Grape/royal purple garnet (Mozambique) - seeking opinions

[toomuchB]

I've had mixed luck with this material in the past.
How does this look in terms of color for 'grape' or 'royal' purple garnet from Mozambique?

Too pinkish/reddish? Pretty purple rhodolite but not what one expects from 'royal' or 'grape'?
I know these are subjective terms - for me, I think of the ones AJSgems had for sale back in the day, and some of the older stones that were sold by The Rare Gemstone Company a few years ago. Some images of these pop up if you google the companies + grape/royal purple garnet.

I have my thoughts and concerns but looking for other peoples opinions, esp from those with this material in high quality.
How do you read the images? I presume these are daylight photos because that is what I asked for, but its an overseas vendor, so maybe he missed that detail.

There is another slightly different looking stone this vendor will show me later, not sure if it will be better or worse based on the studio shots.

 

[LilAlex]

Hard to say. And it's always at an angle to the camera (?!).

I have one purchased years ago from a reliable vendor who takes outstanding and very representative photos (Adamant) and it was touted as one of the best ever. It is gorgeous but I didn't even notice right away -- it needs a lot of light. And it looks like "your" gem here is getting a lot of light. So where would you be wearing it and would that environment be likely to show it off? You probably know all this already -- maybe I'm just muttering to myself.

 

[toomuchB]

Hard to say. And it's always at an angle to the camera (?!).

I have one purchased years ago from a reliable vendor who takes outstanding and very representative photos (Adamant) and it was touted as one of the best ever. It is gorgeous but I didn't even notice right away -- it needs a lot of light. And it looks like "your" gem here is getting a lot of light. So where would you be wearing it and would that environment be likely to show it off? You probably know all this already -- maybe I'm just muttering to myself.

No no, you are spot on. The listing photos do have some head on, non angled photos and it looks very similar.
This is a larger garnet and my expectation is that it will be on the dark side, problem is darker garnets tend to be too dark. I think the best of these are actually smaller to prevent darkness.

Here is a stone I like - it is a previous offering from The Rare Gemstone Company that is back on the market - but I am not willing to pay 1k/ct.
It shows the deep purple (like a warm-toned amethyst - the bottom images/videos) and the more magenta shift (earlier images), and I'm just not sure I'm getting it with the above stone - whether because of the size, or the material is subpar, or the color of these garnets in general is exaggerated and displayed unrealistically.

Royal Purple Garnet Ring in a Diamond Halo

This exquisite Royal Purple Garnet is set in a superb diamond halo, reminiscent of Kate Middleton's signature style. The unique stone displays a stunning combination of red and purple hues, especially under incandescent lighting. This custom-made ring is perfect for an engagement or as a...

manzanitagems.com

I'll add I had and sold a 2ct one that I liked in almost all lighting, and it was a fairly deep purple, but was just too small. I'll see if I can find a photo.

 

[toomuchB]

here is my now-sold 2ct test stone, first image is non-direct fluorescent light and second is strong daylight.

https://imgur.com/a/p2HviSM

I'm quoting @Autumn in New England 's post below, where she showed her gorgeous purple garnet in a previous thread I made on this material. This is the direction of what I'm after as well as the 1k/ct one I posted above.

Not even sure what my question is at this point I mean I think there is a very slim chance the stone I posted approaches what I'm after. There's a solid return policy and its via Etsy so there's some protection there... I feel silly for even considering it, after all you get what you pay for, right?

Here's my stone... I got it from AJS.


It's not a pinky ring... my fingers were just too swollen at the time for it to fit normally. lol

 

[toomuchB]

I have one purchased years ago from a reliable vendor who takes outstanding and very representative photos (Adamant) and it was touted as one of the best ever. It is gorgeous but I didn't even notice right away -- it needs a lot of light.

Hahah I actually saved a screenshot of the listing back when it was up. 5.31ct right? Won't upload the screenshot for your privacy , but it looks quite pinkish, rather than the more 'purple purple' I'm after - but maybe its different in person/different lighting situations.

 

[LilAlex]

Hahah I actually saved a screenshot of the listing back when it was up. 5.31ct right?

Omg -- yeah, I thought I was making a safely oblique-enough reference. I should keep my mouth shut but I can't not reward your integrity here (!). Yes, that was the one. It's been years and I have done nothing with it. And I have recently sold a few things that I have done nothing with (in hopefully-premature Swedish death cleaning mode -- which my MIL references and which my wife is slowly adopting...).

