Help finding some baby AVRs.....

[Jereni]

So I'm typically a CS girl, but I've decided to venture into the diamond world once again, and do it right this time! (When DH bought my e-ring, I'd lurked on PS but didn't truly do my research and ended up with an oval I like, but don't love.)

For some time now, I've been lusting after the gorgeous alternate cuts that I've learned about since joining PS. OECs, AVRs, etc. My longterm dream is a ~3ct AVC, but I have a ways to go on saving for that.

What I'd like to do now is work on accumulating some 'baby' old-style/alterate cuts that I will have made into stacking rings in a variety of metal colors. My inspiration is the ring pictured here:


I've read David's article on old cuts, and obviously seen hundreds of these rings on PS, but I've never actually gone through the process of analyzing and trying to find a really good performer, so I hope you all can help me!

Ok, specs. I'm looking for rounds, 5mm max in size, so I guess around 0.5cts or a little smaller? I'd like VS2 or SI1 clarity - I'm guessing that in the size I'm looking for, an SI1 would easily be fine.

 

[Jereni]

I think I'd like to start with an AVR.

I looked at GOG, and they have a lot of options… I'm having trouble telling the difference between these three:
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8588/
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9068/
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9065/

Then there's this one but it's almost $1K more…. is that just because it's a G or am I missing something else?
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9067/

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Those stones in the stacking bands are mostly a lot smaller than the .40 range. I would wait until I had a plan to make a specific ring before buying the stones.

Last stone is more because it is at the .5 mark where there is a price jump. Also, it is G color which costs more than I-K.

I advise sticking with higher colors on small AVRs as they will be brighter.

 

[chrono]

Jereni,
I love the idea of your stacking band but find that stones sized for stackers just don't show the difference in faceting well unless you peer at them up close or under a loupe. Are you all right with that? At a glance, it'll look just like a regular ordinary round.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Plus, I think little bands like that will cost a LOT less buying ready-made as opposed to custom. But if you are using larger stones, that is a different story. I think those stacking bands mostly have 5 to 25 pointers.

 

[yssie]

Jereni,
I love the idea of your stacking band but find that stones sized for stackers just don't show the difference in faceting well unless you peer at them up close or under a loupe. Are you all right with that? At a glance, it'll look just like a regular ordinary round.

Ditto, and

Plus, I think little bands like that will cost a LOT less buying ready-made as opposed to custom. But if you are using larger stones, that is a different story. I think those stacking bands mostly have 5 to 25 pointers.

ditto. I think that stack is lovely and very unique, and I actually also like the idea of using branded stones - the idea of knowing that they're all specialty cuts - but that'll be secret knowledge, something only you can appreciate.

I definitely think bands like that are more cost-effective to buy ready-made, but there are some vendors on Etsy that might also be worth investigating. What were you thinking re. budget? Or are you really just looking to collect loose stones for now?

 

[Karl_K]

I think those stacking bands mostly have 5 to 25 pointers.

Yep, in that size I would consider well cut single cuts rather than oec type stones.
I have seen a few cut single cut ~.20ct and they rocked my world. (100 year old 5 stone mens ring)
Certainly in 5 pointers id go single cut.

 

[Jereni]

Thanks SO much for the feedback. I feel like an idiot for not realizing the stones in the ring are prob smaller. I am running to a client meeting and will respond in more detail in just a bit. It sounds like I have to rethink this. I love the AVR pattern and want to make sure I'll be able to see it.

 

[yssie]

I think those stacking bands mostly have 5 to 25 pointers.

Yep, in that size I would consider well cut single cuts rather than oec type stones.
I have seen a few cut single cut ~.20ct and they rocked my world. (100 year old 5 stone mens ring)
Certainly in 5 pointers id go single cut.

PSer WakingDreams has a giant single cut - I think I remember she said it was around half a carat? It was *incredible* in-person - very unique, and absolutely gorgeous!!! I can only imagine how rare a stone like that must be

 

[Karl_K]

PSer WakingDreams has a giant single cut - I think I remember she said it was around half a carat? It was *incredible* in-person - very unique, and absolutely gorgeous!!! I can only imagine how rare a stone like that must be

kewl, any pics posted here?
Very rare in that size.

 

[yssie]

PSer WakingDreams has a giant single cut - I think I remember she said it was around half a carat? It was *incredible* in-person - very unique, and absolutely gorgeous!!! I can only imagine how rare a stone like that must be

kewl, any pics posted here?
Very rare in that size.

Just looked - I don't think so. I'll shoot her an email tonight and see if she can share any

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I have tiny single cuts in my sapphire halo earrings and I totally agree that those would be gorgeous especially in antique style stackers!

 

[Jereni]

Jereni,
I love the idea of your stacking band but find that stones sized for stackers just don't show the difference in faceting well unless you peer at them up close or under a loupe. Are you all right with that? At a glance, it'll look just like a regular ordinary round.

