I went a little over the ''budget'' for my e-ring..should i chip in and help, please read my story

[courtneyclv]

Hi,
You are right though..we shouldn't get a ring we cannot afford. BF and I do make good $ at our casino, but since we take a vacation a month..we don't have much cash. (we want our cake AND eat it too!)

BF has never saved in his life. He has other cards, and so do I, all with a lot of extra I could use..but at 10% apr..but this one particular one has 0% until 2008. And we are refi-ing one of our houses in several months..so then we can pay off the ring.

And, we ARE NOT going to charge our wedding like most people, we are going to have it in 2008 so we can save for that.

 

[diamondfan]

If you had the money accessible, I might think it is really fine, but I do think that you should not so overextend yourself now. I hate to say this but even if it is not your dream ring, you do not need to start off with debt and stress. And you can always upgrade, I did, twice, and I never thought I would do it but I did and I am thrilled...so just keep that in mind. Good luck.

 

[findarock]

I am really glad that I read this post.
Courtney, I am currently in the process of buying a engagement ring for my future wife. I am going to surprise her. However, She probably feels that it is going to happen just when.
Anyway, my question is that I have an idea of what she wants and I think some of the rings are a little out of the budget, so as a guy I would feel a little offended if my wife to be was offering to contribute?
I am a little old school that way, but what I have been told from the posts that I have made was not to spend outside your budget and go with what you can afford and then as a 5, 10 yr anniversary gift, you could upgrade?

 

[qtiekiki]

To answer your question, I think it''s ok to chip in and help.

I was thinking along the line of Mara and Diamondfan when I first read the post. Considering that your BF has never saved in his life, I think it would wise to get a ring that you can afford at this moment and upgrade later. It''s hard to just start saving; there might be some lifestyle sacrifices that are hard to give up. Personally I would put the money from the re-finance toward the wedding instead.

 

[angeline]

Date: 11/12/2006 9:13:25 PM
Author: Mara
i see nothing wrong with chipping in to help as long as your BF is cool with it.


however, my initial thought when reading the thread is that if you guys are using credit AND a layaway to get this ring in the first place and the rest of the ring won''t fit on the card (which indicates a low credit line OR an almost full card) ... then i can''t help but think...can you two REALLY afford this ring???


i know you said it''s your dream ring but just make sure you are not overextending yourself to get something luxury like an engagement ring. sure we all fall in love with lots of things but if you can''t afford it, then don''t try to force it. it''s really not worth it. anyway i don''t know your financial situ but reading your post that is the first thing i thought. maybe you guys should keep looking OR have this jeweler call in more stones for you or ask them when they are getting other options in, so that you can go lower than an F and get a more affordable stone with the same kind of setting you want. i started with a G then went H then J and for me they all were great options. i would not buy a colorless stone unless i had a ton of money burning a hole in my pocket and maybe not even then. there are a ton of diamonds out there, so you may be able to find something a bit more affordably priced with the same setting and fits within the budget if you wait a bit or find out if they can call in other stones for you to see.


anyway just some food for thought.

mara, I thought this was a great post. Good food for thought. I hadn''t thought it all though myself and got carried away thinking, it''s the one, it''s the one!!!

courtney - there are always more diamonds! and more rings. This isn''t the last one in the world. I know you want to get it in time for visiting your family, but maybe you still have some time to look around a bit? I really understand though if you just love it and want to get it all over with. Sigh!!! It''s hard making decisions! I am no help. Can you tell I''m a libra, and can''t help looking at all sides of the situation?

 

[courtneyclv]

Hi everyone,

Thank you for your opinions and your advice. I am just confused I guess..like always. I only went about $2500 over the budget, that isn't that much. I don't have to get engaged now..I can be later...It is just that the time is right now I guess. We are going to save for our small wedding and make that in 2008.

I guess some people save and save years for an engagement ring..but honestly, I always thought you would charge a thing like this. I don't know about most people, but I am assuming that nobody has an extra $10,000 laying around for rings! I always thought this was something you charge if you have it available on a low APR credit card and you can make more than the minimum payment.

