Casey Anthony trial...

[JewelFreak]

What I think is probably going to happen to validate Baez's opening states is he'll either produce one juicy bombshell that will leave us all shocked. OR never mention it again. He doesn't have to back up his claims, and the prosecution can't touch him if he doesn't.

Baez has objected to nearly every bit of evidence and has asked for a mistrial on numerous occasions, all of which has been denied by this judge, If he can strategically bait the prosecution into even questioning the validity of his claims or remark on not having had those claims backed up...BAM...mistrial.

we all still really remember his opening statement. The prosecution, if they want to negate that, has to in some fashion acknowledge it and speak up against it...otherwise, it's still there, festering and raising reasonable doubt if the jury follows the letter of the law.

The prosecution CAN mention Baez's contention of abuse even if Baez does not. In closing statements they can say, "Defense's opening statement claims Casey was abused. They presented nothing to back that up. Where's the evidence? She admits she lied & lied about other stuff. What would make anyone believe her on that without corroboration?" It would be devastating.

To get the abuse in evidence & not just ignore it, they have to call witnesses to attest to it. Surely George Anthony again, and he will say NO I NEVER ABUSED HER. The brother too. Likely to be believable since the jury knows Casey never tells the truth when a lie will get her something. Did she ever tell a friend? Did her doctors throughout her life find anything to arouse suspicion? I doubt they can prove it through a dr. because the allegation is not true. Very hard to put that over without putting Casey on the stand.

Here's how they might try it: on cross examination, opposing counsel is allowed to ask ONLY about the witness's statements during direct examination. Baez could keep his questioning VERY narrow -- confined to alleged abuse & not a word about anything else. Then the prosecutor could not ask, say, about the chloroform computer searches or any other subjects if Casey didn't bring them up. However, if the witness says ANYTHING relating to some other issue, it opens the door for opposing counsel to refute it. The big danger: Casey can't keep her mouth shut. She embroiders stories, makes them elaborate. Bound to open some door for further questioning on a subject the defense doesn't want her to testify on, that will show she's baaaad. It will be interesting to see how Baez deals with all this.

--- Laurie

 

[Upgradable]

They are now showing multiple heart shaped stickers found in the search of Casey Anthony's room! These are consistent with the sticky heart shaped residue found on the duct tape that was adhered to the hair and skull of Caylee Anthony.

Talk about the nail in the coffin!!!

 

[Italiahaircolor]

YES!!! I am away from so I'll watch recaps tonight!

 

[Upgradable]

And, to me, it really seems like Baez doesn't know what he's doing. He doesn't know court processes and can't phrase a question in a manner that is appropriate.

 

[lizzyann]

They are now showing multiple heart shaped stickers found in the search of Casey Anthony's room! These are consistent with the sticky heart shaped residue found on the duct tape that was adhered to the hair and skull of Caylee Anthony.

Talk about the nail in the coffin!!!

Holy Crap! I'm three days behind in watching the coverage! I need to catch up!!!!

 

[Upgradable]

They put Cindy Anthony back on the stand to link the Winnie the Pooh blanket, the laundry bag, and the tape to their home and when the last time was that she'd seen them.

This poor woman.....

 

[Italiahaircolor]

The shorts revelation is interesting...

But I'm not sure HOW it's interesting. I have to think about this one...

 

[JewelFreak]

And, to me, it really seems like Baez doesn't know what he's doing. He doesn't know court processes and can't phrase a question in a manner that is appropriate.

Yeah, Uppy, I was thinking the same thing. He's kind of bumbling along. Witnesses don't understand his questions half the time.

Casey looked annoyed & petulant all afternoon. When they had up the photos of Caylee all happy with her mom, Cindy stared at them during a sidebar but Casey never gave them a glance. I can't imagine she's not a goner. Good riddance.

Do you folks think if she's convicted that she'll get the death penalty? I kind of doubt it -- it's handed down so rarely in family killings. I'd rather see her get life w/out parole -- only because a death sentence would completely destroy Cindy.

