Educate me on starting with rough

[Mrs_Strizzle]

A recent thread spoke of an unfortunate event with a cutter that was disappointing, but it did make me realize that there was this avenue of getting a custom cut stone that never crossed my mind. I'm sure there are risks/rewards to this that I also don't know of. Can ya'll share the process and perhaps results if you have started with rough? Thanks!

 

[Polished1911]

I'm very new to all facets of gems and jewellery (pun intended ). But my first experience of any personal gemstone purchase was buying rough last year and getting it cut . I couldn't find goshenite anywhere that looked decent! (It's colorless beryl In which emerald and aquamarine are). So I poked around IG and found a guy (gilyuda) that had rough, in Canada. He was so fun to work with and made me videos to choose my rough. I picked a couple. So then I had rough.... What to do next? I found a small shop on Etsy (Qgems) and reached out to him. Extremely amazing guy! He offered to evaluate my rough for free and be honest if it was facet worthy. It was! Go me. He cut 2 gems out of one piece of rough. One will be for a necklace for me and I'm thinking a signet ring for my guy. Our birstones are emerald and aqua and I got hair up my butt to find the colorless version of both. Botg are very sparkly and beryl is not known for being as such. My experience was really fun and rewarding.

 

[Polished1911]

Honest truth is I wanted a trial run with a very inexpensive gem as well. I would be comfortable going to Qgems, Dan, on Etsy with any piece of rough in the future.

I ended up loving a spinel he had and purchased it for my Engagement ring. That just got finished last week!

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

Honest truth is I wanted a trial run with a very inexpensive gem as well. I would be comfortable going to Qgems, Dan, on Etsy with any piece of rough in the future.

I ended up loving a spinel he had and purchased it for my Engagement ring. That just got finished last week!

OMG, I saw that ring on IG and saved it in my phone for inspiration! I love purple spinels and have more than just a few. Congrats on your engagement! Its absolutely gorgeous!

 

[Polished1911]

I don't have it quite yet. I'm lucky my guy told me to go pick my rock and design it. I'm in the process of working with Caysie on 2 bands to go with it. And I gaurentee my Mr will wait a few months to officially ask. The turkey

 

[Polished1911]

OMG, I saw that ring on IG and saved it in my phone for inspiration! I love purple spinels and have more than just a few. Congrats on your engagement! Its absolutely gorgeous!

Thank you! Now I want ALL the spinels.

 

[CHRISTY-DANIELLE]

@Polished1911 I love the cut on your spinel!

I don't have it yet, but I asked a cutter (MVM gems/Michelle Mai)to cut an 8mm blue zircon for me in the Old European Cut, so this will be my first gem from rough.

 

[Polished1911]

@Polished1911 I love the cut on your spinel!

I don't have it yet, but I asked a cutter (MVM gems/Michelle Mai)to cut an 8mm blue zircon for me in the Old European Cut, so this will be my first gem from rough.

Thanks

She cuts amazing gems!

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

@Polished1911 I love the cut on your spinel!

I don't have it yet, but I asked a cutter (MVM gems/Michelle Mai)to cut an 8mm blue zircon for me in the Old European Cut, so this will be my first gem from rough.

Did you buy the rough and send to her, or buy the rough from her too?

 

[CHRISTY-DANIELLE]

Michelle picked the rough, ( lord knows I don't need to go down that rabbit hole! )
She sent me a gem CAD, which I thought was interesting. She said she will do an open culet like I want.

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

Thank you! Now I want ALL the spinels.

Not to hijack my own thread, but here's my new light purple spinel.

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

Michelle picked the rough, ( lord knows I don't need to go down that rabbit hole! )
She sent me a gem CAD, which I thought was interesting. She said she will do an open culet like I want.

Wow, that is going to be amazing! I LOVE and old cut, and honestly that is why I was asking about getting one specifically cut.

 

[CHRISTY-DANIELLE]

I have looked at that ring many, many times!! I love it!

 

[CHRISTY-DANIELLE]

Wow, that is going to be amazing! I LOVE and old cut, and honestly that is why I was asking about getting one specifically cut.

She randomly posted something on IG about how amazing she thought a gem in OEC would be, so I asked her to do a blue zircon for me (to replace a stone in a ring). I think she's excited about cutting it! I have a little grey/blue spinel in one of her original cuts, a variant of the portugese cut.

 

[Polished1911]

Wow, that is going to be amazing! I LOVE and old cut, and honestly that is why I was asking about getting one specifically cut.

That's stunning! Spinel sure are pretty!

I had so much fun with my custom cutting project of wanting one stone and ended up with 3! How did that happen?

 

[Polished1911]

Michelle picked the rough, ( lord knows I don't need to go down that rabbit hole! )
She sent me a gem CAD, which I thought was interesting. She said she will do an open culet like I want.

That's so awesome she sent you a CAD!

 

[chroman]

@Polished1911 I don't have it yet, but I asked a cutter (MVM gems/Michelle Mai)to cut an 8mm blue zircon for me in the Old European Cut, so this will be my first gem from rough.

She does great work - I hope you love it!

 

[Polished1911]

My other adventure last year with a lapidary was fun as well. He's newer to his craft and was making a new design. So I asked him to cut me an amethyst in it. I'm a delivery driver and it has compass points. He's awesome to work with as well! He let me choose out of the rough he had. His IG has been quiet lately but he just moved a few states over.

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

She randomly posted something on IG about how amazing she thought a gem in OEC would be, so I asked her to do a blue zircon for me (to replace a stone in a ring). I think she's excited about cutting it! I have a little grey/blue spinel in one of her original cuts, a variant of the portugese cut.

