OEC girdle chip & setting questions

[catia]

Hello,
OEC has possible chip at 11 o'clock & is loose in setting.

#1 Is it possible to have this stone fully evaluated meaning removed from this type of setting without destroying the setting?
#2 if the girdle needed repolished who is recommended
#3 what is the proper name for this type of art deco setting? Is it considered a type of bezel?

In my area, I cannot find a jeweler recommended for antique cuts, this isn't a town known for quality jewelry-I took it to 1 today & was told the entire setting needed to be "sawed apart" , & LOL this same jeweler said he did not like the fact that I use a 10x magnifier because he doesn't want his work scrutinized. He said "No jeweler will touch you if they know you are looking at their work under magnification"...So he is a big red flag. LOL that lil 10x magnifier came free from a PS jeweler 10+ years ago.

***I LOVE this setting & this diamond. I could live with the chip if it does not affect the integrity of the diamond.
***All I can say is that this stone is the most amazing stone I've ever seen & I am smitten***
The setting looks like it was made for me, patina & all

Tried to get the clearest pic I can get with a flip phone

 

[catia]

 

[foxinsox]

Well I’m glad you’ve already sussed out that that jeweller is to be avoided! The photos aren’t too clear but it looks like bead-set in an illusion setting. They may also be fishtail prongs. Either way, I don’t think the setting would need to be sawed apart.
Without knowing where you are, I’ll guess maybe continental US and would suggest CJD Sako (https://www.instagram.com/cjd_sako/?hl=en) as he’s very good with rehabbing vintage jewellery. Otherwise David Klass. I’m not sure re appraisers if what you’re looking for is an assessment of the damage but I’d trust them for that too from what I’ve seen of their work here.
If you can post your rough location, people can suggest options for you.

 

[catia]

Southwestern PA

It's bead set. I did not know if there was a specific name for these square illusion settings.
I think (read:hope/pray)--After killng my eyes with 10x magnifier-it looks possibly as if that *might not* be a chip-but possibly the girdle is over the bead on just that 1 corner-& that is why it is rocking-maybe one of those bead things wore out-thoughts?
FINGERS CROSSED
I am not concerned with the fleabites. I am concerned about getting it evaluated & making sure nothing is messing with the integrity of the stone. I want her remounted into same setting if that's possible.

 

[Mreader]

I just want to see clearer pictures bc I love the setting! I can’t see the chip bc photos are blurry. I have a diamond w a chip and I just let it be. If it is loose that is a different matter.

 

[LightBright]

Nothing is messing with the integrity of that stone while it is mounted in that setting. You might have a problem reselling a chipped diamond, if it actually is chipped under a prong. But in that bead setting, the diamond itself is not at risk for self-destruction (IMO). The beads on the beaded fishtail setting should be checked to make sure they are securely holding the diamond. I personally would not touch the ring or the diamond, if the beads are holding it securely. If they need to be reinforced Sako in Los Angeles would be someone who could do it but he is expensive.

 

[newdiamondworld]

I’m confused. Did you chip the diamond? Or you are just considering buying this ring with a possibly chipped diamond?

 

[stracci2000]

If you are in the Pittsburgh area, then you might know that the Clark Building downtown is legendary. It is Pittsburgh's diamond district.
Perhaps you can find someone in there to help you.

 

[Mreader]

I’m confused. Did you chip the diamond? Or you are just considering buying this ring with a possibly chipped diamond?

Oh I was thinking the OP already owned it but now that I reread it I’m unsure also.

 

[YadaYadaYada]

I don’t have anything to add that hasn’t already been said as far as the ring is concerned, yes absolutely stay away from that crazy jeweler who wants to saw it apart

If this is a ring you are considering that you don’t already own, consider how mine clean owning a diamond with a chip will be for you. Some folks are totally fine with it but I’m in the camp that chips drive me crazy especially if they are noticeable. Had to sell a really beautiful diamond because I couldn’t deal with how chipped it was.

The setting is beautiful though, would love to see some more pictures.

 

[catia]

I just want to see clearer pictures bc I love the setting! I can’t see the chip bc photos are blurry. I have a diamond w a chip and I just let it be. If it is loose that is a different matter.

The setting is beautiful. The stone is amazing. I will get pics up. I need to get the potential issue sorted out 1st.
If the diamond weren't rocking, I would let it be. It might not be a chip-one of the beads might be worn & the diamond might have wiggled over the corner, it's about 100 yrs old. It's really hard to tell even with my 10 magnifier.
Am trying to find a reputable jeweler locally who has an experienced in house bench, preferably with a really old fart. I don't want any young whippersnappers even touching this. The place I would've taken it to 1st closed 2 weeks ago after 100 yrs.