Mine is a pyrope-almandine and it's a vivid reddish purple (ETA: GIC "vivid purple") that would never be mistaken for an amethyst (but might be mistaken for the wildly oversaturated amethysts that one vendor lists). It does remind me of those "royal purples" you show. Since there was no way I'd do return to Sri Lanka, I didn't really study it for a long time -- but when I finally looked at it under a proper gem light and outside on a bright day, it was pretty insane. But I have been mostly looking for wear-all-day-every-day stuff (like cab sapphire) and my wife has little interest so it never found a permanent home.

Your 2-ct test is definitely darker than mine. I love @Autumn in New England's -- I'm a sucker for a step-cut colored stone.

 

[toomuchB]

Omg -- yeah, I thought I was making a safely oblique-enough reference. I should keep my mouth shut but I can't not reward your integrity here (!). Yes, that was the one. It's been years and I have done nothing with it. And I have recently sold a few things that I have done nothing with (in hopefully-premature Swedish death cleaning mode -- which my MIL references and which my wife is slowly adopting...).

Mine is a pyrope-almandine and it's a vivid reddish purple that would never be mistaken for an amethyst (but might be mistaken for the wildly oversaturated amethysts that one vendor lists). It does remind me of those "royal purples" you show. Since there was no way I'd do return to Sri Lanka, I didn't really study it for a long time -- but when I finally looked at it under a proper gem light and outside on a bright day, it was pretty insane. But I have been mostly looking for wear-all-day-every-day stuff (like cab sapphire) and my wife has little interest so it never found a permanent home.

Your 2-ct test is definitely darker than mine. I love @Autumn in New England's -- I'm a sucker for a step-cut colored stone.

Ugh you have no idea, I save screenshots and downloads from every source on ANYTHING remotely interesting to me in a gems/jewellery folder. Its a sickness - or maybe a side effect of being in the legal profession. I just checked - I have just under 1.5 million such files, of course 99.9% are unorganized.
Maybe if I get savvy with an AI, it can do some sorting for me with decent accuracy. But, even in the lack of organization, I can usually find something I'm looking for. So I'm just an anomaly - your reference would be safe if I was normal.

Very interesting to hear your take on its characteristics. There are lovely purple garnets from many sources. I am really trying to aim for the famous Manica, Mozambique origin. But maybe I'll sacrifice that for an otherwise ideal stone.

Here's a Tanzanian stone I would not turn down. I think I'd be fine with this darkness for that purple color and size - even taking into account the favors of the fancy lighting.

View this content on Instagram

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View this content on Instagram

 

[LilAlex]

Hahahaha! I have thousands of random screen shots of gems, designs, cool things, awful things -- and I almost never organize them. It is so tedious! I do have a couple folders like Deco-era cab blue sapphires in YG, etc. Or inspos for pieces that we ultimately did make.

I don't even know where mine is from -- and I don't know if I ever knew (?). He called it "hot magenta purple." I have all the screen shots from the listing saved somewhere but I'm not even sure where that is.

Maybe AI can create the perfect gem image for you based on your saves -- small and large and purple and green and old and new. I think this is driving the AI "models" that keep popping up for me on IG. "Huh, I guess this must be what I like?!" (They are all perfect and indistinguishable and utterly, utterly forgettable -- but I digress.)

ETA: Oh, yeah, that Pala one is pretty insane! I don't shop there

 

[glitterata]

I have one of these. Mine's 4 carats and less saturated than those. It shows more magenta, less violet. It's very dark when it's not flashing purple, magenta, and red. I got it on Etsy from a Sri Lankan seller who's no longer active. It was a huge bargain compared to those prices, but it pales next to them. Someday I'll set it.

 

[toomuchB]

Hahahaha! I have thousands of random screen shots of gems, designs, cool things, awful things -- and I almost never organize them. It is so tedious! I do have a couple folders like Deco-era cab blue sapphires in YG, etc. Or inspos for pieces that we ultimately did make.

I don't even know where mine is from -- and I don't know if I ever knew (?). He called it "hot magenta purple." I have all the screen shots from the listing saved somewhere but I'm not even sure where that is.

Maybe AI can create the perfect gem image for you based on your saves -- small and large and purple and green and old and new. I think this is driving the AI "models" that keep popping up for me on IG. "Huh, I guess this must be what I like?!" (They are all perfect and indistinguishable and utterly, utterly forgettable -- but I digress.)

