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Buying a home on interest only

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Date: 7/28/2005 10:46:54 AM
Author: coconut

We are in the market for a house in DC/VA area... the hottest spot in the nation so they say....
The prices went up 50% in the past 2 years!!!

However, if anyone was following lately,
Alan Greenspan announced that the housing prices in the Us are OVER inflated....
I heard that there is a great possiblity of an estimate of 6-8% decrease in price by the end of the year in certain cities: #1 being Boston MA, next being many of the ocean front properties in CA. By next year, the decrease will impact other major cities...

Now... in my opinion an 8% decrease in housing prices doesn't really sound like much compared to the rapid increase..... Also, this must not necessarily mean that the housing prices won't go up anymore now does it?? Perhaps this will be a window of opportunity for ppl for people in the market??



Also, if you can afford to pay for a house in full..... would you? or still mortgage and invest the money somewhere else?
i think there will be more than a 8% decrease in the over inflated areas.once people start to default on these 0 down IO loans. the banks will get stuck with all these over inflated houses and have no choice but to sell it at a loss.

would i pay cash for a house?.....it all depends on your age.if i'm over 55 and planing on retire soon,then the answer is YES. if i'm in my 30's,then the answer is NO.
 
Date: 7/28/2005 10:46:54 AM
Author: coconut



Also, if you can afford to pay for a house in full..... would you? or still mortgage and invest the money somewhere else?
I think many factors enter into this. Age? Income? Stability of income, etc. We could pay off both our houses. Looking at the numbers, the opportunity costs involved & tax credits, it makes no sense. Our 15 year mortgage is about 4.5%. Even our CD''s are getting 4+%.

Also, one needs to look at ratio to other investments. Makes no sense be house poor.
 
Date: 7/27/2005 8:39:06 PM
Author: perry
I persononally know 2 people who lost 40-60% of the value of their ''house'' because of declining values and that they had to change jobs (either to a lower paying job, or to another state).

While most morgtages are affected by such things (for example, if the plant I work at closes housing value in the local area will severely plumet, and my job would be over); interest only loans put you in a far worse situation.

They are not for me.

Perry
Perry
40-60%
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where they live? in mars?
 
I think the big thing to remember with any type of loan, is to make sure you don''t get in over your head. Whether it be IO or conventional fixed rate, it''s important to look at your cash flow and make sure you have enough cash reserves to handle the worst case scenarios.

Some folks have mentioned job loss as a reason not to get an IO loan, job loss would screw over anybody, regardless of the loan. With either loan the first thing a smart financial planner would do is check to see how much cash you have in reserves. Could you handle the payments being without a job for at least 3 months? If the answer is no, then buying that home wasn''t a good idea to begin with, regardless of the loan.

If it''s a single industry town, then you''re pretty much living on borrowed time anyways and buying a house there with either type of loan was a poor decision. Just remember, bubble''s only pop when everyone tries to sell. If your city relies on one industry and that industry tanks, everyone will try to sell and that''s when you''ll see that bubble pop. Places like DC don''t rely on one industry. Right now there really is no reason that we''d see a mass exodus from the DC area hence it''s unlikely the DC area will bust.

IO loans are actually very helpful for people who want to get a jump on building their equity. You are able to put more upfront money into the principle by virtue of the lower interest rate. I can put an extra 300 bucks to the principle each month with an IO loan when compared to a higher rate fixed mortgage.

Just remember, home ownership is a long term investement. In 30 yrs, your home will gain in value guaranteed. The idea is ride thru any ''busts''. Don''t worry about short term dips and droops, the idea is to ride thru them. Just remember to take an honest look at your finances and really check to see if you can handle any emergencies or disasters that may occur.
 
Date: 7/28/2005 4:59:35 PM
Author: Nachoman

If it''s a single industry town, then you''re pretty much living on borrowed time anyways and buying a house there with either type of loan was a poor decision. Just remember, bubble''s only pop when everyone tries to sell. If your city relies on one industry and that industry tanks, everyone will try to sell and that''s when you''ll see that bubble pop. Places like DC don''t rely on one industry. Right now there really is no reason that we''d see a mass exodus from the DC area hence it''s unlikely the DC area will bust.

when the hurricane hits,there is nowhere to hide.it''s just matter of how much it will go down in your area.


