Is this a nice diamond? 60% table

[Ellen]

Congrats love, I look forward to your pics!!

 

[loverock]

Here is one

 

[loverock]

Another one

 

[loverock]

Handshot

 

[Ellen]

Date: 8/2/2009 9:11:52 AM
Author: loverock
Handshot

Beautiful!

And big.

 

[ecf8503]

It looks nice!

My original e-ring stone is a 60/60, non-H&A stone - it''s plenty bright too!

 

[loverock]

Side shot

 

[loverock]

Another sideshot

 

[loverock]

one more

 

[Rockdiamond]

Date: 7/31/2009 4:12:27 PM
Author: loverock
David,


I read a thread you created back in May'09: Is 60/60 a bad proportion for a round diamond- can we trust a GIA EX cut grade? - I didn't finish the whole thread yet


do we have a short answer for this? Yes? No?


Thanks.


loverock

HI all- Hope you had a great weekend...looks for 1000000% sure loverock had an AMAZING weekend!
Congratulations- your photos- and the diamond- look spectacular! YOu must be thrilled.

AS you have experienced, the differences, while subtle, between an "Ideal" cut, and a 60/60 will be noticeable to a connoisseur....or someone interested in learning the difference by comparing.
Although there are other cutting styles which are currently more in vogue, the proportions of 60/60 have long been treasured by many knowledgeable diamond cutters,and dealers.
Diamonds like yours will always be as desirable as any "Ideal" cut to many observers.

The fact that stones like this do not do well on some of the tests says more about the goal of the test.
While I did not love every GIA EX cut grade stone I've seen, I've never seen one I'd call "badly cut" -same for AGS0 cut grade stones.
The differences between the extremes in these grades ( stones cut at the "outside edge" of acceptable stats) will mean the trained eye will choose one or the other....and may make for some debate

If I had my way, more stones would be cut like yours!
They are getting more rare nowadays.

Anyway YES, we can "trust" GIA EX cut grade to be a diamond not having cut "issues" Which is not the same to saying everyone will prefer it.
The answer to the part about- Is 60/60 a bad proportion? The most emphatic "NO" you can imagine! Your new boulder being a prime example.


Again- enjoy your new diamond. Looks greeat!!

 

[loverock]

Thank you David!

I have read a lot of discussions on PS regarding the 60/60 and the new "ideal" cuts. I have to say I very much value and appreciate your opinions.

Although this stone didn''t do well on the HCA testing, I fell in love with when the second time I went back to see it. So did everybody go with me.

Thanks for your help and yes, I had a great weekend.

Loverock

 

[Laila619]

Loverock, it is GORGEOUS!

 

[strmrdr]

congrates!!!!

It sounds like the jeweler really treated you right.
Would you care to share who it was?

 

[elle_chris]

Beautiful, congrats

 

[loverock]

Date: 8/3/2009 9:37:02 AM
Author: strmrdr
congrates!!!!


It sounds like the jeweler really treated you right.

Would you care to share who it was?

It is the Barmakian Jewelers.

 

[MaryCarolyn]

Date: 8/1/2009 8:40:16 AM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 8/1/2009 8:14:45 AM

Author: loverock

So does anybody know why it only scroe 3.3 on the HCA? table too big? crown too high? I thought H&A pattern would always make a great stone.

The crown and pavilion angles mainly account for the score, they aren''t the best fit for each other. If the pavilion angle was shallower, say around 40.6 that would be a better fit for that crown angle, or conversely a shallower crown would be a better fit for that pavilion angle, around 34.5 as an example. And because a diamond shows a h&a pattern means the optical symmetry is good, not necessarily that the diamond will be a great performer.

Still learning about cuts... A little confused, because some vendors (James Allen, etc) brand their top cut as Hearts and Arrows, yet it sounds like H&A only guarantees optical symmetry, not an ideal cut. Can anyone explain? THANKS!!!

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 8/3/2009 10:48:36 AM
Author: MaryCarolyn

Date: 8/1/2009 8:40:16 AM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 8/1/2009 8:14:45 AM

Author: loverock

So does anybody know why it only scroe 3.3 on the HCA? table too big? crown too high? I thought H&A pattern would always make a great stone.

The crown and pavilion angles mainly account for the score, they aren't the best fit for each other. If the pavilion angle was shallower, say around 40.6 that would be a better fit for that crown angle, or conversely a shallower crown would be a better fit for that pavilion angle, around 34.5 as an example. And because a diamond shows a h&a pattern means the optical symmetry is good, not necessarily that the diamond will be a great performer.

Still learning about cuts... A little confused, because some vendors (James Allen, etc) brand their top cut as Hearts and Arrows, yet it sounds like H&A only guarantees optical symmetry, not an ideal cut. Can anyone explain? THANKS!!!

Hi Mary

Some diamonds have both what we refer to as Ideal Cuts as well as h&a, also the brands such as A Cut Above from Whiteflash, Infinity h&a from High Performance Diamonds and so on will be cut to the highest standards in all respects showing both superb optical symmetry and the highest light performance.

