Need help with stray cat

[LAJennifer]

What a precious little baby!!!! I think you should keep him - especially if he's already bonded to your DH.

I would probably take him to the animal group's testing on Saturday and then for a check up at your vet. $18 is money well saved - especially if you end up with a positive for either FeLV or FIV. Not all positives are actually positives (especially if the cat is young). Your vet then can do a more accurate test to determine if it is a true positive.

If you end up FIV positive - don't panic. I took in a feral last summer who is FIV+. We have had absolutely no issues. He is very healthy and hearty and virtually no risk to my 2 resident cats. It can only be transmitted through a DEEP bit wound (saliva to the blood stream). If your cats are friendly - this will never happen. Even play fighting is of no risk (my 2 rambunctious boys go at it - it used to make me soooo nervous, but I've learned to relax).

I would not under any circumstances, however, put a Leukemia positive cat with negative cats.

Chances are your little guy is fine - but if he ends up FIV+, I can talk you off the ledge - but we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

 

[CJ2008]

First, an update:

I took Rattie to the low-cost clinic today and HE IS A HEALTHY BOY! He tested negative! I was so relieved. Plus, he also got his rabies, , chlamydia and FVRCP shots, and deworming. I definitely saved $ by doing all that there - and I have an appointment for a general check-up at the vet on Monday. I scheduled him to be neutered in a couple of weeks (they said it's best to wait at least 2 weeks after the vaccinations).

LGK - the longer Rattie is around the more I feel it's the perfect name for him. My resident cat is a boy - and very, very laid back - he's a total love bug and lap cat - so it would be a male-male situation. Rat is so, so cute!

LAJen - thank you so much for your offer to help me had Rattie tested positive for FIV - having your words in my mind really comforted me when I was waiting.

I am really, really torn as to whether to introduce the two boys - DH said he's a level 9 against keeping him, so I think what's the point? Or is there a point, even if Rattie gets adopted out?

I do think there's a part of DH that wants to keep him, too - he totally likes him as much as I do - but I think he's being more logical which I could understand - there's a part of me that also feels that if I could find Rattie 100% great home it would be really painful to let him go but I probably would and our lives would go back to how they were.

On the other hand, I already feel that I would miss him terribly. I go out to the garage several times a day because I MISS HIM. And it just melts my heart how he's obviously feeling safe with us. He's more playful, and even though today he was hating being in the cage after a while as soon as he got home he was fine.

My cat sitter said a client of hers might be interested - she said she has 3 other cats and that she loves them to death. I trust my cat sitter completely. But part of me is like, 3 other cats? What if they don't like Rattie?

And I want to ask other people who I know are animal lovers but I am afraid to because I keep thinking they'll lie to me "oh, no, we won't let him out, he'll be strictly indoor" or "oh, no we would never declaw him" and what if they're lying just to adopt him? I know I have to start asking around if I want a possibility of finding him a good home but in some ways I'm putting it off.

Also, if someone wants to adopt him, and it works out, is it tacky for me to ask for an adoption fee? I don't mind the $ I'm spending on Rattie - he is so worth it - but if we're not going to keep him, it would help if I got some of that $ back.

I know I'm all over the place with what I'm saying and my questions but I am torn, and confused, it's almost like I just want to keep letting time go by...

 

[Gypsy]

Aww honey. You're already toast. I would answer your questions but your already head over heels. I felt that way about one of my rescues, Sebastian, and I've never gotten over him. Even 5 years after I placed him in a great home I MISS him.

Just reading your post, I think that yes, you should introduce them and ask DH if you guys can keep him.

 

[Imdanny]

LOL. I agree. That was my vote in the beginning.

 

[yssie]

If you introduce them and they Get Along Fabulously, I really think you'll wind up keeping him - few pet owners can resist two cute animals playing or snuggling together, even though it may be practically unwise to keep him. And if they Loathe Each Other then your decision is made easy.

So I say introduce them


If you decide to do a private adoption I would definitely require an adoption fee - you can say that it's to cover his tests and the neuter. If you find a promising candidate you can always waive the fee later, but I honestly would be too worried about idiots making impulsive decisions and later regretting them not to do something to give them pause

 

[LGK]

If you introduce them and they Get Along Fabulously, I really think you'll wind up keeping him - few pet owners can resist two cute animals playing or snuggling together, even though it may be practically unwise to keep him. And if they Loathe Each Other then your decision is made easy.

So I say introduce them


If you decide to do a private adoption I would definitely require an adoption fee - you can say that it's to cover his tests and the neuter. If you find a promising candidate you can always waive the fee later, but I honestly would be too worried about idiots making impulsive decisions and later regretting them not to do something to give them pause

For sure. DH was totally against keeping O.P. when we found him, then when he saw him and Rat piling up to sleep and licking each other, it was alllll over. Plus, you can also do what I did (which is totally manipulative and evil ) and just sort of... let it go. Until it's obvious you have two cats, even without official husband stamp of approval. Because if your household is anything like mine, I am the one that does all the cat related stuff... like finding an adoptive parent for a kitty. And if you fail to find one? Ooopsie! If I felt like DH reaaaallly objected I probably wouldn't have done it quite that way, but I knew he loved O.P. too but just didn't want to disturb the status quo.

I'm so glad Rattie is healthy. He's just beautiful, I keep looking at the pics you posted. I think you need some more on this thread

My method of introduction was to let the boys sniff each other through the closed door for a few days but not see each other face to face. After that, the process I was planning to follow is a very gradual meet & greet situation- where you swap the newbie out into the main cat's territory and vice versa, at first, so they can sniff each other out but not see each other. Then brief meetings at the door, for a few minutes, and if anyone even slightly seems to be getting hissy, separate them. Then gradually let them spend a bit more time together.

With O.P., as soon as they saw each other face to face it was True Gay Cat Love at first sight, and I skipped the slow intro. But if they're not totally instantly taken with each other (but not violenty objecting) the slow intro process can keep them from associating each other with negative things like fighting, and make a stable relationship even if they're not just totally in love instantly.

