Difference (or not) in H and J color?

[Ashleigh]

Dear all,

Firstly, I hope that all in the affected areas of Storm Sandy are safe and sound.

I'd like some advice on color H and J. A colleague mentioned that she and her bf are selecting a diamond for her ering. Initially, she settled on the specs of H VS at least. As I can't see a difference between H and J, and VS and SI, I recommended a J SI1 stone with Excellent cut, GIA XXX, from JA to her. She likes it. Since then, her bf has been in emails with JA reps to get info about the diamond and is about to purchase.

Then I saw Diamondseeker's post on the 1.8ct AVR. A fewer posters mentioned that they can see a difference between G and I color, and that tint from I color will make diamond look less bright and smaller.

Furthermore, I saw Phoenix's tips on buying jewelry. One tip was that G,H and even I diamonds are easier to sell. Though I doubt colleague will sell her ering, I can't help feeling that I might be doing her a disservice by recommending a J SI diamond to her.

I spoke briefly to her just now about color and clarity, and told her she might be better off sticking to H VS diamond. However, she seems intent on the J SI diamond due to, I think, bigger size for same price as smaller H VS.

After this, I'll try to find a H VS diamond for her consideration. And I was thinking of digging up threads on H vs I color, though I'm not sure if I can find such threads and show her color difference/comparison photos if there are. But I doubt there'll be much difference in static photos.

I'm hoping for more experience/opinions replied to this thread so that I can show her the thread. I was trying to help, but now I feel I might have done her a disservice instead of good.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

There are many people who are happy with J color stones. The thing that bothered me was that in some lighting, you could really see the tint. There were times that the stone would look dark when my G stone did not (in my kitchen lighting at night with dark cabinets). In the sunlight I could see the warm tint and could not in the G. If I were your friend, I would at least go to I color. I color in a GIA stone would be more safe than a J. Even Dreamer said in that thread that she doesn't wear a diamond band with her J antique cut because the diamonds in a band look too white in comparison. Charmy also said she had looked at lower colors but had come to the conclusion that she at least needs H color for an e-ring.

So I'd split the difference and encourage them to look at I color (GIA) if they want a larger stone than H would allow. But there's no way to know her color tolerance unless she sees some stones in her own living and working environments.

 

[jstarfireb]

I absolutely agree. There are many beautiful Js, but I color is a safer bet and an excellent compromise between color and price. But knowing what I know now, and having become more color-sensitive over time, I would have chosen something in the F-H range if price weren't an issue.

 

[Ashleigh]

Oh, I don't know how I ended up having a duplicate thread. How do I combine repsonses for both threads? Thanks.

 

[Ashleigh]

There are many people who are happy with J color stones. The thing that bothered me was that in some lighting, you could really see the tint. There were times that the stone would look dark when my G stone did not (in my kitchen lighting at night with dark cabinets). In the sunlight I could see the warm tint and could not in the G. If I were your friend, I would at least go to I color. I color in a GIA stone would be more safe than a J. Even Dreamer said in that thread that she doesn't wear a diamond band with her J antique cut because the diamonds in a band look too white in comparison. Charmy also said she had looked at lower colors but had come to the conclusion that she at least needs H color for an e-ring.

So I'd split the difference and encourage them to look at I color (GIA) if they want a larger stone than H would allow. But there's no way to know her color tolerance unless she sees some stones in her own living and working environments.

Yes, it was what I read from Dreamer and fellow posters that made me rethink my advice to my colleague. I'll tell her to view comparable H and J diamonds IRL before her bf goes ahead with the purchase. Thanks for the advice.

 

[Ashleigh]

I absolutely agree. There are many beautiful Js, but I color is a safer bet and an excellent compromise between color and price. But knowing what I know now, and having become more color-sensitive over time, I would have chosen something in the F-H range if price weren't an issue.

Why didn't it occur to me to find her a I VS stone for consideration? I'll do just that in addition to the H VS stone. And now I'll tell her to view H, I, J stones IRL before purchase. Glad to have more advice so that I can rectify my poor recommendation.

