Engagement Diamond Selection - Opinions requested - 62 table

[NY_Resonant]

Good Evening, everybody! I live in NYC and am friends with someone who has worked in the diamond industry for decades. I've been reading this forum the past few weeks and learning a lot about diamonds, how to judge them, and so forth. I had looked at videos online, decided I would like a super-ideal with tons of fire...Basically a ACA/Brian-Gavin-Black type diamond... But I wanted to see with my own eyes before making a final decision. Round Brilliant cut.

So I reached out to my friend and explained that I was planning to propose. I asked him to show me his inventory and asked for his advice. We set up an appointment in his office on 47th street. When I got there, it was an office with standard white office lighting (Not the LED's that the retail locations on 47th use). He told me he selected his best 5 diamonds with my specs to show me (VS2 or better, ideally VS1...D-G color, around 1.5ct...With a budget of 15-17k)... He indicated that he loved one of them (1.5ct "good G", VS1) and it would be the selection he would recommend for his son. Said this diamond was more rare than I could imagine because it was a 7.48mm diameter 1.5ct with perfect brilliance.

This suggested diamond was very beautiful and looked quite large for a 1.5ct. It had more brilliance and sparkle with a little less fire compared to the other 4 that he showed me. Very nice bright white-flashes diamond. I narrowed my selection down to this diamond and another one that was a 1.5ct F VS1 with the tight ratios that ACA uses on it's specs (ie: Super Ideal type). They were both gorgeous diamonds, the F color one was a bit less bright but had more fire. I looked at them both with a 10x loupe and with my naked eyes. I looked at them on a black background, a white background and looked at them under the desk in a darker environment. It came down to a question of if my girlfriend would like the brilliance or fire more since after careful review they both looked great with different strengths. The G was priced at 14k ALL-IN (NYC taxes are a pain) and the F was priced at 17k. He said he would tell his son to choose the G. I chose the G, ultimately because I could tell it looked bigger and the other parameters looked "too close to call" to my careful eye review.

I'd love this board's opinion on this diamond and on the 14k all-in price for it. Based on my search online, that price looks to be significantly cheaper than anything I can find that is comparable when including taxes/etc. Felt like a "Friends and Family" price.

Here are the diamond specs:
GIA Report #1443524387
1.5ct, G Color, VS1 --- Extremely clean table and looked great to me, little feather on the bottom as shown in report.
7.47mm x 7.49mm x 4.46mm --- Seems like the size of a normal 1.58ct?
GIA - 3x Excellent scores
Florescence: Faint
Star: 50%
Lower Half: 80%
Table Size: 62%
Depth: 59.6%
Girdle: Thin to Medium faceted (3%)
Crown size: 12%
Pavillian size: 44.5%
Crown Angle: 33%
Pavilian Angle: 41.6%

Note: No Fisheye issues or anything like that.

This diamond, when I plug in the specs, falls into the GIA Excellent, AGS Excellent (not ideal) grade. The AGS ideal grade, for a 62 table, is a VERY small range.

I was surprised that I liked this diamond. I went into the meeting expecting to go for more fire focused diamonds and ended up going for the most brilliant diamond shown. Those white sparkles are very pretty and this stone was "brighter" than the other 4 by a noticeable margin. Of course, I can't know my future wife's preferences so i'm looking for some advice from this board.

Opinions welcome! Thank you so much everybody.

 

[lulu_ma]

Tagging @DejaWiz @Kim N @Garry H (Cut Nut) @Karl_K

 

[headlight]

Can you return the diamond? If not, you should not solicit second opinions.
With that said, this is not a diamond I would recommend.

 

[headlight]

Tagging @DejaWiz @Kim N @Garry H (Cut Nut) @Karl_K

I’m not sure the point of all this tagging. You never want a stone with a table larger than the depth. And 12% crown height is a flat pancake.
Sometimes people get all excited that a stone looks large for its size… this is not a good thing! The potential for fire has been compromised and the visual profile is not attractive. You don’t want to have to choose between a brilliant stone or a fiery stone… you want one that is balanced between the 2.

