Do you support schools banning cellphone use during class?

[Slickk]

Cursive. Anyone remember cursive???
How about music in schools. It’s this thing where you give the kids a wooden thing with strings or a horn and they learn about the arts???
We’re so screwed.

Our district has an award-winning music program that we are very proud of.

The problem with phones in school, outside the classroom, is that lunch and study halls are/should be times to socialize, get work done, draw, read. When kids have their phones on and out they are not going to always use them in kind ways. The amount of cyber bullying, taking and posting unflattering pics of peers is unbelievable.
I do think they have a place for research at the older ages but for the younger crowd they are a distraction. I do allow them in their pockets in case of emergency.
And yup. They can’t tell time on an analog clock either! And cursive…

 

[elizat]

Our school has an award-winning music program that we are very proud of.

The problem with phones in school, outside the classroom, is that lunch and study halls are/should be times to socialize, get work done, draw, read. When kids have their phones on and out they are not going to always use them in kind ways. The amount of cyber bullying, taking and posting unflattering pics of peers is unbelievable.
I do think they have a place for research at the older ages but for the younger crowd they are a distraction. I do allow them in their pockets in case of emergency.
And yup. They can’t tell time on an analog clock either! And cursive…

I agree. Kids, of all ages, socialize differently too. They do so much by text or FaceTime. They stay home and don't see each other in person. I think you can see a difference in the social adaptations in people that are younger than 30 to be honest, as phones, tablets , computer games, and digital communication, etc. took over. A lot of them don't know how to communicate well in person and they need the time to actually talk to others in person.

 

[YadaYadaYada]

At younger son’s private school, they teach cursive, he is left-handed so he has trouble writing but his cursive is pretty good. The downside is they do not have art or much of a music program. I’m looking into magnet schools for him starting at 6th so he gets more exposure and more opportunities for extracurricular activities.

I taught him how to read time on a clock when I homeschooled him for a brief period. That was second grade.

 

[YadaYadaYada]

As far as the whole cyber bullying argument against cell phone use in school, this has more to do with raising a child with a good strong character and teaching them right from wrong and what is appropriate and not. In addition, IMO kids should not be on any form of social media before the age of 16 maybe older, our oldest just got an IG account this year, no Facebook, no Tik Tok and no Snapchat. He is also on Discord and yes, kids can be mean but then he knows you can just leave and/or ignore it.

Kids have to have some coping mechanisms and it’s up to the parents to establish them and also be an ear when they need support. Parents need to parent and stop letting the kids act like wild animals both in-person and online.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

Phones in classrooms are not allowed in the UK. In primary schools the older children who have them (aged 10 - 11) have to hand them into a lock box at the start of the day & will get them back at the end. In high schools they are banned from classrooms & always have been. At my daughters school they will even get a detention if caught with a phone during breaks or lunch, so any sneaky messages I get (can X come home with me tonight for dinner / can I go to X’s house today) are always sent from the bottom of the school field where they can’t be seen by staff

It works. Learning needs to be focused & the brain needs to be present, not far away scrolling through Tik Tok.

gee back in the day that's where the smokers used to hang out
now its for phones

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

At younger son’s private school, they teach cursive, he is left-handed so he has trouble writing but his cursive is pretty good. The downside is they do not have art or much of a music program. I’m looking into magnet schools for him starting at 6th so he gets more exposure and more opportunities for extracurricular activities.

I taught him how to read time on a clock when I homeschooled him for a brief period. That was second grade.

oh im so sad to read this
my high school made music compuslary in the first year, we did both theory and practicle, it was learn an orchestral instrument and join the orchestra or play the recorder, i think if nothing else it taught musical appreation
we used to get out of an hour of regular classwork an hour every monday to go to our music leassons (i learnt the french horn)

we learnt to write (no body uses the word cursive here) in the last couple of years at primary school -my writting is pretty much like my spelling !

now im going to really show my age
at intermediate school (middle school but just two years) we did manual for two hours a day every 2nd week
it rotated between art, woodwork, metalwork, sewing and cooking, i have no idea if that is still done like that

as important as the three R's are i find it sad that art and music would not be in a school circulumn

 

[YadaYadaYada]

@Daisys and Diamonds, it is a very small school but this school, even without a music or art program, is better for him than the school in our district. This is also why I’m aiming to get him into a different school for 6-12. I don’t want him to have one view of the world, I want him exposed to all kinds of people and ideas, and for him to have art and music class as well!

 

[telephone89]

I hadnt even thought about lockdowns or things like that, interesting and yet tragic point.

I was thinking of how expensive some of these phones are. If confiscated on school property and lost or damaged, I wouldn't want to be responsible for that.

 

[kenny]

...

I was thinking of how expensive some of these phones are. If confiscated on school property and lost or damaged, I wouldn't want to be responsible for that.

They can leave it at home.
I usually do.

I find I stay more clam, relaxed, and focused without the alarms and interruptions.
But then, the life I have made for myself is real, not fake (apps and social media).
I don't need or want that.