IO loans are actually very helpful for people who want to get a jump on building their equity. You are able to put more upfront money into the principle by virtue of the lower interest rate. I can put an extra 300 bucks to the principle each month with an IO loan when compared to a higher rate fixed mortgage.

you can do that with a fixed rate mortgage too. remember, fixed rate is not going to stay low forever.
 
Date: 7/28/2005 6:29:24 PM
Author: Dancing Fire

Date: 7/28/2005 4:59:35 PM
Author: Nachoman

If it''s a single industry town, then you''re pretty much living on borrowed time anyways and buying a house there with either type of loan was a poor decision. Just remember, bubble''s only pop when everyone tries to sell. If your city relies on one industry and that industry tanks, everyone will try to sell and that''s when you''ll see that bubble pop. Places like DC don''t rely on one industry. Right now there really is no reason that we''d see a mass exodus from the DC area hence it''s unlikely the DC area will bust.

when the hurricane hits,there is nowhere to hide.it''s just matter of how much it will go down in your area.


IO loans are actually very helpful for people who want to get a jump on building their equity. You are able to put more upfront money into the principle by virtue of the lower interest rate. I can put an extra 300 bucks to the principle each month with an IO loan when compared to a higher rate fixed mortgage.

you can do that with a fixed rate mortgage too. remember, fixed rate is not going to stay low forever.
I guess I''d be curious what you''d think would cause a massive sell off of real estate. People who are predicting a nationwide collapse are ignoring what actually causes a collapse. Bubble''s don''t pop unless everyone tries to sell at the same time. Rates rising and mortgage forclosures? perhaps, but a 1/4 point increase means a 1000 dollar per year interest increase on a 400k home. Significant? yes. Will an extra 1k per year in expenses cause calamity? In my household, no way. if someone can''t handle a 1k per year increase in expenses they have no business being in that home, period.

Fixed rate loans start with higher interest rate initially than an IO loan. Hence you are spending more money on interest, which could be going into the principle. Hence you can initially put more money towards the principle. For a fixed dollar amount per month, more of that money will go into the principle when compared with a fixed rate mortgage. Not to mention the fact that IO loans STILL haven''t caught up with 30yr fixed rates. Folks have had several years of paying significantly less money towards interest, and more towards principle.
 
Date: 7/28/2005 4:59:35 PM
Author: Nachoman

If it''s a single industry town, then you''re pretty much living on borrowed time anyways and buying a house there with either type of loan was a poor decision. Just remember, bubble''s only pop when everyone tries to sell. If your city relies on one industry and that industry tanks, everyone will try to sell and that''s when you''ll see that bubble pop. Places like DC don''t rely on one industry. Right now there really is no reason that we''d see a mass exodus from the DC area hence it''s unlikely the DC area will bust.
So this week, I want to say on Tuesday, when I was driving into work, they had on the local radio news, that the DC market (just since you used that as the example) had drastically slowed and houses werent selling and blahblahblah and the analysts were all shocked. It had to be a pretty major drop for it to make the news in Chicago. I dont know all the details, but my bf who is still otu there confirmed that he was listening to that on the news that day too. I should''ve looked for an article, but I didnt think of it at the time.

I feel like everyone around me is buying. I''ve looked, but I don''t really want to buy yet....and all this mortgage & what-if market talk stresses me out too much
3.gif
I think that''s a sign that I''m just not ready for all of that yet.
 
It''s important to realize that the slowing down of the market doesn''t mean it''s going to crash. Just about every bubble market is slowing down and plateuing, which is perfectly fine and expected. I think what the big debate is about, is whether the market will actually crash or not. IMO, it won''t. Just the simple fact that if we see 400k homes suddenly go for 200k, everyone will start buying again and prices will start to rise again. We may see a 10% downturn which is perfectly fine. will you lose 40% of your equity though? Probably not.
 
Date: 7/28/2005 10:23:28 PM
Author: Nachoman
It's important to realize that the slowing down of the market doesn't mean it's going to crash. Just about every bubble market is slowing down and plateuing, which is perfectly fine and expected. I think what the big debate is about, is whether the market will actually crash or not. IMO, it won't. Just the simple fact that if we see 400k homes suddenly go for 200k, everyone will start buying again and prices will start to rise again. We may see a 10% downturn which is perfectly fine. will you lose 40% of your equity though? Probably not.
of course not suddenly, the first 10% drop will be really quick and then it will drift down maybe 5% a year for several years to come. i'll give you an example: the houses around us that had asking price of 500K 6 months ago. the owner would get offers like 520K (20k over asking price). that same house today, the owner would be lucky to get offers of 480K (20k under asking price). there is a difference of 40K from it's high.
 