 

[lulu_ma]

I’m not sure the point of all this tagging. You never want a stone with a table larger than the depth. And 12% crown height is a flat pancake.
Sometimes people get all excited that a stone looks large for its size… this is not a good thing! The potential for fire has been compromised and the visual profile is not attractive. You don’t want to have to choose between a brilliant stone or a fiery stone… you want one that is balanced between the 2.

That was my impression. But I’m not a mrb cut expert. I wanted someone with more expertise to chime in!

 

[Karl_K]

There is no free lunch in exchange for the brightness and a small bit of size you gave up a lot in the other areas of diamond performance.
That is not a compromise many would accept.
Since you picked it by eye I will not say its the wrong one for you.
Just pointing out that there are trade offs.

 

[lovedogs]

Oh no no no. Please dont go with this. Your "friend" Is not giving you a deal. This is simply a stone thats poorly cut. He likley showed you other options with even worse cut. Please please please go with your original instinct to get an ideal cut stone

 

[Kim N]

I agree with the others. It looks flat and produces very little fire, and I suspect you and your future wife may not be impressed with its performance once it's outside of the jewelry store. I highly recommend you return this diamond and go with your original plan.

Keep in mind also that proportions alone don't determine performance, so even with the ideal-proportioned F we would recommend checking its light return with an ASET scope.

Take a look at these stones and you'll get an idea of prices for much better cut stones.

Diamond | 1.563 ct G VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4511757

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.563 carat G color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4511757

www.whiteflash.com

1.50 Carat round diamond

1.50 Carat round diamond

www.jamesallen.com

1.55 Carat round diamond

1.55 Carat round diamond

www.jamesallen.com

 

[DejaWiz]

Hello and welcome to PriceScope, NY_Resonant!

I'm going to start off bluntly: Despite the GIA Excellent grade, the 41.6/33/62 combo isn't a good one, unfortunately.
GIA "Excellent" doesn't always translate to "adequate".
About 70% of GIA Excellent grades aren't adequate.

Many of us here will attempt to steer attention to SIC (super ideal cut) diamonds: if not to give someone a great diamond to buy, at least to give someone the absolutely best point of reference as a basis for comparison so that they can delve into the "Cut" of the 4Cs and get to know what truly makes a diamond a "diamond"...and a diamond can (and should) be cut and proportioned in such a fine manner that it will throw as much light as physically possible back to the viewer's eyes. Maximum optical performance and beauty.

The 41.6/33/62 combo, while still making GIA Excellent, is far out of bounds for AGS Ideal:



To demonstrate why simply shopping "Excellent" cut grade isn't adequate, here is a great video by JannPaul comparing two diamonds, both graded "Excellent" but one is adequately cut and proportioned for maximizing optical performance while the other one is not.

Here are some diamonds with the same 41.6/33/62 combo:

0.50 Carat round diamond

This 0.5 carat round diamond D color vs1 clarity has Excellent proportions and a diamond grading report from GIA

www.jamesallen.com

0.70 Carat round diamond

This 0.7 carat round diamond H color vs2 clarity has Excellent proportions and a diamond grading report from GIA

www.jamesallen.com

1.00 Carat round diamond

This 1 carat round diamond D color vs1 clarity has Excellent proportions and a diamond grading report from GIA

www.jamesallen.com

1.50 Carat round diamond

This 1.5 carat round diamond F color vs1 clarity has Excellent proportions and a diamond grading report from GIA

www.jamesallen.com

Now compare those with these diamonds that have proportions and angles that fall within a strict range for maximizing the optics...notice that even the lower color grades (I've included even I-K colors) have so much light return that they still have amazing brilliance and sparkle:

Diamond | 0.702 ct D VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4542436

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 0.702 carat D color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4542436

www.whiteflash.com

Diamond | 0.808 ct G VS1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4543838

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 0.808 carat G color VS1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4543838

www.whiteflash.com

Diamond | 1.508 ct I VS1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4519828

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.508 carat I color VS1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4519828

www.whiteflash.com

Diamond | 1.52 ct J VS1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond GIA Certified | 4455686

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.52 carat J color VS1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the Gemological Institute of America (GIA). | 4455686

www.whiteflash.com

Diamond | 1.54 ct K VS1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond GIA Certified | 4430027

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.54 carat K color VS1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the Gemological Institute of America (GIA). | 4430027

www.whiteflash.com

Please use these examples as an almost indestructible basis for comparison: you can find a diamond with amazing optics and even push your local jeweler to get you one, but it will take some effort and may even take some trial and error...that is a part of the process as a consumer protecting their own best interests when interacting with some jewelers that are placing their profit margins before diamond beauty.

