Expectations with Small Budget?

[hawk25]

Hi everyone, I've been lurking for the past few weeks to try to prepare myself for buying an engagement ring in the next few months, trying to learn everything I could. To be honest, I'll probably be asking for everyone's expert advice in a while, and hopefully learn enough to one day meaningfully contribute here.

But until then, I'd like to ask whether its reasonable to expect to buy good quality brilliant cut diamond, around 0.7ct for around a $1500 budget online, give or take a few hundred? Would it worth moving down to around a 0.6ct to get better quality?

I know everyone has different expectations, and reading PS has definitely skewed mine lol, but yours are more than good enough for me. I realize I wouldn't get a H&A for that budget (I'd love to be proven wrong though), but something with lots of fire and brilliance. Just has to be eye-clean, going to be put into a WG setting with sidestones so color isn't very important (at least according to my research at truthaboutdiamonds). I haven't been impressed at all with local stores, and am quite impressed with JA

I can see lot of small time lurkers being in the same boat as me, so what does everyone think?

 

[heididdl]

I think you might have to go to .60 here is a JA http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.60-carat-H-color-SI1-clarity-Excellent-cut-sku-196828
All I know is that cut is the most important of the C.......to get an eye clean s1 would be nice and H is terrific. If you want to go with the .70 you might have to expand your budget to 2,500 or so...

Definetely get a certified stones as you will see lerking we have all learned the hard way.

lol

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I would agree that excellent cut is essential, and many people choose H or I SI1 to get the most they can for the money. If you don't mind a little tint in the stone, you can go to J SI1. But I personally don't usually recommend going lower than I color. I SI1's at .70 start at about $2000 on James Allen, although they give a small additional discount to pricescope members and for paying by wire. So you'll be in the .60 range for an H or I SI1 with excellent cut.

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.61-carat-I-color-SI1-clarity-Excellent-cut-sku-198160

 

[hawk25]

I guess I was hoping for a 0.7ct since BGD is selling a 0.606ct Signature H&A right now for $1995. Unless there's -that- much of a noticeable difference between H&A vs non-H&A (I still have a lot of research to do I think), I wouldn't mind getting a non-branded (price hiked) H&A if it meant a bigger diamond. My max budget is $2000 (new graduate budget)

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.606-i-vs2-round-diamond-ags-104061539112

Now to go to an actual store to see the size difference between a 0.7ct and 0.6ct...I wish I could get a mold of my girlfriend's hand to bring with me lol. I think she's a size 7.5, so I don't want it looking too small

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I guess I was hoping for a 0.7ct since BGD is selling a 0.606ct Signature H&A right now for $1995. Unless there's -that- much of a noticeable difference between H&A vs non-H&A (I still have a lot of research to do I think), I wouldn't mind getting a non-branded (price hiked) H&A if it meant a bigger diamond. My max budget is $2000 (new graduate budget)

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.606-i-vs2-round-diamond-ags-104061539112

Now to go to an actual store to see the size difference between a 0.7ct and 0.6ct...I wish I could get a mold of my girlfriend's hand to bring with me lol. I think she's a size 7.5, so I don't want it looking too small

A non-branded H&A is going to cost you more than the James Allen stones posted above! They are excellent cut but NOT hearts and arrows! There is a price premium for those no matter where you buy them.

If she is a size 7.5, you may want to boost the size appearance by getting a halo setting. Because if you are right about her size, you are correct that a .60-.70 will look fairly small. This one is only $875 in 18k white gold and I think it comes in platinum for a little more.

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/engagement-rings/halo/18k-white-gold-pave-halo-engagement-ring-round-center-item-7081

Did you mean the total budget for diamond and setting is $2000 or just the diamond?

