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I don''t want to be THAT girl.

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largirl

largirl

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Oct 17, 2007
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I so don''t want to be "that" girl - the one that nags her boyfriend about getting married and starts inwardly planning her wedding without a ring and definitely not the one that lays down the ultimatium.

But...we''ve been dating six years. We have a house. We''re both in our late 20''s. Our friends are starting to get married (my best friend has been married three years, two of his good friends are going to be married next year). And I''m so sick of waiting. I''m sick of people asking me "when?". I just want to be his wife. I want him to be my husband. I want to move onto the next stage in my life - after six years I feel completely stagnant. At this point I just want to get it over with so I don''t have to think about it any more! Heck, I don''t even need a ceremony or a party. Elopement is fine. Vegas is fine! I''ve talked to him about it a little, but I don''t want to push him. I haven''t exactly narrowed down the reason why he''s waiting - I know that he wants to be out of debt before we go into more debt (we''re paying off about $9K in student loans and should be done by next fall). I know he wants to wait a while before having kids and thinks that after marriage that will be the next immediate step (I''ve assured him we can wait for that). I know he''s shy and isn''t eager to be the center of attention. I know he''s not super keen on the institute of marriage, period, but I also know that he''s planning on asking me someday. He absolutely loves me, I have no doubt. And I don''t doubt my love for him. And I hate myself for constantly wondering when it''s going to happen. I hate to say that lately I HAVE been nagging him and have been dropping hints - okay. flat out telling him - that we need to do this soon. But I hate being that person. I just think, "God, being silent for six years didn''t move us forward....maybe he NEEDS to be nagged!". Thank god I''ve refrained from the ultimatium. I would never want to be proposed to because of an ultimatium. I also hate it because I do want it to be a surprise, but really, after six years is that even possible? I''ve been expecting it every dinner, every vacation, every special occassion for the past three or four years! I want to stop. I want to stop caring!

No real question here, I guess....any general advice or hearing from people who are in the same boat would be great.
 
don''t worry about being "that girl". be more worried about being "that girl" who''s so afraid of being that "other girl" that she doesn''t say what''s really on her mind and her boyfriend therefore enjoys the status quo thinking all''s good.

i used to try to be the cool girlfriend, who never pressured, never asked questions like other girls about the future, timelines, kids, marriage. it took me time to realize, hey, i want those things! why shouldn''t i expect them and even better, start saying it outloud?
i any case, things worked out for me, but in retrospect, if i''d spoke up more/been firmer, it probably would''ve happened sooner. not everyone''s situation is the same, but that''s my 2 cents. in my case, my bf takes very long to make decisiions and procrastinates thinking about "heavy" or difficult topics, so the onus was more on me to force it on the radar so to speak.

SO talk to him without making him defensive (if you can). Tell him what this is doing to you. Ask some of the tough questiosn ("why aren''t you ready and willl you be?"). Be clear that you ARE ready. Otherwise the nagging will start a bad cycle. He''ll feel more pressured, you''ll feel more resentful, self esteem takes a hit, he feels more pressured,etc. Hang in there, many of us have been there and it''s tough b/c it''s out of one''s control (and if you''ve got any "controlling" genes, it''s especially tough
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), BUT when it does happen you start to forget the grueling period that led up to it!! keep us posted.
 
I think it''s possible that you and I are LIW twins
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I am basically in the same situation; 6 years, have a house, all friends getting married or are already married... etc. etc. etc. Sadly, I don''t have any advice for you at all, other than sitting him down and setting a timeline. I have a feeling several people here will tell you to do that.. that''s what they told me when I posted pretty much the same thing you just did awhile back
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Fortunately, I followed the advice and talked to him about how important this is to me and how it''s really difficult to wait this long. I explained that it can be somewhat painful watching all of our friends enjoy engagements and weddings while everyone continues to wonder why we still aren''t married. Or even engaged! Anyway, the conclusion of the talk was that I needed to know he was serious about this and wanted some kind of a committment. Sooo, he told me we will definitely be engaged within one year (from the time of the talk, which was a couple months ago). It still sucks knowing I might have to wait several more months, but at least I know it''s coming within that amount of time. More importantly, we had a great discussion about everything and now we better understand each others feelings on the subject. Good luck!
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One of my friends was in a similar situation ... 7 yrs together, house etc. After years of frustration she gave him a deadline to propose. She''s married now (with an adorable toddler) but not to the guy she owned the house with. To a guy she met six months after she moved out of that house which happened a few weeks after the deadline passed.

