Best Point-and-Shoot Camera Options for Colored Stones?

[minousbijoux]

Another thought for those of you who use an artificial light source and a light box type set up - how do you show the gem in "natural light" or daylight? Do you correct for that with lights that mimic sunlight, or can you take your setup outside and use sunlight?

 

[kenny]

Another thought for those of you who use an artificial light source and a light box type set up - how do you show the gem in "natural light" or daylight? Do you correct for that with lights that mimic sunlight, or can you take your setup outside and use sunlight?

Almost any light source, within reason, can be used with good results.
You just need to set the camera's white balance to whatever light source you are using.
Some cameras do this automatically, though with varying degrees of success.
Even the settings on cameras for, say, fluorescent, daylight, cloudy etc can be inaccurate.
Fluorescent bulbs come in many colors of white, and daylight at noon has a very different color than daylight 30 minutes before sunset.
And don't forget that the blue sky is a very strong light source ... IOW the direct sunlight does not have to be streaming into your window and onto your gem for a window to affect your white balance.

In photography you should avoid using two light sources, such as daylight from a window and light bulbs, unless you are intentionally going for a creative effect.

Something that's not so obvious is every light source actually gives off a different color of light.
We humans are not good at noticing this because our brains quickly compensate to the color in various light sources.
Cameras are not as clever as our brains.
Not yet.

To answer your question in another way the cheapie spiral Home Depot CFLs I use are 5000 Kelvin, which is widely considered daylight.
Kelvin is just another scale, like Celsius or Fahrenheit, that is used to measure the 'color' of white light.
Old fashioned light bulbs were around 2700 Kelvin, or towards the yellow end.

The best way to know that your pics are well white balanced is to place the gem on a white or neutral gray surface.
if that surface in the picture is greenish, bluish, yellowish, pinkish you know your white balance is wrong and the color of the gem is not true. But that's another thing often easy to fix in post.

 

[PrecisionGem]

One thing to consider with lights is that you want a full spectrum light. The CFL bulbs and florescent are not. If you look at a CFL with a spectrascope you will see all kinds of black bands in the spectrum. An LED is actually a better light source, or the old fashioned incandescent bulb.

 

[kenny]

One thing to consider with lights is that you want a full spectrum light. The CFL bulbs and florescent are not. If you look at a CFL with a spectrascope you will see all kinds of black bands in the spectrum. An LED is actually a better light source, or the old fashioned incandescent bulb.

Gene, I love learning new stuff.
I often hear that various light sources cause certain gems to change color.
Is this why you want full spectrum lights for photographing colored gems?

 

[chrono]

In photography you should avoid using two light sources, such as daylight from a window and light bulbs, unless you are intentionally going for a creative effect.

Why this? On a cold wintery day when the sun is weak or overcast, it is difficult to brave the cold winds so I stand by the window to take a picture. Sometimes it is still too dark, so I turn on the lights in the room for additional lighting. I do not get any funky results from either the stone nor camera.

 

[chrono]

One thing to consider with lights is that you want a full spectrum light. The CFL bulbs and florescent are not. If you look at a CFL with a spectrascope you will see all kinds of black bands in the spectrum. An LED is actually a better light source, or the old fashioned incandescent bulb.

I only photograph colour shifters and changers under LED and incandescent to show their different colours. The shifts on my non-shifters / changers are very minor to insignificant under CFLs. What do those black bands in the spectrum mean?

 

[colorluvr]

Question for Gene:

So, you don't consider these to be full spectrum, even though they are 5000K and are being touted as full spectrum? Yes, they are huge, but I bought these when I lived in Oregon and NEVER got natural light in my house, even on the few days that the sun actually shined

http://www.replacementlightbulbs.com/lampfeus5055.html

 

[kenny]

In photography you should avoid using two light sources, such as daylight from a window and light bulbs, unless you are intentionally going for a creative effect.

Why this? On a cold wintery day when the sun is weak or overcast, it is difficult to brave the cold winds so I stand by the window to take a picture. Sometimes it is still too dark, so I turn on the lights in the room for additional lighting. I do not get any funky results from either the stone nor camera.

Then your two light sources happen to be close enough in color temp at that time of day to notice the difference in that you are shooting.
Other light sources may not be so close and other subjects may reveal the color difference more.