 

[BriBee]

I guess I was hoping for a 0.7ct since BGD is selling a 0.606ct Signature H&A right now for $1995. Unless there's -that- much of a noticeable difference between H&A vs non-H&A (I still have a lot of research to do I think), I wouldn't mind getting a non-branded (price hiked) H&A if it meant a bigger diamond. My max budget is $2000 (new graduate budget)

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.606-i-vs2-round-diamond-ags-104061539112

Now to go to an actual store to see the size difference between a 0.7ct and 0.6ct...I wish I could get a mold of my girlfriend's hand to bring with me lol. I think she's a size 7.5, so I don't want it looking too small

Is there someone you can take shopping with you that has a similar finger size (mom, sister, friend)? Then you could get an idea of finger coverage. It's great that you know her size because if you look at local stores you can tell them and maybe there will be a sales person with similar finger size that can help you too.

 

[JulieN]

You can get a nice .7 in budget. .8 is pushing too hard.

 

[hawk25]

Did you mean the total budget for diamond and setting is $2000 or just the diamond?

Oh sorry, I worded that post wrong/weirdly. I meant that for my budget, I believe I should avoid H&A entirely to avoid the markup, unless people here think it's worth getting a smaller H&A (like the BGD link I posted) vs another James Allen one slightly bigger. Am I right?

With the one you suggested vs the BGD one, the difference is about $260 for the same size. For arguments sake, if the other specs were relatively the same (SI1 vs VS2, H vs I colour), then the $260 is the H&A markup. Would it be worth the money?

Unfortunately, I know she doesn't like Halo settings (it would be nice if she did). The $2000 budget would be for the diamond only, but I have a sneaking suspicion that as the time to buy comes closer that amount will start to inch up lol.

 

[hawk25]

Is there someone you can take shopping with you that has a similar finger size (mom, sister, friend)? Then you could get an idea of finger coverage. It's great that you know her size because if you look at local stores you can tell them and maybe there will be a sales person with similar finger size that can help you too.

That's a good idea, but I think I'm alone on this one. The only people I can think of are her sisters (its going to be a surprise, so they're both out of the question ). I'll definitely ask the sales people though, thanks.

I just browsed through all 64 pages of the under 1ct SMTB thread trying to judge finger coverage lol.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Well, it would be worth $260 to me to get hearts and arrows, but in order to get you to a larger stone, you might forgo that to get greater size. $2000 just for the diamond will help a lot! You can get into a .70 with that budget. Here's an example:

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-I-color-SI1-clarity-sku-198087

 

[hawk25]

Well, it would be worth $260 to me to get hearts and arrows, but in order to get you to a larger stone, you might forgo that to get greater size. $2000 just for the diamond will help a lot! You can get into a .70 with that budget. Here's an example:

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-I-color-SI1-clarity-sku-198087

H&A was never too important to me if it meant sacrificing size (in my inexperienced opinion), but if this video by GoodOldGold is accurate in most cases, I might reconsider.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbnGLi04JjM

 

[BriBee]

Glad you found that video, it does a great job of showing just how important cut is. I would really consider going with an H&A stone.

 

[bunnycat]

Well, it would be worth $260 to me to get hearts and arrows, but in order to get you to a larger stone, you might forgo that to get greater size. $2000 just for the diamond will help a lot! You can get into a .70 with that budget. Here's an example:

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-I-color-SI1-clarity-sku-198087

H&A was never too important to me if it meant sacrificing size (in my inexperienced opinion), but if this video by GoodOldGold is accurate in most cases, I might reconsider.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbnGLi04JjM

You can still get a nicely performing stone without the H/A symmetry. It's not a measure of performance, just symmetry so for your budget, I'd agree you don't really NEED it (wanting it may be another thing). I think you can get up to .7 with $2K. It may just take a while to find something with suitably well cut proportions on JA. You have to do a lot of sifting.

Another alternative you might consider is giving ID Jewlery a call and check out the E-rings under 5K thread. On the last page is a ring done by ID Jewelry for a guy with a smaller budget than yours that turned out really well.

