ChemEngineer
Rough_Rock
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- Nov 29, 2008
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Got it, thanks. I was planning to go to the jeweler my mom knows.
I''ll research that topic more because I don''t know where I would find an independent appraisers in my area.
Going to purchase a stone in the next 48 hrs. I need your help !!
- Thread starter ChemEngineer
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Got it, thanks. I was planning to go to the jeweler my mom knows.
I''ll research that topic more because I don''t know where I would find an independent appraisers in my area.
Mrs W
Brilliant_Rock
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You know, there are some really great deals at bluenile but ppl don''t really know/care bc they don''t have all the info(idealscope) and I tend to think that they forget about the 30 day inspection pd. This diamonds is very promising and many pricescopers have chosen bluenile over other vendors bc they have some of the best prices online and those ppl who did are very happy and satified with their purchase. So ChemEngineer don''t let the bluenile diamond scare you bc its not from WF or GOG, there are other great diamonds out there too...
Here is one pricescoper who is very satisfied with bluenile and its a beautiful stone by the way
The stones Honey22 posted are very nice but if you really want the bluenile stone, I say get it, inspect it and if you don''t really love it then send it back.....It won''t hurt trying to get what you really want at a great price right? The only thing that could happen is that you send it back or you keep it bc you really love it and you also get a great deal
Here is one pricescoper who is very satisfied with bluenile and its a beautiful stone by the way
The stones Honey22 posted are very nice but if you really want the bluenile stone, I say get it, inspect it and if you don''t really love it then send it back.....It won''t hurt trying to get what you really want at a great price right? The only thing that could happen is that you send it back or you keep it bc you really love it and you also get a great deal
Absolutely Breann, I dont doubt for a minute that BN have some great stones. But, at PS we are kinda cut freaks and look for the best cut for our money. BN just doesn''t offer the same level of service that GOG or WF do.Date: 11/29/2008 7:04:06 PM
Author: Mrs W
You know, there are some really great deals at bluenile but ppl don''t really know/care bc they don''t have all the info(idealscope) and I tend to think that they forget about the 30 day inspection pd. This diamonds is very promising and many pricescopers have chosen bluenile over other vendors bc they have some of the best prices online and those ppl who did are very happy and satified with their purchase. So ChemEngineer don''t let the bluenile diamond scare you bc its not from WF or GOG, there are other great diamonds out there too...
Here is one pricescoper who is very satisfied with bluenile and its a beautiful stone by the way
The stones Honey22 posted are very nice but if you really want the bluenile stone, I say get it, inspect it and if you don''t really love it then send it back.....It won''t hurt trying to get what you really want at a great price right? The only thing that could happen is that you send it back or you keep it bc you really love it and you also get a great deal
If the OP is looking for a good quality stone, then the BN would suffice. If he wants the best sparlkly stone he can get, then he should keep looking.
I do agree the BN has a great inspection period, but for the many, looking at a single diamond at home isn''t really helpful. You have nothing to compare it too, and if you havn''t seen many diamonds IRL, then pretty much anything will look great. We had a poster recently who insisted on being able to see the diamonds in person and he picked a horrible stone.
I am sure there are many PSers who are happy with their BN stones, I would hazard a guess that they are many more with stones from WF or GOG.
Hey ChemEngineer. No probs at all, but I am certainly not an expert. I love my sparklies and love helping others find great stones.
It's totally up to you. Here at PS we are more focussed on cut - aiming for the best possible cut stone in budget. There is probably nothing wrong with the BN stone you posted, but from that price I can tell you it won't be the best of the best cut wise.
It's up to you what your priorities are? Size? Maximise sparkliness (cut), colour. Only you can decide. But I would certainly look around a bit more at PS vendors that give you more cut information before you jump into the BN stone. It's an important purchase and you need to be 100% sure you are getting the best for the love of your life.
Relax and take it slow, we are here to help
ETA - just FYI, John Pollard here is an expert! So definately take his opinion into account
- Joined
- May 1, 2008
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Got it. 6.84mm spread will be notably larger than 6.20mm.
Poppycock. Some fine diamonds have completely polished girdles. For that matter the most modern girdling machines are putting a "finely finished" texture on diamonds these days; not faceted, not completely polished. There is also the fact that some of the finest cutters (Richard VonSternberg and his people as examples) elect to leave girdles frosted, though this is most notable in colors lower than the range you're looking at. Either way I'm surprised you received that information from T&Co. That is untypical.
