Chartering a jet?

[Rank Amateur]

My family has a reuinion in FLA coming up and there may be 25 or 30 of us leaving from Detroit (or nearby). At what point does it make sense to charter a plane and how does one go about looking into it?

 

[Mara]

Start calling around for pricing etc. Yellow pages or online should help.

 

[fire&ice]

R/A - each airport (try to use the smaller ones - even if you have to drive) has a independent airline. Though sometimes the little jets don't seat as many as you want to carry. I know it's cheaper to fly a few folks on a private plan last minute - I don't know about your amount of passengers though. Also, corporate jets used to rent them to individuals connected to the company (which could be your neighbor works for them). I don't know if they still do this as liability issues may prevent them these days.

Mara's right - call around. But, I would go to your airport and inquire. I have a feeling that getting a "block" rate w/ on a carrier through your travel agency is probably cheaper.

Good luck. I would be interested in your findings.

 

[Rank Amateur]

Wierd thing happened.

Just when I was thinking about walking down to talk to my neighbor's my son excitedly told me that there was fire truck in front of their house. Then an ambulance.

After a while my two oldest came running in to tell me that they had taken Leonard's wife away on a stretcher. We found out later that he had been complaining of a migrane which tragically turned into an anyuerism (sp?) and a stroke.

One of their sons came down and filled us in on what was going on. Such a nice family. Three boys. She's only about 40 or so. Needless to say they have better things to worry about than my charter queries.

They got her into surgery right away and it remains to be seen how she is going to fare long term.

Anyway, I've made a contact at the local small-ish airport and hope to learn more about charter possibilities tomorrow. I have a feeling that it will be in the $20,000 range which will be a bit steep considering commercial fares are in the $250 range.

 

[canadiangrrl]

No good advice to offer on chartering a plane. Just wanted to say that I hope your neighbour is able to recover successfully.

 

[fire&ice]

Oh dear, so young! I hope someone gave her an asprin pronto. Which brings me to point, I always carry uncoated asprin. Not for me, but for someone having a stroke. My older friends have told me that taking an asprin in the first minutes of believed stroke can minimize the ramifications by over 75%. The *un*coated is so you can crush it quickly if the person can not swallow. I'm also a believer in taking a baby asprin or drinking a glass of red wine daily.

R/A - I'd contact a travel agency. Though I rarely use them, they can negociate for a block rate. Also, book early. You may want to try AAA. Good luck & I hope your neighbor is O.K.

 

[fire&ice]

20K sounds expensive. Again, I only know how much the smaller planes cost. I think my husband pays about 750.00 an hour w/ minimum of 4 hours. I'll have to ask him. This is from an individual who owns a plane & has a pilot on retainer. I think your biggest hurdle is the amount of people. Most little jets can't seat more than 25 people - and that's the large ones.

 

[Tali]

----------------
On 11/20/2003 10:00:56 AM fire&ice wrote:

Oh dear, so young! I hope someone gave her an asprin pronto. Which brings me to point, I always carry uncoated asprin. Not for me, but for someone having a stroke. My older friends have told me that taking an asprin in the first minutes of believed stroke can minimize the ramifications by over 75%. The *un*coated is so you can crush it quickly if the person can not swallow. I'm also a believer in taking a baby asprin or drinking a glass of red wine daily.

blockquote>



I mean this in the nicest possible way, but.......


AGH!!! NONONONONO! This is well-intentioned advice, but absolutely WRONG in this case. Never give an aspirin to a stroke victim until after it's determined if the stroke is from a bleed or not. this is determined either by CT scan or MRI. Giving an aspirin to someone with an aneurysm (a weak artery which causes a bleed into or around the brain) could make them WORSE!!!!!

Strokes are caused by one of 3 things: 1) a bleed {of which aneurysm is one potential cause}, 2)an embolism {a clot let loose from the heart, lodged in a vessel in the brain thus blocking blood flow}, or 3) ischemia {loss of blood flow due to hardening of the arteries within the brain itself, or similarly the flecking off of a plaque in the carotid (or other) arteries}. For the latter 2 categories, an aspirin is indicated.

All that being said, many more strokes caused by ischemia, followed by embolism, than there are from bleeds, so an aspirin is USUALLY indicated. The best thing for stroke is to get the patient to the hospital ASAP, preferably within 3 hours of the onset if possible so the maximum can be done for the patient with the minimum brain injury.

