Bezel or prong setting for old cuts?

[Dmndsr4evr11]

Hello,

Do you think a thin bezel setting like is better for old cuts vs swoopy prong setting? I am so torn as I feel that a bezel setting like @elizat’s three stone ring (which I love) would be better for old cuts but I think it will somehow limit light return although it’s an open bottom? Please help me decide before I make DK insane hahaha.

@elizat, it seems most of your rings are in bezel settings. Do you notice less sparkles in the stones as it it covered all around? I probably shouldn’t worry too much about it as they’re small stones with 0.60 center with 0.25 sides.

Thank you.

 

[elliefire99]

I honestly think you are good either way. Many old cuts have thin, crispy, edges, so you may consider a bezel to protect the stone in that case. That said, I did have DK clean up a thin, bruted girdle on an OEC for me. I think it cost me about $200, and will make sure your stone is safe whether you go with prongs or bezel

I don't have any antique cuts in bezels personally, so I unfortunately can't speak to differences in light return!

 

[Dmndsr4evr11]

I honestly think you are good either way. Many old cuts have thin, crispy, edges, so you may consider a bezel to protect the stone in that case. That said, I did have DK clean up a thin, bruted girdle on an OEC for me. I think it cost me about $200, and will make sure your stone is safe whether you go with prongs or bezel

I don't have any antique cuts in bezels personally, so I unfortunately can't speak to differences in light return!

Thanks, @elliefire99.

 

[maryjane04]

I personally love bezels. But I don't like it covering too much of the girdle. So my vote is for both

I also love love love delicate claw prongs. Can't you have both?

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Depends on the cut of the stone. @yssie is one of the only people who I know who understands and can explain that.

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

I set mine like this to protect the thin girdle and have prongs. I was scared to bezel my thin girdle, but that may be unfounded worry.

 

[Dmndsr4evr11]

I personally love bezels. But I don't like it covering too much of the girdle. So my vote is for both

I also love love love delicate claw prongs. Can't you have both?

I’m afraid of too much metal on such a small stone. Maybe when I have the opportunity to get a big stone, I’ll do that. I do love your setting.

 

[maryjane04]

I set mine like this to protect the thin girdle and have prongs. I was scared to bezel my thin girdle, but that may be unfounded worry.

@Mrs_Strizzle I think yours was an inspiration for mine. I wasn't worried about the girdle but more about my wonky stone and increasing the real estate

 

[Dmndsr4evr11]

Depends on the cut of the stone. @yssie is one of the only people who I know who understands and can explain that.

Thanks @diamondseeker2006. It’s such a small stone at 0.60 carat with two 0.25 sides that many people are probably laughing here why I’m so concerned about how to set them hahaha. It’s my second venture into an old cut. My first one was a 0.25 OEC I got a few months ago. I’m slowly easing my way up. Almost went for a much larger lovely OMC from OWD but thought it may be too warm. Here is my little itty bitty stone.

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

@maryjane04 yes! Increased real estate is never a bad thing! Your ring is gorgeous.

 

[Dmndsr4evr11]

I set mine like this to protect the thin girdle and have prongs. I was scared to bezel my thin girdle, but that may be unfounded worry.

Oh so beautiful, @Mrs_Strizzle. What are the specs of your stone? Love the whole ring.

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

Oh so beautiful, @Mrs_Strizzle. What are the specs of your stone? Love the whole ring.

It is a 3.63 ct O-P with a 41 table and 62.9 depth.

 

[elizat]

I have a lot of what are faux bezels, with tiny prongs. I don't like math and thinking about things in terms of numbers, kind of hurts my head, so I buy with my eyes.

I think with my stones, it hasn't mattered that much how I set them really, because when I look at my certificates, I tend to pick similar numbers. I didn't realize that before, but I just looked and I have a range where I usually land.

All of my stones, apart from one, have an extremely thin to thin girdle. I do the faux bezel for protection too.

If you have a very shallow stone, a bezel can help close it up and perform better at times. But, I'm not a numbers person and thinking about angles and at what angles it is best to do that makes my head hurt, so I just treat each one individually and always talk with the vendor I'm using to set them about what would be best.

 

[maryjane04]

@maryjane04 yes! Increased real estate is never a bad thing! Your ring is gorgeous.

Thank you so much! Likewise.. from one bezel with prong owner to another yours divine and that itty bitty table! Swoon!

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Thanks @diamondseeker2006. It’s such a small stone at 0.60 carat with two 0.25 sides that many people are probably laughing here why I’m so concerned about how to set them hahaha. It’s my second venture into an old cut. My first one was a 0.25 OEC I got a few months ago. I’m slowly easing my way up. Almost went for a much larger lovely OMC from OWD but thought it may be too warm. Here is my little itty bitty stone.

In that case, I think bezels would be perfect! I really think that would work best for the size of these stones! I do think bezels are really pretty on old cuts in general!

 

[Dmndsr4evr11]

It is a 3.63 ct O-P with a 41 table and 62.9 depth.

Wow!