Something like a face or an opaque white vase would be a good example if lights of different colors were striking it from opposite sides, but gems may be more forgiving since they are transparent.

It would also depend on how much the two light sources can 'mix'.
For instance if the window is right on the left and a tungsten bulb is on the right close to the gem the color difference would be more noticeable than if the gem was far from the window and the tungsten bulb was in a reflector pointed up at a white ceiling.

 

[chrono]

Something like a face or an opaque white vase would be a good example if lights of different colors were striking it from opposite sides, but gems since they are transparent may be more forgiving.

And a whole lot smaller too.

 

[kenny]

Chorono, I added to my post.
Sorry. I can never get my thoughts right the first time.

 

[kenny]

Something like a face or an opaque white vase would be a good example if lights of different colors were striking it from opposite sides, but gems since they are transparent may be more forgiving.

And a whole lot smaller too.

In this case size doesn't matter.

 

[kenny]

One thing to consider with lights is that you want a full spectrum light. The CFL bulbs and florescent are not. If you look at a CFL with a spectrascope you will see all kinds of black bands in the spectrum. An LED is actually a better light source, or the old fashioned incandescent bulb.

I only photograph colour shifters and changers under LED and incandescent to show their different colours. The shifts on my non-shifters / changers are very minor to insignificant under CFLs. What do those black bands in the spectrum mean?

I'm gonna offer a guess in the last sentence of this post.
Gene can tell me if I'm wrong.

Light is energy at many frequencies or wavelengths.
You can think of it like sound from a piano, which has 88 keys.
There are low notes, medium notes and high notes and everything in between.
(Actually for the analogy to work the piano would produce sound over the entire range of human hearing, 20 - 20,000 Hz for a child, and there would be an infinite number of keys, not just 88.)

Full spectrum would be all 88 notes working.
Not full spectrum would be some keys not making any sound.
Lights with output that is not full spectrum have some wavelengths missing; the bulb does not produce much if any energy at some wavelengths.

Full spectrum lights may be better for colored gems because that missing wavelength may just happen be the wavelength that causes a gem to change its color.

 

[distracts]

Another thought for those of you who use an artificial light source and a light box type set up - how do you show the gem in "natural light" or daylight? Do you correct for that with lights that mimic sunlight, or can you take your setup outside and use sunlight?

I don't have a light box setup but probably a good half of my indoor at my desk pics are taken with an artificial light facsimile. Totally accidental on my part - I have seasonal affective disorder and have a number of SunBox lamps to use as part of treatment. But they're pretty good for the purpose of mimicking sunlight in photos. It's not exact, but it's certainly much closer than my ceiling lights.

 

[minousbijoux]

Another thought for those of you who use an artificial light source and a light box type set up - how do you show the gem in "natural light" or daylight? Do you correct for that with lights that mimic sunlight, or can you take your setup outside and use sunlight?

I don't have a light box setup but probably a good half of my indoor at my desk pics are taken with an artificial light facsimile. Totally accidental on my part - I have seasonal affective disorder and have a number of SunBox lamps to use as part of treatment. But they're pretty good for the purpose of mimicking sunlight in photos. It's not exact, but it's certainly much closer than my ceiling lights.

Are they expensive? If not, it might be worth it for gemstone photography (and any day where I had the seasonal blues!) - do you have recommendations?

 

[PrecisionGem]

Ok, here's a picture of the same stone, this time taken with the $90 LUMIX point and shoot camera. I did crop it and do a quick color balance in Aperture. The angle the stone is sitting could have been improved, but I didn't want to mess too much up with my normal photo set up. The camera was on a tripod.

 

[kenny]

Wow, $90!
Looks great Gene.

 

[chrono]

Wow, who needs a fancy DSLR when a point and shoot camera does almost as well!

 

[minousbijoux]

Ahh, a tripod. Gene, any sense as to whether you could come as close in the way of a nice photo with the point and shoot in the absence of a tripod? And Kenny, is there a cheap way to go for tripods for mere mortals like me?

TIA

 

[ChrisA222]

Gene, whats a "color balance in Aperture"? Is that a software program? See..thats what I was trying to avoid...to be able to get decent pics without having to manipulate them. I guess I could do it...but its A)annoying and B)something else that I have to figure out how to do. I have no clue how to use photo editing, and thought there must be some decent camera out there that wouldn't require it. I say this because my camera does OK with detail--its the colors that are always wrong (and the saturation)..but not really the detail.