I could get a ring IN the budget, and found one..but for the extra couple thousand, the other ring is larger, better color etc. I know some 'girls' that need a $30,000 ring! Now that is excessive I believe! I don't think charging $6,000 is that bad. I just paid off my braces that were 5k..so I am comparing that to a ring I will wear my entire life. I see people here all the time charge boobies too, for around 6k and they never pay cash! LOLLOL hehe..


hmmm

 

[winternight]

Well its really up to you - personally I''d have to agree that there is no reason to overextend now, but I definitely get the pressure that you must feel living in Vegas - I''m from South Florida and people there are a little crazy about these things as well. Its also really hard when you fall in love with something.

I''m over my fiance''s budget also by at least a few thousand, but in my case he has the cash its just that he recently started making money and comes from a modest background - its terrible but I''m really wondering what is the average amount spent on an e-ring by someone in his salary.

 

[diamondfan]

Remember those DeBeers ads?!

I think like you C, sometimes...oh, for a bit more I can have Y instead of X. I think it is fine, and if the budget can be more fluid and not so set in stone, and there are other things you guys can give up to put the money towards the ring, then great. And your overall budget is not out of this world so maybe just bumping it up that extra bit will be perfect, I just thought it sounded like that overage might be tough and I thought it might not be worth it...but only you know the actual ins and outs of your situation!

 

[cheethoe]

Hi Courtney,
I''ve been working on an e-ring for my girlfriend for the last 4.5 months, in fact my jeweler should have finished it by now but I''m on vacation in Japan so It''ll be waiting for me when I get back. Anyhow, I think it''s perfectly fine to offer to chip in if your over budget. Your fiance should be close enough with you that he shouldn''t get offended.
I can tell you are set on this ring even though it seems lots of people here are hinting to you to make some changes (ie. get GIA cert, get stones elsewhere, etc). I would see if you can get the jeweler to cut the price of the ring by $2500. Let them know you''re over budget and remind them you''re a repeat customer (I''m assuming since you have store credit). Also if you can find cheaper GIA cert diamonds of the same size/color/clarity online, print it out and bring it in, show them they aren''t your only option and that you are looking elsewhere and that you''ve found stones with a more trusted certification for the same or less. And dont forget to take into consideration sales tax, tell them that buying online will save you hundreds of dollars in sales tax. Maybe you can bring the ring back into budget
I went into a jewelry store and was able to have them slash the price of a $14K ring down to $11K (I ended up not buying it, still over budget and I wanted better clarity), anything you can slash should help your situation. As for average amount spent on an e-ring, I don''t know your fiance''s salary but most of my friend spent about average of $4.5K on their e-rings. I spent about $10K, and yeah I had an extra $10K laying around for it. I did charge it on my CC, but I paid it off immediately (and got cash rewards from the CC company).
Oh and one more thing, I think you were mentioning that the problem was that the whole cost (minus the store credit) wouldn''t fit on the 0% interests for 15mo credit card. If you have good credit you can call and get your credit limit raised, I actually did that before buying my ring.
Good luck!

Date: 11/13/2006 2:39:40 AM
I''m over my fiance''s budget also by at least a few thousand, but in my case he has the cash its just that he recently started making money and comes from a modest background - its terrible but I''m really wondering what is the average amount spent on an e-ring by someone in his salary.

 

[cheethoe]

Oh yeah, and I just wanted to say, I hate how jewelers will try to "help" you fit the ring you want into your budget by switching to smaller/lower quality stones which makes it not the ring you want. Especially when it''s a place who''s demographic marks up by 15-20%. Jewelers have plenty of room to work with... so work it!

 

[gail013]

If you really want something now, buy the setting with your store credit as someone else here suggested, and maybe put in a temporary cz or something, and save the $ to buy the real thing down the road. I have heard of other people doing that, just because they couldn''t find the stone they wanted, and it wasn''t always a financial reason. It will give you time to look around and know you made the right decision.

The last poster is right, you should be able to negotiate a better price-have they taken off anything? By the way, what does your BF think?

 

[ephemery1]

Date: 11/13/2006 2:18:14 AM
Author: courtneyclv

I guess some people save and save years for an engagement ring..but honestly, I always thought you would charge a thing like this. I don''t know about most people, but I am assuming that nobody has an extra $10,000 laying around for rings! I always thought this was something you charge if you have it available on a low APR credit card and you can make more than the minimum payment.