In her case it wasn''t setting a "deadline" that broke things up ... he didn''t get mad about that ... was just "meh, whatever". The deadline PASSING woke her up to the fact it was never gonna happen with him.
 
It seems a lot of people are buying houses with their SO''s who are not married or engaged. I was wondering how people come to such a descision. Doesn''t marriage come up when two people are making such a large, important purchase together? Not being snarky, just wondering.
 
Date: 10/17/2007 5:35:34 PM
Author: brooklyngirl
It seems a lot of people are buying houses with their SO''s who are not married or engaged. I was wondering how people come to such a descision. Doesn''t marriage come up when two people are making such a large, important purchase together? Not being snarky, just wondering.
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Cohabitation is extremely common these days. I may have missed it, but I don''t think largirl said that marriage never "came up" during the house-purchasing-process.
 
Great example, Deco! I fully believe that "getting married" isn't necessarily a success--in your friend's case, she realized her ex couldn't meet her needs, put herself first and that enabled her to find somebody who could meet her needs and make her happy.

Largirl, it does sound like you've been patient and it's obvious that the relationship means more to you than being married, which is great. I dated my husband for 7 years before my (internal) deadline came and went and I left. He did propose a few months later (after a LOT of self-introspection and getting to the root of his isues) and now we're married and are very happy, but had he not proposed, I'd still be in a better place today after leaving.

I use the term "overcooked" pretty often because that's how you feel after waiting for a long time. It sounds like you are starting to feel "overcooked" and are looking for ways to stop focusing on wanting marriage. There are things you can do to distract yourself--new hobbies, more focus on yourself, etc.--but there's really no way to just stop focusing on marriage. Ideally the goal is to engage him in a non-confrontational, open conversation about realistic, timely goals for your relationship. If he's not ready to talk about it, then even that is a clue.
 
brooklyngirl...We did talk about it in abstract ways. We've been planning on spending the rest of our lives together for years. It was (and still is) assumed that marriage would happen some day. I just want that "some day" to be sooner rather than later. If I had a re-do I'd probably have not done it this way, but rather kept my own apartment until we were engaged. Not that I don't love living with him - I really do - but then he wouldn't have ever gotten comfortable with the status quo.

NewEnglandLady, he's been surprisingly receptive to my nagging and teasing - teasing me back, once even saying he'd been thinking about doing a destination-style wedding. At one point I very briefly thought about leaving him over this waiting, but then realized quickly that I'd rather be with him and not married than NOT with him. So that, while pondered, isn't an option for me. If he just came out and said, "Dude, I don't believe in marriage on a moral level" then I could stop wondering when it was going to happen and accept that life. And I would, happily. I just keep hearing the dreaded words "someday..." Although I will say a friend broke up with her boyfriend and they were engaged two weeks later, so maybe there's something to it. :)

I am struggling to come up with a way to voice my thoughts to him without sounding like I just want a wedding or dress or the superficial parts because I can't articulate to myself very well why I want to be married. I just do. It's what happens next. I want to be a wife. But I can't explain how that is different than being a girlfriend (other than the legal part). It's just something I feel inside, something that feels right, and the lack of being able to concretely explain it to myself I think is one of the things that's prevented me from talking to him seriously about it. That and my fear of breaking down into tears. :)
 
I agree with with the previous posters. There needs to be a timeline, if not a timeline for you, as a couple, to get engaged, then an internal timline for you. Speaking from experience, the longer you wait for something to start happening, the most angry and frustrated you get, and that slowly makes both parties miserable. So, I say talk to your bf (calmly, and rationally), and see where he is, how he reacts to this topic. At the same time figure out your timeline (one that''s realistic that you can stick to), and have a plan in place (living arrangements, etc) in case your internal dealine passes and nothing happens. If marriage is something that you cannot live without, then why waste your time on a relationship that has no chance for marriage?