 

[Blackpaw]

oh yes you should definitely try a gradual introduction its so great you're looking out for this gorgeous fella

 

[CJ2008]

Hi,

I'm running out the door so I'll be writing more later...

Took him to the vet today - they guess between 5 and 7 months...and everything looks great.

The only problem is...vet found flea dirt on him this was so NOT a good thing to happen because I feel it's going to throw DH more into the "we can't keep him" thing and it's going to be harder to convince him to let him come in the house.

And, I didn't tell DH this but yesterday I had the two boys eating on opposite sides of the door, so they could smell each other. Rattie hissed a couple of times but for the most part they didn't seem too worried about each other - just curious.

He had a bath and they said they didn't find any live fleas, but they said that doesn't mean he doesn't have them...

They suggested I treat both him and my other cat with Revolution, that I wash any bedding he's been using in hot water, and even my clothing, which I did. I also wiped down some of the surfaces in the garage with a mixture of bleach and water and vacuumed a bit, and threw out the vacuum filter.

I am so upset at this because I feel this is going to put a damper on everything... and it's definitely putting a damper on me feeling comfortable with the two boys meeting...I am probably making a bigger deal than it is, but I do remember one of you guys (I think it was Yssie) who said that once you have a flea problem, it's hard to get rid of them.

 

[JewelFreak]

If you keep treating them for another cycle, you won't have fleas. I've adopted several cats from the street, had them bathed & never even done flea treatments except the bath, and never had a flea problem. I wouldn't even mention it to DH, it's not big enough.

Try putting Rattie in his crate in, say, kitchen or living room, and let the two get acquainted that way for an hour. Maybe try it a couple or 3 times in a day. You can return him to the garage in between. There will be some hissing at first, it's normal cat "sociableness," but if your other cat is a laid-back type, I'll bet a million bucks after 2 or 3 days they'll work its out fine. I adopted my first street cat when I was 6 & in the more than 50 yrs since then, have had many, with resident cats around. I've NEVER had fighting housemates; usually they end up getting along great. Sometimes that takes adjustment time, a week to a month, but you'll see it happening bit by bit. The worst situation I had was when the resident cat just couldn't STAND sharing -- and they simply avoided each other, never fought even once.

Male to male stuff isn't a problem with cats as much as w/dogs. I've had 2 females at once & now have 2 males, no difference.

My husband is always dead-set against the next cat or dog, tells me I'm nuts, has a little hissy fit of his own, then falls irrevocably in love. I think yours will do the same. I always tell him we'll place the cat if he finds he hates it or it doesn't work out, knowing that's unlikely to occur. Love works! Go CJ!

--- Laurie

 

[Gypsy]

I have had A BAD flea problem when I was in college and my roommate got a new cat. It was disgusting. And what I learned from it is this. Three straight months of Frontline (or Revolution) following the introduction of any new animals to the household, for every animal in the household and you are GREAt.

Seriously. As long as you keep them both on some good flea treatment (I prefer Frontline and you can mail order it from Costco straight to your door. A three month supply is around 35 bucks. So 70 bucks for two cats) for a while and you have no worries.

I've introduced MANY cats off the streets into my home. My own cats are pretty much permanently on Frontline (two of them have SEVERE flea allergies) so anyone new just gets dosed immediately. We've been fine.

I wouldn't mention it to DH either. Of all the problems Rattie could have had, this is the easiest to fix. You are good, no worries.

 

[CJ2008]

But I already told DH...

If I could do it over again, I wouldn't tell him...

But it's too late...

ETA: I feel this is going to speed up the process of me having to tell DH I've been thinking about keeping him...where the other way I was just going to do it gradually...and I think it's too early to tell DH straight out...I feel like he might resist me more...I was hoping the two boys would meet and like each other and then one day surprise DH with both of them hanging out...

 

[Imdanny]

Yes, when to tell the DH or SO is something to think about! I have something like that going on right now. It's when to tell the SO (he doesn't read this forum) that I want us to spend the $400 that fell in my lap on my Cartier ring that just happens to be $400. I know it's going to be so tempting for him to want to resent "me getting something" or "us not paying some bill" and I have to think about the timing and the right words and ultimately about how firm I want to be because this is my money and decision (would hate to have him resent it or not agree to it, though!). I see your situation is different but kind of similar. I wasn't aware of the fact that you want to keep the cat, actually. I'm still voting (and rooting for you) for the this cat to have a home with you guys because I have a feeling that your home is the best home this cat can have with the best care possible. And, yes, I agree with Laurie. Fleas (or potential fleas) can definitely be taken care of with modern flea products. I wouldn't worry about this being a long term problem. There are so many cats (and dogs) in the world that are not cared for. I think it's great how you have cared for this one. I hope this story has a happy ending like a Hollywood movie during the holiday season. Best wishes to you.

 

[yssie]

Ooh yes, fleas are a pain but as long as you are careful not to get lazy about the cleaning like I did once the problem seemed gone (vaccuming rugs regularly and replacing the flea collar in the canister every so often, washing in hot water often, flea treatments and baths as necessary - we use the same ointment as Gypsy) you can definitely head off a potential problem before it becomes a big issue.


Good luck CJ!

 

[Imdanny]

Update, my SO said yes! Maybe your DH will too! I'd say think positive thoughts! The two cats might get to know each other and really like each other's company.

 

[JewelFreak]

Danny, fab about your ring! Post pics, please!

Usually a kitten & an older (especially laid-back as yours is) cat do great. There are no particular territory issues w/a kitten, nothing to prove so things go smoothly.

I can tell you're a worrier, CJ, as I am -- I picture the worst-case scenario & get all wired. Don't let it stop you from trying it -- because it's never as bad as you fear, I mean never! I finally figured that out, so now I shut my mind off & give something a shot (with sweaty palms) -- and am always pleasantly surprised. And extremely happy!