Hi Courtney... congrats on finding "the" ring... sounds beautiful!

I don''t know many people with an extra $10,000 laying around (though it would be nice!

), but most of our newly-engaged friends took a couple years to save $5,000-$10,000 before purchasing a ring of that price. In our case, FI spent over a year saving up $5000 plus had $2300 from a family ring. Then I contributed an additional $1000 (approx. the cost of the setting) to get exactly what I wanted! I also covered some bills for him in those final months to make things easier...

I personally don''t know of anybody who bought a ring on credit, but I can see why it would make sense for some people... especially if you were paying it back immediately just to earn the points on your credit card.

 

[Mara]

most of the time on here people do not advocate buying something like a luxury e-ring on credit. really it IS a luxury good. and credit is used too often in America anyway. i wouldn''t charge boobies on my card either.

we actually put the cost of the diamond on a cc (amex) because we wanted the reward points, and then greg paid it off when the bill came. we tried to buy what we could afford. and when i upgraded my ring this year, i paid cash and it was a fairly large amount. i am a fan of upgrading though which also means i''m not married to the idea of having to overspend one time and that''s it.

on one hand i totally get the ''its my dream ring and i really want it'' and over 20-40 years it amortizes quite nicely as justification. but just be sure you are not overextending yourself just because ''everyone else is doing it'' kind of thing. take into account your own situation. i kind of agree that if your bf is not used to saving, putting this on various cards or layaway could be a bit of a recipe for disaster. what if it takes longer to payoff than you planned or he doesn''t take it seriously because it''s 0% til 2008. but once you''ve committed to the ring you''re stuck.

so anyway, i don''t think anyone is trying to tell you WHAT to do, just think about it and make sure you are doing what''s right for you and him and who cares about anyone else and what THEY do. do what''s best for you two and your new life together.

 

[crowmama]

I''ve just finished reading all of the posts, and just wanted to add about diamonds being a luxury item. Dream diamonds are, in many ways, dreams -- none are perfect. It''s possible to get engaged with a diamond that is perfect for your situation now, and that might be a diamond that you guys can afford to pay with cash now.

I agree with Mara in that I don''t want to tell you how to live your life. As you''re planning your life together, though, remember that diamonds don''t appease hunger, they don''t keep you warm or dry at night, and although they can go up in value, nothing is certain. Looking forward to upgrading your diamond later for a milestone event is fun, too, and along the way you have had the opportunity to take care of getting a rainy day fund saved, making a down payment on a house, and all that good stuff as well.

We like diamonds here, but if someone gave me a choice of any diamond in the world, or my aluminum sided 1968 split level fixer-upper house, I''ll take the house any day. With my husband in it, of course!

Just some thoughts as my hubbie and I celebrate our 6th anniversary...

 

[nejarb]

Date: 11/13/2006 1:14:52 PM
Author: Mara


i kind of agree that if your bf is not used to saving, putting this on various cards or layaway could be a bit of a recipe for disaster. what if it takes longer to payoff than you planned or he doesn''t take it seriously because it''s 0% til 2008. but once you''ve committed to the ring you''re stuck.


so anyway, i don''t think anyone is trying to tell you WHAT to do, just think about it and make sure you are doing what''s right for you and him and who cares about anyone else and what THEY do. do what''s best for you two and your new life together.

I totally agree with this. I think buying a ring that you can''t afford to pay for with cash right now is a bad way to start your new life together. You''re going to be stressing over it for the next few years, and you''ll have to make other sacrafices. And for what? If we''re all being really honest with ourselves, alot about the size or bling-bling-iness of our rings really just ends up being a status symbol. And I think that''s fine, to some extent, but there is absolutely no benefit in over-extending yourself and creating unnecessary stress for something that is largely about impressing other people.

and yes, alot of people do have 10k (or in some cases much more) just sitting around. for a ring, for an emergency that comes up, or for interest income.

 

[courtneyclv]

Oh man..more thoughts going through my head! I don't think that is extending ourselves in reality. We both make very good money in tips and hourly. (we work at the same casino..im a waitress and he's my bartender..haha) So a monthly bill will not be a problem. It is just that we don't have the cash laying around. We travel monthly and spend our cash on that.