Don't be a stranger here: you have an entire army of diamond lovers, enthusiasts, prosumers, trade members that sell on optics and beauty, and even diamond cut designers/inventors willing to jump in and give you the absolute best advice and direction.
The icing on the cake is that you will not be pestered to buy from anyone here that does happen to be in the trade because it is forbidden per the forum rules...even direct messaging is disabled as another step to safeguard consumers against pressure.
No one here makes any commissions or gets any rewards: we make recommendations because we want our fellow humans and consumers to get the absolute best diamond for their budget...a diamond that will keep your (and everyone else's) eyes glued to it.

 

[sledge]

Keep in mind also that proportions alone don't determine performance, so even with the ideal-proportioned F we would recommend checking its light return with an ASET scope.

I agree with @Kim N and would further emphasize this is a VERY important thing to remember for anyone shopping for a diamond.

Yet, proportions are absolutely important because effectively they determine the path that light will enter, bounce and leave (or leak) in the diamond. The caveat is that we have to remember the values we see on a report is a condensed summary that has been averaged ad rounded.

In the case of crown & pavilion angles, there are 8 each. The crowns get measured, averaged and rounded to the nearest 0.5 degree. Same happens for pavilion except they are rounded at 0.1 degree.

Big picture, what this means is that while the average may be a 33.5/41.6, you may have one set of actuals at 33/41.5. Maybe two more at 34/41.7. I can speculate all day, but the point is the actuals have variance and sometimes what appears to work as an average doesn't always work when you analyze the individual actual values.

A detailed Sarine report would provide that additional data and help us further analyze the proportions. However, the more simple way is to confirm light performance with an idealscope or ASET.

Maybe this chart will help you visualize it better. While the averaged values show "excellent", look how little it takes to slip into GOOD or VERY GOOD on cut quality.

I might add there are other reasons to reject and return this stone if you are willing to do so and have the option, but I'd like to hear your input before I comment further.

 

[momofive]

Hi. Just chiming in here. I am currently in the market for a upgrade diamond. Right now I am using a PS recommended jeweler in the Diamond District in NYC as well - ID Jewelry. My current diamond is a radiant. I bought it years ago from a very good friend of our best friend. (We even see the jeweler at social events and he’s a great guy).
For this purchase I decided to use PS as I have been a lurker for years. I did all the research and bought myself an ASET scope as that seems to be an excellent tool to use to help make a decision, along with all the other factors.

When the scope was delivered, I put my current ring under it and was very disappointed. There was very little red and I saw lots of white and areas I could see through the diamond. Now, the diamond sparkles a lot and I get compliments on it fairly often, but, I felt a bit betrayed by the ”friend“ jeweler. I had asked him to find me the best diamond for my budget, but now I know I could have done better and he should have kept looking.

I am taking this current shopping experience very slow and have already told ID Jewelry that I want to gather as much info about any diamonds that are contenders and put the info up on PS for all these wonderful diamond experts to give their opinion. Even though the jeweler comes highly recommended, he still is the one selling the diamond. I want as many unbiased opinions as I can get to make an informed decision.
I hope this helps you.

 

[lulu_ma]

@NY_Resonant well, the experts have spoken. Remember, no one here has any financial interest in your decision-we all just want to see you get the best diamond for your budget

 

[NY_Resonant]

Good morning, everybody. Thank you for all the input!

Sledge, the crown angle is 33 (not 33.5) which changes things a little in the chart but your point stands…

Momofive, definitely need to be careful on 47th street in NYC — first shop I stopped at called “Fantasy Diamonds” tried to sell me a treated 1.7ct diamond for 13.5k. When I asked him about the word treated on report he tried to explain it as a positive permanent improvement on the stone .

Headlight, nothing has been signed or money exchanged for this diamond yet... So I have flexibility.