Absolutely right. It's the reason I feel that having an ideal-scope or ASET image is important. I'm a fan of providing more information than a simple report to consumers for the reasons you outline. To that end I think you've received sensible advice from others if you go this route (involve an appraiser with up to date equipment).
ChemEngineer
Rough_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2008
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Honey,Date: 11/29/2008 7:09:36 PM
Author: honey22
Date: 11/29/2008 7:04:06 PM
Author: Mrs W
You know, there are some really great deals at bluenile but ppl don''t really know/care bc they don''t have all the info(idealscope) and I tend to think that they forget about the 30 day inspection pd. This diamonds is very promising and many pricescopers have chosen bluenile over other vendors bc they have some of the best prices online and those ppl who did are very happy and satified with their purchase. So ChemEngineer don''t let the bluenile diamond scare you bc its not from WF or GOG, there are other great diamonds out there too...
Here is one pricescoper who is very satisfied with bluenile and its a beautiful stone by the way
The stones Honey22 posted are very nice but if you really want the bluenile stone, I say get it, inspect it and if you don''t really love it then send it back.....It won''t hurt trying to get what you really want at a great price right? The only thing that could happen is that you send it back or you keep it bc you really love it and you also get a great deal
Absolutely Breann, I dont doubt for a minute that BN have some great stones. But, at PS we are kinda cut freaks and look for the best cut for our money. BN just doesn''t offer the same level of service that GOG or WF do.
If the OP is looking for a good quality stone, then the BN would suffice. If he wants the best sparlkly stone he can get, then he should keep looking.
I do agree the BN has a great inspection period, but for the many, looking at a single diamond at home isn''t really helpful. You have nothing to compare it too, and if you havn''t seen many diamonds IRL, then pretty much anything will look great. We had a poster recently who insisted on being able to see the diamonds in person and he picked a horrible stone.
I am sure there are many PSers who are happy with their BN stones, I would hazard a guess that they are many more with stones from WF or GOG.
I see your point. I thought all you had to do to get the diamond with the most beautiful fire and sparkle was meet the specs. of a round brilliant with Excellent polish, symmetry, no fluorescence, color D-F, pointed culet, eye clean clarity (also making sure the inclusions on the map are not in critical places), and a low score on HCA. I guess what you''re saying is that you cannot get the whole picture from the GIA certificate.
I really am trying to make this as scientific as I could. Is there something I''m missing? Are there more criteria that I am not aware of?
What is your point here Mrs W, this has already been stated?! I am not arguing it''s a well cut stone, I am just saying you have no way of knowing if it''s a really well cut stone. Period. You don''t have enough info to make an informed decision here.
You seem to be more annoyed that I am not supporting BN. It''s got nothing to do with the vendor and everything to do with getting the BEST CUT stone.
ChemEngineer
Rough_Rock
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- Nov 29, 2008
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Honey,
I thought that to get the best cut stone you want a good score of 0-2 using the HCA calculator. Is that not a good way to go? I think John mentioned that that was a 2-D way of measurement. Are you saying that you need that AGS ideascope with a high score to actually get the most sparkle and fire?
I finally understand why you guys have reservations against bluenile. In theory they could have excellent diamonds but since they do not provide enough information you cannot determine it''s true cut quality.
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Chem and Breann, you may find this an interesting read:
http://journal.pricescope.com/Articles/37/1/GIA-Excellent-Cut-Grade-Case-Study.aspx
Honey is right. While the GIA EX cut grade has an area of overlap with other well-considerded predictive systems (the AGS Cut Guides, AGA, HCA) it also has a wide area of 'steep/deep' proportion sets which can result in light leakage and color entrapment.
As an example, the diamond on the right in this photo is a GIA EX. However I doubt if any PS professional or enthusiast would recommend it to a shopper interested in cut quality.
The good news for you is that the diamonds you're considering are not in this steep/deep territory. In fact they're at the shallow side of GIA EX and potentially in the area that AGS would reward with a top performance grade.
With that said GIA's evaluation is still two-dimensional. Many enthusiasts want to know the whole picture; you may or may not require this. You're performing due diligence and finding there are sellers who provide more, logically for a small markup. Alternately, the sellers you're considering do allow enough return time to involve an independent appraiser capable of providing those details if you want them.