Do you think that since we don't have the cash it is still a bad idea? See, bf is going to refi the house in several months. He may take out 20k, he may take out 5k. At least 5k to pay off the ring. Someone suggested that we use the refi for our wedding. Well our wedding wont be until fall 2008 and we ARE saving for that when we get engaged. I put away $20 a day, $400 a month for each of us...
(I HATE when people charge that and they pay for it their entire lives!) and we are only having about 50 people..so it won't be too much.

Yes, I have seen people overextend themselves..like my parents. My parents know nothing about saving and finances and charged things their whole lives. Years ago they were in debt over about 60k from trips etc. Luckily they refied and payed it off. I don't want to be like that.

I also hate to use credit cards..but I have to put things on them such as airfare.

Oh, my credit at the store is an upgrade..so I have to spend about $7500 to get the $3700 credit.

OH! And we also have a yearly jewelry convention that you can go too. Somehow you have to know somebody to get in. (you should all look into this!) You can buy diamonds, rings etc. for about 30-50% off. The problem is that you HAVE to pay cash, you may not get GIA certificates, and sizing is weird.

Courtney

 

[winternight]

Ok I guess I''ll chime in. Personally I don''t think you should be buying a ring for anything other than cash and that it should represent a small percentage of your total savings - i.e. nothing over 25%. I think its a problem if you don''t have the cash for the ring and an emergency fund. Honestly I''m surprised at the amounts people spend on rings and was wondering what the average salary, e-ring budget correlation looked like. I think about 1 month salary or less is appropriate, but then I also want a house asap. I would also be really uncomfortable having my e-ring on layaway, believe me its much better to buy expensive things with some cash in the bank/401k/investments - it feels alot better!

 

[Arcam]

"Luckily they refied and payed it off."

I''m not going to comment on if/how much you should be spending, but wanted to point out that paying off CC loans by refinancing a house isn''t paying off debt. Its just shifting money from one loan to another (except they can take your house if you don''t pay your mortgage) While refinancing can be a good idea because of a combination of tax benefits and lowering your tax liability, its still debt. You might also want to consider how much you will want to refinance in a cooling (or declining) real estate market. (its my understanding that las vegas, like CA/DC/FL is experiencing a measurable decline)

 

[goldenstar]

Courtney, i''m in a similar situation. my bf is currently saving money for a ring. we''re hoping to get engaged in march or april 2007, but we''re playing it by ear. if our budget were half of what it currently is, we could get engaged tomorrow. my bf wants to get me the ring i want, within reason or course. and i would never expect him to buy me something that he can''t afford. i''ll admit our budget might be a little high, and we could very well use the money for other things, but we both have agreed that its doable. he has cushion money in the bank, and would not touch that for the ring. since the diamond is a luxury, we want to make sure our ducks are in a row first. he wants to have at least 75% of the money saved in cash and then might charge the rest so that we can get engaged sooner. i might pay for the setting myself because i feel bad about him spending more than what our stone budget is. we both are sacrificing in small ways to save money. i try to cook as much as i can instead of going out, and we cut back on travel and such. its okay to buy what you want if you understand that its give and take.

based on what you''ve said so far (salary, real estate), i think you as a couple can afford the 2,500 over budget. if he doesnt mind, there''s nothing wrong with paying for some of it. but since its a big purchase, maybe you could take fewer vacations to save some money. by forgoing a few vacations you can easily make up the difference.

this might be a little off topic but it seems that a lot of people feel like when they refinance their homes its like getting free money. it might feel that way but you''re still paying back that money because now your home loan is a higher amount. no matter what you use that money for, you''re still paying it back over time. of course i think its great to refinance and take advantage of the equity you have. its just that when you use it and use it, there''s not as much left for things like emergencies, remodeling, investments, etc.

 

[courtneyclv]

You are so right though! People refi and get a rate of anywhere between 5-8% and pay off a credit card BUT that rate may only be at 10%. It would be better to not use that money for refi in that situation.

Yeah, it is hard for BF and I do save. We like our cake and want to eat it to! I guess we really don''t need so many darn vacations...he is already planning our winter snowboard trips..I want to say..."whoah buddy! You need to pay off my ring before more trips are planned!"

