First diamond purchase

[spum]

Hi all,

I have attempted to learn as much as I can about diamonds prior to purchasing an engagement ring, and at this point I think I've learned just about all I can from the materials available freely online. Having found what is (in my extremely ill-informed opinion) the ideal diamond for my preferences and finances, I was hoping to get some more expert commentary on it so that I can find out all the wrong ways I'm thinking about this.

Without further ado, the stone I'm looking at is this one (see the GIA and GCAL certs):

http://www.bluenile.com/princess-cut-diamond-1-carat-signature-ideal-cut-f-color-vs1-clarity_LD02246781?eid=1620

I'm using Blue Nile because their website is excellent when it comes to searching for a very specific set of criteria.

I am locked in by the special lady's preferences to a princess cut and a platinum band, and I am locked in by my own finances to the 1 carat price zone. I am able to afford just about any diamond in that size range, i.e. $5 to $10k. Since I can afford it, my thought process was to require Blue Nile's "signature ideal" cut right off the bat, as this is the most important of the four C's. I'm not going to spend thousands of dollars for a diamond with no fire or sparkle. As far as color, I was willing to go with anything G or better, although I recognize that E and D are, for a person like me or the special gal, indistinguishable from F. This diamond happens to be an F. I also limited myself to VS1 or higher, again simply because I can afford it and this seems to be other people's cut offs. I could probably relax this criterion and not notice much difference. My eyes are not microscopes, after all. Finally, I required that the girdle not be too thick (no worse than "slightly thick").

When I apply this filter to Blue Nile's inventory, I get a few dozen diamonds starting at around $7k and reaching as high as $9k. Girdle is not technically searchable, so many of these can also be eliminated. What I then did was I hand-picked about a half dozen, looked at the GCAL certifications, and found the one with the best optical brightness map. The link above shows that diamond. As an example of another diamond that meets my criteria but whose optical brightness appears inferior, see this:

http://www.bluenile.com/princess-cut-diamond-1-carat-signature-ideal-cut-f-color-vvs1-clarity_LD02919974?eid=1620

This diamond is actually a VVS1, but notice how much more blue there is in the optical brightness map. My main question, aside from general comments about the stone I selected and my thought process in arriving at it, is how much stock should be put in the GCAL optical brightness map as a kind of "tie-breaker" between diamonds that look good by the numbers. Is there a different criterion I should use instead? If you think the rock I picked is lousy, please, please do share with me why you think so. I would tremendously appreciate any and all responses as I prepare to spend an entire year's savings!

 

[JulieN]

It looks fine, a little uneven but won't be noticeable IRL, crown height ok but could be higher. BN Signature is just so expensive for what you get, though. For PSers who want a princess from BN, I usually steer them towards AGS 0 for the better pricing and ideal cut:

Two-chevron for bold flashes, really nice size, but no simulated ASET: http://www.bluenile.com/princess-cut-diamond-1-carat-very-good-cut-f-color-vvs2-clarity_LD03066713?click_id=130179891

Nice size for a 1 carat, ASET not quite as even or red as the next two, but still will be really nice: http://www.bluenile.com/princess-cut-diamond-1-carat-very-good-cut-f-color-vs1-clarity_LD02013273?click_id=19093847

Really symmetric ASET with lots of red, very square:
http://www.bluenile.com/princess-cut-diamond-1-carat-very-good-cut-g-color-vvs2-clarity_LD02020935?click_id=701882344
http://www.bluenile.com/princess-cut-diamond-1-carat-good-cut-g-color-vs2-clarity_LD02406677?click_id=316867723

 

[Christina...]

My problem with BN is that you can't view the stone before you purchase. Facet patterns vary greatly in fancy shapes, one does not necessarily look like another, so seeing actual photos of the diamond would be very important to me. I would also want a gemological review before making a purchase of this size. AGS is currently the only lab designating a cut grade for princess cuts, this would offer me even more reassurance that the stone was going to be a nice performer.

here are few more options to consider..
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare.aspx?idnos=2612497,2568621,2787278,2803911,2812731,2405185u

ETA: You could also consider lowering clarity to an eye clean SI1 which to the naked eye will look the same as a VS1 without the price tag. This would allow you to increase the size of the stone if you wanted to.