 

[catia]

Not kidding, I just called one of the other oldest jewelers in the city, I inquired if they had an in house bench for repairs.
He asked me what I was looking for.
I said "Well what I really want is an old fart to evaluate my antique ring because the diamond is loose".
He said "Well you're in luck, I'm 65 & have been here for over 40 years whattaya got?"
I told him & knew exactly what I was talking about-he said bring it in now, it might be something i can fix today, if not we'll figure it out. I've got 2 hours.
LOVE OLD FART JEWELERS-LOVE!!!
Fingers crossed it's not a big issue.

 

[foxinsox]

That’s brilliant! Hope the old fart got it sorted for you and it’s secure. Then please come back and post clearer pictures because from what I can see, that’s a really pretty ring and stone!

 

[catia]

popped out & getting pics now

 

[catia]

 

[catia]

Went to the Clark Bldg- David Helfer Jewelers-stone was popped no hesitation, no drama & we got down to business. Ira is a lovely man knows exactly what he is doing, his years of experience are a comfort, & I feel lucky to have him.

Definitely a chip, he said it's likely been there for years. Gave me the name of a GIA gemologist to speak with, but said he'd reset it no problem & to make sure I remind him no rhodium.
Ira wasn't keen on how we lovingly refer to them as fleabites, he said "who refers to them as fleabites? Is that a technical term? And I said-the ladies who collect the antique honkers on pricescope & he laughed.
He said he'd set it & forget it, without repolish-asked me what I would do anyway if they told me it messes with the integrity of the stone, I said I may get repolish, said he's got guys for that all over the country & if I need it let him know.

Guess what??? My ring was NOT sawed into 4 pieces like 'jeweler" #1 (the actual owner of a brick & mortar & came recommended) said was required to get the stone out...AND... Ira made me use his good loupe & made sure i knew how to use it properly & told me where to get one like his.

Night & day.
Get & keep yourselves and old fart jeweler--they've seen it all, know the 'lost arts' & aren't afraid to tell you just how it is-and at the end of the day that's what we need to hear.

Price of popping the stone at the 'hack jeweler' who didn't want to do it because I would scrutinize his work under a 10x loupe- who was going to saw my ring into 4 pieces-then said it was not worth it to him because he did not want the risk of damaging the stone--$60

Price of going to a REAL jeweler who knew what he was looking at-didn't flinch, did not damage my setting & will reuse it, PLUS made me use his loupe--PRICELESS

Yes I am sad about the chip, but I feel secure in whatever decisions I make moving forward.
The seller will take it back if I change my mind.
I'm not changing my mind unless the stone is beyond repair.
I've seen stones with LOTS of fire-NOTHING comes close to this stone that I have ever seen in person. Better than the one in my minds eye I was trying to match-Not kidding--I did not even know it was possible to have this much fire-I've got the neon embers when she's awake-orange/blue/ green/and the pastels when she's mellow. There is never not something. In the morning when I have my coffee-it literally throws a molten lava color from within-The kozibe out that whazoo-gives it the confetti effect.

 

[stracci2000]

Went to the Clark Bldg- David Helfer Jewelers-stone was popped no hesitation, no drama & we got down to business. Ira is a lovely man knows exactly what he is doing, his years of experience are a comfort, & I feel lucky to have him.

Definitely a chip, he said it's likely been there for years. Gave me the name of a GIA gemologist to speak with, but said he'd reset it no problem & to make sure I remind him no rhodium.
Ira wasn't keen on how we lovingly refer to them as fleabites, he said "who refers to them as fleabites? Is that a technical term? And I said-the ladies who collect the antique honkers on pricescope & he laughed.
He said he'd set it & forget it, without repolish-asked me what I would do anyway if they told me it messes with the integrity of the stone, I said I may get repolish, said he's got guys for that all over the country & if I need it let him know.

Guess what??? My ring was NOT sawed into 4 pieces like 'jeweler" #1 (the actual owner of a brick & mortar & came recommended) said was required to get the stone out...AND... Ira made me use his good loupe & made sure i knew how to use it properly & told me where to get one like his.

Night & day.
Get & keep yourselves and old fart jeweler--they've seen it all, know the 'lost arts' & aren't afraid to tell you just how it is-and at the end of the day that's what we need to hear.

Price of popping the stone at the 'hack jeweler' who didn't want to do it because I would scrutinize his work under a 10x loupe- who was going to saw my ring into 4 pieces-then said it was not worth it to him because he did not want the risk of damaging the stone--$60

Price of going to a REAL jeweler who knew what he was looking at-didn't flinch, did not damage my setting & will reuse it, PLUS made me use his loupe--PRICELESS

Yes I am sad about the chip, but I feel secure in whatever decisions I make moving forward.
The seller will take it back if I change my mind.
I'm not changing my mind unless the stone is beyond repair.
I've seen stones with LOTS of fire-NOTHING comes close to this stone that I have ever seen in person. Better than the one in my minds eye I was trying to match-Not kidding--I did not even know it was possible to have this much fire-I've got the neon embers when she's awake-orange/blue/ green/and the pastels when she's mellow. There is never not something. In the morning when I have my coffee-it literally throws a molten lava color from within-The kozibe out that whazoo-gives it the confetti effect.