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/show-me-your-e-rings-under-5k.184135/page-4']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/show-me-your-e-rings-under-5k.184135/page-4[/URL]

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Well, it would be worth $260 to me to get hearts and arrows, but in order to get you to a larger stone, you might forgo that to get greater size. $2000 just for the diamond will help a lot! You can get into a .70 with that budget. Here's an example:

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-I-color-SI1-clarity-sku-198087

H&A was never too important to me if it meant sacrificing size (in my inexperienced opinion), but if this video by GoodOldGold is accurate in most cases, I might reconsider.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbnGLi04JjM

Nooooo! That example "common rb" cut is NOT a GIA Excellent cut stone like the ones I am posting! I have bought two diamonds from Good Old Gold and one was hearts and arrows and one was GIA Excellent (ideal) cut. THIS video shows you can hardly tell the difference! Look at the two stones on the left:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwiM3COzjFM&list=UUEV7slr-i-VduBBnfv9MxhA&index=1&feature=plcp

 

[bunnycat]

Glad you found that video, it does a great job of showing just how important cut is. I would really consider going with an H&A stone.

One thing about the video is that we don't know is what he's using as his "common cut" or what the specs are on the stone so it would be wrong to assume that just because the stone is a "common cut" it would be similar to the performance of a Non- H/A stone that had near ideal specs. A non H/A stone that fits in ideal specs is going to perform very nicely...it's just finding them that takes time.

 

[bunnycat]

Well, it would be worth $260 to me to get hearts and arrows, but in order to get you to a larger stone, you might forgo that to get greater size. $2000 just for the diamond will help a lot! You can get into a .70 with that budget. Here's an example:

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-I-color-SI1-clarity-sku-198087

H&A was never too important to me if it meant sacrificing size (in my inexperienced opinion), but if this video by GoodOldGold is accurate in most cases, I might reconsider.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbnGLi04JjM

Nooooo! That example "common rb" cut is NOT a GIA Excellent cut stone like the ones I am posting! I have bought two diamonds from Good Old Gold and one was hearts and arrows and one was GIA Excellent (ideal) cut. THIS video shows you can hardly tell the difference! Look at the two stones on the left:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwiM3COzjFM&list=UUEV7slr-i-VduBBnfv9MxhA&index=1&feature=plcp

what she said!

 

[BriBee]

Well, it would be worth $260 to me to get hearts and arrows, but in order to get you to a larger stone, you might forgo that to get greater size. $2000 just for the diamond will help a lot! You can get into a .70 with that budget. Here's an example:

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-I-color-SI1-clarity-sku-198087

H&A was never too important to me if it meant sacrificing size (in my inexperienced opinion), but if this video by GoodOldGold is accurate in most cases, I might reconsider.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbnGLi04JjM

Nooooo! That example "common rb" cut is NOT a GIA Excellent cut stone like the ones I am posting! I have bought two diamonds from Good Old Gold and one was hearts and arrows and one was GIA Excellent (ideal) cut. THIS video shows you can hardly tell the difference! Look at the two stones on the left:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwiM3COzjFM&list=UUEV7slr-i-VduBBnfv9MxhA&index=1&feature=plcp

what she said!

thritto, she's totally right

 

[hawk25]

Ah I see now, thanks for the help everyone! 4 hours since joining PS and I'm loving how much I'm learning already lol

 

[stargurl78]

I definitely agree with DS! If you are on a budget you can find a great stone by going with a GIA Excellent cut rather than splurging on an H&A.

 

[distracts]

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.63-carat-J-color-VS2-clarity-Excellent-cut-sku-184165
http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-J-color-SI1-clarity-Excellent-cut-sku-179687
http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.74-carat-J-color-SI2-clarity-sku-198300

I'd go with an excellent cut but not super-ideal or H&A. Personally, I'd go with the .63 or .7, not shell out the extra to get the .74 because the size difference isn't THAT much, and put the money into a blingier setting.

 

[farmer gal]

If you could swing 2000 this stone would be my choice. It appears very white to the eye and has a beautiful cut as well.

http://www.jamesallen.com/#!/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.75-carat-J-color-VS2-clarity-Excellent-cut-sku-196353

I would place it on hold asap if you are even slightly interested. I would also request an idealscope image. Make sure you also ask what the price would be with the pricescope discount.

 

[ChrisES]

Cut is more important that size.

That said, there is an obnoxious breakpoint / price jump at .70 even.