I have my own house here too and have a lot in equity. I am not going to refi though because that would be very greedy of me..and would just raise the payment. I want to wait as long as I can until I can sell it for what it is now worth..now thats ''free'' money.

 

[asschersmitten]

Courtney, I have been reading you post but unable to read until today. Here is my story.... Was with a boy for 2 yrs, got engaged and paid 2800 for the ring... broke up 2 yrs after that... after a break and some growing up got back together. I was 19 at my first engagement to him and we are 23 and 26 now. We are getting engaged again but wanted a new ring to symbolize our new relationship. We could have done the same thing in, go back to the original jeweler and get something at least double for full credit of the original. We weren''t thrilled with that idea given the jeweler (Shenoa... you can read plenty nightmare stories on PS) So instead I listed my ring for $3000 on craigslist.com with many pictures. We got over 45 responses to the ad and were able to get the full 3000 for the ring so we were up 200 and got to go where we pleased. We went to a local jewelers so i am sure we didnt get the bottom dollar best deal as opposed to dealing with a PS vendor, but i got to pick out just what i wanted... see the diamonds in person etc. We too had a 0% credit card which is 0% until April of 2008. We were hoping to put 3000-4000 on the card and use the 3000 from the original diamond for the rest. Figuring, as I am sure you are as well, at 0 % why wait. it was either save 225 a month until april of 08 then get engaged or buy it now and pay the 0% at 225 until then. Same difference right? Well all was to plan until the jeweler brought in a 1.4 carat Asscher or square emerald cut that I was in loooooooooooove with. HUGE spread and not a "by the numbers" ideal diamond but beautiful, as most ppl will tell you it is very hard to buy an asscher cut "by the numbers" as they are each so different etc etc. He brought in a few more including a few ideal cut diamonds which were smaller (1.1-1.2) but as soon as you set the 1.4 down it was a big "duh". so the diamond was 6900 plus tax... pretty much right at budget. but then there was the matter of the setting..... I LOVE antique-esq settings... my first setting was a beautiful antique setting but I could not use it again b/c it could not accomodate a larger or square stone. I saw a few settings that were nice... had my heart set on a pave halo.... then came out the Baguette Halo design.... and .. well... wow... could not have looked more amazing with the asscher diamond... as both have long clean lines. The setting.... 2700 (OUCH) but the boy.... well he saw my eyes when it was together... it was a true wow experience. the diamond looked HUGE the setting was dynamic. Soooo... without much hesitation he said yes lets get the whole thing. We are currently living with my parents to pay off debt and save for a house. I am waiting top government security clearance to start a new job and he is awaiting a promotion both of which will happen in the spring so we are stuck until at least the summer or 07. We figure we will have plenty of time to pay off the card and save for a hosue since our expenses otherwise are only 1 car and cell phones and we make a decent buck now before new job and promotions. ANYWAY.... PLENTY of people gave crap about using credit since we just paid off every cent of credit debt we each had and only have student loan stuff left which barely counts. We put 6700 on the card and already paid off 2000. We may not save enough to decorate our new home when we eventualy move with everything we could possibly want.,..... but the boy said he would put off his dream entertainment center for my ring.... what a guy I know.... So here is what I am saying...... PEOPLE USE CREDIT and at 0% don''t feel bad.... i totally get why and how you are using it. I had the "for right now ring" before and I CAN"T WAIT to get the "for always" ring. It will be worth it. As long as you LOVE your stone and your ring... P.S. we also look at it as a 6700 expense since the 3000 was long gone yrs ago. Or,.... if you can be patient throw the old thing on craigslist and wait.... thought i TOTALLY get the impatience... my ring was ordered 34 days ago and its been torture!

 

[Beacon]

Can you explain your problem to your jeweler and see if he will come down on the price for you? It can be done, so I would try.

If your fiance is ok with you paying for part then there is no prob. My husband would not have gone for that though, he is the old fashioned type. So better carefully present the concept before you figure that ring is on your hand!

In the end it makes no difference who pays since you are refing your house to pay it off, you''ll then have that debt "together". So that should reassure your fiance if he is still edgy about it.

