Help! which is a better buy-i am stuck!

[seeker of diamond]

I have learned a lot reading through this forum about diamonds and looking forward for help to get me out of this situation i am in.

I am stuck with a jeweler (long story short - returned something i didnt like & now money is stuck)
He has given me 2 options (0.87 & 0.83 carat) he can get to his shop.. and given me details of the diamonds. i haven''t seen them yet!I am also running out of time and i need to buy either one of the two options by next week. He knows i am in a hurry & he knows my money is stuck so he is obviously doing the least required. Has given me details of both of them and asked me which one i am willing to buy and he will get that stone (small shop but has been around for long)

I m more inclined towards 0.87carat..because of measurement & carat... what is stopping me is the HCA reading which is giving "Very good" & not "excellent" for all-fire, scint, spred & light return.

DIAMOND 0.87 carat - Option 1

Cert: GIA
Cut: Ideal
Color: H
Clarity: VS2
Depth: 62.00%
Table: 57%
Crown Angle: 35.0°
Crown Height: 15.0%
Pavilion Angle: 41.0°
Pavilion Depth: 43.5%
Star length: 50%
Lower Half: 75%
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Excellent
Griddle: Thin to slightly thick faceted 3.5%)
Culet: None
Flou.: None
Measurement: 6.14 x 6.11 x 3.80 mm

Checked on HCA=2.4- very good(within GIA excellent candidate but slightly out of AGS ideal) but i like the price for 0.87 carat
Light Return Very Good
Fire Very Good
Scintillation Very Good
Spread/diameter Very Good

DIAMOND 0.83 carat - Option 2

Cert: GIA
Color: H
Clarity : VS2
Cut : Excellent
Depth: 60.3%
Table: 56%
Crown Angle: 33.5°
Crown Height: 14.5%
Pavilion Angle: 40.8°
Pavilion Depth: 43.0%
Star length: 50%
Lower Half: 75%
Girdle: Thin to Medium, Faceted (3.0%)
Culet: None
Flou.: None
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Excellent
Measurements: 6.09 - 6.12 x 3.68 mm

Checked on HCA=0.7-Excellent (within GIA excellent candidate but slightly out of AGS ideal)
Light Return Excellent
Fire Excellent
Scintillation Excellent
Spread Very good

Help me!

 

[stone-cold11]

I would go for #2.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 2/23/2010 12:38:12 PM
Author: Stone-cold11
I would go for #2.

Hi Seeker,

Your cry for help will not go unanswered!

Ditto stonecold, 2 for me too.

 

[seeker of diamond]

thanks...so u think 0.83 carat is a better buy than 0.87carat? Will o.83 carat shine a lot better than 0.87?
But is 0.83 expensive for $3300?

 

[stone-cold11]

A lot better? No idea from the numbers, but it is the safer bet based on the numbers.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 2/23/2010 12:56:32 PM
Author: Stone-cold11
A lot better? No idea from the numbers, but it is the safer bet based on the numbers.

I agree.

 

[seeker of diamond]

after lot of trial i was able to put the HCA of both together.... both are out of AGS ideal.

Do u still think 0.83 will be better.... i m planning to make final decision today.

 

[stone-cold11]

Can''t you just call both in and compare side by side?

 

[seeker of diamond]

Date: 2/23/2010 2:25:59 PM
Author: Stone-cold11
Can''t you just call both in and compare side by side?

I had asked the jeweler the same question.... he says in that case he needs more time ( he knows my deadline.... i can see he is not willing to cooperate) Seems now he has my money- he does not want to spend much time/effort on me.
After this purchase i am never again visiting old jeweler shops! ...my mistake as well -i should not have rushed with money deposit.

 

[stone-cold11]

so both are the same price?

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 2/23/2010 2:22:59 PM
Author: seeker of diamond
after lot of trial i was able to put the HCA of both together.... both are out of AGS ideal.

Do u still think 0.83 will be better.... i m planning to make final decision today.

There is really no way to tell without images unfortunately. The second is somewhat " safer" by the numbers but that is no guarantee. The first stone has angles which are what we call '' steep deep.'' This basically means the stone could show light leakage, you don''t want this as you need the diamond to make the most of the light hitting it to reflect it back to your eye as '' sparkle.'' The stone may or may not show light leakage depending on these angles as GIA round these proportions, if the angles are in reality less than 35/41 the stone might not show leakage and be perfectly fine. If the angles are in fact steeper than 35/ 41 or the diamond is not precisely cut, then leakage could result.

 

[seeker of diamond]

Date: 2/23/2010 2:32:38 PM
Author: Stone-cold11
so both are the same price?

yes they are both same price $3300

 

[seeker of diamond]

Date: 2/23/2010 2:34:12 PM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 2/23/2010 2:22:59 PM

Author: seeker of diamond

after lot of trial i was able to put the HCA of both together.... both are out of AGS ideal.


Do u still think 0.83 will be better.... i m planning to make final decision today.