--- Laurie

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Baez, IMO, isn't equipped to try a case of the magnitude. He was the local go to guy for petty criminals, DUI's and theft and whatever...his office was next to a bail bonds place. Casey found his name from other inmates. He's not the death penalty attorney I would choose, that's for sure. His constant asking for a mistrial is getting old. Every single day. Obviously JP is going the distance on this one, he's not letting Baez or Casey off the hook. Nor should he. Baez needs to understand that instead of asking for one repeatedly and trying to get out of finishing this, he should just focus on trying the case.

I don't think she'll get death. She should, but she won't. The evidence, while compelling and strong, isn't enough to put her on death row. The jury, actually, isn't even working with all the facts. Never once was the issued raised at there was a HUGE knock down, drag out fight between Cindy and Casey the night prior to Caylee's disappearance (Cindy put Casey up against a wall, hands around the throat calling her a bad mother). There's also the missing fact the fact Casey never really wanted Caylee and considered adoption and blamed her mother for the decision to keep Caylee. All of that is the "premeditation" required for murder one to stick, and the premeditation is what the jury would need to put Casey on DR in good conscious...the state never approached that, never presented it. Outside of the computer searches, can anyone really think of one example they showed of premeditation? I can't. They worked the timeline and the findings--period, end of story.

I still can't wrap my head around the shorts...any theories or thoughts? I am still trying to make that make sense. Why would Caylee be in 24mo clothes when she was a 3T?

 

[Upgradable]

You don't suppose she'll get an appeal for inadequate representation?

 

[Italiahaircolor]

You don't suppose she'll get an appeal for inadequate representation?

Actually, I'd be surprised if she did.

Baez is a fool. But, 2nd chair is Chaney Mason. Mason is pretty well respected...

1. He is currently is rated as an "AV" lawyer (the highest possible rating) by Martindale Hubbell, and is listed in the Bar Register of Preeminent Lawyers.

2.The press has also conferred upon Cheney special recognition for his skills, reputation, and expertise as a lawyer by naming him as a "Top Lawyer" on numerous occasions. He has been profiled in Orlando Magazine as one of the Attorneys You Can Trust, Six of Orlando's Legal Legends.

3.In 2004, he was awarded the Robert C. Heeney Memorial Award by the National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers. This is "NACDL's most prestigious award given annually to one criminal defense attorney who best exemplifies the goals and values of the Association and the legal profession."

(the above taken directly from his professional website)

If 2nd Chair is taken into consideration when deciding if counsel was adequate, then Casey will have an uphill battle fighting against those credentials.

 

[steph72276]

Italia, what was the shorts thing? A ton of babies can wear smaller clothes. My son was on the smaller side and could still wear some 24 months when he was 3 and even was still wearing some 3T when he was 5.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Italia, what was the shorts thing? A ton of babies can wear smaller clothes. My son was on the smaller side and could still wear some 24 months when he was 3 and even was still wearing some 3T when he was 5.

Baez brought it up during the cross of Cindy.

Caylee was discovered in clothing that was "too small" for her...she was wearing a 3T at the time of her death. Baez, I think, was hinting that whomever (George) took Caylee from the home didn't know her well enough to dress her in properly fitting clothes. Basically saying that, as her mother, Casey would have at least known to dress Caylee in properly fitting clothes.

 

[steph72276]

Italia, what was the shorts thing? A ton of babies can wear smaller clothes. My son was on the smaller side and could still wear some 24 months when he was 3 and even was still wearing some 3T when he was 5.

Baez brought it up during the cross of Cindy.

Caylee was discovered in clothing that was "too small" for her...she was wearing a 3T at the time of her death. Baez, I think, was hinting that whomever (George) took Caylee from the home didn't know her well enough to dress her in properly fitting clothes. Basically saying that, as her mother, Casey would have at least known to dress Caylee in properly fitting clothes.

Oh okay, gotcha. Yeah, that's a major stretch. Casey probably didn't even know or care what size she was anyway.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Well...we have our answer...Cindy is still a staunch supporter of Casey...she mouthed "I love you" when she got off the stand. Casey for her part, turned away.

