Alexandrite engagement ring

[wagamamas]

Hi - I just recently purchased a natural Alexandrite engagement ring for my girlfriend. How is the tone of this stone, as i'm worried it may be too dark.

Many thanks.

 

[gongli]

yes i think it's a bit dark. how did you decide on alexandrite? what is your budget for the stone?

if you're into alexandrite for its color change, here's a few other color change stones i found.

http://mastercutgems.com/preview.php?cat=284&id=6312

http://www.gemfix.com/sapphire_blue.html#thumb

otherwise have a look at multicolour.com, ajsgems.com, gemselect.com, they have many at different price points.

 

[jstarfireb]

In alexandrite, the most important thing is the strength of the color change. Do you see a color change from purple in candlelight and incandescent light to green in daylight and fluorescent light? (ETA: Mine goes from an amethyst purple to a traffic light green, and it's pretty easy to elicit the change.)

It's hard to tell from your photos if the tone is too dark or not, but I would keep a stone of reasonable size that has a good color change even if the tone is dark. One other thing to consider is that alexandrite is often cut too shallow to improve yield, and it ends up with a window. I can't tell from the photos whether your stone is windowed. I'd have to see it straight down.

 

[wagamamas]

jstarfireb - thanks for the info. There is definitely a change in color with flourescent light, it changes to a teal/green (will try to add pics once I can get some daytime shots). I'm not too sure what is meant by 'windowed', but have included a picture looking down. fyi, the stone is 1.27 carats, do you think the quality of the stone is good considering the size and color change, given the dark tone?

As well, based on your best guess, what is an average price for a stone of this quality and carat?

Thanks

 

[T L]

LovingDiamonds is our resident alexandrite expert. However, for me, if I find a stone doesn't perform, or is too dark, I don't find it worth it. An ering is made to enjoy for someone in all lighting and it should be as perfect as possible. If you think it's too dark, there are other colored gems out there that are more attractive. Super fine alexandrite costs thousands per carat, and most of the alexandrite out there is very mediocre, even if it does have 100% color change.

 

[jstarfireb]

Well, I'm not really an expert and not sure of the value, but I can tell you that the prices skyrocket above 1ct. I do think it's of good color, nicely cut, and seems to have a strong color change. I can only guess that it's quite valuable if it's natural, perhaps similar to the price of a diamond of the same size. The highest-quality alexandrite is more expensive per carat than diamond.

Do you know the origin? I think most alexandrite these days is mined in India or Brazil. Also, if it's not certified as natural, I would send it off to a lab right away to have it certified. I would hate for this to be true, but it's possible for a jeweler or a customer to be duped into buying synthetic alexandrite and thinking it's natural. If that were the case, it wouldn't be worth much at all.

Regarding the windowing, I don't see much in that stone...if anything, a very small window. Windowing is an effect of a gem being cut too shallow, so the light passes right through it instead of reflecting back at you. It creates a transparent area in the center of the stone where you don't see much color. Almost all alexandrite is windowed, but yours doesn't seem to be bad at all.

 

[LD]

Would you mind giving us a little more information?

1. Carat weight (ooops Edit - sorry, you've already said it's 1.27ct)
2. Location where it was mined
3. Buying price and seller (if you don't mind sharing - rough ball park if you don't want to be exact would be fine).
4. Do you still have the seller's description of the stone (this can be very telling).
5. Did it come with a lab report? If so, what did it say and who was the lab.
6. If you've got daytime photos that would be interesting to see.

(Jstar - there's been no mining in Brazil for a number of years. There are only a few small mines producing at the moment mainly in Tanzania I think.)

 

[wagamamas]

lovingdiamonds - this was purchased from a local retailer for approx $12K. I was told that it was from a Brazilian mine, however there is no documentation supporting this. The stone came with a GIA report, and came with the following description (no additional description from retailer other than what was provided on GIA report):

Weight: 1.27 carats
Measurements: 7.55 x 5.49 x 4.22 mm
Shape: Oval
Cutting Style (Crown): Brilliant Cut
Cutting Style (Pavilion): Step Cut
Transparency: Transparent
Color: Dark Greenish Blue to Dark Purple
Conclusion (Species): Natural Chrysoberyl
Conclusion (Variety): Natural Alexandrite

Included some daytime shots, however the color that comes out does not match what I am seeing (i'm seeing more green). Attached GIA supporting picture for your reference.