 

[spum]

Thank you very much for the quick response, Julie. I'll try to respond with follow-ups inline for clarity:

It looks fine, a little uneven but won't be noticeable IRL, crown height ok but could be higher. BN Signature is just so expensive for what you get, though. For PSers who want a princess from BN, I usually steer them towards AGS 0 for the better pricing and ideal cut:

Two-chevron for bold flashes, really nice size, but no simulated ASET: http://www.bluenile.com/princess-cut-diamond-1-carat-very-good-cut-f-color-vvs2-clarity_LD03066713?click_id=130179891

When you say, "A little uneven," are you talking about the symmetry of the blue areas on the optical brilliance map? What is more important, having fewer blue areas, or having what blue areas are present be symmetrical?

Regarding the different facet patterns, do you have a good link that describes why you might want one versus another? Is this something that is best viewed in person, at a jeweler?

Nice size for a 1 carat, ASET not quite as even or red as the next two, but still will be really nice: http://www.bluenile.com/princess-cut-diamond-1-carat-very-good-cut-f-color-vs1-clarity_LD02013273?click_id=19093847

I'm curious why your Blue Nile results all have these AGSL certs. Do you prefer them over GIA or GCAL? Why? What is it in the AGSL report that you're most concerned with? Do you have a link that describes how to interpret the ASET images?

Really symmetric ASET with lots of red, very square:
http://www.bluenile.com/princess-cut-diamond-1-carat-very-good-cut-g-color-vvs2-clarity_LD02020935?click_id=701882344
http://www.bluenile.com/princess-cut-diamond-1-carat-good-cut-g-color-vs2-clarity_LD02406677?click_id=316867723

Again, you mention symmetry. As with the GCAL optical brightness plot, is symmetry the most important factor, or is the predominance of one or more of the individual colors most important?

As a final question, why do you think the per-carat cost on these three is so low (closer to $7k, as opposed to $7.8k) compared to the stone I linked to? I see that the last two are G rather than F, and they're all VS1, VVS2, or VS2 rather than VVS1. Do these factors account for most of the difference, or is there another important factor (i.e. cut-related) that I'm not considering?

I apologize for the barrage of questions, but thank you again for anything and everything you have to say. You clearly know a lot more about this than me, but I'm trying to make an educated decision and appreciate your expert opinion!

 

[spum]

Christina, thank you as well for your post. I'm glad to see you're challenging my choice of Blue Nile, because it was fairly arbitrary. I like the White Flash link you sent below, and they certainly appear reputable--do you have experience buying from them?

My problem with BN is that you can't view the stone before you purchase. Facet patterns vary greatly in fancy shapes, one does not necessarily look like another, so seeing actual photos of the diamond would be very important to me. I would also want a gemological review before making a purchase of this size. AGS is currently the only lab designating a cut grade for princess cuts, this would offer me even more reassurance that the stone was going to be a nice performer.

Do you think it would be worthwhile to go into a jewelry store with the express purpose of looking at different princess facet patterns and seeing what I like the best, or is there an online resource that would also be a good starting point? Regarding gemological review, what is the definition of that term? Is it simply that the diamond has been looked at with a scope / ASET and photos are available, or is it something beyond what White Flash provides? I'm apologize if my questions here are confusing.

here are few more options to consider..
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare.aspx?idnos=2612497,2568621,2787278,2803911,2812731,2405185u

ETA: You could also consider lowering clarity to an eye clean SI1 which to the naked eye will look the same as a VS1 without the price tag. This would allow you to increase the size of the stone if you wanted to.

How would you know, without seeing it in person, that a lower-clarity diamond is actually clear to the eye? Would a photo like those in the White Flash listings be sufficient?

Thanks again for all your help. I appreciate any feedback you can provide.

 

[JulieN]

In all of the pictures in the GCAL report you can see that one side under the table is not as bright as the other 3 sides. Re GCAL report blue, it is supposed to be leakage. Princesses leak more than rounds, that is the nature of the cut. A very symmetric, even cut is a sign of high cut quality. I think your initial pick should be very nice, and you should be happy with it.
There are 3 ways to cut a princess pavilion, 2-, 3-, or 4-chevron. The 2 chevron will have the boldest flashes, 4 will have more pinfire, and 3 will be inbetween. Here is a video comparing 2 and 3 chevrons: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nneVwREmtgY On PS most people prefer bold flashes over smaller pinfire, but if you want a "typical" princess look of glittery sparkles the 3-chevron is the one.

My Blue Nile suggestions are all AGS reports because I selected for them; AGS has a cut grade for princesses, GIA does not.

