Honest Opinion Needed ! TOO MUCH METAL ?!?!

[frankiextah]

hi everyone ...

took the LM adrianna 811 ring out to look at today and realized something ...

there is actually quite a lot of metal surrounding the stone, making it almost looking like a bezel when looking under spot lighting / jewelry store lighting ! to my understanding, Adrianna rings shouldn't have that much metal on the halo surrounding the stone, am i correct? any Adrianna owners out there can shed some light ?

i also went to Tiffany & Co with a friend today in NYC (to look at potential E-ring options), and i saw the most gorgeous LM-like RB halo (and it's NOT the embrace collection, i think it's their one of a kind rings) ! it is also claw prong set with a thin pave halo, looking JUST like the LM adrianna from top down, and there is absolutely no sight of metal around the stone... i know LM tries to minimize metal so i'm not sure why i'm seeing so much of it around the stone ??

i'm thinking to reach out to Leon this coming week to discuss this problem ... before that, i'd love to see what everyone thinks ...

* sorry ring is not cleaned, and photos are large to show what i'm seeing... *

 

[Gypsy]

I think you are fixating hon. It's not about one part of a ring. It's about the whole effect. And I promise you the ring is stunning and perfect. Just put it in a box and find a new project to occupy you.

Your mom's ring is one of the most beautiful Leon's I've ever seen. I promise, promise, promise. But you need to take a deep breathe and walk away now.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Did you notice this in person or only in magnified photos?

I think the ring looks perfect.

 

[mrssalvo]

Is this the ring that was looked at by David Wolf? I can't really see anything from the photos but if there is something there that shouldn't be, extra metal from the finishing or something that by all means you should say something. Honestly though, I agree with gypsy, the ring looks gorgeous. You can find tiny flaws in any ring under super scrutiny and at some point you just have to let some things go and try to enjoy!!

 

[frankiextah]

well, to be honest i have let a few things go ... one of those is that the band is not 1.8mm as i had instructed... my appraiser david wolf verified that LM made it at 1.90-1.95mm...

thing is, the metal that "surrounds" the center stone is not consistent / not even ... some parts the melee diamond sits flush with the center stone, some parts there is a fair amount of metal between the melee diamond and the center stone ...

i am seeing this in without any magnification or visual aids. when it's under candlelight / spot light / jewelry store light situations, it is very apparent. in broad daylight, i see it when the ring is tilted and the metal reflects light.

i do know as a fact that the extra metal is not needed there for the use of securing the melee stones in place, since its cutdown pave style, there are "mini" prongs that hold each melee in place. there is visually NO metal on the outer edge of the halo, so i do not see why there should be an uneven boarder of metal that surrounds the main stone...

i just thought the idea is that the melee diamonds should really sit flush with the venter stone without any metal in sight ?

i will try to take more pictures to show this more clearly ...

 

[frankiextah]

here... my attempt to show the unattractive, uneven "white metal ring" around the center stone, in between the melee diamonds and center stone :

 

[GliderPoss]

I don't think there is too much metal at all! It's a beautiful ring. As the others said - stop fixating and just enjoy your bling!

 

[pancake]

Those photos are really really enlarged - everything looks more exaggerated. As it is, I can only see what you are referring to in the last photo (the one where the glare highlights the metal around the centre stone).

Personally I think the ring looks stunning, and you are fixating on something that nobody else would ever notice. I think you also have to remember that this is a handmade ring. It is just not possible for it to be 100% uniform.

 

[frankiextah]

i was thinking that the ring shouldn't have ANY amount of that metal surrounding the center stone at all... ? that metal ring glare is actually very obvious and apparent in person ...

i'm curious to know if any of the other adrianna rings out there (cushions or rounds) have the same characteristics ?

 

[pancake]

Well, it sounds like you are bothered by it regardless of what anyone else might say or see - in which case I guess the only thing you can do is talk to Leon about it and see what he says.