I would also add - do not shift down the type of color or clarity you want in your stone cause I think it will bug you every day until you finally upgrade it.

 

[courtneyclv]

ASSHERSMITTEN THIS IS FOR U...
(sorry if some of you read this already in my other post)

What a guy you know..awwww....
That was a great story and I am SO happy you are together again! Yes, there may be more cooking and less restaurants, a few less nights out a week. But I also know my BF and I know that wouldn''t bother him. He gave me this wonderful heartfelt talk last month about how he wishes he could give me the world and wants me to be his wife (not officially proposed to yet) , and yada yada yada. ~wipe a tear~

I know this ring is what he is giving to represent that and it will mean so much to me that we will be engaged. So yes, credit is a bad thing, but if you can afford it, pay your bills, pay your mortgage, and have extra to LIVE LIFE (my quote) haha...why not go ahead and do it. The happiness I will feel when I look at my finger and know that my ring is a sign of the love and life we share..is worth an extra monthly payment to me.
Thank you for your encouraging story...


Yes, I think it would bother me if I went down in color. The H and I GIA stones looked almost yellowish in color compared to this stone. And the SI2 and SI3''s that I saw also had specs or clouds you could almost see with the naked eye. I did have my eye on a ring for $6500 that was 1.0 ct princess center but next to the 1.21...WOW..had to pass it up. The setting, kind of tapered baguettes and then engraved ''antique'' pave side..make the center stone POP out.

I thought my ''dream'' ring was going to be a radiant center with trillion sides/tacori..but that really drew you away from the center stone. Now I think that the center stone is the one to show off..not the sides..they should really complement each other.

Hey, at least I didn''t go $7,000 over budget like the new post that was posted today! JK...

 

[ladykemma]

Date: 11/13/2006 2:18:14 AM
Author: courtneyclv
Hi everyone,

Thank you for your opinions and your advice. I am just confused I guess..like always. I only went about $2500 over the budget, that isn't that much. I don't have to get engaged now..I can be later...It is just that the time is right now I guess. We are going to save for our small wedding and make that in 2008.

I guess some people save and save years for an engagement ring..but honestly, I always thought you would charge a thing like this. I don't know about most people, but I am assuming that nobody has an extra $10,000 laying around for rings! I always thought this was something you charge if you have it available on a low APR credit card and you can make more than the minimum payment.

I could get a ring IN the budget, and found one..but for the extra couple thousand, the other ring is larger, better color etc. I know some 'girls' that need a $30,000 ring! Now that is excessive I believe! I don't think charging $6,000 is that bad. I just paid off my braces that were 5k..so I am comparing that to a ring I will wear my entire life. I see people here all the time charge boobies too, for around 6k and they never pay cash! LOLLOL hehe..


hmmm

nope, cash only!

i would encourage you both NOT to refinance the house or finance the ring. pay cash as you go, divorce proof your marriage!

 

[courtneyclv]

We have to refi, its an adjustable rate mortgage that will be VERY expensive. An extra $5,000 is nothing to take out if there is 60,000 in equity.

 

[diamondhunter10]

I am not sure if you stated this and I did not read it, but is he aware of this idea?
If he doesnt The decision is more emotional, meaning that he may be offended and subconsciously make him feel like less of a man. I know that is not the case with my husband, he would of loved the fact that I would offer to help in this situation, conversely, my brother-in-law would be devastated by that request.

I am sure if you took the specs of the ring that you are looking for that you could get a better deal somewhere. You may also want to look at different cuts and settings that can sometimes add a lot to the WOW factor.
I suggest you do what is in your heart, however since this is a luxury item, you dont want to charge or refinance for this ring.
Believe me, nothing causes a bigger rift on a relationship than having arguements about finances.

 

[courtneyclv]

Hi,
Oh its all good..the house is my BFs (i have my own too) and we have to refi within the next 6 months because it is adjusting. It is inevitable and we HAVE to do it..no matter what. No way around that.

We aren't doing it for the ring! That would be silly!!LOL We may take out some money to do improvements on the house. But not money just to be greedy with..that is silly since a credit card can get paid off if we put down larger monthly payments, with the no interest until 2008.

I have to use that jeweler because we have a $3700 credit if we spend double that... I could shop around..but do not know if I would save over $4000