How do you all deal with not so constructive criticism?

[anchor31]

Date: 5/18/2007 10:04:23 AM
Author: zdrastvootya
Thanks everyone, for your insights. Good to hear opiniions from folks in the QC (isn''t that a tv show?). Our American friends must be falling asleep by now! Ally, I think you''re identifying symptoms of a few things. The ''siege'' mentaility of a french-speaking minority surrounded by an english-speaking majority. The kicker is that the minority is the majority in that province.

I met 2 Montreal girls on vacation and learned a few things. They were very friendly, and their English was quite good. One thing I found weird was they were translating their names into English. Marie introduced herself as ''Mary'' and her friend as ''Josie'' rather than Josee (ack, where''s my accent). It struck me that they didn''t really encounter anglophone Canadians that much, or they would know that they didn''t have to translate their names.

I think that was an indication of ''the divide''. Marie also told me, she''d never been to Toronto or anywhere in Ontario. She mentioned that her and her friends have encontered fairly often that servers in downtown Montreal restaurants don''t speak French. I don''t think she was angry about it, but more disappointed. I think Montreal is quite bilingual which is great, but still a divided city where there are ''islands'' of English-speaking.

Anchor, cultural/religiious accommodation is a hot topic for me right now. I picture myself (like a lot of Canadians, I suppose) as polite, tolerant, etc., but now we''re meeting the challenge of orthodox religions/cultures that have taboos/customs outside our secular society. I used to make jokes about someone who seemed inherently rude, and say ''it''s a cultural thing'', but in truth coming from a different culture doesn''t excuse it. I''m thinking now, if you don''t believe in Canadian core principles (like equality of women), maybe you shouldn''t come here. (Something I''d never thought I''d say - sounds very bigoted.) I''m wondering if this is a condition of citizenship? If so, I understand people give it lip service, but maybe we need to emphasize it more in immigration policy. (Of course there are people born here who don''t believe in these values, but we can''t kick them out

I note that in QC folks are willing to take a stand on the issue, because it''s inherent over there to protect French culture. Over here in Ontario, we''re not so used to this position and have been wimpy in dealing with the issue.

Z.

Hehe, maybe our american friends are falling asleep, but it sure is refreshing for me!

I have to admit that I do pronounce my name (Roxane) in English rather than French when I talk to an anglophone. I''m not sure why we do that... I go to Ontario several times a year; my mother''s family in from the Ottawa region. I''ve been to the Toronto area and Borden (the Georgia Bay is just stunning!) as well. Do you mind my asking in what area you are in ON?

Personally, I''ve never been anywhere in Montreal where I was no served in French. I don''t mind speaking English, but if someone answers to me in English, I usually politely ask if they speak French. They usually say yes and switch to French. I would be disappointed as well if someone was not willing to serve me in French. Our official language in French, so being a Quebecer and refusing to learn French would be (to me) like being American and refusing to learn English.

I''m with you 100% on the cultural/religious accomodation thing. I wasn''t aware you were having that kind of issues as well, although I shouldn''t be surprised. To me, your opinion doesn''t seem bigoted because I agree! If people don''t agree with our culture and way of life, why would they come here in the first place? Do they really believe they can try to change us?

As for how we dealt with it, I''m not no proud to say it took a lot for our government to finally stand up to it. They agreed to the first requests... and it took many petitions to have those "accomodations" removed. After a while, the government finally saw that the Quebecers would NOT allow their identity and culture to be slighted.

 

[Phoenix]

Alleycat, I haven't read all of these posts in detail and know very little abt Canada in terms of what's going on abt the cultural / language/ racial isssues, but here is my 2 cents:

I have almost never felt being discriminated against when I was living in the UK (and even less so now, now that we're living in Asia and I look just like a local) or when I go back to visit. Sure, when we first got to London (after having lived in France for abt 6 months, where everyone, and I mean everyone was super-nice to us and I've been told this was mainly because this was a little town in France where people are just naturally friendly), I felt a little apprehensive, but mainly this was because we didn't speak English and were unfamiliar with the territory and culture. I have been given the same opportunities, education and career-wise, as any other Brit. I've done very well in schools and in my career, and have worked very very hard for my achievements. Same goes for most of my brothers and sisters.

I don't consciously think: "Oh, I am Vietnamese, are they going to accept me, an immigrant, into their society?". Seriously, London is a multi-cultural society and sure it has its fair share of social/ racial/ religion issues. It'd be naive of me to think that everyone believed in equality and have the same respect and tolerance for one another. But I do think that many Brits, at least many Londoners, despite of their cultural/ racial differences (or maybe because of them) in their day-to-day lives, do not look at each other and think some others are worse off than themselves just because of their colour/ race/ background, or even if they do, they don't at least say it to yr face (if they think that and keep it to themselves, you won't necessarily know but over time, you'll be able to tell as their thoughts will manifest into their behaviour). The way I look at it, we all work and contribute (in different ways) as well pay taxes just like everyone else does. Oh, and I don't think that we're guests in the UK, I believe that ok, it's great that they let us in and am thankful for all the opportunities that we've been given, but we have worked hard to get to where we are and have earned our rightful place in society and we consider ourselves British (albeit of Vietnammese descent). If all the so-called immigrants were guests, then that would make the UK, and particularly London practically a hotel, as there so many people of so many and diverse cultural and racial backgrounds there. It's like the majority of Americans were not native but have become "locals"/ Americans because they've been living there for so long now and have contributed to that society. It is these so called immigrants that make America what it is today, IMO.

I am sorry you've had this awful experience (and yes, it sounds like she was heavy-handed and tactless), but you've got to not let it bother you or it will eat you up. In fact, what I think you should do is to prove yr lecturer wrong. You should work even harder on yr assignments, get someone (maybe yr FI or a close friend) proof read yr future assignments and ask them to be really, brutually, honest with you. Do whatever you can to immprove yr work, put the accents on the words by hand if you can't find the software to do it for you. You have to show her that you belong there. For God's sake, you were born in Canada and yr family has contributed. You are no more a guest in Canada than she is (her ancestors went there from France, it's not like they were natives. You could say that you're both immigrants, but they just arrived there several generations before you did). Do NOT let her drive you away from Quebec. If you did that, you'd be doing that for the rest of yr life. Prove to her that you're much better than what she thinks you are. Do brilliantly so she'd have no excuse to come down on you.

Good luck.