ETA: Oh, yeah, that Pala one is pretty insane! I don't shop there

Good to know I'm not the only hoarder.
Also, I can tell you based on the listing that it does not indicate origin

I have one of these. Mine's 4 carats and less saturated than those. It shows more magenta, less violet. It's very dark when it's not flashing purple, magenta, and red. I got it on Etsy from a Sri Lankan seller who's no longer active. It was a huge bargain compared to those prices, but it pales next to them. Someday I'll set it.

This is beautiful, thank you for sharing. Indeed, I'm looking for a different type of color. There is a chance the stone in my OP is more like this, than what I am looking for.

 

[Autumn in New England]

@LilAlex Now I really wanna see it, because you have spectacular taste!!

@toomuchB I'm so flattered you like mine! AJS did have some lovely grape garnets back in the day. Let's see, I think you have a great idea of what to look for in this stone... not overly dark, fully saturated, not too pink or red (certainly no brown), etc. The only other thing I would mention is, you definitely need good cutting with this material. That will really help make the most of the deeper tone and pink/blue flashes. So with that in mind, I might skip the first oval you posted. I just think you can do better, and I want you to be 100% pleased!!

 

[WhoaNelly]

Jeff White recently posted on his GemScoop that he purchased some from the original find. It’s rough and maybe you can reach out to him about cutting one for you? I don’t remember the price per carat though. Good luck!

 

[LilAlex]

Now I really wanna see it...

Not sure I'm doing it justice here -- and this is all vendor data so I could just be a big phony as far as you know. ("And here's a stock photo of my boat!")

I'll need to take my own photos but it's put away. I have at least a dozen videos from Ivan in various lighting conditions (indoors, outdoor shade, outdoor direct sun). They clearly show it is garnet-like (but lively) indoors in ambient light and sensational in bright light.

These photos are from the ad in 2020 or 2021, IIRC, and seem to match the outdoor shade videos. The IG post was a couple years later (looks like 2023) -- I just found it by accident as I was searching for the original listing.

 

[Autumn in New England]

Not sure I'm doing it justice here -- and this is all vendor data so I could just be a big phony as far as you know. ("And here's a stock photo of my boat!")

I'll need to take my own photos but it's put away. I have at least a dozen videos from Ivan in various lighting conditions (indoors, outdoor shade, outdoor direct sun). They clearly show it is garnet-like (but lively) indoors in ambient light and sensational in bright light.

These photos are from the ad in 2020 or 2021, IIRC, and seem to match the outdoor shade videos. The IG post was a couple years later (looks like 2023) -- I just found it by accident as I was searching for the original listing.

Oh honey, you HAVE to do something with this majestic creature.

 

[toomuchB]

Here are some more images of the OP stone. Again, I assume the OP ones were daylight, and these are fluorescent. Don't think it'll change opinions but may as well post. Clearly lacking that specific 'warm deep amethyst' look. But fairly nice under strong lighting.

 

[toomuchB]

Jeff White recently posted on his GemScoop that he purchased some from the original find. It’s rough and maybe you can reach out to him about cutting one for you? I don’t remember the price per carat though. Good luck!

I sent him an email! Thank you for the lead.

@LilAlex Now I really wanna see it, because you have spectacular taste!!

@toomuchB I'm so flattered you like mine! AJS did have some lovely grape garnets back in the day. Let's see, I think you have a great idea of what to look for in this stone... not overly dark, fully saturated, not too pink or red (certainly no brown), etc. The only other thing I would mention is, you definitely need good cutting with this material. That will really help make the most of the deeper tone and pink/blue flashes. So with that in mind, I might skip the first oval you posted. I just think you can do better, and I want you to be 100% pleased!!

Interesting you specify good cutting because cut is probably my least important C, I'm quite forgiving. But I can understand why this material in particular needs it.
I also think I can do better. But sometimes you just want it to work out you know? Especially when the price is far less than 1k/ct
I'll wait and see how the additional stone he has looks.
I'll wait for a response from JW.
I'll wait for a response from one or two other dealers with (potentially) this material who I've contacted.
Not gonna force it, gems find us much of the time.

 

[Autumn in New England]

I sent him an email! Thank you for the lead.




Interesting you specify good cutting because cut is probably my least important C, I'm quite forgiving. But I can understand why this material in particular needs it.
I also think I can do better. But sometimes you just want it to work out you know? Especially when the price is far less than 1k/ct
I'll wait and see how the additional stone he has looks.
I'll wait for a response from JW.
I'll wait for a response from one or two other dealers with (potentially) this material who I've contacted.
Not gonna force it, gems find us much of the time.