Deja, thank you for those comparisons. I see what you mean by the lower colors but any ”warmth” is something that would not be well received by my better half, she has made comments in the past about one of her friend’s rings having that yellow tone…I’ve looked at a number of H stones in person and I decided to stay in the D-G range for sure.

Kim, thank you for those diamond link options. Part of what I need to consider is the budget though and those options after tax would likely land me in the 16k-19k range versus the 14k all-in price for this stone. It’s hard to shell out 2-5k more for a sight-unseen stone on the internet versus one that I saw and looked beautiful in the office…

I like the white flash videos a lot but they seem to be under such controlled lighting which is good for comparing one ACA vs another ACA but I wish they had videos in different lighting(sun, office, dark environment, on the hand, at a normal viewing distance, etc).

One diamond that tempts me a LOT from videos is the Jann Paul Decagon White-Series. My eyes can definitely tell how amazing those look in the videos, even compared to other super ideals. Unfortunately they don’t list prices in the 1.4ct+ range (Smallest I’d go) on the website… I guess I’ll email them and ask?

Would a Jann Paul Decagon be something the people here would recommend?

Meanwhile, I think I’ll look at some more super ideals on the diamond district…and also ask my friend to see his G stone in different lighting outside/etc.

Thank you everybody!

 

[DejaWiz]

Good morning, everybody. Thank you for all the input!

Deja, thank you for those comparisons. I see what you mean by the lower colors but any ”warmth” is something that would not be well received by my better half, she has made comments in the past about one of her friend’s rings having that yellow tone…I’ve looked at a number of H stones in person and I decided to stay in the D-G range for sure.



One diamond that tempts me a LOT from videos is the Jann Paul Decagon White-Series. My eyes can definitely tell how amazing those look in the videos, even compared to other super ideals. Unfortunately they don’t list prices in the 1.4ct+ range (Smallest I’d go) on the website… I guess I’ll email them and ask?

Would a Jann Paul Decagon be something the people here would recommend?

Meanwhile, I think I’ll look at some more super ideals on the diamond district…and also ask my friend to see his G stone in different lighting outside/etc.

Thank you everybody!

You're very welcome...I wanted to post those lower color grades as examples of superior optics that will outperform poorly proportioned diamonds of even much higher color grades. Definitely stick to the color grade range that you and yours will be comfortable and happy with.

As for your other question:. Y E S
The JP Decagon is one heck of an amazing diamond. There are a handful of threads about those lucky enough to have gotten them providing lots of pictures and videos in real-world viewing environments, which will give you a realistic viewpoint of just how great the Decagon is.

 

[lovedogs]

Good morning, everybody. Thank you for all the input!

Sledge, the crown angle is 33 (not 33.5) which changes things a little in the chart but your point stands…

Momofive, definitely need to be careful on 47th street in NYC — first shop I stopped at called “Fantasy Diamonds” tried to sell me a treated 1.7ct diamond for 13.5k. When I asked him about the word treated on report he tried to explain it as a positive permanent improvement on the stone .

Headlight, nothing has been signed or money exchanged for this diamond yet... So I have flexibility.

Deja, thank you for those comparisons. I see what you mean by the lower colors but any ”warmth” is something that would not be well received by my better half, she has made comments in the past about one of her friend’s rings having that yellow tone…I’ve looked at a number of H stones in person and I decided to stay in the D-G range for sure.

Kim, thank you for those diamond link options. Part of what I need to consider is the budget though and those options after tax would likely land me in the 16k-19k range versus the 14k all-in price for this stone. It’s hard to shell out 2-5k more for a sight-unseen stone on the internet versus one that I saw and looked beautiful in the office…

I like the white flash videos a lot but they seem to be under such controlled lighting which is good for comparing one ACA vs another ACA but I wish they had videos in different lighting(sun, office, dark environment, on the hand, at a normal viewing distance, etc).

One diamond that tempts me a LOT from videos is the Jann Paul Decagon White-Series. My eyes can definitely tell how amazing those look in the videos, even compared to other super ideals. Unfortunately they don’t list prices in the 1.4ct+ range (Smallest I’d go) on the website… I guess I’ll email them and ask?