The HCA is a rejection tool, not a selection tool. You use this to narrow down your candidates and weed out the crappy ones. A lower score is not necessarily better ie. 0.8 isn't better than say 1.9. Anything under 2 is worth further consideration.
When selecting a stone, we recommend plugging the numbers into the HCA and the if it falls under 2, requesting IS images to confirm if their is no leakage and light return is optimum.
The problem is, some combos/stones can look score under 2, but have some leakage etc. When you go with a vendor such as GOG or WF, they have the stones in house (they don't drop ship) so they can photograph the stone and provide IS and ASET images right away for you to make an informed choice. They also have a range of stones that are handselected to be the best of the best cut wise. These are ACAs from WF and Round H&A from GOG. The guess work is taken out, Jon (GOG) and Brian (WF) have handpicked these for you. You can basically just pick one that falls into your colour, clarity size and budget requirements, they are going to be stunning.
The ones I have posted for you previously and all these top cuts. Yes they are more expensive than BN, but you are paying for a. a better cut stone and b. the information they provide to make this informed choice.
It's totally up to you as I said before. For your budget and size requirements, I would honestly aim for G-H colour, SI1 (eyeclean). They both have great upgrade policies, so if you want to upgrade your size, colour, clarity whatever down the track you can do so.
Good luck!!
ETA - Chem, I get you! I am a scientist too. Probably one of the reasons I am OCD and didn't settle for anything less than an ACA! I even had it shipped here to Australia. So, I can understand you
ChemEngineer
Rough_Rock
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- Nov 29, 2008
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John,
Thank you for that informative post. I see that there is a lot more to this. I want a superior cut with maximum sparkle and fire. I''ll take a look at GOG and WF for this since BN does not provide enough info. The BN stone I picked out looks like it would be fine but I would have to take it to an appraiser before I would know it''s true brilliance.
Thanks for the help.
- Greg
Thank you for that informative post. I see that there is a lot more to this. I want a superior cut with maximum sparkle and fire. I''ll take a look at GOG and WF for this since BN does not provide enough info. The BN stone I picked out looks like it would be fine but I would have to take it to an appraiser before I would know it''s true brilliance.
Thanks for the help.
- Greg
ChemEngineer
Rough_Rock
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- Nov 29, 2008
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honey22,
I did look at BN Signature cut but they were way more expensive than the ideal cut diamonds. Also, for some reason, when I plugged in the numbers into the HCA calculator they were getting scores of 2+ mostly around 3. Is there a pricescope discount for GOG or WF?
Thanks.
I did look at BN Signature cut but they were way more expensive than the ideal cut diamonds. Also, for some reason, when I plugged in the numbers into the HCA calculator they were getting scores of 2+ mostly around 3. Is there a pricescope discount for GOG or WF?
Thanks.
Mrs W
Brilliant_Rock
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2008
- Messages
- 810
I understand what your saying Honey22 in the best cut stone possible, Im all for that!
All I was saying was that the stone has very good potential to be a really good cut stone and to take it independant appraiser and if not in love with the stone then send it back to Bluenile, i do not care what vendor the diamond comes from just as long as the stone is a beautiful performer and this 1 bluenile stone just happend to be in his budget and specs of criteria.
I do know that Excellent GIA stone means nothing, i just stating the stone was excellent cut as in good/great cut, not meaning to argue with you bc i do admire you as a fellow pricescoper.
I really hope all this heated discussion did not drive ChemEngineer away!
To ChemEngineer, yes in order to tell if a stone is a great performer one cannot go by #s alone by also by idealscope to see if there is great light return and Ditto to everything JohnPollard said
I do know that Excellent GIA stone means nothing, i just stating the stone was excellent cut as in good/great cut, not meaning to argue with you bc i do admire you as a fellow pricescoper.
I really hope all this heated discussion did not drive ChemEngineer away!
To ChemEngineer, yes in order to tell if a stone is a great performer one cannot go by #s alone by also by idealscope to see if there is great light return and Ditto to everything JohnPollard said
BN range of signature cut are not as strict as WF or GOGs ''branded range''. BN''s range is a lot looser. I would not trust that all the stones in that range are ''ideal''. If you look carefully at the HCA results, you will see the while outline is AGS ideal candidates and the dotted white line is GIA excellent candidates. A true AGS ideal stone will fall inside this solid white outline.