There is really no way to tell without images unfortunately. The second is somewhat '' safer'' by the numbers but that is no guarantee. The first stone has angles which are what we call '' steep deep.'' This basically means the stone could show light leakage, you don''t want this as you need the diamond to make the most of the light hitting it to reflect it back to your eye as '' sparkle.'' The stone may or may not show light leakage depending on these angles as GIA round these proportions, if the angles are in reality less than 35/41 the stone might not show leakage and be perfectly fine. If the angles are in fact steeper than 35/ 41 or the diamond is not precisely cut, then leakage could result.

i am totally stuck Lorelei!

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 2/23/2010 2:53:12 PM
Author: seeker of diamond

Date: 2/23/2010 2:34:12 PM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 2/23/2010 2:22:59 PM

Author: seeker of diamond

after lot of trial i was able to put the HCA of both together.... both are out of AGS ideal.


Do u still think 0.83 will be better.... i m planning to make final decision today.

There is really no way to tell without images unfortunately. The second is somewhat ' safer' by the numbers but that is no guarantee. The first stone has angles which are what we call ' steep deep.' This basically means the stone could show light leakage, you don't want this as you need the diamond to make the most of the light hitting it to reflect it back to your eye as ' sparkle.' The stone may or may not show light leakage depending on these angles as GIA round these proportions, if the angles are in reality less than 35/41 the stone might not show leakage and be perfectly fine. If the angles are in fact steeper than 35/ 41 or the diamond is not precisely cut, then leakage could result.

i am totally stuck Lorelei!

Ok no problem, I will try to simplify!

Click on this tutorial from the tutorial section to locate the crown and pavilion angles on a diamond, see diagram.

With diamonds, the crown and pavilion angles are critical in order to direct light through the stone and back to the viewer's eye as sparkle and beauty, all the things we expect to see from a diamond! The crown and pavilion angles can therefore be likened to a car engine, as an engine helps power a car, the angles help power the diamond and drive the light return.

Because the angles on the first diamond might not be the best fit for each other, this means that light can escape from the stone instead of being seen as sparkle. Rather like a leaky bucket where water can seep out, a diamond with such angles can, in some cases, also let light escape.

Further to this which somewhat complicates matters, GIA's cut grading method means that they round these angles, so we aren't always getting an exact measurement, but an average. Because tiny incremental differences in these angles can affect the beauty we see as this can influence how well these angles work together, and as these angle measurements are rounded and not exact, it is possible that the angles for this diamond might be steeper than GIA says. If this is the case, then it is more likely that the diamond can lose light or show leakage. It is also possible that the angles might not be as steep as GIA reports, but are shallower. If this is the case then the diamond might not show leakage at all.

The best way to check for leakage is with an Idealscope image. These are often available from online vendors but from jewellery stores not so much. Click here for more info on Idealscope images.

Let me know if this explains things better for you!

 

[seeker of diamond]

Date: 2/23/2010 3:03:42 PM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 2/23/2010 2:53:12 PM

Author: seeker of diamond

Date: 2/23/2010 2:34:12 PM

Author: Lorelei

Date: 2/23/2010 2:22:59 PM


Author: seeker of diamond


after lot of trial i was able to put the HCA of both together.... both are out of AGS ideal.



Do u still think 0.83 will be better.... i m planning to make final decision today.

There is really no way to tell without images unfortunately. The second is somewhat '' safer'' by the numbers but that is no guarantee. The first stone has angles which are what we call '' steep deep.'' This basically means the stone could show light leakage, you don''t want this as you need the diamond to make the most of the light hitting it to reflect it back to your eye as '' sparkle.'' The stone may or may not show light leakage depending on these angles as GIA round these proportions, if the angles are in reality less than 35/41 the stone might not show leakage and be perfectly fine. If the angles are in fact steeper than 35/ 41 or the diamond is not precisely cut, then leakage could result.

i am totally stuck Lorelei!

Ok no problem, I will try to simplify!


Click on this tutorial from the tutorial section to locate the crown and pavilion angles on a diamond, see diagram.


With diamonds, the crown and pavilion angles are critical in order to direct light through the stone and back to the viewer''s eye as sparkle and beauty, all the things we expect to see from a diamond! The crown and pavilion angles can therefore be likened to a car engine, as an engine helps power a car, the angles help power the diamond and drive the light return.


Because the angles on the first diamond might not be the best fit for each other, this means that light can escape from the stone instead of being seen as sparkle. Rather like a leaky bucket where water can seep out, a diamond with such angles can, in some cases, also let light escape.


Further to this which somewhat complicates matters, GIA''s cut grading method means that they round these angles, so we aren''t always getting an exact measurement, but an average. Because tiny incremental differences in these angles can affect the beauty we see as this can influence how well these angles work together, and as these angle measurements are rounded and not exact, it is possible that the angles for this diamond might be steeper than GIA says. If this is the case, then it is more likely that the diamond can lose light or show leakage. It is also possible that the angles might not be as steep as GIA reports, but are shallower. If this is the case then the diamond might not show leakage at all.


The best way to check for leakage is with an Idealscope image. These are often available from online vendors but from jewellery stores not so much. Click here for more info on Idealscope images.


Let me know if this explains things better for you!

Thanks Lorelei...i understand now what you were trying to explain me earlier.