I'm glad you went to the Clark Building.
That's where my original engagement ring came from.

 

[prs]

Your diamond is gorgeous!

It looks like you might have another flea bite or two on the side opposite the chip. A lot of old cuts have wafer thin girdles, that's why they chip so easily. The good news is that polishing out chips on wafer thin girdles can be done with minimal carat loss.

 

[catia]

I’m confused. Did you chip the diamond? Or you are just considering buying this ring with a possibly chipped diamond?

Sorry, let me clarify. I did not chip the diamond-it came that way.
I purchased the ring, but I can send it back. I have contacted the seller.
I do NOT want to send it back, but I will if I have to. As long as the integrity of the diamond isn't affected & I am good to use it in a ring for daily wear-there is not issue.

It was an estate piece & diamond evaluated in the setting, but not by a jeweler. They do not mess with their estate pieces-it not cleaned or polished or spruced up. It was sold to me as 14 kt white gold & the diamond specs as:
aprox 6mm H SI1, estimated .84cts-No cert
I was fine with the fleabites, but that chip is a little bigger than my comfort zone & need expert's opinion.
I was satisfied with the price we agreed upon. I think I got a good deal, but you ladies are much more savvy. We can talk about that after I know what's up with the stone.

FYI:
Turns out the stone is actually 6.5mm & 1.17cts, looks like an I

I moved to the "darkside" (uncerted)because I was not finding what I wanted in my price range. Mainstream diamond prices are too inflated right now & I trust my eyes after 10 years of reading PS & experiences with OECs & antique cuts & viewing stones on my own, hoping to find THE ONE. Nothing has come close to this. It's ridiculous the amount of fire & I am a fire nut.
As to plot/cert- if you saw this ring with that stone in person-you'd know too.
I could care less about her color or what junk she has in the trunk-because the way she faces up-and this setting-she is in my sweetspot for spread- You can easily see this ring from 20 ft away without me even trying to show you.

Just want to get past this chip hurdle.

 

[catia]

Oh, the black spots are still 'gunk' that did not come off-not carbon spots, he steamed it but it did not all come off. I do beleive there is 1 actual carbon spot close to the girdle but who knows-you can't see any of that face up under 10x

 

[Gone_]

if you like the setting and the diamond...and you got a good deal, I'd keep it. Or are you worried that there could be further damage to the stone if you keep it and don't address the chip?

 

[Rfisher]

The seller will accept a ring return that’s been worked on outside of their control?
Kudos to them!

Congrats on finding a vintage stone and ring you are smitten with! It’s lovely!

 

[foxinsox]

My ering diamond is chipped like this and it’s not an issue as it’s under a prong and protected.
Did the old fart say if the chip was structural or if it’s ok?
I think it’s lovely and you found a good stone.

 

[LightBright]

The chip is NORMAL for that cut type antique stone. It’s very old and hand cut. Sometimes the cutters chipped the stone cutting it. Or maybe it’s part of the original crystal. (Not many people ever see this type of antique old diamond, so I don’t think anyone here knows why these types of chips happened, these are my guesses.) That girdle is likely “a mess’ (what people here on PS might say). This is exactly normal. Flea bites, and chips like that happened when the cutter (who used old tools) cut it in the late 1800s. I had exactly the same experience as you. An Antique cut stone from that time frame, in a newer Edwardian setting, with a chip like that mounted under a prong. I could show you a photo of mine, but it looks exactly the same (my chip was worse). It did not get there from someone wearing it (might have been from setting it or it got there from someone cutting it). Or possibly it is part of the natural crystal. That chip of yours is NOT a threat to the structural integrity of the stone. The stone can be remounted exactly as it was, set down in three beads, and you will only be able to see the chip with major inspection with a loupe.

The light play and faceting of your stone will continue to impress you with ZERO effects from the tiny chip. Do not allow anyone to repolish or do anything to your antique diamond, because you will lose this gorgeous cut (koizibe, fire, interesting moods, are to be preserved). In my opinion, you should remount it and enjoy it. It needs nothing more - in my opinion- the chip is no threat at all. Your diamond is very pretty.