What's the worst that can happen? They won't get along -- nobody's going to die or even be injured. In that case you find a home for Rattie. As you intended earlier, nothing lost.

You will more likely gain a darling little friend for your other cat. I think my kitten has added years to my old cat's life! They play & play; roll up & sleep together; groom each other -- this for a fat bored old boy w/a horrible heart & kidney disease! He's even lost weight. So go for it -- you have nothing to lose.

--- Laurie

 

[CJ2008]

I keep saying I'm going to write more but just keep coming on with questions - sorry! I've just been running around the last couple of days, haven't had any time to breathe! I will update, though, as soon as I get a chance. In the meantime, thanks for all your encouragement and support (Imdanny - yay on the ring )

I've been feeding Rattie Fancy Feast - but what's a better (store brand, if possible) food for a cat his age? (between 5-7 months). What about dry food?

 

[JewelFreak]

You'll find healthier foods at pet supply stores, like Petco or PetSmart. They're not generally much more expensive, if at all. Iams has gone downhill, bought by somebody or other. I'd put him on adult food; after about 6 months it's better. Dry food is good for his teeth but you really do need a healthful quality -- dry food can cause ureter blockage and/or kidney stones in males especially (I have one to whom that happened). If you give him canned, stores sell kitty treats for teeth health that are helpful. In my experience, just about anything you find at PetSmart, etc., would do fine, though others may disagree. You definitely don't need to go for the most expensive holistic snobby brands.

-- Laurie

 

[Matata]

I've been feeding Rattie Fancy Feast - but what's a better (store brand, if possible) food for a cat his age? (between 5-7 months). What about dry food?

The best food to feed is raw, whole prey (rats, mice, quail) but most folks can't handle it. Canned or freeze dried is better than dry food no matter the quality of the dry food. Here's some resources for you:

Some reliable etailers are:
http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/
http://www.petfooddirect.com/
http://www.waggintails.com

The following are commercially-available food choices for your cats that do not involve handling or feeding raw meat.
You can mix or match from the following:

* Dehydrated meat, organs, and bones which are balanced unto themselves
* All-meat canned products some of which require the addition of a bone source; others have too high a Cahos ratio
+ 3-5% (in overall food weight) veggies or rice bran is optional though desirable in order to avoid constipation
* Wet and dry commercial food without grains balanced in terms of calcium:phosphorous

Also included in the interest of variety, are brands of canned food with small amount of grains; skip if your cats are allergic to grains and/or you wish to avoid grains (cats have zero need for grains, so there is no need to feed it even if your cat is not allergic).

Dehydrated meat, organs, and bones
These can be crumbled over your cat's food as a bribe or fed as a meal with or without water. Since cats are supposed to eat a high moisture diet, more water is always better than less.

- Hare Today
http://www.hare-today.com/; Goat and rabbit include bones & organs
- Wysong's Archetype
- Stella and Chewy's Freeze-Dried Chicken & Beef Diet (formerly Carnivore Crunch); 2.98% calcium and 1.88% phosphorus
- Nature's Variety Freeze-dried (4 flavors: Chicken+Turkey, Beef, Lamb, and Venison), same Ca & P as raw equivalent
- Ziwipeak air-dried food and treats contain Venison, Chicory Syrup, Hoki fish oil, Lecithin from soy (thank you Andrea for checking on this, mixed tocopherols, and parsley

Pros
All these contain meat, organs, bones, essential fatty acids, probiotics, and enzymes.
They are grainless and not heated at any stage of the production process.
All 3 brands can be crumbled over any type of food as they are balanced.
They can (should?) also be reconstituted by adding water and fed as a meal.

The one downside other than lack of moisture is it can be quite expensive especially if you have a multi-cat household.
Other issues listed here incl the fact that chicory syrup is sugar, and "additives" are incomplete

All-meat canned products

* Wysong's Au Jus
* Evanger's 100% meat classic line (details below)
* Wellness 95% USDA, human grade beef, venison, chicken, turkey or salmon (Note: contains carrageenan)
* Iceland Pet Pate for Cats (Note: contains carrageenan)
* Tripett
* Feline Caviar (Note: contains carrageenan)
* EVO 95% (Note: contains carrageenan)
* Merrick Before Grain - Beef, Tuna, Quail, Chicken, Turkey & Salmon.
*Soulistic (made by the Weruva people exclusively for Petco or something along those lines

Important thing to keep in mind - not all of these are balanced foods as they contain mostly cooked muscle meat w/ no organs, no bones although some contain a calcium source (NOT always 1.2:1). However, taurine, and in some cases - calcium/bonemeal, and a small amount of veggies can be added to make these more appropriate for long-term feeding.

Au Jus can be balanced by adding bonemeal/calcium or Wysong's companion product Call of the Wild. All these formulas are quite rich so can cause digestive upset in some cats.

Looks like these are balanced for cats
Beef Au Jus: 1.3:1
Venison Au Jus: 1.2:1

These are high/low which could maybe be OK short term/intermittent:
Rabbit Au Jus: 1.6:1 (high)
Duck Au Jus: 1.14:1 (low)

And these are not balanced at all:
Chicken Au Jus: .05:1
Turkey Au Jus: .08:1

Why the same variety is all over the board IRT cal:phos ratio, who knows? At least a couple of the varieties are OK, though, in terms of cal:phos.



Evanger's
Petfooddirect.com and sitstay.com carry Evanger's products but check the manufacturer's website for other retailers as the 100% meat line is harder to find:
http://www.evangersdogfood.com/dog/allmeat.html

Their "Super Premium 100% Beef" should be supplemented with other foods and vegetables. Also this is the only brand that is certified Kosher if that is important.
Ingredients: Beef, Water Sufficient For Processing
So no calcium or bone source is stated.

They have added a couple of varieties which seem complete:
100% Duck which contains Whole Dressed Duck and Duck Broth
100% Chicken which has Whole Dressed Chicken and Chicken Broth.