 

[VRBeauty]

I don't think there was anything wrong with your recommendation. I would guess that most women wear diamonds that are the equivalent of GIA J SI-1 - and do so happily. And it would never occur to most women to ever sell or trade up their original e-ring.

That said, if the two of you could go on a diamond-comparison excursion together, by all means do so!

 

[diamondseeker2006]

The only caution I will add is that it will do almost no good to look at diamond color in a jewelry store because their lighting is designed to make all diamonds look bright and sparkly and you usually can't tell a thing about color. You need to see diamond color in the outdoors, in your car, in your home, and at work to see how it looks in different environments.

 

[Ashleigh]

The only caution I will add is that it will do almost no good to look at diamond color in a jewelry store because their lighting is designed to make all diamonds look bright and sparkly and you usually can't tell a thing about color. You need to see diamond color in the outdoors, in your car, in your home, and at work to see how it looks in different environments.

Thanks, I'll tell her that as well. From these advice from you all, it seems that I should refrain from advising anyone buying diamonds as there seems to be many conditions (like not to view jewelry under jewelry store lightings) etc that I'm not aware of or know but never thought to tell her. I think from now on I should just admire from the sideline.

 

[GreenBling]

My AGS I faces up bright and white (but not icy white white) most times but the tint can be amplified in certain lightings. Nothing wrong with your collegue getting a J as long as she knows what to expect. But if budget allows, I do prefer higher color.

 

[swingirl]

My recommendation is to have the diamond shipped to the buyer before setting. That way they can inspect it and decide for themselves where their color preference lies. I am one of those who definitely sees the color difference but prefers warmer stones.

 

[hearts-arrows_girl]

I can see the difference in H and J color, but it wouldn't be a deal breaker to me. I think your advice to get a J SI1 in order to get a larger stone, was very thoughtful! There is a tint in J's, but if someone wants a bigger stone, and it isn't going to sit next to higher color stone, they will be very happy. The J's I've seen on people look plenty white. Just follow up with the caveat that if she gets a wedding ring with diamonds, get one with I/J color stones. I do agree, it is hard to give diamond buying advice, because if they don't like what you suggested, it is awkward.

An I color SI1 is a great compromise too. Please post what they decide on.

 

[Rhea]

I think J could be a good balance. I wouldn't worry about her being able to sell it in the future. There will always be people who think like she does, they want a larger diamond and are okay with a more tinted colour. I think James Allen also has an upgrade program, don't they?

 

[Dreamer_D]

My comments were aimed at DS, a fellow diamond OCD nut For the vast majority of (smarter, saner) people, J color is JUST FINE and they happily wear it with a diamond band.

If your friend is new to diamonds and also has no preconceived notions about diamonds and how they should or should not look, then I heartily recommend a J color diamond to get a larger stone. Only the wearer -- IF she is very nitpicky -- would ever notice body color. And then only if she looks for it.

I had no trouble selling my AGS0 1.67ct J VS1 either. Don't worry about it.

Most likely she will be very happy with her stone. If not, she can exchange it or upgrade!

But 99.9% of people out there just love what they have.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

My comments were aimed at DS, a fellow diamond OCD nut For the vast majority of (smarter, saner) people, J color is JUST FINE and they happily wear it with a diamond band.

If your friend is new to diamonds and also has no preconceived notions about diamonds and how they should or should not look, then I heartily recommend a J color diamond to get a larger stone. Only the wearer -- IF she is very nitpicky -- would ever notice body color. And then only if she looks for it.

I had no trouble selling my AGS0 1.67ct J VS1 either. Don't worry about it.

Most likely she will be very happy with her stone. If not, she can exchange it or upgrade!

But 99.9% of people out there just love what they have.

It's rough being one of the .1% OCD people isn't it, Dreamer! Most people are like my sister who wouldn't have a clue of what color her diamond is if you asked her!

 

[dmz]

Take a look at this video. One of the best comparisons of colour that I have seen: http://vimeo.com/3288695

 

[Phoenix]

It's late here and I was just about to sign off, but I saw this. I haven't seen read the other replies thoroughly enough but thought I'd post a pic of Holly who's an H next to my J studs. Just happened to take this pic today.