 

[catia]

The chip is NORMAL for that cut type antique stone. It’s very old and hand cut. Sometimes the cutters chipped the stone cutting it. Or maybe it’s part of the original crystal. (Not many people ever see this type of antique old diamond, so I don’t think anyone here knows why these types of chips happened, these are my guesses.) That girdle is likely “a mess’ (what people here on PS might say). This is exactly normal. Flea bites, and chips like that happened when the cutter (who used old tools) cut it in the late 1800s. I had exactly the same experience as you. An Antique cut stone from that time frame, in a newer Edwardian setting, with a chip like that mounted under a prong. I could show you a photo of mine, but it looks exactly the same (my chip was worse). It did not get there from someone wearing it (might have been from setting it or it got there from someone cutting it). Or possibly it is part of the natural crystal. That chip of yours is NOT a threat to the structural integrity of the stone. The stone can be remounted exactly as it was, set down in three beads, and you will only be able to see the chip with major inspection with a loupe.

The light play and faceting of your stone will continue to impress you with ZERO effects from the tiny chip. Do not allow anyone to repolish or do anything to your antique diamond, because you will lose this gorgeous cut (koizibe, fire, interesting moods, are to be preserved). In my opinion, you should remount it and enjoy it. It needs nothing more - in my opinion- the chip is no threat at all. Your diamond is very pretty.

^^^ This ^^^ is really what I needed & wanted to hear. Experience from someone who has been there, had the same type of stone & continued to wear her ring. It is also in line with what the bench jeweler said, he did not think it was a big deal. I don't know if I would have the heart to return it even if I could not use it in my wedding ring-it REALLY is that amazing in real life.
Thank you!

 

[catia]

Now I have to take the ring back & get it sized & diamond reset, & I will be without it for a few weeks, he's got a full schedule. Here are pics with my bad camera before I had the stone popped out & sellers pics.

 

[catia]

Am nervous about reset, so I have decided I want the stone insured.

I can not just use my receipt because the sellers description was estimated, & he stated the stone was a 6mm .84 carat,
After popping out the stone, the bench said it is in fact a 6.5mm & 1.17 carat. Which is YAY!!! for me of course, I thought she looked pretty healthy- but now I need an appraisal to get it insured for more accurate value.
For those of you with actual antique stones-who have had appraisals-should I be seeking out an antique jewelry appraisal?

 

[LightBright]

Am nervous about reset, so I have decided I want the stone insured.

I can not just use my receipt because the sellers description was estimated, & he stated the stone was a 6mm .84 carat,
After popping out the stone, the bench said it is in fact a 6.5mm & 1.17 carat. Which is YAY!!! for me of course, I thought she looked pretty healthy- but now I need an appraisal to get it insured for more accurate value.
For those of you with actual antique stones-who have had appraisals-should I be seeking out an antique jewelry appraisal?

TBH, I wouldn’t insure it. But that’s me. Are you thinking that reset would cause a loss, damage or something? This is just my opinion.

 

[YadaYadaYada]

Have you verified with the jeweler doing the work that their policy will not cover the ring? I would verify this before going to the trouble and expense of insuring it yourself.

 

[catia]

Have you verified with the jeweler doing the work that their policy will not cover the ring? I would verify this before going to the trouble and expense of insuring it yourself.

I did not ask because it is my stone not the jewelers stone. I intended on getting her insured regardless.
She was sold to me as 6mm, .84ct, & it is actually 6.5mm 1.17ct .
I gained .33 & .5mm-
Apparently what I was experiencing with the illusion setting was not an illusion!

Now, because she's over a carat, a true antique stone, my wedding ring & forever stone--AND LOOSE- I am considering sending it to GIA & get it graded, plotted etc & then appraised. Make an honest woman out of her lol. I know she's got 'junk in the trunk' mostly that girdle is a mess.
***I am not planning now to do any repolishing unless I absolutely have to***
There is NOTHING I would want to change about how this diamond performs.
I do not care what the grading says because I KNOW how she performs. It actually might be interesting to learn just how bad they grade her, for amusement & to show as an example of how grading of these stones is so detached from actual performance.
So wanting to send to GIA is mostly so I can get insured & appraised have a good way to identify should anything ever happen. I do care about making sure I am insured for full replacement value in case anything ever happens, because I know how hard it is to find a stone like this.
If anything happens to this stone, I would be devastated. It truly is my dream stone in both performance & size.
I have always been an antique cut girl at heart, but my search to find a diamond that performed how I remember seeing when I was a young girl-that image always stuck in my minds eye & nothing ever lived up to it-I was starting to feel that my memory was unrealistic-there are a LOT of antique duds-most on the market are not great performers. Then I started down the avenue of precision antique cut, which perform beautifully, with light performance, maximizing the brilliance does lessen the intensity of fire, those pastel flashes are amazing though.
It is the fire that does it for me-The color of the fire in this diamond has BOTH the neon-like jewel tones, when she's revved up- PLUS the pastel tones of fire when she is being mellow.
I was amazed with this stone from the second I had it in real life-& that was when she was set & dirty-I just want to get through this reset. I can't imagine how she is going to perform clean & set-it is such a clear stone & looks like a G to me.

edited to remove many typos