Real estate around here in the BayArea will most likely slow down as it has started to do in other areas, but it will rise again, ESPECIALLY in areas where it's very desirable to live like this area. Amazingly enough, everyone always seems to want to come to California even though it's so expensive. I was born and raised in the Bay and even when things have gone down in the past, even in a bust like the last one in early 90's, they always rise again and somehow it seems the bubbles always get bigger.
20.gif
 
Date: 7/28/2005 10:23:28 PM
Author: Nachoman
It''s important to realize that the slowing down of the market doesn''t mean it''s going to crash. Just about every bubble market is slowing down and plateuing, which is perfectly fine and expected. I think what the big debate is about, is whether the market will actually crash or not. IMO, it won''t. Just the simple fact that if we see 400k homes suddenly go for 200k, everyone will start buying again and prices will start to rise again. We may see a 10% downturn which is perfectly fine. will you lose 40% of your equity though? Probably not.
I understand that, it just seemed to suggest that houses in DC weren''t going for what they were askign for and sitting on the market for long periods of time now. I wasnt claiming it was crashing, I just thought it was interesting because people always talk of the DC area as being a pretty hot market. I don''t think DC has a normal market, I think it is cyclical based on the elections though.

In 2000, my dad planned to buy me a house in DC for college, he told me recently it would''ve been financed through an IO mortgage when we were exploring my options for a condo around here. We looked for a while at some great places, but ultimately he didn''t like anything too much and I was leaning toward living on campus freshman year to meet people, so it was put off a year. After a year, I had figured out I''d be gone half of soph. and most of jr year abroad, so it didnt make sense really...if I had stayed in DC, it would''ve been a great thing for him, he probably would''ve made some money back on it. I don''t know the numbers, but he claimed the payments would''ve been less than he paid in my rent while I was there, and then you factor in the rent I''d have gotten from roommates. Just for a reference, I paid 1500.mo to park and share a two bedroom converted into a 3 bedroom, and while I wasnt in the cheap buildings I definitely was not in the nicest one. I could totally see in a situation like that how an IO would be great. It must''ve worked because through out my years there I met quite a few students who''s parents had bought them places for while they were at school and now I''m thinking a lot of them used that method. I know little about mortgages, and at first I was reading all these horrible things, but I think its just about being educated about your options and choices.

Btw, people sure like to talk about housing issues on here
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Housing & food.
 
Date: 7/29/2005 12:23:15 AM
Author: Dancing Fire
of course not suddenly, the first 10% drop will be really quick and then it will drift down maybe 5% a year for several years to come. i''ll give you an example: the houses around us that had asking price of 500K 6 months ago. the owner would get offers like 520K (20k over asking price). that same house today, the owner would be lucky to get offers of 480K (20k under asking price). there is a difference of 40K from it''s high.

Well, I think what you are describing is more a market correction rather than a crash. Housing prices dropping by 5% a year really isn''t a big deal, it''s not the type of drop that will cause people to lose the the shirt off their back. I think (correct me if I''m wrong) that initial worry was that you''d get into a house one month, and another month later you''d have to sell at a 25% loss (400k down to 300k). Houses in DC and other hot markets are sitting longer which is actually a good thing, since that''s the way housing markets ''normally'' operate. We''re settling back down into a normal real estate market. Houses spend a couple months on market instead of a week. Sign of a bust? Not really, it''s just a sign of the market cooling to it''s normal state.

Also bear in mind that it''s hard to lump all of these ''hot'' cities together (even though I have). You have some markets cooling, while others are still rising. San diego for instance is still going up, albeit at a slower pace. It would take a huge job sector to crash to bring all these markets down at once. Something like the aerospace industry collapse of the 90''s, that was the main contributer to the real estate crash in the 90''s. Suddenly you had all these people out of work, trying to sell their homes to chase jobs in other areas. Currently, there isn''t any industry that is that vulnerable. Basically the only trouble spot right now is gas prices, but that''s chump change for most people. I guess what I''m saying is that I''m not sold on the doomsday crash scenario quite yet. It would be nice to suddenly see that nice new 4 bedroom home with a big front yard to suddenly cost only 200k again, but it''s unrealistic to think that it will actually happen.
 