It's just sick. Sick, sick, sick, sick, sick. How Cindy is still in a place where she can love that monster b***h confounds me. Casey has ruined her family. Love isn't the four letter word I'd waste on that little lying ... never mind, I can't use that word on this site.

 

[JewelFreak]

Bet her grandmother knew what size she was much better than her mother. A comment of Cindy's struck me -- asked about hair length, she said, "I trimmed the ends off every few months to keep her hair healthy." First thought: Why didn't her mother do that? It's the sort of thing mothers do.

Wonder why the prosecution didn't bring up that argument. Seems to me it's indicative -- they could have asked Cindy about it to get it into evidence. If they can do the tattoo, the fight isn't any more irrelevant than that; more relevant maybe.

The shorts is a weird thing. How about this: Casey has decided to get rid of Caylee & she's still angry at her mother. She wants to get the thing over with. Hustles Caylee into clothes, grabbing the first thing that came to hand, the small shorts. Jams her into them (as Caylee complains, no doubt, but Casey wouldn't give a darn anyway), grabs her & rushes out the door. Make sense?

 

[Italiahaircolor]

I like your theory, and it fits for sure...

I also noticed, when I was looking at photo evidence of the case...the outfit Caylee was discovered in was the pink "Big Trouble" outfit. Like most kids clothes, I'm sure it was purchased as a set. This is the same outfit that can be seen in the picture of Caylee with Casey at Ricardo Morales home.

Casey hated a lot of the men in life that had moved on from her...Ricardo Morales being one of them. I think, somewhere during the premeditation of the crime, she may have even been angry enough to get even. She went around telling people Ricardo was still hot and heavy for her, still bothering her to reconcile and hook up. She rejected him...and she said "he didn't like that"....

Don't mothers usually disregard clothing that is too small for their children? Pack it away, sell it, gift it? Why would Casey keep ill fitting clothes at all in daily rotation?

1. It still fit Caylee, despite its size.
2. She was saving it for something.

I think Casey would have liked to, had she not been busted so out of the blue by her mothers ambush, stuck this on someone else. Cindy Anthony testified today that she never saw that outfit and it was never in circulation in home-- she never washed it, dried it, folded it, put it away. Maybe, somewhere along the way, Casey was setting Ricardo up. The outfit was in his home, never hers...she rejected him, he resented her and wanted to hurt her. At face value, it could be plausible. It wouldn't have been the first time a jilted love took out his angst on a child...

But, obviously we know better than to believe that.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Are the chloroform internet searches not evidence of premeditation?

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Are the chloroform internet searches not evidence of premeditation?

Yes. But, is it enough to put somewhere to death? I don't know, that's for the jury to decide. I think she is as guilty as sin, and I think she made those searches and think that Morales (again with the Morales thing) gave her the idea with his Myspace picture.

I would feel more confident in the juries ability to see the facts, that it was clear and dry, if they could prove, without doubt, that Casey did the searches. I believe she did...but will they, and if they do, is it enough?

 

[Upgradable]

Remember that 24 months is 2 years. Caylee was still 2, though about 3 months short of her 3rd birthday. Both of my kids could have easily worn 24 month shorts and 3T shirt. That is one of the least suspicious things to me.

Now, the first heart "sticker" they showed in the yellow box on top of the envelope, they eventually told you it was a sticker backing. Did you see the leftover rim of that sticker? It sure looked like a sparkly vinyl outline, just like the one found at the grave site.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Caylee's friend, who was never called, had sold a story about how when the girls were little, they would apparently bury their dead animals in the makeshift pet cemetery where Caylee's remains were found. The same friend also recalled that they would place "heart stickers on them".

I'm guessing the friend was never called because she sold the story, and there is no real way to put her on the stand looking...unmotivated? Baez could punch holes through that and make her look greedy.