Would a Jann Paul Decagon be something the people here would recommend?

Meanwhile, I think I’ll look at some more super ideals on the diamond district…and also ask my friend to see his G stone in different lighting outside/etc.

Thank you everybody!

YES YES YES! Decagons are freaking amazing from what I've seen in videos and IRL pics.

WF has all of their ACAs in house, so they can take pics and videos for you in natural lighting if that helps.

 

[0515vision]

As someone who bought her first solitaire without PS input (to mark the first anniversary of my heart attack, no less), I desperately hope you purchase a diamond that will be beautiful through the decades.

Perhaps you’ve already seen these, but I love a good team effort and watched to pitch in:

https://www.briangavindiamonds.com/collections/diamonds/products/1-336-d-vs2-signature-round

https://www.briangavindiamonds.com/collections/diamonds/products/1-336-d-vs2-signature-round

Also, although it was beautiful your your eye as compared to the other stones the seller strategically showed, she will be comparing for decades to every other woman’s solitaire. If 18 months from now she says, “My diamond looks dull compared to so-and-so’s diamond,” you want to honestly be able to say, “It likely needs to be cleaned.” Mind-clean is another essential factor to this purchase.

Good luck!

 

[sledge]

@NY_Resonant a couple of thoughts:

1. Sorry for the misread on the crown angle. It does slightly improve, but the same issue exists. Just for clarity, even if you had ideal proportions, the same issue exists. I actually discovered what many here would consider a perfectly proportioned diamond that was a total mess. You can read more about it here if you are interested.

Why Advanced Images Matter...A Bad 34.5/40.8...

I'm just as guilty as anyone. Helping someone find a stone and run across one with that 34.5/40.8 combo. You smile. You then run through the rest of the proportions.... 57 table, 61.7 depth, 75 LGF's, 50 stars and medium-slightly thick girdle....check, check, check,check and check You...

www.pricescope.com

2. We haven't seen a picture or video of the stone in question, but generally speaking it will not be as aesthetically pleasing (ignoring light return) than a more ideally proportioned stone. Look at the static images below to see what I mean.

3. WF is a top tier vendor that keeps their ACA, ES and PS stones in-stock. They can easily pull them and provide additional video and photo in whatever environment you want upon request (within reason of course).

4. Agree with your color choice to stay G+ if you and your girl are color sensitive.

5. I respect the fact you are using your eyes to make judgment calls and putting your trust in a friend. There are two primary issues. First, the friend profits from your decision so he has bias. Second, your eyes aren't really trained to a point they can be fully trusted. Sure, if we line 5 or 6 stones up to each other most folks can pick the best of the group. But what if they all sucked? Great, that person chose the least sucky of the group but not a great diamond.

6. If you aren't willing to jump off on the super ideal train, have you considered finding a GIA 3X stone with ideal proportions and that tests out with proper light performance? They are harder to find but they do exist. On 47th, you should visit Yeukitel @ IDJ and let him know you are looking for a killer stone to meet PS standards and he will be able to help you out tremendously and will have scopes on hand to show you how they perform. If by chance you have the other diamond, he can probably scope it too and show you how it compares to others.

JA, GIA XXX, 62 table, 59-60 depth


JA, GIA XXX, TH, 54-57 table, 60.5-62 depth (True Hearts are JA's version of super ideals that follow a fairly tight set of proportions)

 

[lulu_ma]

What about this one?

Diamond | 1.527 ct G SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4473400

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.527 carat G color SI1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4473400

www.whiteflash.com

 

[sledge]

Also, can you clarify your concern with the sales tax issue? I don't see any magic in the process of buying from your friend.

Best I can tell, sales & use tax is 8.875% in NYC.

Business NYS Sales Tax

If $17k is your make budget, simple math tells us the most you can spend pre-tax to obtain what you want:

Convert tax percent to a decimal = 8.875% / 100 = 0.08875
Convert post tax to pre tax dollars = $17,000 / (1+0.08875) = $15,614.24
Check the math = $15,614.24 x 1.08875 = $17,000

So to me, you have $15,600 to spend on a stone. Now if you don't want to spend the full $17k that's a different story altogether.