Date: 7/29/2005 2:19:03 AM
Author: Nachoman


Date: 7/29/2005 12:23:15 AM
Author: Dancing Fire
of course not suddenly, the first 10% drop will be really quick and then it will drift down maybe 5% a year for several years to come. i'll give you an example: the houses around us that had asking price of 500K 6 months ago. the owner would get offers like 520K (20k over asking price). that same house today, the owner would be lucky to get offers of 480K (20k under asking price). there is a difference of 40K from it's high.

Well, I think what you are describing is more a market correction rather than a crash. Housing prices dropping by 5% a year really isn't a big deal, it's not the type of drop that will cause people to lose the the shirt off their back. I think (correct me if I'm wrong) that initial worry was that you'd get into a house one month, and another month later you'd have to sell at a 25% loss (400k down to 300k). Houses in DC and other hot markets are sitting longer which is actually a good thing, since that's the way housing markets 'normally' operate. We're settling back down into a normal real estate market. Houses spend a couple months on market instead of a week. Sign of a bust? Not really, it's just a sign of the market cooling to it's normal state.
5% a yr really isn't a big deal........it all depends on how many yrs of 5% drop.

25% drop in one month?......impossible

Houses spend a couple months on market instead of a week......first sign of a market reversal.in a real hot market,houses would be sold, even before the for sale sign hits the front yard.

i don't understand
33.gif
what's wrong if the bubble burst? a young couple would able to buy a home at a much cheaper price and for those couples that are looking to upgrade their home would able to buy their dream home at a much cheaper price. so what's wrong with that?
 
Date: 7/29/2005 3:48:34 AM
Author: Dancing Fire
5% a yr really isn''t a big deal........it all depends on how many yrs of 5% drop.

25% drop in one month?......impossible

Houses spend a couple months on market instead of a week......first sign of a market reversal.in a real hot market,houses would be sold, even before the for sale sign hits the front yard.

i don''t understand
33.gif
what''s wrong if the bubble burst? a young couple would able to buy a home at a much cheaper price and for those couples that are looking to upgrade their home would able to buy their dream home at a much cheaper price. so what''s wrong with that?
Continuous 5% drops also isn''t a crash, nor is it that bad either. The market is basically correcting to it''s equilibrium point. The only downside is that people won''t be able to harness as much of their equity. At some point it will stabilize around a pricepoint people are willing to buy at. We''ve already seen that that pricepoint is fairly high, the only occurance that would make that change is something like an industry collapse like I mentioned earlier. Bubble''s don''t pop willy nilly.

Sure it''s a market reversal, but it''s a reversal back to normalcy, not a reversal towards chaos. Market''s cool off, that''s a given. But will it crash, doubtful. There''s a big distinction there. There''s nothing wrong with buying a home at a cheaper price, I just don''t see it happening anytime soon. Having the bubble burst would basically sink the whole economy into a recession. Those couples looking to buy dream homes likely won''t have jobs to support that cheap house.
 
From my perspective being heavy into the tech world since I got out of college here in the BayArea, if this housing market was going to crash it would have done so at the time in 2000 when companies were tanking and people were hugely out of jobs. For every friend who kept their job, I had 2 friends who lose theirs. I lost my job a few times, kept myself afloat by consulting, but there were friends who were not from here who had to leave and fly home and live with their parents. The housing market did falter a bit and things did not move much for a year or two.

But in 2003 and 2004 things really started coming back. Now jobs are booming again, I am on a local job list for marketing and tech jobs and there are something like 75-100 new jobs that come through there a day. All for local BayArea tech company. People are coming back into this area from out of state. The housing marketing is again booming.

To me (and I am not an expert, only by living here)...if jobs were down and people were losing money like sieves thanks to the stock market...that is when the housing market would tank too. But there were people who were not related to tech and/or those who were more wise about not speculating on their stock options who were able to keep going, I read something like BMW sales did not fall in 2000-2003 as much as you would expect, etc. Some people had money and some didn''t. The housing market faltered a bit but came back even stronger.