R/A, my best to your neighbor's family. F&I, no offense intended, just trying to get the most accurate information out there.

 

[Mara]

What about heart attacks...does the aspirin work for those? I have heard the same thing actually. Doesn't Excedrin do a commercial about that very thing? Someone out playing tennis, gets a stroke or heart attack, falls down, someone grabs Excedrin from the bag, he's okay?

 

[Tali]

----------------
On 11/20/2003 12:55:11 PM Mara wrote:


What about heart attacks...does the aspirin work for those? I have heard the same thing actually. Doesn't Excedrin do a commercial about that very thing? Someone out playing tennis, gets a stroke or heart attack, falls down, someone grabs Excedrin from the bag, he's okay?
----------------

Yes, aspirin for heart attack is DEFINITELY helpful, and should be given ASAP, even if at home. There's no reason not to in that case. No, it won't reverse the heart attack, but it may keep it from getting worse. Again, prompt medical attention is the best bet.

 

[fire&ice]

----------------
On 11/20/2003 12:48:22 PM Tali wrote:

----------------
On 11/20/2003 10:00:56 AM fire&ice wrote:

Which brings me to point, I always carry uncoated asprin. Not for me, but for someone having a stroke.
blockquote>

AGH!!! NONONONONO! This is well-intentioned advice, but absolutely WRONG in this case. Never give an aspirin to a stroke victim until after it's determined if the stroke is from a bleed or not. this is determined either by CT scan or MRI. blockquote>


You are correct in this particular case. I read stroke & did not think it through. I appreciate the clarification; but, I have been told by quite a few stroke victims that their doctor told them that the asprin given within a very short time probably saved them quite a bit of grief.

Please believe me that I am not trying to argue with you. Given the benefits of an asprin just after or during a stroke or heart attack, wouldn't it be a prudent course? If the person was having a bleed stroke, would the symptoms be different? Also, would the asprin have a drastic negative effect on this particular type of stroke.

The stroke victims all credit the expediancy of the administration of asprin to an easier rehabilitation. I understand the "first do no harm" sentiment. But, could the benefits (and I've heard they are quite dramatic) outweigh two things 1. the more rare "bleed" stroke & 2. - you can answer this - the negative effect of asprin on a bleed stroke victim.

I just know in my case, we are at least 1/2 hour travel time just to *get* to a hospital. I've been told (perhaps erroneously) that the sooner the asprin is admin. the better. I know in a friend's case they were near Praque & had no clue to where the closest hospital was & they had a hard time w/ the language barrier.

I guess in simple terms: Can you tell by the symptoms & if not, would the gamble be worth it? Another question, would migraine sufferers be more inclined to have this type of stroke? Or a stroke in general?

Or is this asprin thing a hype? I know our doctor was on board w/ hubby taking an asprin a day. My brother (doctor) & his wife take an asprin a day.

Medical advice is confusing. It seems every day something new contridicts previous findings or recommendations. Especially diet stuff. 10 years ago, meat & fat was considered horrible. Eat all the pasta you want. Now, we know what diets preach. I love my carbs. I don't have a weight problem. I yearn for the good ol' days of guilt free rice & pasta. I guess my savings grace is that I do love fresh fruits & veggies for their flavor alone. I have always loved dark chocolate. Currently, "they" say it's better for you. But, I'm sure the day will come where this too shall be vilified (sp?). Maybe Julia Child has the right idea, "Everything in moderation." Sometimes that's no fun. Also, the latest red wine findings. Could it be that people who drinking red wine are the very same people that enjoy *relaxing* with a fine appreciation of a good thing? Or is it the wine itself? Wow, I better go to the grocery store. I'm confusing myself too much.

I guess at the end of the day - are you saying one should not admin asprin under any circumstances?

 

[winyan]

Hopefully, the person administering aspirin will check first to make sure the ill individual isn't aspirin sensitive, as I am.




Neither I, nor my cousin can take aspirin.




win

 

[Tali]

----------------
On 11/20/2003 2:16:11 PM fire&ice wrote:

----------------

Please believe me that I am not trying to argue with you. Given the benefits of an asprin just after or during a stroke or heart attack, wouldn't it be a prudent course? If the person was having a bleed stroke, would the symptoms be different? Also, would the asprin have a drastic negative effect on this particular type of stroke.