 

[Dmndsr4evr11]

I have a lot of what are faux bezels, with tiny prongs. I don't like math and thinking about things in terms of numbers, kind of hurts my head, so I buy with my eyes.

I think with my stones, it hasn't mattered that much how I set them really, because when I look at my certificates, I tend to pick similar numbers. I didn't realize that before, but I just looked and I have a range where I usually land.

All of my stones, apart from one, have an extremely thin to thin girdle. I do the faux bezel for protection too.

If you have a very shallow stone, a bezel can help close it up and perform better at times. But, I'm not a numbers person and thinking about angles and at what angles it is best to do that makes my head hurt, so I just treat each one individually and always talk with the vendor I'm using to set them about what would be best.

Thank you, @elizat. Great advice.

 

[Dmndsr4evr11]

In that case, I think bezels would be perfect! I really think that would work best for the size of these stones! I do think bezels are really pretty on old cuts in general!

Thanks, as always, @diamondseeker2006.

 

[LLJsmom]

This is a good question! I hope more people will chime in.

 

[yssie]

Oh. I would totally bezel that (not-itty-bitty!) baby. As long as my vendor thought the VTN girdle would be fine - and I can’t see any particular reason it shouldn’t be! I love bezels on stones this size

So interestingly enough many years ago I actually had three stones with really similar faceting - two a bit smaller than yours, one a little bigger. I was going to make earrings and a pendant for my wedding. (This was a long time ago!) And I was debating between prongs and bezels too... And my other half had one of the first consumer 3D metal printers available, and he made me three dummy mounts to try.

No actual setting of the stones, just cups with and without cutouts... I’m sure I posted photos somewhere on PS... I’ll search for them on the computer tomorrow Long story short - in the larger tables, deeper stones where the pavilion mains were driving light return faceup (@Karl_K’s excellent article here https://www.pricescope.com/articles/do_pavilion_mains_drive_light_return_modern_round_brilliant) I found that both prongs (well, pseudo-prongs) and enclosing the girdle of the stone (with minimal “lip” rising over the crown) but leaving the pavilion mostly open had very little effect on face-up. However. A bezel style that fully enclosed the pavilion, again with minimal “lip” rise over the crown - the shape of the pavilion enclosure made a difference.

It was, at the time, very surprising. Now I have some explanations - but I really need a ray tracing programme to prove anything! A rounded cup enclosing the pavilion, if the interior is polished - I clearly remember little visual reduction in brightness face-up but enhanced “contrastiness” (B&W chessboard effect of the facets turning on and off as you tilt the stone). A flat-sided pavilion enclosure, if the interior is polished - much less bright face-up but immensely more fire. That part is easy - less brightness = less interference = better odds of your eye catching a single wavelength of dispersion. And I suspect any pavilion enclosure with interior unpolished would yield a dull and dreary stone.

Real world bezels are never cups or straight-sided buckets, of course!! For one thing the underside is almost always open for cleaning. Often there are gallery cutouts. So... Okay, totally failed on the long story short bit, but - an ASET would tell you so much more. Are you able to acquire one? Either pics or a scope of your own? But... In general... My opinion on this would be to just keep the rise over the crown as low as possible and bezel away!!

 

[Dmndsr4evr11]

Oh. I would totally bezel that (not-itty-bitty!) baby. As long as my vendor thought the VTN girdle would be fine - and I can’t see any particular reason it shouldn’t be! I love bezels on stones this size

So interestingly enough many years ago I actually had three stones with really similar faceting - two a bit smaller than yours, one a little bigger. I was going to make earrings and a pendant for my wedding. (This was a long time ago!) And I was debating between prongs and bezels too... And my other half had one of the first consumer 3D metal printers available, and he made me three dummy mounts to try.

No actual setting of the stones, just cups with and without cutouts... I’m sure I posted photos somewhere on PS... I’ll search for them on the computer tomorrow Long story short - in the larger tables, deeper stones where the pavilion mains were driving light return faceup (@Karl_K’s excellent article here https://www.pricescope.com/articles/do_pavilion_mains_drive_light_return_modern_round_brilliant) I found that both prongs (well, pseudo-prongs) and enclosing the girdle of the stone (with minimal “lip” rising over the crown) but leaving the pavilion mostly open had very little effect on face-up. However. A bezel style that fully enclosed the pavilion, again with minimal “lip” rise over the crown - the shape of the pavilion enclosure made a difference.

It was, at the time, very surprising. Now I have some explanations - but I really need a ray tracing programme to prove anything! A rounded cup enclosing the pavilion, if the interior is polished - I clearly remember little visual reduction in brightness face-up but enhanced “contrastiness” (B&W chessboard effect of the facets turning on and off as you tilt the stone). A flat-sided pavilion enclosure, if the interior is polished - much less bright face-up but immensely more fire. That part is easy - less brightness = less interference = better odds of your eye catching a single wavelength of dispersion. And I suspect any pavilion enclosure with interior unpolished would yield a dull and dreary stone.

Real world bezels are never cups or straight-sided buckets, of course!! For one thing the underside is almost always open for cleaning. Often there are gallery cutouts. So... Okay, totally failed on the long story short bit, but - an ASET would tell you so much more. Are you able to acquire one? Either pics or a scope of your own? But... In general... My opinion on this would be to just keep the rise over the crown as low as possible and bezel away!!