On the one hand, they say whole dressed duck/chicken, which would imply bones but they give no Ca or Phos info. The word "meat" I'd interpret as no bones. Perhaps there are some Evanger's varieties that do contain calcium/real bone, so wouldn't need much tinkering. I

Iceland Pet Pate for Cats (contains carrageenan)
3 formulas - Salmon, Trout, and Cod & Cod Liver. Contains no bones or skin.

Tripett
http://www.tripett.com
Cans of green tripe from lamb and beef marketed for dogs. If you cannot get raw green tripe from the butcher, this is an ok option for cats if fed in very small amounts. Reason it's not a great option is that it contains garlic, and even without garlic might be too rich for some cats. Note to fellow vegetarians: feed on a day when you can open the windows :big grin

Feline Caviar (contains carrageenan)
http://www.caninecaviar.com/
Ingredients: Beaver and water (Please check w/ manufacturer as we've had conflicting info on whether this product contains bones)

Good idea for cats allergic to chicken and other easily-available meats who need a novel protein source

Merrick Before Grain
http://www.merrickpetcare.com/
* 95% Meat formulas include beef, chicken, turkey, salmon, tuna, & quail
* kitties seem to like the quail formula, and paws down for the rest (as reported by some)

Innova Evo 95% Meat (contains carrageenan)
http://www.naturapet.com
Balanced meat product that contains meat & calcium source plus vits/mins. Dog 95% meat formula is same as Cat formula, so allows for a few more options w/proteins.

Canned food without grains
These brands still contains carbohydrates, so be careful esp if you have a diabetic cat. FWIW, the carb source is either potato starch or some other non-grain food.

Grainless canned/wet food brands and varieties:
Nature Organics, Wellness, Nature's Variety, Merrick, Natural Balance, EVO, Addiction, Ziwipeak, etc.

Wellness (by Old Mother Hubbard)
They now have 2 lines - Grain-free and CORE

Wellness Grain-Free (contains carrageenan)
http://www.wellnesspetfood.com
*All formulas are grainless exept for Chicken & Lobster, Salmon & Trout, & Sardine, Shrimp, & Crab.
Caution: On paper it looks ok, but some kitties have had digestive problems w/ it e.g. mucousy and/or bloody stools, vomiting, diarrhea etc.

No negative reports so far on their grain-free, gluten free, & carrageenan free pouches (for kitties who like gravy-style foods):
http://www.wellnesspetfood.co/cat_welln ... index.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Wellness CORE canned (contains carrageenan)-
Just 2 varieties w/ one being all-fish, and this one w/ 2 types of poultry:

- Contains no veggies/plant matter but for some reason they added "Dried ground potatoes" whatever that is. Also means it isn't necessarily lo-carb.
- 1st 5 ingredients are meat w/ one being broth, but what the heck is "Natural Chicken Flavor"?
- The fiber source is Guar Gum which is very fermentable for cats, and can cause diarrhea. At the very least it can mean food could travel too quickly through the system for the nutrients to be absorbed b/c cats need moderately fermentable fiber.
- Contains Carrageenan (which can be pro-inflammatory), Cranberries, & Flaxseed which unless a cat has a skin condition is not needed. Even then would be short-term not every day.

On the plus site, it has a good amt of protein, tho a bit hi in fat so I'd be careful there and watch for weight gain. No fruits, which is good.

No veggies can be a negative b/c all other fiber sources are problematic for cats in one way or another. So as long as the plant material remains at a low % (5 or so) to fulfill fiber needs I don't have a problem w/. This uses guar gum which is not ideal IMO.

Bottom line - it's really not bad in many ways esp protein. And Wellness uses human-grade meat, so that's nice. The rest of the stuff in it is no worse than most other brands e.g. NV, Naturapet's EVO in that they too use chicory root, guar gum, carrageenan, and some brands also use Yucca Schidigera Extract which in theory is to reduce fecal odor but in reality isn't good for a cat's digestive tract.

I'd watch for digestive upset tho b/c the other Wellness grain-free canned varieties seem to cause problems w/ some kitties. I don't trust this company all that much, but w/ so few choices, what's one to do if raw is not an option.

Nature's Variety- Instinct (not Prairie)
95% Meat, 5% Fruits & Vegetables
http://www.naturesvariety.com
All these varieties are grainless - Chicken+Turkey, Beef, Lamb, Rabbit, Duck, and Venison
One of the few brands w/o carrageenan :thumbs up

Negative: protein is way too low:
9% protein/.25 dry matter = 36% on a DM basis; what's in a mouse - mid-50% so this is what I'd consider a "low-protein" food i.e. not cool

Their canned grainless cat food was identical to dog food, so to save money can purchase larger cans of dog food esp. if you have a multi-cat home and can go through contents quickly. I would still add taurine to any and all foods, not just this brand.

Merrick (contains carrageenan)
http://www.merrickpetcare.com
*The flavors California Roll and Southern Delight contain grain.

Grainless Merrick flavors - Cowboy Cookout, Grammy's Pot Pie, New England Boil, Surf & Turf, Thanksgiving Day Dinner, and Turducken.
And from the dog section, "Working Dog Stew" has tripe as the first ingredient and FWIW, is low-glycemic. Would have to check taurine levels.

Natural Balance (contains carrageenan)
http://www.naturalbalance.net/catformul ... anned.html
5 varieties are grainless - "Venison & Green Pea", "Green Pea & Duck", "Chicken & Green Pea", "Salmon & Green Pea", and “Chicken & Liver Pate" Ultra Premium Canned Cat Foods
Protein is ~41%, not as high as should be, but higher than NV

Halo/Spot's Stew
http://snipurl.com/37bqr
They finally gave up on grain :2 thumbs up
Pros - contains liver so not just muscle and/or unknown meat.
Cons - not as hi in protein % (around 45.83%) as a mouse's but higher than NV and NB; chicken variety contains garlic, also soy sauce; they don't list the veg% but there are a lot of diff veg in each formula

Innova EVO (contains carrageenan)
http://www.naturapet.com/
Not lo-carb but no grains and does contain the usual wacky Innova stuff like apples, carrots, and tomato flakes etc. The calories are a tad hi compared to other canned foods. Higher Phos levels than other canned foods as well, so be cognizant of this if you have a kitty w/ CRF.