I wish you luck!
 
Here''s what I think you should tell him:

"I am struggling to come up with a way to voice my thoughts to you without sounding like I just want a wedding or dress or the superficial parts because I can''t articulate to myself very well why I want to be married. I just do. It''s what happens next. I want to be a wife. But I can''t explain how that is different than being a girlfriend (other than the legal part). It''s just something I feel inside, something that feels right, and the lack of being able to concretely explain it to myself I think is one of the things that''s prevented me from talking to you seriously about it. I want to get married soon, and by soon I mean within the next 1 year/2 years/(whatever you think). I need to know that you''re on the same page as me...are you?"

I think that''s the perfect thing to say since that''s exactly what you think. He''s your boyfriend of six years-you most likely feel comfortable telling him anything...so don''t let this become some big secret resentment. Just tell him!
 
Largirl, you sound like you''re in the same boat as I was in a little while back (exactly the same, minus the house). I too struggled with trying to explain to myself and FF the concrete reasons for wanting to be married (I don''t think marriage really changes things, especially for couples who already live together). After a lot of thinking, fighting, venting to my best friend, it really came down to marriage making our relationship official in the eyes of our families and society. When a couple is cohabitating, there are a lot of ambiguities, especially between the two sets of families -- they don''t know how to act around one another, how to approach one another, and how to approach the couple. In this sort of situation there is a lot of room for all kinds of confusion and hurt feelings
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. Also, I''m sure there is some resentment at being referred to as girlfriend (I know that''s the case for me, bc I don''t feel like the girlfriend, I feel like the wife).

In the legal sense, marriage is a civil contract, establishing certain rights and responsibilities for the couple regarding insurance, taxes, wills, next of kin, etc., serving to protect the newly formed family.

I hope this helps
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Hey, Largirl, I didn''t mean to imply that you should leave him. In all honestly, unless a woman is 100% ready to move on with her life, leaving will just blow up in her face. I joined a support group (I know it sounds cheesey, but it helped) of women who were in similar situations after I left my now-husband and what happened every single time a woman left before being ready is that she''d go back and in every case that I saw, nothing would change.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with wanting to be married. Just like there is nothing wrong with NOT wanting to be married. And from what you''ve described, it doesn''t sound like he''s against marriage, per se. But I do think it is something you should clarify with him because if he really does NOT EVER want to be married, I don''t think it will work. I know you say that you could drop the idea of marriage if he said he didn''t want it, but I can tell you in the dozens of cases I''ve seen where this has happened, not once has it worked. Resentment is inevitable, especially as a woman''s biological clock grows louder and unless a woman completely changes her gut feelings about marriage, it''s not something she can "give up". Nor is it something she should give up, and if she were with a man who deeply loved her, it''s not something he would ask for her to give up.

I find the best place to start when figuring out timelines is with kids. WAY back in the day before my husband and I lived together, we put together a marriage timeline based on kids. We knew we wanted kids and more importantly, knew we wanted marriage BEFORE kids. So that might be a good place to start with him--when do you guys plan on having kids, does he absolutely want marriage before kids? How long does he want to be married before having kids? Those kinds of questions at least open him up to talking about "when".

Granted, timelines aren''t set in stone (my husband decided he wasn''t ready for the timeline we''d created when it came down to it--but he had 7 years to flake out whereas most timelines are much more short-term), but at least it gets him thinking about it and creating something that is realistic.
 
it''s natural to want to be married. most of us aren''t obsessed (or weren''t) about the superficial aspects of it all. Marriage is the ultimate sign of committment and if it''s something you want, you will feel in limbo until a decision is made one way or the other. i think your boyfriend will understand it more than you think...i think you really need to talk to him. stop being fearful! Once he hears you say the words "i want to be married to you, and i''m ready. how do you feel"?, the ball can start rolling. if you''re nervous to say that, or worried how it''ll be interpreted, then that means maybe you need to come to terms with what it is you want and realize it''s completely meritted! and if you cry, that''s fine..this is the stuff that makes a relationship so much deeper: communicating at a raw level about what each person truly wants and feels.

nicole, it''s so cute, you''re definitely using "husband" alot! i''m still getting used to it..
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I agree that you need to say something, otherwise you''re going to become bitter.