Here is how to read an ASET: http://www.whiteflash.com/about-diamonds/diamond-education/about-aset.htm
If you look at the ASET for the two Gs I posted you'll notice the area under the table is almost all red with a very symmetric distribution of blue. The red extends all the way into the four corners and also in the middle of each side of the square. Between the 4, AGS I posted probably I would take a chance on the 1.20 F, or go with the 1.03 G VVS2 to save $1000 over your original choice. The 1.02 G VS2 is a little on the small side, though it does come in at the lowest price. Or stick with your original BN Sig Ideal.

The difference in the pricing between the BN Sig Ideal and the AGS Ideals is branding; BN charges a bit more for their Signature Ideal because they can.

Whiteflash ACA princesses are very nice, the pricing is a little bit lower than Blue Nile if you pay by bankwire, and they have nicer settings than BN. The photos are not sufficient, you can email or call them to determine how visible the inclusions are.

 

[spum]

Julie,

Thank you again for the feedback, and I apologize for the delay in responding this time. In reviewing your previous posts, I have one additional question that I did not think of at the time. Namely, I noticed that the two "really symmetric ASET" stones from Blue Nile you linked to above are given an "ideal" cut rating by AGS, but only "good" or "very good" by Blue Nile. What is the reason for the discrepancy--or more to the point, how is Blue Nile assessing cut ratings? I hope it is not simply a formula based on table and depth.

As a second thought, I searched Whiteflash's inventory for 1.00 - 1.10 carat, F - G color, VVS1 - VS2 clarity, AGS-ideal cut diamonds, and found only the following six stones:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare.aspx?idnos=2835508,2568621,2612497,2405185,2377157,2377156

Although I have attempted to grade these stones myself per your explanations, I would appreciate very much if you could share your own thoughts on their relative merits. To my untrained eyes--I'm going to refer to them by their price--the $7586 stone looks best in the ASET images, while the $7490 looks the best through the ideal scope. Visually, I think all of them except the $7131 and $7480 stones look lovely. (I am not a fan of the four-chevron design.)

Thank you so much, once again!

 

[JulieN]

Blue Nile has only Signture, VG, Good,and Fair cut grades for their fancy diamonds.

Only diamonds cut specifically for Blue Nile through their contracted cutter, that also meets the Signature standards, can be a BN Signature Ideal. Any other princess, even ones that look better than a Signature Ideal, won't be a Signature Ideal.

I usually do not go looking for VVS stones, VS is more than plenty. All of WF's ACAs will be really nice. If you want to get into specifics about each one, you should get on the phone or email the WF staff, they will be able to provide more details.

 

[JulieN]

Actually, if I were you...

10K budget, you seem to be focusing on higher color and clarity, if you value fine craftsmanship, I would get this one: http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=view-id-diamond-infinity&id=112

You can see it if you are near any of these jewelers: http://craftedbyinfinity.com/web/locations-usa/
Or Wink will send it to you, free shipping both ways.

 

[spum]

Blue Nile has only Signture, VG, Good,and Fair cut grades for their fancy diamonds.

Only diamonds cut specifically for Blue Nile through their contracted cutter, that also meets the Signature standards, can be a BN Signature Ideal. Any other princess, even ones that look better than a Signature Ideal, won't be a Signature Ideal.

I usually do not go looking for VVS stones, VS is more than plenty. All of WF's ACAs will be really nice. If you want to get into specifics about each one, you should get on the phone or email the WF staff, they will be able to provide more details.

Julie, this is exactly the response I was looking / hoping for. I am not interested in a brand name for the sake of a brand name. I appreciate very much the scientific approach AGS takes, and I'd rather have a diamond that performs brilliantly under ASET testing than one that gets an arbitrary stamp of approval from BlueNile.

Actually, if I were you...

10K budget, you seem to be focusing on higher color and clarity, if you value fine craftsmanship, I would get this one: http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=view-id-diamond-infinity&id=112

You can see it if you are near any of these jewelers: http://craftedbyinfinity.com/web/locations-usa/
Or Wink will send it to you, free shipping both ways.

I probably gave you that impression with my original post, but I am quite content with anything that is eye-clean. A VS2, for example, would be fine by me. Per your recommendation, I spoke with a professional at Whiteflash and I must say, she was extremely polite and helpful. They earned my business with their support staff and their emphasis on AGS certifications.

So, I was able to narrow my selection down to just these three:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare.aspx?idnos=2568621,2612497,2405185

They are virtually identical from a color-clarity standpoint, and the nearly identical per-carat prices seem to reflect that. There appears to be a two-, a three-, and a four-chevron stone in the bunch. All three look like they have very appealing ASETs, so I was hoping you could lend your expert opinion about what differences I might see if I could examine these three stones in person. I am almost positive I will purchase one of these, so your thoughts would be very much appreciated.