Gotcha....if that's the case, then maybe I should separate this into two projects, one for the stackers, and one for a small AVR ring.

Do we think that a 0.5ct AVR would be large enough to appreciate the facet design and the optics? I'm thinking instead of maybe doing a 5 stone graduated ring, with all AVRs.

 

[Jereni]

ditto. I think that stack is lovely and very unique, and I actually also like the idea of using branded stones - the idea of knowing that they're all specialty cuts - but that'll be secret knowledge, something only you can appreciate.

I definitely think bands like that are more cost-effective to buy ready-made, but there are some vendors on Etsy that might also be worth investigating. What were you thinking re. budget? Or are you really just looking to collect loose stones for now?

Hi Yssie! Btw I totally have a homage ring to you in the SMTB forum. I loved your Butterflies three stone so much

So, you are right on the money - I was excited about the idea of having the stackers using different, specialty cuts. Figured it could be a work in progress where I built up the stackers over time. However, everyone's comments about the size of the stacker stones is giving me pause. If I'm going to go for specialty cuts, I want to be able to appreciate them at arms length, more or less.

Budget wise, I was going to do this in stages and just wanted to make sure I got well-priced stones for my specs. I was assuming I'd have to go custom for the stackers if I did the specialty cuts, and figured I'd do it one stacker at a time and go from there.

 

[Jereni]

Yep, in that size I would consider well cut single cuts rather than oec type stones.
I have seen a few cut single cut ~.20ct and they rocked my world. (100 year old 5 stone mens ring)
Certainly in 5 pointers id go single cut.

Hmm, ok I hadn't thought about single cuts - I don't know much about them except that they are usually the cut for melee right? If they look cool a little bigger then that could be a good choice for the stacking rings.

Any PS vendors that would be recommended for getting well cut single cuts and making stackers like this?

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Generally when you have a ring custom made with little stones, the person making the ring sources the stones. I wouldn't collect stones that are under .25 and that is what are in most of those stackers. I am all for smaller AVR's in a 5 stone ring or in larger sizes. And of course, GOG doesn't even sell their melee AVR stones loose. I think .40 up can be bought individually, but that is larger than is in most of those stackers.

 

[Jereni]

Understood - I am rapidly abandoning the idea of sourcing the stacker stones separately. Mostly just trying to think of a vendor who makes really good, even bezels and then go with them. I think I'll come back to that ring later.

The real goal of this project was AVR stones, and making a ring out of a few smaller ones (~0.5ct, give or take depending on design). I think I'm decided on the 5-stone graduated ring idea, provided I can come up with some good proportions, good stones that go together, and have them be big enough to appreciate the optics.

As you say, GOG doesn't sell the melee loose, so I'm thinking I pick 3 stones from their inventory above 0.4cts, with good performance, and then have GOG make the ring and supply the smallest 2 stones from their melee.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I would adore a 5 stone band with AVR's! I think that would be your very best way to show off the stones!

 

[VRBeauty]

Jereni - I love the idea of stackers and look of stackers, however... when you're talking about stackers (with a center stone) rather than eternity rings... colored stone stackers were all the rage (including here) a few years ago, and now you rarely see or hear of them. I'm wondering if there's something about the reality of wearing stackers day-to-day that made people move on to other styles? Or maybe people are still buying or adding to their stacker collections, but not posting about it (or just posting in colored stone, which I should drop in on more often ). Of course I'm not saying stay away from stackers because they're out of fashion, I'm just wondering out loud whether there's a practical reason why we're not hearing more about them now.

 

[Christina...]

It sounds as though your moving away from the stacker idea for now, but a couple in the photo reminded me of these by jbEG...

http://jewelsbyericagrace.smugmug.com/Jewelry/Rings-Antique-Vintage/57ct-Rose-Cut-Diamond-Bezel/22058183_mrRrQH#!i=1760349979&k=pThFsQS

I think I've seen them in smaller ct weights as well.

 

[Karl_K]

Any PS vendors that would be recommended for getting well cut single cuts and making stackers like this?

There is a cutter doing single cuts that are a work of art in the US that is at jfk every year, the usual suspects should be able to get them and build a ring. I cant recommend a specific vendor being in the trade.

 

[Dreamer_D]

In my opinion, to appreciate the faceting in old cuts and old style cuts, you want to get into the 5.5mm or bigger range.

I suggest putting all your budget to a single larger AVR rather than 5 smaller ones.

 

[Rosebloom]

I keep thinking about those gorgeous stacking rings with colored diamonds. Mmmm. A little pink, light yellow, intense yellow, maybe (irradiated most likely) blue? Yummy.