Yeah, I tend to be more forgiving than your average PSer on cut too (I loathe windows, but can pretty much overlook anything else). Some collectors won't even consider a stone that isn't precision. Out of all my gems, I can count the master cuts on one hand. lol Anyway, I do think the color of that oval is really nice. I still worry about how the cut will affect the optics in person, but I totally understand about recognizing a good deal and wanting to give it a chance. Plus, color is king. Whatever you decide, I'm sure it will be fabulous. Keep us posted!

 

[toomuchB]

Update - the other stone this dealer had is a complete bust - terrible cut and reddish. So lets ignore that.

When I put one of the better looking photos (likely under direct fluorescent light, but you can see the neutral colored white plastic doesn't look 'unrealistic' or overly bright) side by side with Autumn's stone under (I assume) typical lighting - it does have a pretty good resemblance. Am I crazy? Emphasis on ideal/strong light vs Autumns which just looks that stunning effortlessly.

Maybe I have to accept the higher price for a stone I have strong indications will perform well (I found AJS too expensive, and the 1k/ct one above is too) or wait until I'm just very lucky.

As mentioned I'm waiting on some other options but its fun to agonize in the meanwhile I'm not sure if I have a valid point here or need to be brought back down to earth.



ETA no offense intended to Autumn's much better stone of course.

 

[PrecisionGem]

These purple garnets to shift color depending on the light. They will be the most purple outdoors, and shift more reddish in incandescent light. (if you can find any incandescent bulbs!)

 

[toomuchB]

These purple garnets to shift color depending on the light. They will be the most purple outdoors,

Yes, yet there seems to be a great variation in how 'pure' purple they can be.

A dealer I've bought from and trust shared me this photo of their cut stock of purple garnets, stating "The photo has been colour-balanced to 5000K pure white so it is somewhere between warm and cool light to give a better idea of the actual colour."


I think most would disagree with me, but my favorite of this bunch is the shield cut. It is the most amethyst like to me. The rest (other than the reddish round) have this 'electric' purple color, which seems to inherently have this pinkish element. My logic is, I'm sure the shield shifts plenty pinkish enough in various lighting to ALSO have that electric pink look/flash sometimes.
Now, the shield is too extinct, which I think damages the overall look and makes it look more blackish than it would be with a more flattering cut. Furthermore, its too small for me at 2.6ct
Here are some listing images of the shield. Its got like a reverse bowtie extinction.


Here's photos from the listing of the fat pear which I am guessing would be a more preferred stone in the lineup to most.

 

[LilAlex]

"The photo has been colour-balanced to 5000K pure white so it is somewhere between warm and cool light to give a better idea of the actual colour."

This is potentially misleading. Unless shot in RAW, and especially if not in RAW and shot on a phone, this has been crazy-processed in terms of saturation and contrast. (But maybe the whites are accurate.) Not sure what phones do to purple but they love blue.

 

[Autumn in New England]

That photo of the oval does indeed look well-balanced to me! If there's a difference in hue, tone and/or, saturation to my stone, I don't see it. lol They look nearly identical. Again, I think the only issue might be cut (which can affect apparent color/pleochroism), but you have mentioned it is not bothersome to you. So if the recent photo of that stone is an accurate representation of the color in person, and you like the look of mine, I think you may want to consider it! How is the return policy?

P.S. Unless otherwise indicated, I take all photos at midday in natural, indirect light. These were taken near my front window with no indoor lighting and no direct sunshine. I really try to capture what I see in person!

 

[LilAlex]

P.S. Unless otherwise indicated, I take all photos at midday in natural, indirect light. These were taken near my front window with no indoor lighting and no direct sunshine. I really try to capture what I see in person!

If this was for me, I was referring to the vendor photo!

I also agree that no photo or set-up is more reliable than a trusted party saying "This is what it actually looks like!" The tricky part, of course, is knowing whom to trust when those words are said -- but that does not apply to you, @Autumn in New England!

 

[Autumn in New England]

If this was for me, I was referring to the vendor photo!

I also agree that no photo or set-up is more reliable than a trusted party saying "This is what it actually looks like!" The tricky part, of course, is knowing whom to trust when those words are said -- but that does not apply to you, @Autumn in New England!

No, that was for OP! The small photo of the oval next to my ring looks like it has nice light/temp balance. I agree that the group photo's color looks distorted. It's quite cool! Could be he has a proper 5,000k bulb, but his phone settings are off, as you said.