I believe you! Aspirin for heart attack, yes, so long as not allergic as Win points out. An aspirin in this case could/would make the bleed significanlty worse. Usually a bleed causes intense headache before the stroke symptoms appear.

The stroke victims all credit the expediancy of the administration of asprin to an easier rehabilitation. I understand the 'first do no harm' sentiment. But, could the benefits (and I've heard they are quite dramatic) outweigh two things 1. the more rare 'bleed' stroke & 2. - you can answer this - the negative effect of asprin on a bleed stroke victim.

That's a tough call. From the layperson point of view, if you gave an aspirin to someone who is having a stroke, because you think you are doing the right thing for them, but it turned out they had a bleed, you aren't, at least not yet, going to get sued. I'm not a layperson. I am going to get sued if I do this, ergo if a patient presents to an ER with stroke symptoms, and no one is going to give an aspirin until they get the head scan. And waiting for the scan is the right thing to do. As you say, primum non nocere: first do no harm. Aspirin will make the bleed as much worse as it will make the ischemic or embolic stroke better.

I just know in my case, we are at least 1/2 hour travel time just to *get* to a hospital. I've been told (perhaps erroneously) that the sooner the asprin is admin. the better. I know in a friend's case they were near Praque & had no clue to where the closest hospital was & they had a hard time w/ the language barrier.

I guess in simple terms: Can you tell by the symptoms & if not, would the gamble be worth it? Another question, would migraine sufferers be more inclined to have this type of stroke? Or a stroke in general?

Usually, a bleed type stroke is preceeded by an intense headache, as in this person's. If that history is known, then bleed is likely. If unknown, say you just walked in on your grandma that you haven't seen in a week and her left side is paralyzed. You can't know. Is the gamble worth it? In all honesty, the odds are definitely with the aspirin. If there's no help around for a long time, and no hope of getting it, many would go fo the aspirin, but for most of us, being remote is not the case. And fortunatley no, a migraine sufferer is not more prone to a bleed, nor any other stroke. This unfortunate woman's stroke initially mimicked a migraine.

Or is this asprin thing a hype? I know our doctor was on board w/ hubby taking an asprin a day. My brother (doctor) & his wife take an asprin a day.


No, definitely not hype. Aspirin is usually a very good thing. I just get amp'd up when blanket statements are made without the appropriate caveats.

Medical advice is confusing. You are so right! It seems every day something new contridicts previous findings or recommendations. Especially diet stuff. 10 years ago, meat & fat was considered horrible. Eat all the pasta you want. Now, we know what diets preach. I love my carbs. I don't have a weight problem. I yearn for the good ol' days of guilt free rice & pasta. I guess my savings grace is that I do love fresh fruits & veggies for their flavor alone. I have always loved dark chocolate. Currently, 'they' say it's better for you. But, I'm sure the day will come where this too shall be vilified (sp?). Maybe Julia Child has the right idea, 'Everything in moderation.' Sometimes that's no fun. Also, the latest red wine findings. Could it be that people who drinking red wine are the very same people that enjoy *relaxing* with a fine appreciation of a good thing? Or is it the wine itself? Wow, I better go to the grocery store. I'm confusing myself too much.


Actually, it's the alcohol! 2-3 alcoholic beverages a day, of any sort, have been shown to reduce the risk of heart attack and stroke (the non bleed kinds)

I guess at the end of the day - are you saying one should not admin asprin under any circumstances? ----------------

If there's not medical help around then I'd say go with the odds. If there is, I'd wait the 60-90 mins to get the results of the scan to administer the aspirin. That amount of time will not make a huge difference in outcome. And aspirin always for heart attack, unless allergic.

Wow, I hope that made sense, and shows up ok. Preview button's not working for me.....

edited because it was totally illegible........

 

[Rank Amateur]

Julie has come through the surgery well and had recovered enough to be antsy about being a patient (her usual role in a hospital is as an emergency room nurse). She's on a bunch of different medications and they have a drain to keep pressure off the brain. She has some difficulty with movement on one side, but it's too soon to tell what permanent challenges she will face. Evidently her short and long term memory has been unaffected.

She has a great deal of support from family, faith, and friends. I guess that's what it's all about.

 

[fire&ice]

Thanks Tali - *very* good information. And well presented.

R/A - that's good to know. My continued prayers for her.

Back to topic - one thing to consider - do you really want all family members flying on the *same* plane? I know it's more likely that one would get hit by a bus; but, what a tradegy if the plane went down. Just something to think about.