 

[Rhino]

In my opinion, to appreciate the faceting in old cuts and old style cuts, you want to get into the 5.5mm or bigger range.

I suggest putting all your budget to a single larger AVR rather than 5 smaller ones.

I have seen this comment (in bold) made many many times on this forum regarding any cut other than a standard 57 facet round brilliant. It's been said of Solasfera, Star129, etc. including Hearts & Arrows and now AVR's which happen to be the optical antithesis of a Solasfera or Star129.

The truth is this. In smaller diamonds in general, no matter WHAT the cut, it's not going to be easy to differentiate the faceting when you are looking at the diamonds, even at an arms length at a glance. How well one differentiates the differences in smaller diamonds (0.08ct-0.2xct) will really depend on the lighting they are observing them under. The brighter the lighting the easier it will be to differentiate the differences,the dimmer the lighting the more difficult it will be. People who have already purchased these do in fact see the difference but I would again stress ... it really depends on the lighting. In natural ambient daylight, even a non PS layman will see it and appreciate the personality the diamonds bring to the table.

As Dreamer D notes above, it will of course be easier to observe in larger diamonds. This would hold true of AVR, Solasfera, Star129, Eighternity or any other cut you consider. The larger the diamond the easier it will be to differentiate in the faceting and light performance. At the same time the smaller cut fancy rounds ARE STILL UNBELIEVABLY GORGEOUS and still maintain their character. Not too long ago we were helping a client who had their heart set on a 1/3ct Solasfera and was really put off by the comments made on this forum about smaller diamonds and I told the client, let me send you the diamond ... compare it to others ... as many as you can within a 30 day period and if you don't see any difference send it back for a refund. He took my advice and after comparing it in about 4-5 jewelry stores, even against AGS Ideals was a believer. Before you completely ditch the idea that there is no difference you may want to actually see them for yourself. Our guarantees are rock solid. Your opinion may agree or disagree but you'll never know until you see for yourself.

Kindest regards,
Rhino

 

[Dreamer_D]

As I noted, that is my opinion based on my own experiences with diamonds of a host of sizes.

If someone has the budget for a .30ct diamond, then of course they can choose whatever cut they like and they may enjoy one speciality cut over another comparing all same sized stones of different cuts.

But if someone wants a chunky look and is at the same time thinking of a 5 stone with 4mm stones, my advice stands that I would personally put the budget to a single larger AVR (or other specialty stone) to make the faceting most apparent for her budget.

 

[Karl_K]

My 2c both Dreamer_D and Jon are right.
In lighting that the main return is brightness the smaller diamonds when well cut regardless of shape look pretty much like spots of light. The features all blend together.
When in lighting conductive to fire and flashes of light; sunlight, spot lights and warehouse lighting the tables turn and the differences become apparent. The light show they put on has distinct differences.

5 stone vs 1 larger diamond is a personal preference in my opinion.
Some will have a clear preference some will like both.

 

[Karl_K]

Any PS vendors that would be recommended for getting well cut single cuts and making stackers like this?

There is a cutter doing single cuts that are a work of art in the US that is at JCK every year, the usual suspects should be able to get them and build a ring. I cant recommend a specific vendor being in the trade.

Fixed typo....

 

[Jereni]

Thank you all so much for the continued feedback, I am finding this really educational.

In my opinion, to appreciate the faceting in old cuts and old style cuts, you want to get into the 5.5mm or bigger range.

I suggest putting all your budget to a single larger AVR rather than 5 smaller ones.

As a newbie to this, my instinct is that this will be true for me.

On the other hand, my budget does not permit for an AVR as large as I would like if I were going to do a ring with one stone. I like bigger stones In diamonds that gets into a whole new world of pricing than it does in most CS stones that I enjoy. A 2+ carat AVR in the colorless range looks to be close to $40K. I am looking more to make a ring under $10K or so.

So given the feedback, I am thinking that I might enjoy a dainty graduated 5 stone band, with the center stone being large enough to appreciate the facets. I'm now thinking of going up to 0.75ct for the main stone and dropping off from there.

I think that will allow me to appreciate the cut and also give me a ring with multiple AVRs, which is also part of the appeal of the project for me.

 

[Jereni]

The larger the diamond the easier it will be to differentiate in the faceting and light performance. At the same time the smaller cut fancy rounds ARE STILL UNBELIEVABLY GORGEOUS and still maintain their character.

Thanks for the info Rhino! This is why I'm thinking the graduated idea works both ways. I would get to appreciate a large-enough stone in the center, with some extra bling in the ring in the same cut pattern...I really like that idea even if small AVRs are somewhat more than small MRBs would be.

 

[Jereni]

Ugh, I reserved a diamond at GOG to show you all, and now it's not on their search page and I can't link to it or find a way to get to it and put the photos/ASET online.

Do I need to release it to get all that info and then re-reserve it?