My youngest guitar student (a neighbor) started at age 12 and took lessons for 6 years.
Even in high school he didn't even want a cellphone, and had no social media accounts.
He had a nice group of friends, diverse but likeminded about keeping their distance from "social technology".

He's very smart and went to a special high school for high IQ-ites.
Now he's away at a top-rated university.
I like to think he absorbed my perspective about dumbphones and anti-social media.
His mom keeps saying what a great influence I was on him.

He's living proof a kid CAN live, and thrive, outside of Zuck's 'metaverse'.

 

[telephone89]

Then leave it at home.

I usually do
I find I stay more clam and relaxed without the interruptions.
But then, the life I have made for myself is real, not fake (apps and social media).
I don't need or want that.

My youngest guitar student started at age 12 and took lessons for 6 years.
Even in high school he didn't even want a cellphone, and had no social media accounts.
He had a nice group of friends, diverse but likeminded about keeping their distance from "social technology".

He was very smart and went to a special high school for high IQ-ites.
Now he's away at a top-rated university.
I like to think he absorbed my perspective about dumbphones and anti-social media.
His mom keeps saying what a great influence I was on him.

He's living proof a kid CAN live, and thrive, outside of Zuck's 'metaverse'.

Or we could just let people be responsible for their own items. I hope you aren't trying to equate lack of cell phone or technology with intelligence. I'd wager 99% of college students at any top ranked university have a phone. I'd imagine your student is quite in the minority, but good for him, and good for you patting yourself on the back about it.

 

[Tonks]

The phone question is so interesting. What seems ideal and what is reality are often at odds.

My kids have to have phones at school. Their school implemented a locking door system for all exterior doors. They get into buildings using an app on their phones.

As for during class, it sounds great to say they can’t have them. But the reality is that even if they don’t, they’re using laptops to take notes or tablets for math (literally this year is the first year either of my children has had a math teacher use paper—they have been doing all math until pre-calculus on tablets). And if you’re an Apple household (I have no idea how Android works), and your kid is signed in on iCloud, they can text in class even without a phone. Texts pop up on their laptop or tablet.

So….the genie can’t be stuffed back in the bottle, really. If you have schools go back to paper, maybe.

 

[Lookinagain]

The phone question is so interesting. What seems ideal and what is reality are often at odds.

My kids have to have phones at school. Their school implemented a locking door system for all exterior doors. They get into buildings using an app on their phones.

As for during class, it sounds great to say they can’t have them. But the reality is that even if they don’t, they’re using laptops to take notes or tablets for math (literally this year is the first year either of my children has had a math teacher use paper—they have been doing all math until pre-calculus on tablets). And if you’re an Apple household (I have no idea how Android works), and your kid is signed in on iCloud, they can text in class even without a phone. Texts pop up on their laptop or tablet.

So….the genie can’t be stuffed back in the bottle, really. If you have schools go back to paper, maybe.

So not having school age kids, I'm curious, do they have to submit their work to the teacher electronically during class so that they need wifi or internet access to function? Or are they just doing the work on the tablet or laptop? I'm only asking because if they don't need wifi or internet to do or submit the work, then they wouldn't have access to the cloud for texting, etc. Maybe this is a naive question but I do know I can use the calculator on my iphone or use the Notes app, even if I turn off data and wifi so just wondering if they need these to do their work in class?

 

[kenny]

Does all this ubiquitous technology make it harder for teachers to catch cheating?
But then, I fear, many think there is no such thing as cheating any more.
We wouldn't want to crush little Susie's or Tommy's creativity.
If they want to spell it that way ... well, the bless their precious hearts.

Ever since music was put online, the line [between stealing and people, uhm, sharing, what they think they have a right to] has been dissolving.
"But, if it's on the Internet then it's fair game."
(Just because technology makes it easy, doesn't make it okay, or legal.)
I hear that stores don't even bother prosecuting shoplifters anymore.
WTFF?!? ... the extra F is for Flying.

Every kid gets a trophy now for just showing up.
Now, instead of actually learning, they're just 'taught to the tests'.
That's easier, faster, and cheaper for the teachers school officials.
The dumbphone kids must LOVE this.

School officials protect their jobs by pulling fast ones to ensure failing kids (glued to their dumbphones) to graduate.
That ain't fair to the kids who worked for their passing grades.

Now that kids can access cheating software, like Grammarly, do schools even bother teaching grammar any more?

Boy, I sure am glad I don't work in edjumuhkashun these days!
I'd quit!

 

[monarch64]

omg sitting in the same room?! Wowza. I wonder if people feel more natural texting vs talking.

Typically, the later in life you learn to drive the worse at it you are...so worried about these late drivers....

Anecdotally, my mother didn’t learn to drive until she was 35 (lived in major cities, walked or took the bus everywhere), and in the last 46 years she has not had a single speeding ticket nor accident. My grandmother, conversely, taught herself to drive at 14, and was NOT a good driver—she used both feet (no clutch, automatic trans), slammed her brakes, rode her brakes constantly, and was just uncomfortable to ride with.