 

[sledge]

A few more thoughts.

Have you considered buying one of the WF stones and having shipped in loose for you to evaluate with YOUR EYES? They have a hassle free return policy and it would give you an opportunity to compare the super ideal against the 62 table you love in the same lighting, environment, etc.

Also, another benefit with WF and some other super ideal vendors is their upgrade program. WF is pretty simple -- when you want to "upgrade" rather that means more carats, less carats, better color, lower color, etc then you simply pick a new ACA of equal or greater value and you get 100% of the original value you paid.

Many other places have their own restrictions like making you upgrade different C's or spending 2X the original amount or only giving you 50% of the original value or this or that. WF's upgrade program is pretty amazing and they have a good stock of stones so it's easy to upgrade as well.

You should ask your jeweler friend what his upgrade policy is? When he starts telling you a diamond is sentimental and forever, let him know girls suffer from this thing called diamond shrinkage syndrome (DSS) which is just a fancy way to say that at some point in the future, that 1.5 carat will feel too small and 2 carats+ is likely in the picture.

 

[MissGotRocks]

You will not find super ideals in the Diamond District booths. They may tell you they are but they cannot back them up with anything but their word. Worthless. Unless you are very trained, I would not venture into the Diamond District!
If a diamond has super ideal proportions, it will give you the best light return. If you go with a company with a superb upgrade policy, you can start smaller and upgrade as finances allow. Don’t get stuck with something with no return/upgrade policy as there are too many other sources to choose from.
I personally have purchased a total of nine diamonds from Whiteflash (some have been traded and upgraded) and can certainly vouch for their transparency and honesty. They would be happy to do pictures and videos for you.
It seems that you and your girlfriend are aware of a diamond’s performance, color and clarity. Just be sure to do your due diligence before purchasing so there will be no regrets. I understand budget but you get what you pay for so I would still rather have smaller but better quality.
Check out this thread - you will see the consistency of all of these diamonds - all beautifully cut! https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/show-me-your-whiteflash-acas.228560/

 

[jewels4life]

Good morning, everybody. Thank you for all the input!

Sledge, the crown angle is 33 (not 33.5) which changes things a little in the chart but your point stands…

Momofive, definitely need to be careful on 47th street in NYC — first shop I stopped at called “Fantasy Diamonds” tried to sell me a treated 1.7ct diamond for 13.5k. When I asked him about the word treated on report he tried to explain it as a positive permanent improvement on the stone .

Headlight, nothing has been signed or money exchanged for this diamond yet... So I have flexibility.

Deja, thank you for those comparisons. I see what you mean by the lower colors but any ”warmth” is something that would not be well received by my better half, she has made comments in the past about one of her friend’s rings having that yellow tone…I’ve looked at a number of H stones in person and I decided to stay in the D-G range for sure.

Kim, thank you for those diamond link options. Part of what I need to consider is the budget though and those options after tax would likely land me in the 16k-19k range versus the 14k all-in price for this stone. It’s hard to shell out 2-5k more for a sight-unseen stone on the internet versus one that I saw and looked beautiful in the office…

I like the white flash videos a lot but they seem to be under such controlled lighting which is good for comparing one ACA vs another ACA but I wish they had videos in different lighting(sun, office, dark environment, on the hand, at a normal viewing distance, etc).

One diamond that tempts me a LOT from videos is the Jann Paul Decagon White-Series. My eyes can definitely tell how amazing those look in the videos, even compared to other super ideals. Unfortunately they don’t list prices in the 1.4ct+ range (Smallest I’d go) on the website… I guess I’ll email them and ask?

Would a Jann Paul Decagon be something the people here would recommend?

Meanwhile, I think I’ll look at some more super ideals on the diamond district…and also ask my friend to see his G stone in different lighting outside/etc.

Thank you everybody!

Heck yes, I’d recommend a decagon! I love love mine and I have threads on here where I show videos of my decagon, versus my Brian gavin stone. Email Eugene @ jaan Paul. He’s a sweetheart and who I worked with.

 

[Kim N]

Good morning, everybody. Thank you for all the input!

