever ran into a patch of trouble and had to split up or something, I think they'd be lost without each other. Kind of a scary prospect.
I was with a guy when I was 22 until I was 25. He was older, serious, we could have gotten married. We lived together, bought a house together etc. I wanted him to be the one. But he wasn't. I am so glad I didn't decide to marry him just because it was the thing to do or because we were in love. He was not the right one. We had a great, pretty mature relationship. But it just wasn't the right one. I learned alot when with him and CHANGED alot too. Not together and not apart, just into a different person. Felt like I was missing out on living my 20's life and like I was tied down. Like I was living a mature life when I didn't want to be. I was only 25. That is how I could view someone who may enter into marriage when they are younger, aka 21 or 22 and then in a few years realize WOAH what did I do? I felt trapped and we weren't even married, just living together.
Well I met Greg less than a year after we broke up and it turned out to be the right guy at the right time with the right ME and the right situation etc. When I met him I wasn't ready to be married either. It took a few years for us to really think that was where we wanted to go. At that point I felt like I *was* stable enough to want to grow together with Greg, and really make a go of it for better or for worse. And I hadn't felt like that up until that point.
icekid
Ideal_Rock
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peony-
How have I changed in the past say, 5-6 years? I became more confident in myself, and what I want. I know a lot more about what I believe. I''m not so naive! I know what kind of people that I choose to make my friends, and what kind of people I avoid. With my ex, when he asked me what''s wrong I would usually tell him nothing (when that was not true). Even though I knew it was stupid! With my FI, he knows when I am mad or upset and why before he has to ask
I definitely handle arguments differently now. We''ve discussed EVERYTHING- people might ask you if you''ve discussed where you want to live. I''ve lived in three different parts of the country now, so where I want to live is not simply "hmm, such and such a place sounds nice..." I have the experience to back that up. Younger people generally have less experience.
And I certainly think it''s possible to change and grow together. Everyone continues to change and evolve for their entire life. That doesn''t stop when you turn 30. However, when you''re older most people are able to handle those changes better. Moreover, most people by that time have a solid base that isn''t changing as much- and those are the things that you hopefully share with the person you''re married to. Your core values- I think it''s really tough to have a marriage with someone if you don''t share the same core ideas. And maybe you don''t really know what those values ARE exactly at 18? Though perhaps you did. I personally did not really know myself at that age. I don''t think I had been exposed to enough of the world to really have solid opinions yet.
How have I changed in the past say, 5-6 years? I became more confident in myself, and what I want. I know a lot more about what I believe. I''m not so naive! I know what kind of people that I choose to make my friends, and what kind of people I avoid. With my ex, when he asked me what''s wrong I would usually tell him nothing (when that was not true). Even though I knew it was stupid! With my FI, he knows when I am mad or upset and why before he has to ask
And I certainly think it''s possible to change and grow together. Everyone continues to change and evolve for their entire life. That doesn''t stop when you turn 30. However, when you''re older most people are able to handle those changes better. Moreover, most people by that time have a solid base that isn''t changing as much- and those are the things that you hopefully share with the person you''re married to. Your core values- I think it''s really tough to have a marriage with someone if you don''t share the same core ideas. And maybe you don''t really know what those values ARE exactly at 18? Though perhaps you did. I personally did not really know myself at that age. I don''t think I had been exposed to enough of the world to really have solid opinions yet.
Caribou
Brilliant_Rock
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This is an interesting topic. I''ve changed in my early, mid, and late twenties.
19-21 -I had a pretty bad temper....I would go off on my friends if they pissed me off regardless of where we were. Today I think back to those days and I cringe, I would never do that now and would be mortified if anyone did that to me.
22-27 - All my friends were loosing ''it'' and getting boyfriends and suddenly I wasn''t as important. It really bothered me. I also got my first ''real'' boyfriend then, we were together 1 month shy of 3 years...I was engaged to him. Again, I cringe thinking about that realtionship....the crap I went through. But I was very insecure with myself this is big...you need to find some security in yourself before you can truely be in a relationship. Women have a tendacy to put up with so my much...much more than we should I''m very guilty of that.
28-32 - I still was very insecure with myself..not good. But I was a little more strong from my break up to not deal with certain things...HOWEVER, not strong enough because I got into yet another bad relationship. I dealt with alot but because he didn''t do the one major thing that my EX did it didn''t seem so bad. WRONG.
32-33 - I grew alot from my last break up. I realized that I was really very angry a lot of my life...alot of it probably stemming from my dad''s lack of being a father and my grandfather''s death whom I adored. Also I was extremly insecure....
I really can''t explain what happened but one day I was at home and I felt great, it had been 4 months since I had been completely free of my EX. I realized that day for the first time, at 32, I had great friends who although judgemental and nosey at times were only looking out for my best interest. I truely felt...feel loved now by everyone in my life. I met my current boyfriend (whom I''ll eventually marry) during this time...it took some time and patience on his end but finally the time was right and I was willing to trust and put myself out there. He''s wonderful!!! I feel so lucky to have him...never had I felt that way. I trust him completely and know that he will be there for me...never had I felt that. I really believe that I am in this relationship because like I said a couple posts ago...I do not need him...I want him in my life, I''ll be fine if, God forbid, he was no longer in my life...that''s key to know that you''ve matured.