Basically the proportions of a diamond, in particular the crown and pavilion angles are the main engines which drive the light return - this is the beauty we see such as sparkle, fire, brilliance and so on. So the overall proportions of a diamond are crucial to make a diamond, well....behave like a diamond! H&A is the result of optical symmetry as explained above, you can find diamonds which don't have great proportions show hearts and arrows if they have decent optical symmetry, but they as a result of the lesser proportions won't be the best performer.

So to summarize...

Some of the branded h&a diamonds also have top cuts and proportions and also have superb optical symmetry resulting in a perfect h&a pattern.

Some diamonds have excellent proportions and will have great light return but may or may not show h&a.

Some diamonds in rare cases will have lesser proportions and show h&a but will not be great performers.

This article explains the intricacies of h&a and how the patterning is judged, you will see that the standards are quite strict, just because a diamond shows h&a does not mean it meets the standards as decreed by experts concerning this precison cut.

http://journal.pricescope.com/Articles/65/1/Hearts-and-Arrows-Diamonds-and-The-Basics-of-Diamond-Cutting.asp

If you haven't already come across it, this is the advanced tutorial which gives a basic grounding in all aspects of diamonds including cut, work through it and if you have any more questions you can of course ask!

http://diamonds.pricescope.com/

This page explains optical symmetry which is not the same as lab graded symmetry which evaluates the physical symmetry of the diamond, read more here on lab graded symmetry - optical symmetry is evaluating the display of the optical alignment of the facets when observing the internal reflections of the stone.


http://www.goodoldgold.com/OpticalSymmetry/

 

[loverock]

Date: 8/3/2009 10:48:36 AM
Author: MaryCarolyn

Date: 8/1/2009 8:40:16 AM

Author: Lorelei

Date: 8/1/2009 8:14:45 AM


Author: loverock


So does anybody know why it only scroe 3.3 on the HCA? table too big? crown too high? I thought H&A pattern would always make a great stone.

The crown and pavilion angles mainly account for the score, they aren''t the best fit for each other. If the pavilion angle was shallower, say around 40.6 that would be a better fit for that crown angle, or conversely a shallower crown would be a better fit for that pavilion angle, around 34.5 as an example. And because a diamond shows a h&a pattern means the optical symmetry is good, not necessarily that the diamond will be a great performer.

Still learning about cuts... A little confused, because some vendors (James Allen, etc) brand their top cut as Hearts and Arrows, yet it sounds like H&A only guarantees optical symmetry, not an ideal cut. Can anyone explain? THANKS!!!

That was my confusion too.

 

[loverock]

Mary

This page had given me a second thought on the diamond gradings.It is interesting. Thanks.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/NewCutGrading/GIAExAGSIdeal/


Loverock

 

[hearts-arrows_girl]

Loverock, Your new stone looks fabulous! 60% paid off for you! Congrats on hittin the 2ct mark! (Mine's a 59% also large by PS standards)

I went from a 1.02 61% table, to a 1.23 54% table, and now have ended with a 2.03 59% table. Each one had its ups and downs. When I first got the 54% table, I would look down and go "Gee, I miss the brightness of the 61% table, then when I got the 59% table, I went, Gee, I miss the extreme contrast I would see under the lights at my supermarket with my 54% table. I then remembered how extreme in total my 54% stone was. When it looked good, it was awesome, the best I'd ever seen, but it also looked bad or too dark in some sitiuations, so I was bummed. I actually use to change locations (I'd say, let's go over here), when I would show someone my stone with the 54% table, so that I could show off the highs and sort of hide the extreme lows. My 59% table seems to look great in all settings. (I'll have to admit, I do miss the highs, but am glad to not have the lows) Each size, to me, has it's trade offs, so what I did was find my current stone's most beautiful situations and let it shine! For me, I had to compromise, since I am color sensitive, I accepted a larger table so that I could afford my H color in the 2ct size I have always wanted. (all my other numbers are within range to get maximum performance for this table size, so that might account for my good luck with this stones fire and brilliance) But I can say, all 3 of those stones were extra sparkly with plenty of fire, but each one definitely had a life of its own. None of my stones were AGS Ideal cuts, but they were Ideal for me. I hope my story helps.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Date: 8/2/2009 8:31:27 PM
Author: loverock
Thank you David!

I have read a lot of discussions on PS regarding the 60/60 and the new ''ideal'' cuts. I have to say I very much value and appreciate your opinions.

Although this stone didn''t do well on the HCA testing, I fell in love with when the second time I went back to see it. So did everybody go with me.

Thanks for your help and yes, I had a great weekend.

Loverock

You''re so very welcome- and thank you!!

Junebug- thank you so much for sharing your experiences- I love hearing the practical side of this!

 

[loverock]

Thank you Junebug!

Yes, You are absolutely right, they both have their high and lows. I actually still kept my previously ring with the 54% table - thinking of setting it into a necklace. Every once a while I would compare the 2 diamonds and looking for the differences (never got tired

). I was very used to the look of the 54% table before and now I am very used to and love the look of the 60% table!

Loverock

 

[loverock]

In case anybody''s interested, I have posted some additional pics of this diamond here: Link