Sledge, the crown angle is 33 (not 33.5) which changes things a little in the chart but your point stands…

Momofive, definitely need to be careful on 47th street in NYC — first shop I stopped at called “Fantasy Diamonds” tried to sell me a treated 1.7ct diamond for 13.5k. When I asked him about the word treated on report he tried to explain it as a positive permanent improvement on the stone .

Headlight, nothing has been signed or money exchanged for this diamond yet... So I have flexibility.

Deja, thank you for those comparisons. I see what you mean by the lower colors but any ”warmth” is something that would not be well received by my better half, she has made comments in the past about one of her friend’s rings having that yellow tone…I’ve looked at a number of H stones in person and I decided to stay in the D-G range for sure.

Kim, thank you for those diamond link options. Part of what I need to consider is the budget though and those options after tax would likely land me in the 16k-19k range versus the 14k all-in price for this stone. It’s hard to shell out 2-5k more for a sight-unseen stone on the internet versus one that I saw and looked beautiful in the office…

I like the white flash videos a lot but they seem to be under such controlled lighting which is good for comparing one ACA vs another ACA but I wish they had videos in different lighting(sun, office, dark environment, on the hand, at a normal viewing distance, etc).

One diamond that tempts me a LOT from videos is the Jann Paul Decagon White-Series. My eyes can definitely tell how amazing those look in the videos, even compared to other super ideals. Unfortunately they don’t list prices in the 1.4ct+ range (Smallest I’d go) on the website… I guess I’ll email them and ask?

Would a Jann Paul Decagon be something the people here would recommend?

Meanwhile, I think I’ll look at some more super ideals on the diamond district…and also ask my friend to see his G stone in different lighting outside/etc.

Thank you everybody!

100% yes to a JannPaul Decagon!

And like others have said, Whiteflash will take videos for you in any lighting you request.

 

[momofive]

Yeukitel is who I am working with at ID Jewelry. He knows I am a PSr and that I want to show all info and photos/videos to everyone on PS.

 

[NY_Resonant]

Thanks everybody for the input!

I’ve emailed Jann Paul but I think they are closed for the Chinese New Year? Will follow up next week. I have time, I plan to propose on April 2nd in Japan under the cherry blossoms .

Sledge, on the sales tax issue it’s just a matter of pricing. My friend said 14k all in which means he is selling me the diamond for 13k at the 8.8% tax rate. I’m sure he is still making a profit but it’s cheaper than any GIA 3x 1.5x G VS1 that I can find online so I definitely believe he is trying to give me a good deal. He’s an old style guy, heart of gold, who has been in the industry a long time but he is NOT a ASET/angles focused guy.

He will take the diamond back if she says no for a full refund, he will allocate 100% of the price towards any upgrades I do in the future, etc.

Now that doesn’t mean i’m not better served buying the diamond elsewhere!

I hear and agree about it being difficult to find amazing stones in the diamond district of NYC. I’ll do that this coming week just to increase my experience looking at diamonds in person.

I’ll wait to hear back from Jann Paul for sure, his decadon looks amazing and I like the idea of having a world-class more unique cut. Hopefully I can afford it

Thank you all for the Whiteflash info. I definitely liked a couple of their 1.5ct G SI choices in the 15k range (With the fear of inclusions being visible somehow). Getting some videos in other lighting, etc seems like a great idea.

 

[jewels4life]

Thanks everybody for the input!

I’ve emailed Jann Paul but I think they are closed for the Chinese New Year? Will follow up next week. I have time, I plan to propose on April 2nd in Japan under the cherry blossoms .

Sledge, on the sales tax issue it’s just a matter of pricing. My friend said 14k all in which means he is selling me the diamond for 13k at the 8.8% tax rate. I’m sure he is still making a profit but it’s cheaper than any GIA 3x 1.5x G VS1 that I can find online so I definitely believe he is trying to give me a good deal. He’s an old style guy, heart of gold, who has been in the industry a long time but he is NOT a ASET/angles focused guy.

He will take the diamond back if she says no for a full refund, he will allocate 100% of the price towards any upgrades I do in the future, etc.

Now that doesn’t mean i’m not better served buying the diamond elsewhere!