 

[marymm]

I myself do not consider there is too much metal whatsoever - when I saw the pics in your other thread I actually thought to myself, "now there's a halo that is all diamonds, not metal and diamonds." But regardless of anyone else's opinion, this is something you had especially created for your mother and you are obviously examining it very closely.

I do think it is virtually impossible to have a flawless handmade ring. I also wonder if perhaps the metal around the diamond might be uneven in order to accommodate the diamond halo melee - I don't see how the halo could be squeezed closer to the diamond (thereby reducing or eliminating the uneven metal you see), without affecting the uniformity of the melee setting?

I do remember you mentioning being surprised and disappointed that LM hadn't met your shank specs - for me personally the minor mm difference would be a non-issue, but if it is important to you and it was specified on the work order perhaps it is something LM can address.

I understand the desire for perfection, and I am also one to take a hyper-critical eye to important purchases -- but only you can decide if these imperfections you now see are significant enough to require action.

 

[Circe]

I can see what you mean in the shots in which the ring is turned at an angle. That said, I actually quite like the effect: IRL, it's generally incredibly suble, and I think it has the visual effect of making the stone look a little bigger in real life (not that that beauty needs it). So, yes, I can see what you mean ... but I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing.

You could possibly mitigate it simply by having the stone set a bit lower in the prongs to cover the metal, but then you run the risk of damaging their integrity.

 

[slg47]

Frankie-I think I see what you are seeing. I have attempted to highlight it in this picture. The ring really is beautiful, but if this really bothers you maybe contact Leon and see what he says? As far as the shank width, I am assuming that Leon chose it so that the melee in the shank would be proportional to the melee in the halo. Did the work order say 1.8 mm specifically? My understanding (have not worked with Leon, but from reading on PS) is that when you work with him you are essentially paying for his eye for proportions and you lose some ability to influence the design specifics.

 

[Lula]

I see what you are talking about. There's definitely a reflection on the edge of the metal, and I'm not sure if it's the edge of the diamond creating that effect (optical illusion of some sort?), or if it's extra metal. But I'm wondering if you will end up with an airline if the metal is removed?

 

[stci]

I don't think there is too much metal at all! It's a beautiful ring. As the others said - stop fixating and just enjoy your bling!

I agree!!!!

 

[Amethyste]

THe ring is exquisite. THe "U" shape that holds the halo stones (i think) are somewhat of a modified bezel in my eyes. THat makes it easier to set/reset/tighten the halo stones maybe in a later date without getting close to the girdle of the center diamond. I think it looks gorgeous. The thing that caught my eyes however, is not the "metal" around the center diamond, but the long prongs extending quite deep into the center diamonds... BUT As someone mentionned on here, the pictures are quite magnified, so I think I might be seeing distorted.

 

[Gypsy]

Frankie-I think I see what you are seeing.

I think that metal area is needed to hold the stone. If the girdles are exposed on outside edge of the halo, in order to have enough metal to hold the stone maybe that ring of metal around your center is needed?

 

[frankiextah]

lula, the diamond would NOT end up with an airline if the metal is not present. LM should have pushed the melee diamonds closer to the center diamond and eliminated that metal edge.

here, no. 1 is what it should be on the ring (the top and bottom of the melee diamonds should have no metal "edging"). no. 2 is what is happening on my ring right now (the top has no metal but the bottom shows that metal edge).



amethyst, i wanted the prong setting look, not a bezel look with prongs... oh, and don't worry, the claw prongs shown on the photo is somewhat skewed by the angle when i photographed the ring. so it's not long at all by any means.

gypsy, i don't think that the metal edge serves any supporting function in holding up the center diamond at all. the "U" curve is simply a "cut out" to allow the melee diamond to slot in. the pointy ends are the "prongs" to hold the melee diamond in place.

i drew a cross section of the ring to show the support structure. as you can see, the pink part is where the center diamond rests, and the main claw prongs hold it in place :




the main concern for me is : if there is absolutely NO metal "bezel" edge on the outmost edge of the halo (as you can see the row of melee diamonds create that ring's outer edge), why does it need metal edging on the other side of the melee diamonds, consider the fact that no metal edging is needed to hold up the melee diamonds?