If you say ''I want to be married to you, I want to be your wife'' rather than ''I want to get married! I want a ring!'' then you are emphasizing

People don''t need to be able to explain exactly WHY they have certain feelings or certain wants. I mean, can your guy explain WHY he loves the things he loves? Or wants the things he wants? You are entitled to your feelings and to want the things you want, and you are entitled to have him respect them. That means, him telling you straight out whether it''s what he wants too, listening to you and being respectful of you.

Sit him down, non-defensively tell him exactly what you want. Tell him it''s extremely important to you and that you hope he understands and respects that, and tell him you don''t owe him an explanation for how it''s ''different''. It''s different because it feels different to YOU. End of story.

But you really, really do need to tell him what you want and how you feel. Don''t be afraid! Do it!
 
One of the "concrete" reasons for getting married is getting to take his last name as your''s (if you are planning to do that). Maybe if you explain that as one of the reasons for marriage is that you''re ready to Mrs. "Smith" then maybe he''ll begin to see how special it is to you.
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Who knows maybe he''ll like the sound of hearing that out loud and agree that he wants you to be a Mrs. "Smith" too!
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I’m in the boat right beside you! Your situation is almost identical to mine: been together for a while, own a house together, have friends who have taken the plunge, we’re even the same age. So, if it is any comfort at all, at least you know that you are not alone. Not even close to it.

I agree with the other ladies here. You have to sit down and talk to him about your future together. Make sure you two are on the same page. If you can’t set a timeline for an anticipated engagement, maybe you should set an internal timeline to have the discussion again with him and again and again until he gets it. You say that you would still be happy to be with him even if he said marriage would never be part of the equation. If he was to tell you during your talk that he does not see himself getting married perhaps it would be easier for you to begin to let go of the LIW anxiety you have knowing that it isn’t in the picture right now.

Many times ladies on this board have mentioned the uncertainty that comes with being LIW being the biggest cause of the anxiety we often feel. Feeling as if a major aspect of your life is left up to another person could cause anyone to freak out a bit. I’m very independent and waiting for my SO to take control of the situation and get things moving drives me batty. I don’t need to know when it is coming just that it is on the horizon and maybe that’s all you need too.
 
i think "thing2of2" hit the nail on the head. you should really bring it up to your BF mostly to let him know how important an issue it is to you. it''s not about "you are too slow" or "it''s never going to happen", but we have to admit that as women we have a limited amount of time and eggs, so the clock is ticking!! someone who loves you should consider something that you feel as important to be important to them as well.

and i am already THAT GIRL, even though i have a ring on the way. it never ends! until the day i have it on my finger and i decide that i love it, i will just be a ball of anxiety. women have the worrying gene. men have the SportsCenter gene. and never the twain shall meet!
 
Go and buy ''Why Men Marry Some Women and Not Others''.

I read it and then gave it to my then bf in front of all his friends.
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I made it very clear that marriage was a non-negotiable. It actually wasn''t - but you never ever tell a man that.

He realised that he didn''t want to risk losing me and that I wanted to get married more than he wanted not too (he doesn''t ''believe'' in marriage - parents messy divorce etc).

The important thing is that you make an internal deadline and realise that if it passes you either settle for what you have, or move on.

Right now, you are risking being in the situation that he finally proposes and you realise it''s actually too late and you aren''t interested anymore.
 
I have a close girlfriend going on dating her bf of almost 8 years and her situation closely mirrors yours. I don''t think her man is in the stages of thinking of marriage and why bother in his eyes, "why buy the cow when I''m getting the milk for free" situation. I wish there is something I could tell her that she doesn''t already know. He basically old her "I think we''ve missed our opportunity to get engaged" ???? What does that mean? Anyways... its a whole ''nother thread.