19-21 -I had a pretty bad temper....I would go off on my friends if they pissed me off regardless of where we were. Today I think back to those days and I cringe, I would never do that now and would be mortified if anyone did that to me.
22-27 - All my friends were loosing ''it'' and getting boyfriends and suddenly I wasn''t as important. It really bothered me. I also got my first ''real'' boyfriend then, we were together 1 month shy of 3 years...I was engaged to him. Again, I cringe thinking about that realtionship....the crap I went through. But I was very insecure with myself this is big...you need to find some security in yourself before you can truely be in a relationship. Women have a tendacy to put up with so my much...much more than we should I''m very guilty of that.
28-32 - I still was very insecure with myself..not good. But I was a little more strong from my break up to not deal with certain things...HOWEVER, not strong enough because I got into yet another bad relationship. I dealt with alot but because he didn''t do the one major thing that my EX did it didn''t seem so bad. WRONG.
32-33 - I grew alot from my last break up. I realized that I was really very angry a lot of my life...alot of it probably stemming from my dad''s lack of being a father and my grandfather''s death whom I adored. Also I was extremly insecure....
I really can''t explain what happened but one day I was at home and I felt great, it had been 4 months since I had been completely free of my EX. I realized that day for the first time, at 32, I had great friends who although judgemental and nosey at times were only looking out for my best interest. I truely felt...feel loved now by everyone in my life. I met my current boyfriend (whom I''ll eventually marry) during this time...it took some time and patience on his end but finally the time was right and I was willing to trust and put myself out there. He''s wonderful!!! I feel so lucky to have him...never had I felt that way. I trust him completely and know that he will be there for me...never had I felt that. I really believe that I am in this relationship because like I said a couple posts ago...I do not need him...I want him in my life, I''ll be fine if, God forbid, he was no longer in my life...that''s key to know that you''ve matured.
peonygirl
Brilliant_Rock
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So I'm hearing two things from you ladies; being too immature/young can be problematic because 1) one may end up marrying the "wrong" person for various reasons and 2) even if a person does marry "the right" person, the relationship may not last because of insufficient relationship skills.
Is there anything that one can do to obviate these concerns? Open communication, couples counseling, etc? Like I mentioned earlier, I'm 22 and in a very serious relationship with a 26-year-old and we're talking about getting engaged within the next few months. We're financially independent, have dated a lot of other people, fairly set in our career paths (I'm in a 5-year grad program and he's in an 8-year program), etc. We have discussed literally every concern under the sun, including how we're going to combine finances, religion, child-rearing strategies, where we want to live in the future, how we'll deal with in laws, splitting household chores, etc. We've spent extensive amounts of time with each other's parents, relatives, and friends. Both of us come from divorced families and we're very realistic about relationships and marriage, including the fact that there will be ups and downs in any relationship.
That said, I hesitate to think that dating for six more years will yield any epiphanies, but I agree with a lot of what you mature/experienced gals are saying. What's a girl to do?
Is there anything that one can do to obviate these concerns? Open communication, couples counseling, etc? Like I mentioned earlier, I'm 22 and in a very serious relationship with a 26-year-old and we're talking about getting engaged within the next few months. We're financially independent, have dated a lot of other people, fairly set in our career paths (I'm in a 5-year grad program and he's in an 8-year program), etc. We have discussed literally every concern under the sun, including how we're going to combine finances, religion, child-rearing strategies, where we want to live in the future, how we'll deal with in laws, splitting household chores, etc. We've spent extensive amounts of time with each other's parents, relatives, and friends. Both of us come from divorced families and we're very realistic about relationships and marriage, including the fact that there will be ups and downs in any relationship.
That said, I hesitate to think that dating for six more years will yield any epiphanies, but I agree with a lot of what you mature/experienced gals are saying. What's a girl to do?
Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
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I think you can follow your heart if you feel equipped to do so, peony.
I think that people really know when they are ready vs not...even if they think sometimes they are ready but know inside they aren't.
As long as people know that marriage is not to be entered into lightly or as a side-effect then age may not be as important. I just think that too many people view marriage as some 'end' to achieve or similar but in reality nothing ends when you get married, the work is just beginning.
It is not the same as living together, it's not the same as dating, etc. There are more day to day issues or larger issues, aka how to save or how to retire or how to raise the kids. But on the other hand, you do feel more of a bond when you know you are legally bound together, it's fairly interesting. And the becoming a 'family' is special too. The way I look at it is if you can view yourself with your honey in 10/20/50 years and still having something to talk about or discuss or being in love, then you have a good chance of survival! But I also say listen to instincts, sometimes they know more than your heart is willing to allow. If you have weighed the pros and cons, you will know if it's right, age or not.
And if not, you'll find that out too!!
I think that people really know when they are ready vs not...even if they think sometimes they are ready but know inside they aren't.
As long as people know that marriage is not to be entered into lightly or as a side-effect then age may not be as important. I just think that too many people view marriage as some 'end' to achieve or similar but in reality nothing ends when you get married, the work is just beginning.