 

[toomuchB]

This is potentially misleading. Unless shot in RAW, and especially if not in RAW and shot on a phone, this has been crazy-processed in terms of saturation and contrast. (But maybe the whites are accurate.) Not sure what phones do to purple but they love blue.

Okay, thank you, I really need to become better versed in photography.
I have bought from this seller in the past and their images were accurate - but I never asked for a group photo. Just relied on listing photos and what seemed to be an unprofessional quick outdoor video. If the shield was big and not so extinct I still think it would have potential.

I found some of their photos of the 2ct I sent above on imgur (the test stone - I bought from them). Id say the daylight color is pretty accurate (where in my pic, its far too direct and strong, but was more or less the color). I did not get to see the deep purple color in cool light until it got to me. Which was the color I preferred!


FYI maybe I should have added, the same dealer who sent the group photo said, about the Indian stone, that he has bought purple garnets from Indians before and they are less purple in real life, and photos are likely "under 7000-10000K cool daylight which skews them a cooler colour". Of course they have an incentive to say something like that, but just wanted to get your take I guess? The photo comparing it to Autumns looks honest to me - but yes I know one could easily bump the saturation meter up a bit without making the white plastic look insane.

That photo of the oval does indeed look well-balanced to me! If there's a difference in hue, tone and/or, saturation to my stone, I don't see it. lol They look nearly identical. Again, I think the only issue might be cut (which can affect apparent color/pleochroism), but you have mentioned it is not bothersome to you. So if the recent photo of that stone is an accurate representation of the color in person, and you like the look of mine, I think you may want to consider it! How is the return policy?

P.S. Unless otherwise indicated, I take all photos at midday in natural, indirect light. These were taken near my front window with no indoor lighting and no direct sunshine. I really try to capture what I see in person!

Okay, thank you for saying this lol. Yes the cut could be better. Its a very meh standard oval. He has a few and most of them are windowed so I should be grateful that the best looking one is also the second largest and non-windowed.

Return/refund policy is to India (but yep, stone is Mozambique) - 14 days after getting the stone no questions asked. I confirmed this with him and its his official etsy store policy. I just pay return shipping.

I'm leaning towards trying with this stone and I am going to decide today, else I will never do it. I know what I DON'T want, based on my test stone. I also know I am very fussy.

So, I'm nervous because I never buy a stone I thinking there's a fairly high likelihood I'll return. But it can't be that bad, as I've sold (mostly cheaper) stones, and the hardest thing was finding a buyer.

I'm not sure if there is any value in asking for some random Indian lab report that I do not recognize, but I'll ask about this him anyway.

 

[Autumn in New England]

Okay, thank you, I really need to become better versed in photography.
I have bought from this seller in the past and their images were accurate - but I never asked for a group photo. Just relied on listing photos and what seemed to be an unprofessional quick outdoor video. If the shield was big and not so extinct I would still think it have potential.

FYI maybe I should have added, the same dealer who sent the group photo said, about the Indian stone, that he has bought purple garnets from Indians before and they are less purple in real life, and photos are likely "under 7000-10000K cool daylight which skews them a cooler colour". Of course they have an incentive to say something like that, but just wanted to get your take I guess? The photo comparing it to Autumns looks honest to me - but yes I know one could easily bump the saturation meter up a bit without making the white plastic look insane.



Okay, thank you for saying this lol. Yes the cut could be better. Its a very meh standard oval. He has a few and most of them are windowed so I should be grateful that the best looking one is also the second largest and non-windowed.

Return/refund policy is to India (but yep, stone is Mozambique) - 14 days after getting the stone no questions asked. I confirmed this with him. I just pay return shipping.

I'm leaning towards trying with this stone and I am going to decide today, else I will never do it. I know what I DON'T want, based on my test stone. I also know I am very fussy.

So, I'm nervous because I never buy a stone I thinking there's a fairly high likelihood I'll return. But it can't be that bad, as I've sold (mostly cheaper) stones, and the hardest thing was finding a buyer.

I'm not sure if there is any value in asking for some random Indian lab report that I do not recolonize, but I'll ask about this him anyway.

Keep us posted, my friend!

 

[pomo_juice]

This is potentially misleading. Unless shot in RAW, and especially if not in RAW and shot on a phone, this has been crazy-processed in terms of saturation and contrast. (But maybe the whites are accurate.) Not sure what phones do to purple but they love blue.

So true! Every time I get something alone the lines of shot in such and such light, better camera, color corrected to give you better idea of color from a vendor, I promise you the actual stone NEVER look like the enhanced photo. The enhanced photo always looks much better.