I hope things work out for you guys and you guys sit down and talk about your future. Be up front and honest, and if its meant to be then you guys will eventually get married and be together
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It is AWESOME to hear other from other people in the same situation. Everyone gave great advice about the timeline. Now to suck it up and just do it!

thing2of2, I think you''re right that I just need to tell him exactly what I wrote. LOL. I guess I did know what to say, after all. It''s hard because we think very differently (he''s a computer geek so he''s very analytical and numbers oriented and I''m emotional and romantic) - while usually that''s good and we balance each other out wonderfully, when it comes to things like this that you can''t quantify and that are based on emotions it''s hard to explain to him. So I was looking for a "We should get married because A, B, 1, 2, and those all add up to Z!" That is, a more logical, emotionless way of thinking of it. But it IS an emotional decision so why should the explanation be different?

brooklyngirl and mirre, you gave me some more "logical" reasons to try too, so thanks!
 
So I wrote him a letter (what can I say, I kind of chickened out and I have a much easier time expressing what I want to say in writing than in person) and gave it to him. I am fairly sure he read it but hasn''t said anything about it yet and I haven''t asked. BUT. But I did actually have a decently long conversation with him about getting married and was able to pinpoint the reason he''s waiting as money. We wouldn''t get any money from our parents (or very little) and he doesn''t want to go into debt to pay for a wedding. He has some savings, and I have very little (I blew it all on ICL surgery for my eyes a year ago). So I told him some of my ideas to save up money, explained to him that the majority of the money isn''t paid until shortly before the wedding date so we''d have until then to continue to save, and told him that I thought I could keep it to under $10,000 if we kept our guest list to 150 people. He seemed really impressed by my figures (and luckily didn''t think I was crazy for thinking about it so much before I was even engaged!) and I think it helped him realize that it really is do-able.

So if he doesn''t bring up the letter shortly, I''m going to...but we did have an awesome conversation about the actual wedding itself!
 
Well look at it this way at least some progress is better than none at all...the talk about the wedding may have helped. The financial aspect of it all may be what was holding him back from moving forward.

Keep us posted!
 
Date: 10/18/2007 8:05:22 PM
Author: Pandora II
Go and buy ''Why Men Marry Some Women and Not Others''.

I read it and then gave it to my then bf in front of all his friends.
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I made it very clear that marriage was a non-negotiable. It actually wasn''t - but you never ever tell a man that.

He realised that he didn''t want to risk losing me and that I wanted to get married more than he wanted not too (he doesn''t ''believe'' in marriage - parents messy divorce etc).

The important thing is that you make an internal deadline and realise that if it passes you either settle for what you have, or move on.

Right now, you are risking being in the situation that he finally proposes and you realise it''s actually too late and you aren''t interested anymore.
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Ditto...sometimes they need a wake up call otherwise they will meander along indefinatley...
 
Well, tonight will be the first time I see him/get a chance to talk to him since I left him the letter this morning! Fingers crossed that it goes well!
 
Keeping my fingers crossed for you! Hope all goes well!
 
Well, I asked him if he got my letter, and after teasing me for a minute, he said yes and then gave me a huge hug and kiss and said, "Don''t worry about it." Writing that now it sounds dismissive, but the way he actually said it was sweet and reassuring, if you can picture it that way. So....now I just need to actually tell him my "by" date. I was thinking about, "So...if we want to do this next fall, we''d probably have to be engaged by the end of the year. What do you think?"
 
Largirl, I think that''s a great way to go about it. At least it gets the ball rolling, you know? If you say "if you want to get married by next fall like we discussed, then we''d probably need to be engaged by the end of this year. Is that feasible?" If he says "yes" then great! If he hems and haws, or tells you it''s too soon, then at least you know so can find out when IS feasible. If he can''t even tell you that, well then at least you know so you can figure out what you need to do.
 