I hear and agree about it being difficult to find amazing stones in the diamond district of NYC. I’ll do that this coming week just to increase my experience looking at diamonds in person.

I’ll wait to hear back from Jann Paul for sure, his decadon looks amazing and I like the idea of having a world-class more unique cut. Hopefully I can afford it

Thank you all for the Whiteflash info. I definitely liked a couple of their 1.5ct G SI choices in the 15k range (With the fear of inclusions being visible somehow). Getting some videos in other lighting, etc seems like a great idea.

The decagons are amazing little fireballs . Plus, they send you a video of them making your ring. It’s very special to have that . The team at jaan Paul will set up a zoom appointment with you to show you stones and let you see what they look like and answer any questions you may have. If you decide on a stone, you’ll pay a 10 percent deposit to secure it

 

[0515vision]

This is question to those familiar with retail pricing of diamonds.

My impression is that there is generally a *healthy* markup on diamonds. At the $14k all-inclusive price for a subpar performance stone, I assume the seller is neither doing himself a disservice nor you a favor. Am I correct?

*written with respect and genuine curiostity*

 

[lulu_ma]

Thanks everybody for the input!

I’ve emailed Jann Paul but I think they are closed for the Chinese New Year? Will follow up next week. I have time, I plan to propose on April 2nd in Japan under the cherry blossoms .

Sledge, on the sales tax issue it’s just a matter of pricing. My friend said 14k all in which means he is selling me the diamond for 13k at the 8.8% tax rate. I’m sure he is still making a profit but it’s cheaper than any GIA 3x 1.5x G VS1 that I can find online so I definitely believe he is trying to give me a good deal. He’s an old style guy, heart of gold, who has been in the industry a long time but he is NOT a ASET/angles focused guy.

He will take the diamond back if she says no for a full refund, he will allocate 100% of the price towards any upgrades I do in the future, etc.

Now that doesn’t mean i’m not better served buying the diamond elsewhere!

I hear and agree about it being difficult to find amazing stones in the diamond district of NYC. I’ll do that this coming week just to increase my experience looking at diamonds in person.

I’ll wait to hear back from Jann Paul for sure, his decadon looks amazing and I like the idea of having a world-class more unique cut. Hopefully I can afford it

Thank you all for the Whiteflash info. I definitely liked a couple of their 1.5ct G SI choices in the 15k range (With the fear of inclusions being visible somehow). Getting some videos in other lighting, etc seems like a great idea.

If your gf notices color, I am going to bet that she will notice cut, as well. It is her engagement ring. Go for the best cut that is in your budget. Then, you will never have to wonder.

I used to think that color and clarity were the most important C's. Before I knew about PS, my DH and I helped my FIL pick out an 3.3 ct upgrade for my MIL. Oh if I knew then what I know now.

The stone is pretty, but now I look at it and wish that we had picked her a stone with a better cut. Btw, this stone has a 60% table.

 

[NY_Resonant]

This is question to those familiar with retail pricing of diamonds.

My impression is that there is generally a *healthy* markup on diamonds. At the $14k all-inclusive price for a subpar performance stone, I assume the seller is neither doing himself a disservice nor you a favor. Am I correct?

*written with respect and genuine curiostity*

The only color I have on online wholesale markups is from Ritani which supposedly discloses it. Take this diamond for example:

1.50 Carat Round Diamond GIA 6224734346 | Ritani

1.5 Carat Round Earth Diamond ID Cut F Color VS1 Clarity with diamond report number GIA #6224734346

www.ritani.com

1.5ct, F, VS1 for 13.6k. They claim they bought it for 12.77k. They even provided a hearts picture (no aset or arrows shown though). Proportions look fine too with a slight lean towards fire with the 35.5/40.6 angles combo.

 

[Bonfire]

I’m going to be blunt here.
Never buy a diamond from “a friend of a friend.” You aren’t getting a good deal at all!

You’ve been given excellent advice here by people that know more about diamonds than you’ll find anywhere and want to share that knowledge.
Keep in mind, no one here has any other motive other than to educate you about what to look for in diamond cut and what to stay away from if you want a gorgeous stone for your girlfriend (and we know you do!)
I’m confident as you continue to learn, you will make a wise choice.