I learned how to drive at age 12, but it was all around our farm/property. My parents made both my brother and me wait until we were 17 to get our licenses, because teens in our town who got theirs as soon as they turned 16 almost inevitably had car accidents. That didn’t happen to either of us, so I’m glad they made us wait.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

i know since i stopped working in a job that required me to actually write long hand my handwritting has got even worse
i do wonder what the handwritting of today is like ?

 

[Tonks]

So not having school age kids, I'm curious, do they have to submit their work to the teacher electronically during class so that they need wifi or internet access to function? Or are they just doing the work on the tablet or laptop? I'm only asking because if they don't need wifi or internet to do or submit the work, then they wouldn't have access to the cloud for texting, etc. Maybe this is a naive question but I do know I can use the calculator on my iphone or use the Notes app, even if I turn off data and wifi so just wondering if they need these to do their work in class?

Oh gosh, there is constant tech and internet use, and they definitely need internet to submit work.

For starters, all assignments and class materials are hosted online. Different schools use different platforms. My kids’ school uses Canvas. They are on it all the time. And yes, work is turned in that way—either documents or photos of work. They get it back that way with comments as well.

During class, tech use is necessary. They take notes either by typing or by using a stylus on a tablet to annotate a note packet from the teacher. If they type they are most likely on Google docs and save work in the cloud. If they are annotating they’re on Notability, which also saves work in the cloud.

They are also asked to watch videos as part of various classes regularly. Foreign language does this, as does AP Bio. For various poli/sci type classes there is often in class research that requires the internet.

Overall, most educational settings are reliant on the Google suite of products—google docs, slides, etc. They are used because they are either low cost or free for education. And they save to the cloud. Combine that with the fact that actual devices are moving toward less onboard memory with the expectation that you save to the cloud rather than your hard drive and you get a situation where no, you can’t just not have internet access during school.

Finally, if a site is really struggling to load because a whole class is trying to do something at once, teachers have been known to ask people to use their phones so it will load.

Oh! I almost forgot. Testing. Most, if not all, is all online and on computer. Believe it or not, the SAT is going online. The very last paper SAT will be administered this Saturday. The PSAT has already gone online.

 

[Tonks]

Let me preface this by saying it’s going to be different from school to school.

Does all this ubiquitous technology make it harder for teachers to catch cheating?
But then, I fear, many think there is no such thing as cheating any more.
We wouldn't want to crush little Susie's or Tommy's creativity.
If they want to spell it that way ... well, the bless their precious hearts.

They actually use tech to find cheating. Teachers have a site they use to catch plagiarism. It also filters for AI. Since the kids are all using Google docs, some teachers check the edit history of the document. If you wrote it all along, great. If you cut and pasted it as a huge chunk, that’s a red flag.

Every kid gets a trophy now for just showing up.
Now, instead of actually learning, they're just 'taught to the tests'.
That's easier, faster, and cheaper for the teachers school officials.
The dumbphone kids must LOVE this.

I would challenge you on this. At some schools, sure, you can show up. But not all schools and not all kids. My kids attend a rigorous college prep school and they work their butts off. In the afternoons they go to practice and do homework. I see them for dinner and that’s really it these days, They are both taking a course load of all advanced or AP classes.

Teaching to the tests….again, yes, that happens in some cases but not all. There are certain school districts using merit pay for teachers, which links teacher pay to student performance (usually measured on standardized tests). In that situation, teaching to the test is inevitable. Private schools have different testing requirements and it is far less frequent—at least standardized testing.

 

[Mreader]

@kenny @Tonks In regard to cheating – AI is going to be a game changer (in a bad way) and currently software like Turn It In etc. hasn’t caught up with AI. They do have AI detection but it’s not the best at the moment.

 

[kenny]

Back in 1995, the Unabomber was right.
Technology that seemed good at first will ultimately prove to be very bad for humanity.

Of course I 100% condemn his crimes!
But the guy must have been a big thinker.
He had a point.

 

[telephone89]

"The unabomber was right" ???

Yikes.

What is the point of this thread if you throw out comments like that

 

[kenny]

A second NYT article ...

School Cellphone Bans Are Trending. Do They Work? (Published 2023)

Proponents say no-phone rules reduce student distractions and bullying. Critics say the bans could hinder student self-direction and critical thinking.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Mreader]

A second NYT article ...

School Cellphone Bans Are Trending. Do They Work? (Published 2023)

Proponents say no-phone rules reduce student distractions and bullying. Critics say the bans could hinder student self-direction and critical thinking.

www.nytimes.com

This discussion makes me remember an article I read sometime ago about how tech moguls like Steve Jobs, etc. sent their kids to schools that are tech free.

 

[autumngems]

I saw something once where each classroom had a slot/box for each student, phones had to be put in their slot before class. Good idea. I know here our kids scores are soooooo low in schools and I know some teachers who complain the phones are a big reason.