Wow....how funny.

I was with a man for six years, too. Bought a house, too. And, I too waited and waited for a proposal. I waited and begged and nagged and whined for three years. I felt the same way as you - I just wanted to know I could get on with the rest of my life, already. I even bought the house with him as a sign of good faith, in a town that was 65 miles from my job and 2 miles from his. He paid off his credit cards. He bought the new car he wanted. I waited through all of that. But still no proposal. Finally I decided I was done waiting, and if he wasn''t ready to marry me after all this time he''d never be, and I broke up with him. We sold the house. I moved closer to work. It''s three and a half years later and I''m engaged to a wonderful man that didn''t make me wait TOO long (three years though), and my ex is also engaged to be married. He did make sure I was one of the first people to know. Heh. But that''s okay.

My theory is this: yes, you must give it time. Three or four years is not too long to wait for a proposal, esp. if you''re in your 20''s. But six or seven years is the "poo or get off the pot" time. Yes, it sounds awful to be that girl who nags and begs for the proposal so she can just get on with her life. Yes, it sounds unfair to the boyfriend. But think about it this way - how unfair is it for the GIRLFRIEND of she''s been waiting six years for something and she is still not sure she''ll ever get it? You didn''t make him wait that long to buy a home...

Sorry, I don''t mean to be a party-pooper, I just wanted to point out that you''re not wrong in thinking you''re waiting too long.
 
Girls, this does bring back memories. Looking back, I dont know where I got my conviction from but I definately gave my guy the ultimatum when I was 23 and him 27. We got married a few years latter after a year long engagement. I think that if your guy doesnt know after a set amount of time, thats fine, but not on your time. There should be no embarresment because you are either on the same page or you are not. Better to find out now than to waste another year or two imo.

My regrets are that I didnt get a romantic surprise proposal, but I was too impatient to wait for that to happen in its own time. I remember going on a holiday with him and telling him that we would either come home engaged or that would be our last holiday. Looking back I was quite the balll breaker but its what I believed.

My only other point is that if the guy is not the right one its not worth forcing it. But its still better to face the consequences now than in another 5 years when you have invested even more time with this guy.
 
I''m new to these boards, and when I saw this post, I HAD to reply. Largirl, I feel your pain - I was in your EXACT shoes (minus the living together) one year ago. Here''s the somewhat short version of my story, and take it for what it''s worth. :)
BF at the time and I had been dating for almost 8 years (since age 23). Never lived together, but last October he asked me to move in with him. I told him (as I had MANY times before) that I wouldn''t live with anyone before engagement, and his reply was "Well there''s no need to rush into anything". !!!!! In my mind, he had a "deadline" of December 1, 2006 to propose, which would have been our 8 year anniversary, and on the day he asked me to move in with him, I told him about the deadline.

December 1 comes and goes without a proposal, and I bring it up again. I told him I was tired of waiting and embarassed that I had seen many of our friends go from single to dating to engaged to married to having a kid in less time that we had just been dating, but that I didn''t want to be "THAT" girl begging for a ring, lol. He still held his ground and said that he wouldn''t be forced into a proposal; I told him I didn''t want a "forced" proposal, but I wanted him to WANT to marry me. At that point I finally realized that I had to take real action and I broke up with him.

A month later (January of this year) I started dating a guy I had been friends with for awhile, just for fun and company at the time. Guess what? A month ago we got engaged (8 MONTHS, not 8 years after our first date!) and we will be married in July. He is the greatest guy I have ever known and the love of my life, and I never would have believed a relationship could be this good if I hadn''t witnessed it myself......

It took six months for my ex to call me and tell me he thought he had made a "mistake". Nothing gave me greater pleasure than to tell him that the only "mistake" in our relationship was that I allowed him to string me along as long as he had.

Listen to your heart and you will know the right thing to do. There is NOTHING wrong with an ultimatum - I don''t think you can force anybody to do anything they don''t want to do, as my former relationship proved, and maybe an ultimatum is what he needs to realize what he stands to lose. You need to be fair to yourself. Good luck!
 
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