- my appraiser verified that the halo is at 1.75mm thick (band is 1.95mm). while LM insisted that the halo must match the band, it is not executed here. don't get me wrong, i actually don't mind that the halo is a teeny bit thinner, but i would have thought that LM would have done so if he had so adamantly wanted that/

- i did consider the fact that perhaps the melee diamonds are too small to fill up the "width" of the halo. if that were the case, why did he not use larger melee's ? or leave the melee size as-is and make the halo a hair thinner. i did mention to him that ideally i'd like the halo to be 1.6mm and he immediately insisted that it must match the shank width (i asked for 1.8mm).

 

[bgray]

metal can only be so thin and still be strong and durable enough to withstand wear and slight flexing over time. additionally the deisgn and stones are often tweaked subtly while under construction to accommodate slight variations in melee size and so forth. these pieces are hand made. while i understand that this is "eye of the beholder" and you dont like how it looks I dont think it is done badly or incorrectly.

 

[frankiextah]

slg47 , thankyou so much for the help in interpreting what i was trying to say!!

in regards to your concern, LM did tell me to "trust" him on the halo, and when i told him i wanted it to be at about 1.6mm ( a hair thinner than the shank), he insisted that they should match in width. so i listened to him. what i don't understand is why he needed the extra metal edge to beef up the halo width instead of using larger melees, or, (eh hem) "listen" to me and make the halo at 1.6mm. i do think that without that metal edge the halo would be at 1.6mm...

sorry guys, i know i am dissecting this ring into shreds, but i actually noticed this when i first picked up the ring, but i thought it's a standard for all the halos until i went into Tiffany today and saw one of their one-of-a-kind rings that looks identical as the LM one from top down, and it has absolutely no metal edging around the center stone. this brought me to bring up the issue on PS... i am now quite bothered !

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Honest opinion:

1) All the previous pictures of the ring are gorgeous! No one noticed a thing. No one will ever view your ring magnified 100 times with bright light shining on it. I really think it looks fine. It may make it structurally more sound, too.

2) There is not a heck of alot of difference between 1.8 and 1.9mm for a shank, so that to me is a non-issue. In fact, in light of the problems with very thin pave shanks, I think you are lucky to get the extra tenth of a millimeter (which is very, very slight visually).

3) Handmade rings just aren't usually going to be perfect under major magnification. So don't look at it magnified!!!

 

[frankiextah]

diamondseeker, the thing is when bright light shines on, the more the apparent it is, because there is more light reflected on the shiny surface of the diamond! and even when looking it with my unaided eyes more than 12" away, i can still see an apparent line of metal that goes around the center diamond. the closer my eyes are towards the ring, not only that the metal edge is more visible, but i also see UNEVEN-NESS on the edge - a few out of the 24 diamonds are actually FLUSHED with the center diamond (so apparently no metal edge CAN be done), the rest there is a fair amount of metal in between.

 

[bgray]

i would like to add one thing: your halo slopes down away from the center slightly and the design element that is so successful in my opinion is that the metal that separates the melee from your center stone actually frames the center stone so that it is distinguished from the melee.............and then on the very delicate outside edge the melee appears to float. Personally none of this was done by accident. Leon is a pain but he is a pain who knows what he is doing.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I think an unevenness might bother me more than the presence of the metal. I thought it was that way all the way around. I'm just thinking that your mother would never notice this unless you tell her. And my advice is, please don't mention it to her because I am not optimistic about Leon remaking the ring. I'll be really interested to see what he says. I do want you to be happy with the ring!

 

[yssie]

I don't see the unevenness, but I suspect that's something you'd only see with the ring in-hand IRL.