 

[janinegirly]

Like FL Steph pointed out, many parents keep clothes around that are a size smaller if they have a smaller/petite kid. Sometimes the make/brand runs large so a 3 yr old could still fit in 24 month old short - maybe it was a favorite set and the bigger pair was in the laundry and it still fit. This piece of information is a stretch if you ask me. There is plenty of other damning evidence though!

 

[Pandora II]

Is there an online site that follows everything on this story? I'm in the UK and it's not mentioned over here. All I can find are news articles but nowhere that has everything.

Re the clothing - my daughter is 2 and tiny. For some brand's she still wears 12 months, in others she's a 2-3, the average is 12-18 months so it will depend on how the brand and whether they generally run big or small. Clothes also stretch as they are worn. What kind of centile was Caylee? Were the clothes considered actually too small for her or just as having a small size label?

I also find that I'll take some clothes off and think that well it's getting small but she might get another couple of wears out of it and then a couple of weeks later decide it possibly is a bit short/tight etc and move it out of her wardrobe.

The think that keeps sticking in my mind was one the 911 call when they asked why she hadn't called and she said

"I think part of me was naive enough to think I could handle this myself, which obviously I couldn't and I was scared that something would happen to her if I would have notified the authorities…the fear of the unknown, fear of the potential of Caylee getting hurt, of me not seeing my daughter again,"

Why didn't she say 'fear that Caylee will be hurt, that I won't see my daughter again'

The tense she uses just makes me feel that she knew then the kid was dead and I don't buy the swimming pool things at all. Plus even if she had died in the pool - what normal mother would be doing the partying she was. I don't think I'd be capable of doing anything.

 

[steph72276]

I can't believe her lawyer is up there arguing for an acquittal. He can't possibly believe the words that are coming out of his own mouth. What a waste of everyone's time...

 

[Lanie]

Baez, IMO, isn't equipped to try a case of the magnitude. He was the local go to guy for petty criminals, DUI's and theft and whatever...his office was next to a bail bonds place. Casey found his name from other inmates. He's not the death penalty attorney I would choose, that's for sure. His constant asking for a mistrial is getting old. Every single day. Obviously JP is going the distance on this one, he's not letting Baez or Casey off the hook. Nor should he. Baez needs to understand that instead of asking for one repeatedly and trying to get out of finishing this, he should just focus on trying the case.

I don't think she'll get death. She should, but she won't. The evidence, while compelling and strong, isn't enough to put her on death row. The jury, actually, isn't even working with all the facts. Never once was the issued raised at there was a HUGE knock down, drag out fight between Cindy and Casey the night prior to Caylee's disappearance (Cindy put Casey up against a wall, hands around the throat calling her a bad mother). There's also the missing fact the fact Casey never really wanted Caylee and considered adoption and blamed her mother for the decision to keep Caylee. All of that is the "premeditation" required for murder one to stick, and the premeditation is what the jury would need to put Casey on DR in good conscious...the state never approached that, never presented it. Outside of the computer searches, can anyone really think of one example they showed of premeditation? I can't. They worked the timeline and the findings--period, end of story.

I still can't wrap my head around the shorts...any theories or thoughts? I am still trying to make that make sense. Why would Caylee be in 24mo clothes when she was a 3T?

I've been reading this thread, thanks for all of the juiciness girls! I love analyzing cases like this. Bravo to you italia! I agree with whoever said you should have your own Nancy Grace-style show!

I don't think they would admit the fight into court since it shows a degree of volatility on the part of Cindy. Too big of a seed to be planted in the minds of the jurors.

I have to say I'm shocked so many people are tweeting/emailing in to HLN and CNN (where I'm watching coverage) that the prosecution hasn't proved that it was Casey, beyond a reasonable doubt. I guess the internet searches for chloroform, the evidence of decomposition in her trunk, the stickers, and the fact that she didn't report her daughter missing for a long time doesn't ADD UP to beyond a reasonable doubt. Any of those by themselves, maybe, but all put together, I don't see how people still don't think the prosecution has proven that Casey did it.