Nature's Logic
http://natureslogic.com
Comes in 3 flavors - Duck and salmon, rabbit, and chicken

This brand had some unique positive attributes - use of eggshell and plasma, along w/ the (thankfully more common these days) exclusion of grain and usual rubbish fillers.

http://www.frommfamily.com/
4 choices - Shredded Chicken, Shredded Duck, Beef Entree, Tuna & Chicken, and Tuna Entree

- All have decent protein %, say all the right things about ingredient quality (including all-imp meat)
- Mercifully short ingredient list, at least the food portion of it.

2 odd ingredients tho in all 4 flavors - Potato Starch and Tomato Paste
Check this discussion where we talked about the food being produced in a USDA-approved human food facility in China:
http://holisticat.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2155#2155

Addiction (contains carrageenan)

* Unagi and Seaweed formula
Contains Wild New Zealand Eel, Dried Seaweed, Peas, Carrots + assorted vitamins etc.
http://www.addictionfoods.com/usa

* New Zealand Brushtail & Vegetable formula
Veg consists of carrots and peas. If (like me) you don't know what a Brushtail is :blushin, and to read more about this formula, click here:
http://www.addictionfoods.com/usa/

* Venison and Avocado formula (in larger cans marketed for dogs; also contains taurine but no info at this point as to whether the taurine amount conforms to AAFCO requirements for cats)
Contains New Zealand Venison, Avocados, Carrots, Peas etc.
http://www.addictionfoods.com/usa

Ziwipeak 'Daily-Cat' Cuisine (contains carrageenan)
Available size: 6.5oz in 3 meat formulas - Lamb, Venison, Venison & Fish
Nice that all formulas contain offal e.g. tripe, kidney, and heart http://www.ziwipeak.co

Weruva (contains Thickening Agent -- Tapioca Starch and/or Potato Flour and/or Xanthan Gum)
http://www.weruva.com/
*Check ingredients b/c some formulas are higher in carbs. Chicken, liver, & duck formulas are OK.
Pros: short ingred list, no carrageenan, no fruits
Cons: phos is bit low, but could add cal supp or use as supplemental feeding

AvoDerm Select Cuts (contains carrageenan)
http://www.breeders-choice.com
Pros: no fruits/veggies
Cons: sunflower oil instead of animal based oil, guar gum & carrageenan (binders) higher up on ingred list

Canned foods with grains (and meat as the primary ingredient)
Better quality canned foods that contain grain but included here to provide more choices for cats w/o grain allergies. Do not feed exclusively please b/c cats do *not* need grains and can develop serious allergies/intolerance/sensitivities.

Eagle Pack Duck & Chicken Formula (contains carrageenan)
The other formulas while good, contain either rolled oats or barley
http://www.eaglepack.com

Newman's Own Organics Canned Cat Food (the 4 "Adult" varieties contains carrageenan)
http://www.newmansownorganics.com/pet/
1st ingredient is organic chicken but it does contain brown rice (yes, that's a grain) and oat bran (too fermentable a fiber source for kitties). Contains fish.
Newman's Own
Note -- Organic Beef, Beef and Liver and Liver do not contain grain, carrageenan or fish oil

Castor & Pollux Canned Organix Feline Formula (contains Guar Gum)
http://www.castorpolluxpet.com
Contains brown rice and rice protein concentrate but is otherwise good esp. since 1st ingredient is free-range turkey

Natural Life Pet Products (contains carrageenan)
http://www.nlpp.com/
3 flavors - Ocean Fish, Chicken, and Lamb.
Interesting that they add kidney, nice to have more organs
Available at Wal Mart so hi points for accessibility.
Not exactly cheap (~$1 a can) considering where it's sold
Brown rice is 4th ingredient

Grainless Dry food brands and varieties
Although dry food is not a desirable option for cats, if you have a kibble-head and must feed dry, these are “better" choices. Always make sure your cat drinks a lot of water if s/he eats dry food, and try to switch to canned and/or preferably raw, if at all possible.

Timberwolf Organics Cat Food
Contains potato but no other veggies
http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/
It does have kelp, alfalfa, yucca, and a bunch of other stuff in it not everyone thinks cats should eat.

They claim that close to 1/2 the food (in weight) consists of chicken so it's still way better than a large % of the commercial foods out there.

Natural Balance Venison & Green Pea
http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/false;\Natural_Balance_Venison_Green_Pea_Dry_Cat_p/158041.htm
The other Natural Balance varieties do contain grains.

Innova EVO
http://www.naturapet.com/

Pluses:

- No grains
- Higher in protein than most commercial foods
- Human-grade meat
- 1st 4 ingredients are meat (two of 'em being meat meal)
- No nasty preservatives such as BHT, ethoxyquin, etc.

Minuses:

- Way too many veggies + potatoes, tomatoes, and apples (why?). Could be they are in very small amounts and kinda sorta ok but still (like grains) can have an alkalizing effect on urine.
- there might be some issues w/ cats ingesting rosemary extract on a regular basis
- out of the running for non fish-hating cats as it has only one flavor (which includes herring)
- weight gain reported for some cats
- Phosphorous content is a bit on the high side, so be careful with CRF cats. Course no cats, and certainly not those w/ compromised kidneys should be eating kibble anyway, even a better one


Nature's Variety Instinct - Chicken Meal and Rabbit Meal
http://www.naturesvariety.com/instinct_cat_kibble
It does contain alfalfa meal as the 6th ingredient and some unnecessary ingredients like pumpkin seeds and tapioca but then no additional fruits and veggies despite the incredibly long ingredient list, so overall not too bad. Seems a bit high in calories at 491 per cup.