I did get better pics with the white paper taped to my phone...but still the saturation was definately lacking...I tried turning up the saturation in the camera, and then everything got an aura, and my fingers turned orange!

 

[kenny]

Ahh, a tripod. Gene, any sense as to whether you could come as close in the way of a nice photo with the point and shoot in the absence of a tripod? And Kenny, is there a cheap way to go for tripods for mere mortals like me?

TIA

Just rest the camera on books.
Make the camera point down at the gem by putting a coin or two under the camera, at the back side.
Business cards stacked under the lens may help it from falling forward.

Don't touch the camera to take the pic since that will will move the camera and blur the pic.
Use the camera's timer.

 

[minousbijoux]

Just rest the camera on books.
Make the camera point down at the gem by putting a coin or two under the camera, at the back side.
Business cards stacked under the lens may help it from falling forward.

Don't touch the camera to take the pic since that will will move the camera and blur the pic.
Use the camera's timer.

Brilliant, just brilliant! I'm embarrassed to admit that the "big thing" I'm looking forward to is of taping white paper all inside a box, cutting a hole in the side big enough for my camera lens, putting both my camera and the box on a table with a pile of books, and borrowing my sons desk lamp! Other people might look forward to dinner out, going clothes shopping or hiking, but I can't wait to see what kinds of pics I can get!! Thanks for all the tips!!

 

[PrecisionGem]

I would never try to shoot stones without a tripod. You can go to walmart and buy a small table top tripod for $10. For a little point and shoot camera those table top tripods with the flexable legs would be perfect.

All these blurry pictures I see on Pricescope are because the exposures are slow on these close up shots and the camera is blurred from hand shake, or the camera is moving around and the autofocus cant figure out what the heck it's suppose to do.

 

[PrecisionGem]

This is what you see when you look in spectra scope. This first image is a light source with a full spectrum. The others that are various CFL bulbs have black bands in them. These are area's in the color spectrum where there is no light. Remember from high school physics that white light is the full spectrum of all colors. So for a light source to be pure white light it should have all the visible wave lengths of light and in equal intensities. These CFL bulbs do not.

When you look at a stone in a spectrascope you need a very good light source with no bands, since you are looking for bands in the stone.

 

[PrecisionGem]

If you view a stone with a light source that isn't a full spectrum, then you won't see the true color of the stone. Almost every stone looks different under florescent light than it does in incandescent, because florescent is missing certain colors in it's light.

Most professionals use SOLUX bulbs for accurate color. Museums use these SOLUX bulbs often to light paintings so you can see the colors in an accurate way. A lot of color stone dealers in Tucson will have SOLUX bulbs lighting the displays. The downside to these bulbs is they get hot. I get burned all the time taking pictures of stones with them.

 

[kenny]

Another reason for many of the blurry pics on PS is people hold the camera closer to the gem than their camera can focus.

 

[chrono]

It is embarrassing enough to be taking pictures of gems and rings in my office that I'm not carting a tripod in here as well. What will my neighbours think when I cart the whole getup on my deck?

 

[minousbijoux]

No Chrono, I think the really embarrassing thing will be when you start telling folks they'll have to wait - that you're too busy with your photography to have the meeting or turn in the report. Or, better yet, whenever someone comes near you, you try and draft them into being your photography assistant!

 

[chrono]

I highly doubt that my colleagues will want me to photograph their manly fingers wearing my rings. Being an engineer, I am the only female in the department and have been so in the various companies I've worked with the exception of one.

 

[minousbijoux]

No, no, no! Not as models, no, heaven's no! But someone has to carry the heavy stuff, and has to do the setups!

I am going to try taking pics on a pile of books as Kenny suggested and see if that helps me at all.

 

[minousbijoux]

I'm reviving this thread because I'm in the process of setting up my "photo studio" and am bound to have questions. Also was curious: Chris, did you bit the bullet and buy a camera? Are we going to see some photos?

I set up a box, covered the inside with white paper, put a mirror down on the bottom, cut a hole in one end for the camera lens, and then tried and failed. I think I have to figure out how to stop the aperture down, have a strong enough light source, and have the shutter speed sloooooow as molasses. I'm also starting to think that maybe I can have the camera on a tripod (which I bought, yay!) and shoot down over the side of the box? Thoughts, please?