Because it sounds like you aren't looking to buy right away, I would encourage you to check out all the PS vendors on a regular basis and keep an eye out for AGS0/GIAX stones in the .67-.69 range. They're rare, because cutters look to hit that breakpoint, but you can sometimes find great stones just under it and get something with really nice spread for the buck (and even better appearance because well cut stones throw more light and look bigger than they are).

 

[hawk25]

Thanks for the suggestions everyone, I'm still 2 or so months away from having to purchase the diamond, but it's definitely nice to know my options for right now. I'm going to keep an eye out for a 0.67-0.69, non H&A, only excellent/ideal cuts (something has to pop up within 2 months, right?). The settings I've liked on JA so far will cost as much (if not more) as the diamond itself though (I'm sure some PSers wouldn't agree to that). 0.65-0.7ct looked about the right size I'm looking for, although I do wonder about the colour if the sidestones are a F or G, like this http://jamesallen.com/#!/engagement...lloped-shared-prong-engagement-ring-item-3362 setting.

I went shopping at B&M stores today to get a feel for setting choices, and I was amazed at the range of things I was told (most not in a good way). A rep at Birks told me that GIA cut grades are terrible, as "25% of all diamonds fit the excellent range, not like our diamonds. A lot of people are angry at GIA right now because they are owned by the diamond industry and are purposely getting lax". Peoples Jewellers tried to push a $2000 0.9ct ring that had the biggest feather I've ever seen, it looked like the stone cracked in two (no loupe needed). A small shop's owner that makes its own settings claimed that a diamond he was showing me was a VS2, but when I asked for a loupe, there was a large black inclusion clearly visible in the center face (and to my very inexperienced eye too). When I pointed it out, he brushed it off. I'm still quite young (even more so in appearance), so maybe they thought they could get away with it. Needless to say, my faith in B&M stores is all but gone.

The sales person at Cartier was nice, and he brought up that they don't have an upgrade policy because they don't reuse diamonds, and tried to sell me on the point that their diamonds are 'safe'. I never really thought of that before (I don't really care either to be honest).

The one consistent thing they all suggested was that buying online wasn't safe, wasn't reliable, and would be inferior to their diamonds. Well, they are sales people afterall...

 

[mdmc]

Thanks for the suggestions everyone, I'm still 2 or so months away from having to purchase the diamond, but it's definitely nice to know my options for right now. I'm going to keep an eye out for a 0.67-0.69, non H&A, only excellent/ideal cuts (something has to pop up within 2 months, right?). The settings I've liked on JA so far will cost as much (if not more) as the diamond itself though (I'm sure some PSers wouldn't agree to that). 0.65-0.7ct looked about the right size I'm looking for, although I do wonder about the colour if the sidestones are a F or G, like this http://jamesallen.com/#!/engagement...lloped-shared-prong-engagement-ring-item-3362 setting.

I went shopping at B&M stores today to get a feel for setting choices, and I was amazed at the range of things I was told (most not in a good way). A rep at Birks told me that GIA cut grades are terrible, as "25% of all diamonds fit the excellent range, not like our diamonds. A lot of people are angry at GIA right now because they are owned by the diamond industry and are purposely getting lax". Peoples Jewellers tried to push a $2000 0.9ct ring that had the biggest feather I've ever seen, it looked like the stone cracked in two (no loupe needed). A small shop's owner that makes its own settings claimed that a diamond he was showing me was a VS2, but when I asked for a loupe, there was a large black inclusion clearly visible in the center face (and to my very inexperienced eye too). When I pointed it out, he brushed it off. I'm still quite young (even more so in appearance), so maybe they thought they could get away with it. Needless to say, my faith in B&M stores is all but gone.

The sales person at Cartier was nice, and he brought up that they don't have an upgrade policy because they don't reuse diamonds, and tried to sell me on the point that their diamonds are 'safe'. I never really thought of that before (I don't really care either to be honest).

The one consistent thing they all suggested was that buying online wasn't safe, wasn't reliable, and would be inferior to their diamonds. Well, they are sales people afterall...

I have to tell you I had the very same experience. I went to all my local jewelers. Most did not have certified stones and told me they were not necessary. Another told me color is the most important C . I left shaking my head.