And if not, you'll find that out too!!
Caribou
Brilliant_Rock
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I think there''s always an exception to the rule. My friends got married when they were 23 and 25 (I was 23 at the time), I thought they were both crazy because I could never imagine being married then but here it is 10 years later and they are still going strong. Another friend got married at 23, her husband was 32...10 years later they are still together.Date: 10/28/2005 11:46:52 AM
Author: peonygirl
So I''m hearing two things from you ladies; being too immature/young can be problematic because 1) one may end up marrying the ''wrong'' person for various reasons and 2) even if a person does marry ''the right'' person, the relationship may not last because of insufficient relationship skills.
Is there anything that one can do to obviate these concerns? Open communication, couples counseling, etc? Like I mentioned earlier, I''m 22 and in a very serious relationship with a 26-year-old and we''re talking about getting engaged within the next few months. We''re financially independent, have dated a lot of other people, fairly set in our career paths (I''m in a 5-year grad program and he''s in an 8-year program), etc. We have discussed literally every concern under the sun, including how we''re going to combine finances, religion, child-rearing strategies, where we want to live in the future, how we''ll deal with in laws, splitting household chores, etc. We''ve spent extensive amounts of time with each other''s parents, relatives, and friends. Both of us come from divorced families and we''re very realistic about relationships and marriage, including the fact that there will be ups and downs in any relationship.
That said, I hesitate to think that dating for six more years will yield any epiphanies, but I agree with a lot of what you mature/experienced gals are saying. What''s a girl to do?
I also think it depends on ones environment and up bringing. My boyfriend is 25, I had a problem with the age difference (8 years) in the beginning because I wanted to get married and start having kids (wasn''t getting any younger
You both sound pretty level-headed. Seem to already cover what''s important....do what you know is best for the relationship. Only you two truely know the relationship...don''t let others negatively influence that.
decodelighted
Super_Ideal_Rock
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- Jul 27, 2005
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- 11,534
Peonygirl,
The very fact that you didn''t become defensive over the "age" issue ... rather "curious", using others experiences as a way to learn & perhaps grow ... tells me you have a degree of maturity most young 20''s folks usually haven''t gained yet.
I''m sure that''ll help in any serious relationship!
Deco
The very fact that you didn''t become defensive over the "age" issue ... rather "curious", using others experiences as a way to learn & perhaps grow ... tells me you have a degree of maturity most young 20''s folks usually haven''t gained yet.
I''m sure that''ll help in any serious relationship!
Deco
Tacori E-ring
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2005
- Messages
- 20,041
I started dating my FI when I was 20. I will be 26 when we get married. We have both changed SO much during this time. I sometimes wonder if we had gotten married sooner if we would have a better or worse relationship. Sometimes I think we wouldn''t have made it. (I know that sounds strange) but we made it through the bad times because we WANTED to not because we felt obligated (which I am NOT saying married people do or referring to anyone else''s relationships). We are lucky that we have only grown stronger and closer. I am glad we waited until we were both into our careers, more mature, and stable. Also, this sounds silly but we weren''t ready to have children before recently so there wasn''t a rush to get married. I never undervalued our relationship because we weren''t married. We are partners and being legally married will not change that. After all we already own a house together and FEEL married. I think by waiting it is almost more exciting. We aren''t nervous or scared (which I would have been if we were married 3 years ago) I feel nothing but positive about him being my husband. Obviously nothing is forever. Older people or people who date longer can divorce just like younger people who have a shorter courtship. It is all a case by case basis. So like Mara said follow your heart and you will know what is right.
I think this sentence sums up how I feel about this topic.Date: 10/28/2005 1:44:50 PM
Author: Mara
I think you can follow your heart if you feel equipped to do so, peony.
I think that people really know when they are ready vs not...even if they think sometimes they are ready but know inside they aren''t.
As long as people know that marriage is not to be entered into lightly or as a side-effect then age may not be as important. I just think that too many people view marriage as some ''end'' to achieve or similar but in reality nothing ends when you get married, the work is just beginning.It is not the same as living together, it''s not the same as dating, etc. There are more day to day issues or larger issues, aka how to save or how to retire or how to raise the kids. But on the other hand, you do feel more of a bond when you know you are legally bound together, it''s fairly interesting. And the becoming a ''family'' is special too. The way I look at it is if you can view yourself with your honey in 10/20/50 years and still having something to talk about or discuss or being in love, then you have a good chance of survival! But I also say listen to instincts, sometimes they know more than your heart is willing to allow. If you have weighed the pros and cons, you will know if it''s right, age or not.
And if not, you''ll find that out too!!
I don''t believe age is a determining factor in truly knowing when you are ready to get married. In my opinion, if you question your relationship to the extent of not knowing if you want to be together anymore (no matter what age), I think it may be time to truly evaluate it.
I think it was said earlier that if him leaving is the reason to get married, it may not be the right one. No one in this forum, or for that matter in your life, will be able to tell you what the "right" thing to do is. The only people who truly knows what''s going on in a relationship are the two in it. I think the advice given here is very sound, but ultimately, becca it''s your decision about what you want to do!
Just my opinion.
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