Any comments and/or conclusions you have on the stone would be tremendous help, and put me at ease (hopefully). Just afraid of getting duped, as I know pretty much next to nothing about gems.

Thanks

 

[LD]

Ok, I'm going to be honest because I'm sensing that you're concerned at the cost of what you've bought? First off let me say that you've picked one of the most rare gemstones in the world to give as an engagement ring and it's a wonderful choice because it's a durable gem so can withstand being worn daily. It's also a fascinating and romantic gem and if you get a good one, I don't think it can be rivalled.

The bad news is that I'm afraid that it is very over-priced and if the gem is looking dark then I think you can get better value for your money and is this is a once in a lifetime ring, I think you should get the best for your money. The value in alexandrite is not only in the colour change (very few are 100%) but also that they look good in daylight and also incandescent. So they should be pretty in both. That's the whole point of this gemstone - that you get two looks for the price of one.

If I were looking for one around 1ct I would be tempted by these:

http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/yax581aa/&-911529999
http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/yax630aa/&-911529999
http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/yax583aa/&-911529999

If we say that your budget is $12k so we take off $1k for a similar setting to the one you've got, I would look at these:-

http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/ax10004ab/&1401915745 This may be too dark for you (daylight colour) but it's also 4 times as big!
http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/yax637aa/&1401915745 This is over budget but is one of the loveliest I've ever seen and I have lusted after this one for ages!
http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/ax10122aa/&1401915745 This looks odd in the photo but I have one very similar and it's a gorgeous purple pink in the evening (and the daylight colour is lovely too). It's worth considering because it's well in budget and will look much bigger than the oval you currently have. If you search on my name, you'll find it's twin!
http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/zx165ab/&1401915745 I wouldn't re-cut this. Once set, it'll look fine.

David from Multicolour is an expert on Alexandrites and not all he has is on the website so I would urge you to give him a call and see what he has. Trust his eye because he knows what's good!

 

[LD]

Just so you don't think I'm potty - here's photos of mine that I think is similar to the pear I've linked to. David's photos were reasonably similar when I bought this one and initially it put me off but I'm soooooooooooooooooo glad I bought it! Bottom photo is mine.

Whenever I wear my alex I'm always asked what it is! Some people think it's an Emerald - others just haven't got a clue!

 

[T L]

If the photos are accurate, I would return that stone ASAP. I agree with LD. Seriously, you can buy something so much more beautiful for $12K/ct, or even $5K/ct, or less!

I'm a bit shocked how much that jeweler wants, and I think they probably just want to capitalize on the fact it has a GIA report. Go to a more honest jeweler.

 

[LD]

David also makes jewellery and here's another possible contender but I would definitely ask him more about this stone (there are details if you scroll down the page) but I'd ask about daylight and incandescent colours. This is $10k and you've doubled the size of the centre stone.

http://www.davidwein.com/jewelry/alexandrite-white-diamond-and-white-gold-ring-00104951/overview/419156/10/1

 

[wagamamas]

Thanks for the info. Not feeling too happy now . For a reference before I was buying I was looking on these sites and they seemed to be in the ballpark (which now I know is false). Why is there such a big discrepency between what multicolour has and these two sites (these were my point of reference)?

http://awesomegems.com/alexandrite.html
http://www.africagems.com/alexandrite1caratplus.html

Do you think its worthwhile getting an indepedent appraisal, so they can verify it physically?

 

[T L]

Thanks for the info. Not feeling too happy now . For a reference before I was buying I was looking on these sites and they seemed to be in the ballpark (which now I know is false). Why is there such a big discrepency between what multicolour has and these two sites (these were my point of reference)?

http://awesomegems.com/alexandrite.html
http://www.africagems.com/alexandrite1caratplus.html

Do you think its worthwhile getting an indepedent appraisal, so they can verify it physically?