Royal Canin's Venison and Pea formula
http://www.royalcanin.us/vetdiet/feline ... abbit.html
Should be called pea and venison b/c has peas as 1st ingredent and mysterious "pea protein" as the 4th.

Pros:

-No fruits
- No grains
- No veg besides peas
- Minimal filler
- No chicken or fish, good for cats w/ sensitivity

Cons:

- Canola Oil, flax
- Protein content is too low - 30% as-is and converted to DM basis is 33.33% which falls far short of a mouse's mid-50%
- If pea protein is counted in this 33,33% #, then even bigger problem b/c it's a (less than ideal) plant source as opposed to an animal source thus making the low protein # even more worrisome.


Wellness CORE - Fish & Fowl for Adult Cats & Kittens:
http://www.omhpet.com/wellness/

Pluses:

- No grains
- Best protein (and animal source at that) level of all commercial brands so far - matches up w/ a mouse on a DM basis. Excellent!
- Good taurine amts too - more than AAFCO's puny requirements

Minuses:

- Again w/ the fish, oy
- Potatoes as the 5th ingredient. Also contains Tomato Pomace and Cranberries (ugh, why?)

 

[zoebartlett]

We just took one of our cats to the vet last weekend, and I asked him what food he'd recommend. He recommended that any food we give them should have 50% protein. Most dry stuff that regular stores carry has way less protein than that. There's one kind that you can find in the regular store that is 40%, so that's at least a bit better than the other stuff. I'm sorry but I can't remember the name right now. We've never given our cats canned food, so I can't comment on that. Our cats are 4 years old though, not kittens. You might want to ask your vet for recommendations.

 

[Gypsy]

I feed Innova EVO, Wellness Core and Instinct. These are the dry foods I rotate (it takes about two weeks to switch them to a new dry so we do it only 3 times a year). I only do Wellness for about a month. Same will EVO, just to change things up for them. Heavy on the Instinct dry as it is hypoallergenic, especially for Lucy cause she has some skin issues. I also give her Wellness. No Innova for her though, she doesn't seem to do well on it. Wellness has a great low-calorie formula. I use it on fat cats to slim them... then switch back to the Instinct. But in general I find that Instinct wet and dry are far superior foods and well worth the money. Wellness and EVO actually cost more than the Instinct too, so that's also a nice benefit.

Wetfoods I feed are EVO, Instict, Tikki Cat, Mulligans, and anything else at Pet Food Direct (best pet food chain store period, IMO).

I would also switch him to adult food. Merlin at 7 months is on Adult food. His adult teeth are in and his weight doesn't need to be increased and kitten food is really high calorie.

A lot of people recommend Costo's Kirkland dry foods. But I compared the Instinct Dry to the Kirkland Dry from Costco once and was just shocked. I would not feel them Kirkland Dry at all.

 

[LAJennifer]

Dry foods I feed (usually mixed together) are EVO Weight Management, Innova low fat, Wellness CORE. I've recently tried to introduce Chicken Soup Weight Management, but my cats don't really want to eat it. I have 2 eleven year old cats (that like to free feed) and a 2 year old feral (Wellington) that I took in over the summer. He is a piggie.

I started out feeding Wellington (while he was still outside) Nature's Variety Prairie because I had a bunch of 2 for 1 coupons. He did great on the Prairie dry. I then found out he was FIV+ so I switched him to Nature's Variety Instinct (higher in protein) once I brought him indoors. He got fat - real fat - on half a cup a day. I want to put him back on the Prairie but the mineral levels might be troublesome to my 11 year old male - since he has had urinary tract problems in the past. Separate feedings just aren't possible.

I feed wet food everyday - usually buy the 13 ounce cans of California Natural, EVO, Wellness.

Just a quick note about Kirkland's Best (Costco) - I feed this to the 3 ferals outside. They are THRIVING!!! They look like house cats with gorgeous shiny coats, bright clear eyes, and excellent muscle tone. I almost can't believe it. Before Kirkland's, they were eating EVO mixed 50/50 with Whole Foods 365.

 

[Gypsy]

Jennifer, I agree that Instinct can plump them up. That's what Lucy was on when we first got her. She turned into a beach ball. I switched her to the Wellness low cal, and she slimmed down. But we've switched her back to Instinct now for several months and she's managed to maintain her weight.

I also agree that the Kirkland is certainly superior to supermarket pet food. But as an alternative to feeding them a raw diet (which is what I look for) it's not really viable.

That said, if most people fed their pets at least that quality of food I think they too would see the increases in their pet's health you have with the strays.

As a final note on the subject. At least with my five, Intincts Rabbit formula is like cat crack. They INHALE IT. But they are much more reserved with the Chicken formula and that's what I feed them. I only add the Rabbit in occassionally. Like this month, for the holidays.

 

[LAJennifer]

Jennifer, I agree that Instinct can plump them up. That's what Lucy was on when we first got her. She turned into a beach ball. I switched her to the Wellness low cal, and she slimmed down. But we've switched her back to Instinct now for several months and she's managed to maintain her weight.

I also agree that the Kirkland is certainly superior to supermarket pet food. But as an alternative to feeding them a raw diet (which is what I look for) it's not really viable.

That said, if most people fed their pets at least that quality of food I think they too would see the increases in their pet's health you have with the strays.

As a final note on the subject. At least with my five, Intincts Rabbit formula is like cat crack. They INHALE IT. But they are much more reserved with the Chicken formula and that's what I feed them. I only add the Rabbit in occassionally. Like this month, for the holidays.

Thanks Gypsy - I think I'll try the lo cal Wellness (I just got an emailed coupon for $5 off). I hope that Wellington will someday realize that he is going to get fed everyday, and stop treating every meal like it will be his last. He then, takes my other cats' food. They like to eat a few bites here and there (rather than a whole portion at once), and he finishes off anything they leave.