 

[Lanie]

Also, what do you think about the Bella Vita tattoo? We all obviously know what it means, and that she got it before the body was discovered (right?) so I wonder why that's relevant? Is it that she has a beautiful life now since her child is out of her hair permanently? The tattoo artist was called to the stand, right?

 

[chemgirl]

I have to say I'm shocked so many people are tweeting/emailing in to HLN and CNN (where I'm watching coverage) that the prosecution hasn't proved that it was Casey, beyond a reasonable doubt. I guess the internet searches for chloroform, the evidence of decomposition in her trunk, the stickers, and the fact that she didn't report her daughter missing for a long time doesn't ADD UP to beyond a reasonable doubt. Any of those by themselves, maybe, but all put together, I don't see how people still don't think the prosecution has proven that Casey did it.

I watched a show about how CSI and other crime dramas have made the a prosecutor's job more difficult because the public expects every case to be backed by extremely solid evidence. You know how those shows always wrap everything up in the end so there's no way they have the wrong person. Well now that's what people expect in real life. A defense lawyer can always come up with some far fetched explanation, and apparently juries are starting to have doubt without a load of DNA evidence.

I agree that it looks like she totally did it and I don't see how there could be doubt at this point.

 

[Upgradable]

Also, what do you think about the Bella Vita tattoo? We all obviously know what it means, and that she got it before the body was discovered (right?) so I wonder why that's relevant? Is it that she has a beautiful life now since her child is out of her hair permanently? The tattoo artist was called to the stand, right?

I think that was just incredibly poor judgement. I'm more agast at her partying and renting questionable videos on the night that Caylee was last seen wearing the exact clothing that was found on her remains.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Also, what do you think about the Bella Vita tattoo? We all obviously know what it means, and that she got it before the body was discovered (right?) so I wonder why that's relevant? Is it that she has a beautiful life now since her child is out of her hair permanently? The tattoo artist was called to the stand, right?

I think it goes to her state of mind, priorities and what she was spending her time doing. She was out getting tatted up and having a pizza party while her daughter was missing or dead.

She got the tattoo slightly after Caylee went missing and before she was found. the reason the tattoo fits into the time line when he does is the fact that Casey had scheduled another appointment with a friend to get more tattoo's, which she never made because the Caylee was acknowledged as missing the mess started to get heated. Now, the interesting part of this is that Casey mentioned at the shop, when she was making the second appointments that this time she would be bringing Caylee along.

I think the state presented this to the jury for two reasons...

1. Shows that she was not a grieving, bewildered mother whose child had just died a horrible death. She was carefree and easy going. Living this Bella Vita, and doing exactly what she felt like when she felt like doing it.
2. She DID NOT mention the passing of her daughter, and even said that next time she came in Caylee would be with her.

This was the last time, really, that Casey outwardly acknowledged Caylee as being alive and well. It cinches up the timeline.

Now, another point last evening was brought up...the meaning of the tattoo.

Bella Vita.

We all know what it means. The Prosecution is showing it as this cold, careless act, while the Defense is spinning it to look like a memorial. IMO, the answer is within the wording.

I believe if the tattoo was intended as a memorial, it would say LA BELLA VITA...A Beautiful Life. Specific to Caylee leading A beautiful life. Of course I could never prove this...but, it's my suspicion that if was genuinely done from a place of great, significant loss it would be more direct.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

I can't believe her lawyer is up there arguing for an acquittal. He can't possibly believe the words that are coming out of his own mouth. What a waste of everyone's time...

Ahhh...thats what I call wishful thinking...

The defense, as far as I am aware, has absolutely no case. NONE...100% less factual based evidence that the prosecution. I believe their list includes psychics ... and not just one, multiple psychics.

I know that in the court of law, the burden of proof rests with the prosecution...but in the court of public opinion, the burden is more often than not, with the defense. There may not the proverbial smoking gun, and there may be just a bunch of coincidences, but if the defense cannot rebut those with their own "fact" or "logic" or "reason", then they are doomed. Because I believe, if I were on the jury, I'd
need to see something that could legitimately point me in another direction.