The fact of the matter is that jewelers can charge whatever they want for a gem, you can charge $10K/ct for a fake gem, and it's not breaking the law. White diamonds are more set in price except for some designers that capitalize on a name. I think it's always important to shop around. LD has said numerous times that David Weinberg (who owns Multicolour.com) is an expert on alexandrite, and perhaps he has better mine connections to make his stones more affordable. I would personally see what he has. I don't think his prices are unreasonable, and quite fair, for the stones that LD linked too.

I will also say that I think some particular kinds of gems are better off being bought at one seller vs another. I always recommend Africagems.com for Burmese rubies, as I think they have a good supply and their prices are fair, but as for alexandrite, I think MC.com probably has better prices. It depends on the gem. Some gems are not the same fair market value across the board for a particular vendor.

 

[LD]

I'm so sorry - I really didn't mean to make you unhappy and I really apologise if I have.

In terms of your questions, David specialises in Alexandrite and prices very fairly. If something is expensive on his website then typically it's good. I've collected Alex for over 20 years and honestly I've never been able to beat his prices. I think that he just has better contacts OR just doesn't mark up as much as other websites do. I've bought around 5 or 6 pieces from him and have more from other sources. Unfortunately, those sources now don't sell Alex (and if they do, the quality isn't there).

Not sure what you mean by re-appraise? If you mean get another lab report then no. You know it's a genuine natural Alex because of the GIA report (they're not best for coloured gemstones by the way). For Alex I would use AIGS, Gubelin or AGL. Lab reports do not assign a monetary value and only assess the gemstone's chemical make up.

If you mean appraise as in "did I get value for money", appraisers unfortunately are only as good as the gemstones they have seen and can compare to and their knowledge. You'd probably get wildly differing appraisals for alexandrite. However, I can tell you categorically that $12k for a 1ct gemstone is far far far too much and for that money it would have to be absolutely exceptional. I'm afraid it isn't as it's too dark (and I think that may be your concern also?).

Why don't you give David a call and talk things through with him? If nothing else he will give you an honest opinion.

 

[T L]

I get the feeling that David has great connections, and he's a supplier to a lot of dealers that charge quite a bit more.

 

[minousbijoux]

Wagamamas: you are not the only one who has overpaid for a stone at one time or another and, in some ways, it is a way we learn. A while before I found PS, I bought several top tier stones, including an alexandrite. It is a little bit under 2 cts, is well cut for an alex is Brazilian with beautiful color change. I would be embarrassed to say precisely how much I paid, but suffice it to say that its not too terribly far from what you paid per carat. When I saw the prices at MC, I was floored. I do believe he has the best prices around for the best cut and color. I don't think anyone else comes close. And of course, we can all learn from LD - and TL too.

The good news is that perhaps you can still return it knowing what you know now.

Slight threadjack: LD, from what I've seen, it seems like indian and tanzanian alex have a brown modifier - is this the case, or are the photos deceiving? The ones I'm drawn to on MC and other websites are typically Brazilian because they appear to have the most complete and crisp change from teal or green/blue to magenta/purple. Your thoughts please?

 

[LD]

Wagamamas: you are not the only one who has overpaid for a stone at one time or another and, in some ways, it is a way we learn. A while before I found PS, I bought several top tier stones, including an alexandrite. It is a little bit under 2 cts, is well cut for an alex is Brazilian with beautiful color change. I would be embarrassed to say precisely how much I paid, but suffice it to say that its not too terribly far from what you paid per carat. When I saw the prices at MC, I was floored. I do believe he has the best prices around for the best cut and color. I don't think anyone else comes close. And of course, we can all learn from LD - and TL too.

The good news is that perhaps you can still return it knowing what you know now.

Slight threadjack: LD, from what I've seen, it seems like indian and tanzanian alex have a brown modifier - is this the case, or are the photos deceiving? The ones I'm drawn to on MC and other websites are typically Brazilian because they appear to have the most complete and crisp change from teal or green/blue to magenta/purple. Your thoughts please?