 

[CJ2008]

Matata, thank you so much for that detailed information on the food! I had run out of food so I went out to my local Petco and figured I would ask about a good food. I thought I had made a good choice based on what the girl there told me, definitely a step up from Fancy Feast, and it was on sale for .65/can, so I was happy.

Although now after I read your post thoroughly, plus some of what Gypsy and the others pointed out, I am not so sure this food is good. Plus, I see several of you said I should move him to adult food...

It's Nutro Natural Choice - for the canned, I bought it in 2 flavors - Salmon & Ocean Fish (breakdown below - I included this one only because they seem basically the same as far as the guaranteed analysis) and Chicken & Liver

Chicken Broth, Salmon, Chicken, Chicken Liver, Cod, Wheat Gluten, Dried Plain Beet Pulp, Starch, Egg Product, Natural Flavors, Fish Oil (Preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), Salt, Tricalcium Phosphate, Potassium Chloride, Herring Meal, Guar Gum, Brewers Dried Yeast, Sodium Carbonate, Sunflower Oil (Preserved with Mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), DL-Methionine, Taurine, Calcium Carbonate, L-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (Source of Vitamin C), Zinc Oxide, Vitamin E Supplement, Ferrous Sulfate, Chicory Pulp, Choline Chloride, L-Carnitine, Beta Carotene, Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Copper Proteinate, Manganese Sulfate, Niacin, d-Calcium Pantothenate, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Riboflavin Supplement, Potassium Iodide, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Sodium Selenite, Folic Acid, Biotin,.

Crude Protein (Min.) 10.00%
Crude Fat (Min.) 3.50%
Crude Fiber (Max.) 1.00%
Moisture (Max.) 80.00%
Ash (Max.) 2.50%
Linoleic Acid (Min.) 0.70%
Calcium (Min.) 0.25%
Phosphorus (Min.) 0.20%
Magnesium (Max.) 0.02%
Zinc (Min.) 50 mg/kg
Vitamin E (Min.) 60 IU/kg
Taurine (Min.) 0.07%

(there's more to the analysis but I included only up to here because what stuck out to me the most was that the protein was so low)

For the dry, same brand, Nutro - Indoor Healthy Grown Kitten

Chicken Meal, Corn Gluten Meal, Ground Rice, Chicken Fat (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), Wheat Flour, Natural Flavors, Dried Plain Beet Pulp, Sunflower Oil (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), Soybean Oil (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), Oat Fiber, Herring Meal, Dried Yeast, Potassium Chloride, Calcium Carbonate, Dried Vegetable Pomace (Carrots, Celery, Beets, Parsley, Lettuce, Water Cress, Spinach), Soy Protein Concentrate, Tomato Pomace, Choline Chloride, Fish Oil (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), Cranberry Pomace, Taurine, Salt, DL-Methionine, Vitamin E Supplement, Zinc Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate, Inositol, L-Carnitine, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Dried Chicory Root, Niacin Supplement, L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source of Vitamin C), Manganous Oxide, Copper Sulfate, Riboflavin Supplement (source of Vitamin B2), Potassium Iodide, Calcium Pantothenate, Biotin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (source of Vitamin B6), Vitamin B12 Supplement, Vitamin A Supplement, Thiamine Mononitrate (source of Vitamin B1), Vitamin D3 Supplement, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex (source of Vitamin K activity), Beta Carotene, Folic Acid.

Crude Protein (min.) 42.00%
Crude Fat (min.) 16.00%
Crude Fiber (max.) 4.00%
Moisture (max.) 10.00%
Linoleic Acid (min.) 4.00%
Arachidonic Acid (ARA)(min.) 0.05%
Calcium (min.) 1.00%
Phosphorus (min.) 0.90%
Iron (min.) 200 mg/kg
Manganese (min.) 35 mg/kg
Zinc (min.) 300 mg/kg
Vitamin D (min.) 1,200 IU/kg
Vitamin E (min.) 250 IU/kg
Taurine (min.) 0.20%

What do you guys think of this food?

(As a side note, I found this on the company, which I wasn't happy about...although most of the complaints seem to be about dogs http://www.consumeraffairs.com/pets/nutro.html)

I am totally willing to go back and return the rest of the canned and get him something else if this food is bad...I guess in my mind I'm trying to prioritize the top 3 things to look for in order of priority while trying to stay to $1 or under a can...(ETA - I'm talking about the small cans - like Fancy Feast size.) (ETA2: which is a 3 oz. can - but I'm realizing some of the other brands may not be as expensive in comparison, because the cans, even though they "look" the same size, are larger, like the Wellness Chicken, is 5.5 oz...)

 

[CJ2008]

And now for an update...

I took Rattie to get neutered Wednesday, picked him up on Thursday. Everything went well. He is such a sweet boy - I thought he was going to be mad at me when I picked him up but he let me pet him and was as loving as ever.

The poor thing has been wearing an ecollar since Thursday - the first one the clinic had given me was ridiculous...it was of a soft material, so at first I was glad to see that, but it was too long so he kept stepping over it and would be able to get his front legs through it somehow. He was really freaking out with it. So we had to put him in his cage AGAIN (this is after we had just gotten home from the clinic) and my regular vet gave me a regular ecollar (even though the tech said they never send male cats home with ecollars when it's a "regular" neuter) - but the clinic was so adamant that I leave the ecollar on so he doesn't lick it, I just thought it would be better to keep it on. He adjusted to this one fairly well, and is pretty calm while he is wearing it.

What I notice is that when I take it off to eat/drink/play he goes a little nutty for a while - really attacking his toys, pouncing, etc., for a long time. He has started doing the same to my hands and my feet, too...he gets into his predator stance and I can see it in his eyes that he's going to lunge at me. I've been very consistent with taking my hand away, etc., and just walking out of the room, or giving him a toy to play with. I am sure the poor guy is so stressed out wearing this collar...I feel like this could definitely be him lashing out and releasing some of that nervous energy.