Oh my! You are a world of knowledge, @ yssie. I think I had a brain infarct just reading all your info hahaha. Waiting for DK to send me drawings tomorrow. He sent me the prong setting drawings yesterday. He has been kind and patient with my indecisiveness .

Here are my own photos:

 

[Dmndsr4evr11]

This is a good question! I hope more people will chime in.

Love your ugly doll avatar hahaa. What happened to your 3 stone avatar?

 

[LLJsmom]

Love your ugly doll avatar hahaa. What happened to your 3 stone avatar?

Just wanted some color in my life, andg give the old girl a rest. I see it enough on my hand. And seriously, this guy is my favorite ugly doll. I'll change it up and post one of his friends every now and then...

 

[missy]

Just wanted some color in my life, andg give the old girl a rest. I see it enough on my hand. And seriously, this guy is my favorite ugly doll. I'll change it up and post one of his friends every now and then...

I LOVE ugly dolls! We have a collection (back in Brooklyn and I miss them). Thanks for sharing yours @LLJsmom.

 

[missy]

I vote bezel it @Dmndsr4evr11! Gorgeous.

 

[Cerulean]

I lack the technical knowledge of @yssie by a mile....

But I have both bezeled and semi-bezeled my OEC 3 stone. They are all the same stones. The semi bezel allows so much light in, that I suspect it isn't all too different from a prong mount. I also have photos comparing it while in a holder.

My GIA report is here. I am having a hard time getting my GIA report to even load...but I do know it has a larger table than typical of an OEC. It is the same center stone as my avatar!

Both the semi bezel and full bezel are beautiful, but I did notice a difference. I have pictures in similar lighting environments - they were taken in the same position in my home, or on my block. Obviously time of day is a factor, so this isn't perfect...

In the ring mount and semi bezel, the diamond is "brighter" - it's super crisp whiteness is palpable. I thoroughly enjoy seeing the white stone from the side, too. But facets seem slightly less defined (fewer, broader flashes of color), it's a little mushier, and the stone is a tad less fiery.

In the full bezel - the facets seemed more colorful and prominent. The downside, was that the overall stone seemed a little less bright overall. In some lighting, it seemed to go darker overall. But the contrast is WOAH.

If I had to do it all over, I may have stuck with a full bezel design. I love the current design of my semi bezel, but I think I prefer contrast over even brightness. Altho...after finding such a high color OEC, there is something really pleasing about the side view to me.

Hope this helps!

Ring mount (RM)
RM - Indoors

RM Outside - porch



Full bezel (FB)
FB Indoors


FB Outside - porch


FB - outside porch no 2 (see how it is ....a little less bright? it is so hard to explain...)

FB Outside - down the street


Semi bezel (SB)
SB Indoors


SB technically inside - - EXACT angle and almost same time of day as the 1st porch shot for the full bezel



SB Outside - down the street

 

[YadaYadaYada]

I’m not usually a bezel person but your ring is an exception @Cerulean. Do you mind me asking who made it? Forgive me if I’ve asked this before.

 

[lulu_ma]

Wow @Cerulean thanks for posting this comparison. Both settings are so pretty but the bezel style really makes a difference.

So which is your current setting? The semi-bezel?

Is there a thread where I can see the profile differences?

 

[Cerulean]

Wow @Cerulean thanks for posting this comparison. Both 3 stones are so pretty but the setting type really makes a difference.

So which is your current setting? The semi-bezel?

Yup - the current setting is the semi-bezel!

Other tiny details - the side stones are slightly lower color. I can tell the difference is more prominent with the semi bezel, bc I can see the sides. I am also psychotically color sensitive, and I don't think 99% of people could even see the difference in color.

In the photo with the full bezel that is least favorable - the center would almost go...dark? I have never seen that with the semi bezel.

But I do miss the color show with the full bezel. Not to say I don't get colorful flashes with the semi bezel...but it isn't as pronounced.

Here is another photo of the dark "center" - this is probably a specific quirk given the cut of my stone....this might be uncharitable photo, as my ring was dirty from hiking...but it's the best I've got!

 

[Cerulean]

I’m not usually a bezel person but your ring is an exception @Cerulean. Do you mind me asking who made it? Forgive me if I’ve asked this before.

No problem!

Sako made the full bezel version. The bezels were absolutely perfect with the tiniest milgrain I've ever seen. The craftsmanship was impeccable. However, the design itself had flaws so I replaced it not long after. It was very uncomfortable and I didn't actually like how bands sat flush visually.

Here is the side....the bridge going across the top of my finger was <1mm thick, and painfully cut into my skin. I hated the way it felt, although I am more sensitive than most and my fingers swell easily (the ring was NOT too tight). I didn't catch the thinness in the CADs and I had requested that the shank not be thinner than 2mm...



David Klass made the semi bezel! It is a lot more comfortable for me and I love it....but who knows, maybe I will reset it one day!

Hope that helps!