In any case... I think, in all honesty, you're just not going to get the perfection of symmetry you seem to be looking for in a handmade piece - no handmade piece, not even those that royalty commission.

 

[LGK]

I think the thing is, you're not going to get a good/useful response from Leon on this most likely, which a very good reason to just take a deep breath and put it away. It's possible you may get an explaination as to why he made it that way, but if you're hoping for him to say "Oh my goodness! Please allow me to remake this for you for free!" Well... not so likely unfortunately. I suspect you'll only increase your level of frustration if you keep fretting about this, and there really isn't much chance there's a darn thing to be done about it, you know? Unless an explaination would help- *that* might be possibly forthcoming- but changing it probably won't be.

First of all, it isn't noticeable, really. Yeah you might have noticed it and now you are looking for it, and see it- but I bet your mother never even thinks about it. (And unless you get a remake, please please don't mention it to her!)

Second of all, it may well have a structural reason to exist. Perhaps it's because he chose to set the diamond flush into the halo, and the melee has to be attached to *something*. I don't know- it may even have been a stylistic choice LM made, who knows. Most of the rings I've seen where it looks like halo diamonds are "right up against the center" when you're looking top-down, in profile view you can see the center stone is set up pretty high above the halo and they're really not that close to each other, it only looks that way when seen from above. This ring isn't made like that- the center stone is flush on the same level as the halo- which could definitely mean the metal is there for a structural reason.

And third, yes, handmade rings especially have a certain level of variation in them- you cannot get a loupe perfect handmade ring without spending a gazillion dollars- Leon definitely doesn't work for that level of perfection at his prices. And IMO it's within typical variations for handmade, truly.

Fourth and last- it isn't going to live on your hand. You aren't going to notice it every day, it's simply not going to get the chance to bug you. It isn't a glaring problem or unattractive at all. And I really, really doubt your mom will see it or care if she does. If it were my ring, I wouldn't have probably ever noticed, and if I did, it wouldn't bother me. My suggestion: put it away, give it to your mom when she's ready to take it off your hands, and don't say a word about the "flaw" you've spotted. It is a truly amazingly lovely piece and she'll love it, promise.

 

[petrock<3]

I do see what you are seeing. Unfortunately I notice and am bothered by little things like this too.

But, I think your chances are slim to get it redone. I don't think there is technically anything wrong with the piece. It is worth a try to ask because you are unhappy with it, but it is a beautiful and well done piece as a whole.

There are tiny differences in the diameter of the melee, so the amount of metal is going to be a little different. It is probably more important to have the outside edge line up perfectly. Now, I don't make rings obviously, so could he could have done a better job matching the melee size? I don't know, maybe that is impossible to do.

I'm sorry you are unhappy with it, I hope your mom hasn't noticed any of this. It is a GORGEOUS ring, truly spectacular, and I hope she is enjoying it!

 

[frankiextah]

i do want to show a couple of LM's adrianna rings with melee diamonds that sit FLUSH with the center stone (both use cutdown pave like mine) :

diamonband's



hellokitty's

 

[lovemydiamond]

Your ring looks great. One thing to note (probably someone already mentioned it but I didn't read though all the posts before throwing my 2 cents): the side diamonds and your center diamond can cut each other's edges if you don't have metal before them. I have read posts before that the diamonds in a five-stone wedding band start cracking when a person used a customized design (which has thin metals in between the side stones). I am sure that it is not something you want. Just a personal suggestion: why don't you enjoy your current setting (which looks perfect to me) for a couple of years and change to some other style later if you get bored of it. Your ring's design is really hot right now. A lot of gals would envy you over it.

LMD

 

[frankiextah]

i whipped out my professional DSLR and took a much better photo, the metal around the center stone is obvious :





i apologize for being so obsessive but i do have to treat this ring as if my own... my mom is extremely detail oriented and i would feel that i have failed her in some way... i swear she notices the tiniest thing