As you can see, the J's def have some tint to them, when viewed from the side (face up, it's hard to discern the colour difference).

I think I also mentioned in the "tips list" that whether one goes for higher colours and/ or clarities would depend on one's priorities. If your colleague's priority is size, then she may prefer the larger J which should face up quite white if cut well.

Also, I skimped through the other posts and I agree that maybe an I would be a good balance between budget and size.

 

[iluvdiamonds2]

I would go for a G , if not a G, than the H. J is IMHO going to show some color esp from the side. I would rather have a well-cut G stone that is smaller than a larger J color stone.

 

[Mico]

i just posted my I RB diamond, you are more than welcome to look at my thread topics and look at it. I think if she is color sensitive, I would go any lower than an I. Back in the day there was a test you could do to test your color sensitivity. I scored a 4. I'm pretty keen on color, and that was apparent when we were diamond shopping - my FH couldn't. Everything looked white to him.

to each their own

 

[TC1987]

The I color is where most people can pick up tint. J, to me, has a definite tint. H, unmounted and viewed upside down, can look shackingli "dark", lol. Remember that as the diamond size increases, it tends to intensify or concentrate the tint. (Like, it's hard to detect tints in mele diamonds, but in a 1.5ct or 2ct, it won't hide.)

Also, as you go down the color grades, there is more variation from high to low. There's a narrower range of tints that are called H, but the J range is going to be wider, so whether it's a high J or low J might make a lot of difference to her likes/dislikes.

For some reason that I can't remember, I is the narrowest color grade. There is not a lot of difference in a "high" vs. a "low" I color diamond.

I never used to notice tints in white diamonds from say, G to I, but now I can detect some in F, and I definitely see it in I and J, face up or from the side.

 

[Phoenix]

I posted in yr other thread ..I am reposting my H so you can see the actual body colour IRL.

I'll try and take pics of Holly next to my J studs, face up some time soon.

 

[chrono]

I can see the difference between my E, H, J, and L diamonds even when face up. That said, I love them all. Just because one can see the difference does not mean one stone is better or lesser than the other. If possible, let her view an H and J side by side to let her decide her preference.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

If she does not care about seeing a tint in her stone, then J is fine! If she doesn't want that, then she should go H and possibly I. Regardless of the fact that I is a narrow color range, I have had two diamonds at my home in the last month that were I color, and one definitely had more of a visible tint than the other. But I think GIA I color would be safer since AGS can be a little optimistic on color when the color is borderline.

 

[Ashleigh]

Take a look at this video. One of the best comparisons of colour that I have seen: http://vimeo.com/3288695

Thanks, I'll show her the video.

It's late here and I was just about to sign off, but I saw this. I haven't seen read the other replies thoroughly enough but thought I'd post a pic of Holly who's an H next to my J studs. Just happened to take this pic today.

As you can see, the J's def have some tint to them, when viewed from the side (face up, it's hard to discern the colour difference).

I think I also mentioned in the "tips list" that whether one goes for higher colours and/ or clarities would depend on one's priorities. If your colleague's priority is size, then she may prefer the larger J which should face up quite white if cut well.

Also, I skimped through the other posts and I agree that maybe an I would be a good balance between budget and size.

I posted in yr other thread ..I am reposting my H so you can see the actual body colour IRL.

I'll try and take pics of Holly next to my J studs, face up some time soon.

Phoenix, thanks for the pics. I'll show them to her. From your pics, it appears that while J is not much more tinted than H in white environment, J picks up warm color more in warm colored environment. That's interesting and I wonder why. If not for your pics, I would have thought that both H and J pick up colors linearly, but it seems J picks up color exponentially as compared to H.

i just posted my I RB diamond, you are more than welcome to look at my thread topics and look at it. I think if she is color sensitive, I would go any lower than an I. Back in the day there was a test you could do to test your color sensitivity. I scored a 4. I'm pretty keen on color, and that was apparent when we were diamond shopping - my FH couldn't. Everything looked white to him.

to each their own

Congrats on your elegant ering. I've seen it.