Minous, Indian Alex has some of the finest daylight colour and good ones most definitely don't have a brown modifier. Personally I prefer Indian to Brazilian material but that's only because I've seen a greater amount of good quality Indian compared to Brazilian. Strangely the Russians I own and have seen are not as nice as either! Tanzanian alex can have a brown or grey modifier but, again, some of that material has been top grade without those modifiers. If I was in the market for buying more I wouldn't only look at one location, I would look at all and pick the best stone for my money. The thing is that location doesn't give a premium UNLESS it's the finest high quality Russian material and that very rarely ever comes on the market! These are good examples of Indians that don't have brown or grey. Ignore the cut on the second one!

http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/yax637aa/&1624187289
http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/imax0020aa/&1624187289

 

[minousbijoux]

These are good examples of Indians that don't have brown or grey. Ignore the cut on the second one!

http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/yax637aa/&1624187289
http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/imax0020aa/&1624187289

Yes, I totally agree that these are lovely. You know what? think I might be confusing saturation level with brown modifier. Of the first group you posted several posts back, would you say that the Brazilian is the most saturated? I know in that first grouping, I liked the Brazilian best (perhaps because the colors most closely resemble mine! ).

...and Wagamamas, thanks again for allowing me to threadjack - I hope it helps you as well.

 

[jstarfireb]

Thanks, LD - I wasn't aware that the Brazilian sources had been exhausted. The last time I shopped for alexandrite was several years ago!

ETA: Also wanted to say that the tone looks darker in your more recently posted photos compared to the first few. If the more recent photos are more accurate, then it sounds like you overpaid.

 

[LD]

These are good examples of Indians that don't have brown or grey. Ignore the cut on the second one!

http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/yax637aa/&1624187289
http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?/details/single/alexandrite/imax0020aa/&1624187289

Yes, I totally agree that these are lovely. You know what? think I might be confusing saturation level with brown modifier. Of the first group you posted several posts back, would you say that the Brazilian is the most saturated? I know in that first grouping, I liked the Brazilian best (perhaps because the colors most closely resemble mine! ).

...and Wagamamas, thanks again for allowing me to threadjack - I hope it helps you as well.

Interesting question - as you know photos of Alex lie! So, if I were going to pick one out of the 3 1ct gemstones posted a few back, I would chose the Indian one even though the photos make the Brazilian look better. The reason is that the description of the Brazilian says the daylight colour is dark (the incandescent isn't). The Indian is medium and strong in both daylight and incandescent - and in fact, the incandescent description for both is the same. So the Indian pips the Brazilian to the post for me. So rather than looking at the photos, I look at the descriptors too - which is why I included the paler/orangey gem a few back as well. Does that help? Mind you, if I were buying I would ask David to get out all the ones I'd linked to and ask for his opinion and advice.

Buying Alex is difficult because people perceive colours so differently and then you have one gemstones with 2 colours a receipe for misunderstandings so you need as much information as you can!

 

[wagamamas]

Appreciate the info everyone. Its been quite informative, only wish I found this forum prior to purchasing. Will see what I can do about returning the stone.

When you're saying I way overpaid, what ballpark are you thinking....50%, 100%, 200%?
When the pictures are taken of Alexandrite on Multicolour (or any other website), are they typically shining a light directly on it, or is it presented in ambient lighting?

Needless to say I am quite disappointed in myself and the jeweler that sold the stone.

Luckily, my girlfriend and I will be travelling to Bangkok in Dec (pending recent flood situation), so hopefully i'll be able to sneak away and visit Muiltcolour showroom.


jstar - the recent pictures actually don't do it justice imo, when i see it, its actually quite a bit lighter and more on the green side.

 

[T L]

Appreciate the info everyone. Its been quite informative, only wish I found this forum prior to purchasing. Will see what I can do about returning the stone.

When you're saying I way overpaid, what ballpark are you thinking....50%, 100%, 200%?
When the pictures are taken of Alexandrite on Multicolour (or any other website), are they typically shining a light directly on it, or is it presented in ambient lighting?

Needless to say I am quite disappointed in myself and the jeweler that sold the stone.

Luckily, my girlfriend and I will be travelling to Bangkok in Dec (pending recent flood situation), so hopefully i'll be able to sneak away and visit Muiltcolour showroom.


jstar - the recent pictures actually don't do it justice imo, when i see it, its actually quite a bit lighter and more on the green side.

