Can I get some feedback on this rough please?

[jbkhere]

Hi all! I'm thinking of having something cut. You know my big stupid indecision on amethyst? Well I finally realized that I was being dumb and am trying to get serious now. So a cutter sent me a picture of this rough - I have NO ability to decipher what this may look like once cut - can you? I'm hoping for a yummy flashy blue-y amethyst. Thanks all!!

 

[cm366]

Hey jbkhere - have followed your various quests with interest, can't wait to see what you come up with from this one! Unfortunately, evaluating rough from a picture is even harder than evaluating cut stones, and most cutters will tell you that even with the rough in hand they're rarely certain of just how a stone will turn out. If you're buying rough online, you need LOTS of pictures, showing the stone backlit, on a piece of white paper with a unidirectional light shining on it to evaluate whether the stone allows colour to pass through, and ideally also immersed to help you spot deep inclusions. In darker stones like fine amethyst or stones with surface 'rind', you may not be able to tell whether there's something nasty waiting deep inside.

The only way I'd recommend buying rough online is if you're buying from a cutter whose evaluation you know to be reliable. Even then you're taking much more of a gamble than if you'd purchased cut, but at least you have some confidence in the good faith and skill of the person evaluating the stone. For example, I recently got what I think is some nice rough from Barrett, who used to post here as Amguy. This stone and its cousins have what I think is great colour, but we both agreed that it was impossible to tell (despite his diligent efforts in taking 4-6 photos per rock - Sorry buddy!) much about their clarity from the photos, and he was reluctant to give a firm opinion even with the stones in hand and tools to do all the tests described above.

That said, there's a special feeling to buying rough and getting it cut, which I know I enjoy, and some forum members (I'm thinking of you, Arkteia, as well as Zeolite...) have snared mindblowing pieces this way. I'd suggest you ask around lapidaries whose skills you trust and see if any of them will hunt with you, either in person if you're close enough or online, just to get a better idea of what you're seeking. I can recommend one or two less-established but talented cutters if you're interested, as I've found that more well known vendors tend to be understandably less willing to spend time searching for stones when they could be cutting for a profit.

FWIW, the one thing you can evaluate in rough pictures *about* as reliably as you can in cut stones is the colour of the stone. Unless it's very heavily zoned, which this doesn't appear to be, the piece in your pic looks like it'll yield a nice rich purple. I don't see any blue flash, but that like any transient effect will be difficult to see in the rough, especially when we don't know the conditions under which the photo was taken.

Sorry for the long post - hope some of it helps and that you find a great stone!

 

[chrono]

I doubt anyone can tell how that rough is going to turn out either. It needs to be backlit to get some idea of colouration, inclusions and their locations plus other angles. CM wrote a pretty thorough explanation about the pros and cons of doing it your way. It is quite risky.

 

[ChrisA222]

JBK,

I am no help in buying rough....but, its important to note that (correct me if I am wrong), the locations known for the blue component are JXR and Zambia. I do not believe many of the other common sources (Brazil,Bolivia,Uraguay, or even Four Peaks) offer the blue. I know Four Peaks is known for Red, as is Uraguay.

Ive heard its hit or miss with Bolivian or Brazillian stones...some can be heated to color.

Good luck whatever you do!

 

[jbkhere]

Thank you CM, Chrono & Chris! As always, I appreciate your you're sharing your knowledge with me!

From what I've read, I'd love some Zambian or JXR but there just doesn't seem to be much available. This rough I posted is Uruguayan. CM - the color on your rough looks amazing to me! I would actually love some recommendations on cutters because I do understand most of the well known cutters want to spend their time cutting the rough they've got. **edited by moderator. please do not promote your own sales outside of preloved** Can you give me a ball park idea of what I should expect to pay for a fine color ammy? Lets say I can find Zambian or JXR (I'm assuming these to be pretty much the "top" end - please correct me if I'm wrong) what should I expect to pay for a finished say 3 carat stone (again - I'm ballparking finished size based on the dimensions needed for my pear) $50/ct? $100/ct? Am I way way off?

Chris - I agree with JXR & Zambian for blue flash (totally based only on what I've read on PS) but I've also seen several posts regarding Uruguayan as having blue or blue & red. Or is that a rarity that will just add to this big gamble I'm on?

Thanks all!!

 

[chrono]

The blue versus red are just different flavours of amethysts. I have not seen the Uruguay material show blue flash, only red. Sometimes, this red flash is referred to as the old Siberian colour as it was highly prized historically.

 

[jbkhere]

The blue versus red are just different flavours of amethysts. I have not seen the Uruguay material show blue flash, only red. Sometimes, this red flash is referred to as the old Siberian colour as it was highly prized historically.

Thanks Chrono! So as Chris pointed out - its just JXR or Zambian that I'll have to hope for if I want blue flash? Or are there any others I should consider?

 

[chrono]

My personal preference is JXR because I've not seen any nice Zambian material lately.

 

[LD]

You need Amguy's input on this - he's the amethyst expert and knows his rough too! I can't recall what his new name is on here - if you can find it put a shout out to him. Alternatively I know he does frequent another coloured gemstone website that a number of us are on and it might be worth popping along there. There's also a PM facility on that forum so you could send him a note.

 

[bobsiv]

It may not be as pronounced, but fine Uruguayan material will show blue.

 

[LD]

It may not be as pronounced, but fine Uruguayan material will show blue.

I'm very glad you've posted that photo as I have a Uruguayan Amethyst that has blue! I don't believe it's a phenomenon solely from some of the locations mentioned above - I believe that it's dependent on the saturation and tone not a locality issue.

 

[cm366]

It's definitely not unique to those sites, but it's much less common from other localities and I have to think it'd be hard(er) to ID in the rough. I have a couple of Nigerian stones that show great blue...

Amguy's new name is Barrett, but I haven't seen him post much recently. Will get in touch with the OP with some contact info...

 

[chrono]

It may not be as pronounced, but fine Uruguayan material will show blue.

Gorgeous!

 

[jbkhere]

CM, Chrono & LD - thank you!

bobsiv - wowowowowoww!!!!!! Love that stone!!! Just beautiful!

 

[beau-wy]

I'm pretty sure Barrett is off on an amethyst mining adventure, so it may be a while for him to respond.

 

[chrono]

Barrett was here earlier to today but I think he missed this thread. I hope he sees this one sooner rather than later.

 

[gsellis]

I have cut of few amethyst and can tell you that the picture tells nothing about the stone. It is just too dark, not enough definition, and it needs to be handled. I can hold piece in my hand, and unless I am turning it in the light, I am not able to see all the issues with the stones. Many times there are cracks along the zone lines that will make a cut fall apart unless you avoid them. There can be bubbles. There can be a bunch of issues and none of them may show up in a picture.

 

[jbkhere]

I have cut of few amethyst and can tell you that the picture tells nothing about the stone. It is just too dark, not enough definition, and it needs to be handled. I can hold piece in my hand, and unless I am turning it in the light, I am not able to see all the issues with the stones. Many times there are cracks along the zone lines that will make a cut fall apart unless you avoid them. There can be bubbles. There can be a bunch of issues and none of them may show up in a picture.

Thank you George! That was kinda what I was thinking too - but what do I know?? So I'm glad to hear a cutter's thoughts...Thanks! Its just as well - I'm pretty confident I want to do this pear with JXR. Now if only I could find some