The I color is where most people can pick up tint. J, to me, has a definite tint. H, unmounted and viewed upside down, can look shackingli "dark", lol. Remember that as the diamond size increases, it tends to intensify or concentrate the tint. (Like, it's hard to detect tints in mele diamonds, but in a 1.5ct or 2ct, it won't hide.)

Also, as you go down the color grades, there is more variation from high to low. There's a narrower range of tints that are called H, but the J range is going to be wider, so whether it's a high J or low J might make a lot of difference to her likes/dislikes.

For some reason that I can't remember, I is the narrowest color grade. There is not a lot of difference in a "high" vs. a "low" I color diamond.

I never used to notice tints in white diamonds from say, G to I, but now I can detect some in F, and I definitely see it in I and J, face up or from the side.

Interesting observations. I never knew that. Thanks for sharing.

If she does not care about seeing a tint in her stone, then J is fine! If she doesn't want that, then she should go H and possibly I. Regardless of the fact that I is a narrow color range, I have had two diamonds at my home in the last month that were I color, and one definitely had more of a visible tint than the other. But I think GIA I color would be safer since AGS can be a little optimistic on color when the color is borderline.

Yes, I read about your AVR adventures. Seldom have I seen detailed posts and photos of hugh AVRs. You've got me interested in AVRs, but the premium is high though. Thanks for the tip on GIA vs AGS, I'll let her know.

I can see the difference between my E, H, J, and L diamonds even when face up. That said, I love them all. Just because one can see the difference does not mean one stone is better or lesser than the other. If possible, let her view an H and J side by side to let her decide her preference.

Yes, she's going diamond color viewing this weekend from H to J color with her bf. But she says this diamond color-viewing outing is just for fun since she's still intent on that J from JA.

 

[yssie]

What size stone is she looking at? What's the budget - any ballparks?


A 3ct J is going to show a LOT more colour from the side than a 1ct J.
If the choice is between a 3ct J and a 2ct H, my no-hesitations recommendation would be the 2ct H to anyone whose hobby doesn't involve a diamond board if the choice is between a 1ct J and a 0.75 H my no-hesitations rec is the J.


ETA tell her to wear white or grey, not yellow, and make sure to carry a small white cloth - many jewellery stores insist on showing loose stones on dark backgrounds, which is absolutely useless for colour comparisons.

 

[Phoenix]

Ash, I've posted some comparison pics of my mid-H 5ct next to the J's, another H, a high G and a high F.

I'd still take your colleague shopping and let her see the different colours IRL. I'd make sure they're all ideal-cut though, so you have apple-to-apple comparison.

 

[marcy]

I agree with suggestions you take her out to do some real life comparisons in diamond color having her compare ideal cut diamonds. Side by side the difference in color is pretty easy to see but once the diamond is mounted it is hard to pick out the color difference from the top.

 

[TC1987]

Someone mentioned J color diamond not matching the diamonds in wedding bands, or semi-mounts. In many cases, you can just have the jeweler make or order the ring or setting with J-color diamonds so that it will match. If the diamonds are very small, like pave', a color difference might not matter because the pave' stones are really too small to show tints. It might be an issue with the diamonds in a halo, or for a three stone or five stone ring. Or for diamond wedding band.

 

[Ashleigh]

UPDATE:

I wrote an update yesterday but it disappeared before I could post it.

My colleague and her bf went color-viewing over the weekend and she had 2 surprises for me yesterday!

Guess what? They have bought her ering

2nd surprise - Her ering is a yellow cushion with white melee halo

She showed me a photo of it (her bf only allowed her one photo for her to drool over before he took it away for safe keeping till he proposes ). It's lovely but I was really surprised that it is so different from her initial white round H&A in solitaire setting. I asked her why and she said it was love at first sight. I had hoped to share her lovely ering with all who had helped her in her ering quest but she was too shy to post her ering on the internet.

Thank you to all who had helped her in her ering quest. Though she didn't get a H or J color in the end, it was your advice that she should view colors irl that led her to ering shopping and eventually getting the yellow cushion.