If you really want to purchase from BN, then narrow your selections down to the stones that score less than 2 on the HCA and also fall inside the AGS ideal parameters. This is the best you can do without IS images and should get you a well cut stone.
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Greg - good strategy. Good diamonds can be found with all of the top PS sellers. Those specializing in extremely strict cut quality (precision and performance) provide additional data/photos to demonstrate pedigree. In the absence of such data verification with an independent expert is a logical step and will give you strong documentation for insurance purposes.
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Having been through this adventure myself, I found it easiest to choose from diamonds at Good Old Gold and WhiteFlash. You do not need to get their stones independently appraised because they provide SO much information on the stones. They both carry top cut quality, hearts and arrows stones. We have bought from both and were impressed with the quality of the stones and the customer service.
Greg, I just wanted to add one more thought. It really sort of concerns me that you are planning to take out her blue topaz stone and reuse the setting for the e-ring. If you''d just leave that ring alone, she''d have an engagement ring to wear on her left hand and she could always wear the promise ring on her right hand. I really would want to be able to keep the promise ring forever as it is, if it was me. I really encourage you to get a new setting for the engagement ring. Plus, I think it is highly likely she''ll realize the ring is missing and it will tip her off that something is up. If you really want the ring to be a surprise, get a new setting!
Greg, I just wanted to add one more thought. It really sort of concerns me that you are planning to take out her blue topaz stone and reuse the setting for the e-ring. If you''d just leave that ring alone, she''d have an engagement ring to wear on her left hand and she could always wear the promise ring on her right hand. I really would want to be able to keep the promise ring forever as it is, if it was me. I really encourage you to get a new setting for the engagement ring. Plus, I think it is highly likely she''ll realize the ring is missing and it will tip her off that something is up. If you really want the ring to be a surprise, get a new setting!
ChemEngineer
Rough_Rock
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- Nov 29, 2008
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I trust from what I''ve read on these forums that WF ACA and GOG H&A are guaranteed to be winners. I''m now worried about getting the stone from BN because of the lack of info and the hassle I''ll have to go thru getting it appraised and the possibility of returning it if it is no good.
I''ll have to think about this some more. I think she would also like to keep the promise ring. It''ll will be really bad if she finds out about this all by me sneaking off with her promise ring that she is always glued to.
Thanks,
-Greg
I missed that point inititally. Ditto DS, a woman who is that attached to her promise ring (and trust me, we do get that attached) with surely know withint minutes that''s it gone and will be very distressed. I wore my daily for over 10 years and felt very strange when it was off for surgery, cleaning etc. I would certainly suggest a new setting, she would probably be devastated if that one is changed.
I still remember the mixed emotions the day my FI finally popped my ering on my left hand. Incredible excitment and happiness, but also a tinge of sadness that the ring I had proudly worn for so many years was leaving my hand. Silly I know, but sometimes us women get like that.
ChemEngineer
Rough_Rock
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- Nov 29, 2008
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Hello again,
I thought you guys might wanna know what stone I ended up with.
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/4138/
It''s a 0.90 ct. Round Brilliant F-color, VVS2, H&A cut, VH/VH/VH Brilliance Scope. I spoke with my girlfriend and she was pretty much set with a 1.0 ct. or less diamond due to her finger size and how awkward larger stones feel. She did tell me, however, that she did not want to see any inclusions and said her mom will be looking at it thru a loupe (which is why I went with a VVS2). Also, the great thing about GOG is their 30 day money back guarantee.
Yippie, thanks again everyone for your help.
- Greg
I thought you guys might wanna know what stone I ended up with.
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/4138/
It''s a 0.90 ct. Round Brilliant F-color, VVS2, H&A cut, VH/VH/VH Brilliance Scope. I spoke with my girlfriend and she was pretty much set with a 1.0 ct. or less diamond due to her finger size and how awkward larger stones feel. She did tell me, however, that she did not want to see any inclusions and said her mom will be looking at it thru a loupe (which is why I went with a VVS2). Also, the great thing about GOG is their 30 day money back guarantee.
Yippie, thanks again everyone for your help.
- Greg
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