Please say you will post it when it arrives. I am loving my OEC spinel, and think a blue zircon will be AMAZ-BALLS!

 

[CHRISTY-DANIELLE]

Of course! She had quite a few custom orders she was doing, told me it would be a couple months. I'm patiently waiting, but shouldn't be much longer!

 

[Polished1911]

A recent thread spoke of an unfortunate event with a cutter that was disappointing, but it did make me realize that there was this avenue of getting a custom cut stone that never crossed my mind. I'm sure there are risks/rewards to this that I also don't know of. Can ya'll share the process and perhaps results if you have started with rough? Thanks!

So what do you think you'd like to get cut? I totally forgot to ask!

And if you're looking for rough. Look up "Joe Henley Rough".

 

[CHRISTY-DANIELLE]

Please say you will post it when it arrives. I am loving my OEC spinel, and think a blue zircon will be AMAZ-BALLS!

In the meanwhile, here's my big mama zircon, recut by Jerry Newman. He said it was an early transitional cut (from 1930s ring). Has open culet too. She's a total fireball. (She was reset in this setting, lost some girth with recut, didn't fit in old setting):


I thought I could only get these old cut zircons in antique rings. .and I love them. .so snapped this up as well:

But I messed up that zircon. .. I read (WRONG INFO!!) that you can gently heat a zircon to bring out more blue. This one went from medium blue to sky blue . This is the ring getting the new gem from Michelle.
So yes, zircon are awesome in old cuts, they are much like diamonds in dispersion.

 

[chroman]

And if you're looking for rough. Look up "Joe Henley Rough".

I’ve started down the rough buying rabbit hole for future faceting adventures. There can be quite a learning curve - I know I’ve purchased some, eh.. learner stones. Luckily no lessons *that* expensive (yet).

There’s pleanty of suspect places to buy rough - much like cut gems. But much love for Joe - he has a lot of nice pieces and is great to work with.

 

[arkieb1]

I agree it can be quite a costly rabbit hole, what they don't tell you is that you can lose 1/2 to 2/3s body weight of the rough precision cutting, that stones can shatter, they can be more included and end up lighter in colour than expected. I have found it costly and frequently if cutting expensive material not worth the effort.

The best way to start is by getting a good cutter to help you select rough or start with their inventory of rough and select something.

 

[chroman]

I agree it can be quite a costly rabbit hole, what they don't tell you is that you can lose 1/2 to 2/3s body

A 30% yield is actually pretty impressive. One way to think about it is that the rough weigh in g (5ct) is around the finished weight in ct. that would be a 20% yield.

Unless its someting special, or the price is too good to pass, or the shape is amazing, I try to avoid going under 1g as a minimum size. Though ymmv with that, because 1g of quartz is bigger than 1g of zircon.

 

[JPie]

Michelle came to the SF GTG back in June and she brought her personal collection of gems for us to ogle. She is such a sweetheart and very talented. I can’t wait to see how your zircon turns out, @CHRISTY-DANIELLE !

 

[pwsg07]

I like some special mixed cut (crown top, step cut pavillion) but I was told my roughs are too shallow.

Some cutters are only able to work with the faceting diagram they are familiar with. If you give them a new diagram, they probably cannot do it without doing a test cut first.

I don't like a lot of diagrams having some corners on the outline. Some ovals or cushions looks too modern for me.

To custom cut is actually more expensive because the labour cost is expensive. The stone usually has clarity problem. A recut maybe a better choice to get a cleaner stone and cheaper.

Are you looking for a particular shape?

 

[PrecisionGem]

This is something I don't recommend. By far, the hardest part of producing a finished stone is not the actual cutting, but the procurement, selection of rough, and then selecting the right design to bring out the best in that piece of rough. Building relationships and sources for rough takes years, and many thousands of dollars. Often you need to buy parcels to get the better rough, and a parcel may have 2 or 3 stones you really want, but you need to take the whole thing to get those pieces.

Then there are the issues that can arise. Over the years I have had many pieces crack in 20 places as soon as the stone touches the lap. Sometimes just dropping the stone can cause it to crack. A stone that you thought was really clean, once you get into it you see places that can only be worked around by loosing too much size.

I track all my stones in a database, so over the past 17 years I have averaged 33% yield, but there are many that have turned out to be 10% too. When buying I always calculate on 25% recovery. ( Assume a 10 ct rough will yield a 2.5 ct finished stone). I'm very selective on shape however, and after buying and cutting thousands of stones am pretty good at selecting rough, for a novice it's very easy to get burned.

Picking the design to work with a stone is maybe the most difficult. You want to maximize the size, but also the performance. Not something someone with no experience should be doing. A design that works well in a Sapphire, most likely will not work in Amethyst or Aquamarine.

What about returns? There is a lot of buying and returning going on with cut stones, but if you buy the rough and have it cut, there is no option for a return if it doesn't turn you the way you were hoping or expecting.

For these and other reasons, I would never agree to cut someones rough, just too many opportunities for disappointment.

Buying rough can be fun, and also addictive however. Here's over 21,000 carats of rough I have accumulated over the years.

 

[Mrs_Strizzle]

Thank you for your input, @PrecisionGem. I was hoping someone with your perspective would comment. I can only imagine how hard it would be to deal with high expectations, and certainly hadn't thought of the risk of the stone shattering.

 

[chroman]

Buying rough can be fun, and also addictive however. Here's over 21,000 carats of rough I have accumulated over the years.

That’s an impressive collection - thanks for sharing!