But I'd like to know what you guys think...there's a part of me that fears what if this experience changes his personality? I keep picturing him lunging at my other cat? (believe it or not we still haven't made a firm decision whether to keep him, both DH and I keep dancing around the issue - but time keeps going by and DH isn't trying to rush me to find him a home - and I think he really likes him. But so much of the "next step" and decision will come only after seeing how the 2 cats react to each other - I've had them look at each other a few times through a baby gate I bought - but not since the surgery, so it's been a few days since they've seen each other. The first time, through the closed door, Rattie hissed, my other guy didn't. The 2nd time, Rattie seemed excited, he kept putting both his hands completely under door, as in wanting to play with my other cat - it was the cutest thing. My older cat was crying and hissing and for the most part then seems to retreat as if not wanting anything to do with him. Once Rattie is not wearing the ecollar anymore and I see he's calm, I'll have them see each other again. ETA: Oh, and while Rattie was getting neutered I did have my other cat in the garage so he could walk around and smell him.)

Anyway, there's a little part of me that's worried, because a few of you have said that you never know a cat's true personality when they're kittens...so I'm just curious what you think.

 

[zoebartlett]

CJ -- We just bought Innova EVO Weight Management for our two cats. They need to lose a little weight, and I like that this food (it's dry food) is close to what a cat would eat in the wild. That is, they don't eat a lot of fiber; they eat mostly protein. Innova EVO is 50% protein. That's high compared to most store brands, and eating a high protein diet is best, according to our vet. Our local pet food store (non PetCo or PetSmart) has Wellness, Science Diet, and other brands, but they were lower in protein than Innova. The one you got, at 42% protein, seems pretty good.

Does this mean you're keeping the kitty? ETA: Oops, I just read how you're not sure yet.

 

[Gypsy]

Hmm. Well, I've got Feline Behavioral Therapists coming tomorrow to help me with my brood (Merlin is bullying the others and we've wanted help rehabbing Lucy for a while). So I'm a bit frazzled by cats at the moment... so take this with a grain of salt.

Kittens are rambunctious and playful and prone to fits of wacked out energy, very curious and sometimes come across as a bit dumb (as in Merlin getting into the dryer every time we open it). That said at around 6 months on you can definitely get an idea of their personalities.

My Frodo (had since 6 weeks old) has always been wary of humans, has always loved other cats, loved wet food, refused to play with toys, and loved to cuddle, but only on his terms. He's always been good with his paws and teeth. All of that still applies. But he used to be high energy and active and now he's a couch potato at 6.

Duncan has always been an angel. Still is. Just a lazy angel now at 8. We got him at a year old. He didn't like having to share us with other cats at first, and we were firm with him. Now he just ignores the rest or pretends they are cat TV and watches them like the are the three stooges.

Hally has always been a cute demon with multiple personalities who likes to bully other cats (only she has ADD so she's terribly forgetful about it) and hates female cats. She's always hated human food and loved greens (wheat grass, bamboo, grass, plants). Still is. And her energy level is about the same, even though she's 6 years old and we've had her since she was 6 months.

So... I think Rattie is old enough that his basic personality is what it is. His energy level will change with time and he'll find a routine that works for him and stick to it. But he is inherently his own cat now. You can teach him things, like getting along with your resident cat, not to bite and what not, but the fundamentals of his personality won't change.

As for fixing him. No. It won't change him. A couple of days of discomfort, but that's all. He'll bounce back. I promise.

I've been thinking about you guys so thanks for the update!

 

[Imdanny]

I didn't read any of the posts that said you don't know about a cat's personality when they're kittens but I must most respectfully disagree.

I think the opposite is true.

Only abuse will change a kitten's/ cat's temperament, otherwise they are who they are from when they're kittens in my opinion.

We got our kitten at 9 weeks after, in the shelter, she licked my SO's ear. Three years later, after not seeing him for six months, after about 10 hrs of him being home, she ran up to him, licked his ear, and ran away.

I think one thing I'd like to say about your two cats is that although I respect you for being very deliberative, you're the boss. You can teach your new one not to claw at you (that's not that hard) and if you decide to keep this one you can socialize them together; it's not all up to them how they behave together. As the owner, you have more to say about it than they do and you can constructively work with them until they get along.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[LGK]

I did have one cat change personality a bit as he grew up- Rat was a very very easygoing kitten. I got him at 6 weeks old. You could stick your fingers in his mouth, turn him upside down and play with his soft fuzzy tummy, groom him however you needed, whatever. I did my darndest to get him used to that type of handling. And he was, right up until he hit about one year. Then the demon in him came out, lol.

He got *way* more high strung. Skitty. He tweaks, he fights you tooth and nail over grooming or whatever. If you, say, accidentally move fast near him (like nearly kick him by accident or whatever) he freaks like he thinks you're going to murder him. This was wayyyyy different than he was as a kitten, and he is the same at 15 as he was at 1 year. No clue why he got that way- he was never abused as a kitten he just is... high strung as anything I guess.

He grew into a major spaz- he runs around constantly, and is the only cat, in fact, I've ever seen race around until he starts panting he's worked himself up so much. So yeah, some do change a bit. But he's still cuddly and sweet, you just can't, like, groom him easily and I dread ever having to pill him. And if something (like the rain, good lord) scares him, he disappears for hours.

Rattie looks like he might be full grown enough, though, to have grown into whatever personality he will be.

Sounds like a good start to introducing your babies . Slow and easy does it for sure! Even if they fight and hiss a bit at first, they still could adjust well to each other- just make *sure* to separate them fully as soon as any negativity, like fighting, comes into play.

 

[zoebartlett]

I agree that introducing Rattie to your other cat slowly is probably best. We didn't actually do that with our cats though. We got home with our 2nd kitty, I opened the crate, and when he dared to come out after a little, I just hoped for the best. Luckily, our female kitty just sniffed him and cried a bit. They didn't fight though. She was wary of him, and he just saw someone to play with. In the end, it worked out fine. I just figured, well, they have to get used to each other sometime, right?