Based on the quality, I woud say you overpaid around 400%.

 

[LD]

I would agree with TL's estimation but would caveat that by saying that's based on weight and colour description you've given NOT your photos.

To answer your questions about MC's lighting, they use very specific lighting because Alexandrites never ever show their true daylight colour and it takes a really professional set-up to get them to show their green. Just a FYI, even very weak Alex will show a phenomenal colour change in a photo even if you don't see it in person. It's a very very strange phenomenon. I'm attaching two photos below of a really cheap ring I bought (natural Alex) that had virtually NO colour change properties but as you can see from the photo it looks like it has! Believe me, it doesn't!

From Multicolour's website:

About our photographs.

Alexandrite is especially difficult to photograph. Not only does the color change as a result of illumination under different kinds of light sources but it also varies as a result of geographical location and time of day. Pictures can also differ because of technological obstacles like screen and graphic resolutions. We try to minimize the variations with good equipment and controlled lighting so that our images are as accurate as possible. The colors in our images are dependent on the lighting environment and we use cool daylight tubes (~6000K) for daylight shots and studio or photo flood lights (3300 – 3500K) as our incandescent light source. A typical alexandrite shot will maximize the observable color change by obstructing any unintentional ambient light so that the resulting image is a function of a singular unmixed light source. We work with imaging programs like Paint Shop and Adobe for sizing and positioning but we do not alter the colors unless it is too improve the accuracy of the color presentation.

 

[LD]

Wagamamas - I thought you might be interested in something. I emailed David at MC and brought this thread to his attention as I wondered what his opinion would be. Interestingly he's told me that prices have risen considerably and prices are now much much higher than ever before. His prices are lower because he has some old stock. I would think then if the market is commanding higher prices then it won't be long before prices increase on the MC website. So, if I were you, I'd speak with David quickly to see if he can help!!!!! I still stand by that I feel you can get a much larger stone for your money and it doesn't matter if it's old stock or not - the fact is you want to get the best/biggest/loveliest stone you can! Good luck.

 

[africagems]

re; Brazilian alexandrite mines-the Hematita mine is still in production and controlled by one individual who cuts the rough. He controls the material exclusively and that sets the price. Production is scarce and their is a tremendous demand for the finer qualities (especially rounds in larger sizes) as the Brazilian sets the standard for color change. Thus prices are very high. Some of the prices mentioned in this thread are not even close to what you can buy it for from the miner. I have seen some of the finest indian material (seen thousands of stones) and only a few on them even come close to the Brazilian in terms of a vivid, intense color change, although the indian does have a better daylight color IMO. The best Indian material has at best a decent color change. Clean Brazilian fine stones over 1 carat are very expensive right now as are all fine colored gems

 

[TristanC]

Does anyone know much about the authenticity of the Alexandrite claimed to be from Russia (Urals) from awesomegems?

 

[LD]

Does anyone know much about the authenticity of the Alexandrite claimed to be from Russia (Urals) from awesomegems?

It's very easy to say Alex is Russian BUT unless there is categoric proof I would take it with a pinch of salt. Just take a look at Ebay to see the plethoria of Russian Alex. I think people assume that Russian Alex is the "be all and end all" of Alexandrites but in reality there was good and bad quality just like the Alex from other locations.

It's not often that Russian Alex comes on the market but it does happen however my rule of thumb is that if I see a piece being labelled as Russian I treat it with suspicion. Having said that I'm not sure Awesomegems would sell something as Alexandrite that wasn't so I'd say if you're interested (irrespective of locality) you need to decide whether it's a good Alex or not.

 

[MizLiz]

Hi, I know this is a really old thread but I wondered if anybody knows if the Russian Alexandrite on Awesomegems has come up as authentic from the named sources and if descriptions were accurate or if anybody had any experiences. I saw they had some ripoff reportcomplaints.
http://m.ripoffreport.com/reports/n...ingnet-fake-jewlery-and-investment-fr-1154871

I noticed that they were originally on the reputable colored stones vendor list and then fell off or just were taken off. They have a return guarantee . Any idea of their reputation now that it is 6 years later?