Now that people are once again flocking to the BayArea for tech jobs, they need places to live. Because of this odd push and pull that this area always has, people may leave but they will always come back...I don''t see the bubble here BURSTING out of control. Sure I could see some small market corrections. But now that people have their jobs back and things are getting more stable and you don''t have to stay at a company because there''s no other job out there, I only see things going up. Or stabilizing.

In terms of why it''s bad....I don''t think it would be so horrible for the market to correct itself over a period of years. We aren''t going anywhere anytime soon anyway...or so we think. It''s not a win win for us regardless anyway because we are now IN the market, so if we sold, we''d reap a large windfall but we couldn''t afford the next step up in house because it would be over a million dollars. At the very least, we''d have our 20% down. But a much larger mortgage. But if the market fell, we''d sell at a smaller gain and therefore get into a cheaper house but with a smaller gain. Really the only people who woudl benefit from a market correction or a series of them would be those waiting to get into the market and who have already been priced out.
 
many of us will agree with you...being able to pick up property after the crash is exactly how some made fortunes in real estate.

peace, movie zombie
 
Date: 8/26/2005 11:55:18 PM
Author: SanDiegoLady
I live in San Diego, there are thousands of new houses being built and an incredible amount of them were sold just that way. We could NEVER afford the houses that are being built here now. The median home price is 500k, for a standard not real fancy on a small lot house. Its bloody ridiculous. My house in Washington is (for my standards 1900 sq ft) large and on a huge lot with a view of the Olympic mountains.. cost me 179k just a few years ago.. So many of the houses here in REALLY BAD gang areas are going for 450k for a 1100 sq ft. house! EW!

I hate to say it, and I have been since the big bang here, but when these people start losing thier houses, we will be able to afford to get one in foreclosure. People here want mini-mansions but cant afford to pay for them. Its sad. I just want a house that isnt so close to my neighbors that I can shake hands out the window, yanno? I'm not used to how close these are here.

M
7 yrs from now the Ca housing market will be a lot cheaper than what it is today.


Sad, sad, sad.. I have a friend who's son's balloon house payment is 2500. What the heck is he going to do when the interest kicks in?

he's not alone.i think something like 38% of the first time home buyers are in the same shoes.sad but true.
 
There were some interesting points given by Alan Greenspan.
http://today.reuters.com/news/newsChannel.aspx?type=businessNews
http://money.cnn.com/2005/08/27/news/newsmakers/greenspan_housing.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes

We've made the decision to come back to the Bay area. So after getting downsized late 2002, living back in the Midwest for 2.5 years, we're back where we started from. We're not in San Jose anymore, but we're in the East Bay area (cities east of San Francisco. Here were our observations. Our real estate agent was touting the interest only loans, but I think we will stay clear of them for several reasons due to declining prices here and the start of stagnant houses that remain on the market for over several weeks and several months now. From red hot and soaring prices a couple of months ago, we're seeing some dips.

First and second house we bid on, we were outbid. First house we gave the asking price, and we were outbid probably about 10%. Second house, we put in $25,000 on top of asking price, and we were still outbid. Third house was reduced $30,000, and it was being sold in an "as is" condition. We reduced it another $20,000. The seller came back and wanted $10,000 more. Looking at the market, we declined to accept their counter offer. When we made the offer we were the only ones making the offer. We knew about the overwhelming interest of the first two homes we bid on because they were bankruptcy houses that were underpriced to begin with for a quick sell. So the first two homes that we bid on had at least a dozen other bids. This third house had no bids except for us. We only liked it because of the square footage and seeing that this was not an upgrade type of house. It already had four bedrooms and two baths which was suitable for us since we're thinking of starting a family. There were some termite damages that the seller didn't want to take care of, and we assumed we would take care of it if they accepted our price. Unfortunately, I guess they still wanted more money, and by that time we decided to wait it out. Then somebody told us that they bet the owners are kicking themselves right now because they needed that money for a new house that they are building in another city closeby. Anyway, I don't regret our decision since I've been seeing houses drop in price from $10,000 to over $50,000. I think sellers need to watch their need for greed since it seems like most buyers can't afford the price that they are asking and are out priced. So the sellers either a) be willing to wait longer for a qualified buyer or b) drop their asking price for their house. I guess we'll see what happens...
 
JG, you''re savvy real estate shoppers....but then you''ve lived in the bay area before and are ''experienced''. good luck.

peace, movie zomibe
 
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