Off Topic - What the HECK is going on in America?

[Independent Gal]

Anchor, I''m really shocked to hear about QC, by the way.

 

[Bia]

Date: 6/20/2008 3:33:23 AM
Author: honey22
Well, here in Down Under we certainly have some brainiacs running the country. Some smart politicans decided that we needed to increase our birth rate or there isn''t going to be anyone looking after the oldies in the future. Solution - a $5000 Baby Bonus to get us all bonking. It''s paid as a lump sum as soon as the mother gives birth and registers the birth certificate. So what do our teenagers think - WOW!! $5k will buy me the best tellie ever (or shoes or drugs or cars or whatever things that teenagers want but have no real access to). Having a baby would be the easiest way to get our hands on cash like that! Remember when you were 16, that kind of money was unimaginable. So we now have teenage pregnancy and motherhood on the rise. To children from low socio-economic backgrounds who think this is a great way of turning their lives around and making some cash. I have seen several interviews on telly from kids that are happy to tell the nearest camera that they are getting pregnant purely for the cash, and they won''t have to worry cause their Mum''s will help em raise the kid and they can claim benefits anyway (you get more money with dependants). It''s just so sad!! These kids thinking that they will make a quick buck just don''t have any comprehension of how much money having a baby will cost (not to mention the emotional investment).

The government is starting to realise the error of their ways and are trying to introduce this payment to be made in progress payments over the first few months/years of the baby''s life, or to put it in trust or something, but I can''t believe they didn''t see this one coming when they first came up with the idea? Sure, it''s a great help to parents when they first have a baby, but I think they could have put more thought into people abusing the system.

ETA

I just thought of a way to get those ACA earrings I am longing for .............

That is just absurd.

However, your earring idea...very clever!!! haha

 

[Deelight]

Date: 6/19/2008 5:15:28 PM
Author: Pandora II
It''s not just the US.


The part of London where I am an elected representative has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy in Europe.


We are spending a huge amount of £££ and have put a big team in place to go into schools and run serious sex-ed classes. Above all with the boys. Once you explain to a 15 year-old boy that they will be liable for supporting that kid for the next 18 years and that means a minimum of 15% of their income, they start to wise up.


Contraception is free in the UK and your parents are never informed no matter what your age. We even run specialist teenage drop-in centres for contraceptives and GUM clinics. However our very over-generous welfare system makes it rather easy for them.


The local Catholic girls school refused to let our teams in to teach sex-ed. Right up till the latest figures showed that that school had the highest rate of any in the area!


We''ve also found out that 3 guys are responsible for over 50% of all the pregnancies.


It''s so sad and so often they do seem to get pg in groups. I was still playing with barbie at some of their ages...

That figure there is to me just really highly scary

Honey I think the baby bonus is a good idea and personally if I was preggers would prefer a lump sum so I would have the extra to buy larger items but I agree not everyone is like that. I watched the same program on ACA but had a complete different take on it, could be that I detest that program and other current affairs programs but if the baby bonus was not there a lot of those same girls would have gotten knocked up for the pension or some other reason, it happened before the bonus and it will happen afterwards.

What I think will really stupid is if they means test the bonus that to me is just stupid, punish people for wanting to be self sufficient.

 

[meresal]

Jamie Lynn Spears, 17yrs old, was NOT the youngest girl that delivered a baby at the hospital in Mississippi yesterday. *Sigh*

 

[thedreamer]

I didn''t read all of the responses, so if I repeat things already said, I''m sorry.

I think this situation is really sad, especially the comment that the one student made about having somebody to love you unconditionally. It seems that these young women are living with little to no self esteem and would benefit from some type of therapy or classes or anything that could let them see that they can loves themselves unconditionally and that they don''t need a child for that.

I don''t think that this can be blamed on parents. Kids do what they want, no matter what type of family they grow up in. I listened as a kid, respected people, went to college, etc- my brother had the same parents as me and he didn''t graduate high school, turned into a drug addict, went to rehab and is finally getting his act together. He has a friend who goes to church twice a week and was on honor roll, played sports, well respected- and she got pregnant two years ago at 16. Kids will choose to hide/show what they want and as hard as parents try, they cannot control or mold their kids into who they want them to be.

Also, I agree that birth control needs to be offered to kids; however, I don''t think that would have helped this particular group of people. They seemed to WANT to get pregnant so whether the bc was available or not, I''m sure they would have still ended up where they are now.

I am a huge advocate of education. All kinds of education, not just sex ed. Show these kids what having a baby does to your life. My school had those babies that cried and needed to be fed and were the most obnoxious things ever when I was in high school. Every student had to have one for 3 nights and the baby had a computer in it that printed off how well it was treated at the end. If you didn''t take care of that kid, you didn''t pass health class, and you had to keep doing it until you did. As lame as I thought it was then, I think it was a good idea. The only bad thing was that they gave it to us junior year and there were already a ton of pregnant people by then anyway.

 

[Anna0499]

Date: 6/20/2008 11:14:48 AM
Author: thedreamer
I didn''t read all of the responses, so if I repeat things already said, I''m sorry.

I think this situation is really sad, especially the comment that the one student made about having somebody to love you unconditionally. It seems that these young women are living with little to no self esteem and would benefit from some type of therapy or classes or anything that could let them see that they can loves themselves unconditionally and that they don''t need a child for that.

I don''t think that this can be blamed on parents. Kids do what they want, no matter what type of family they grow up in. I listened as a kid, respected people, went to college, etc- my brother had the same parents as me and he didn''t graduate high school, turned into a drug addict, went to rehab and is finally getting his act together. He has a friend who goes to church twice a week and was on honor roll, played sports, well respected- and she got pregnant two years ago at 16. Kids will choose to hide/show what they want and as hard as parents try, they cannot control or mold their kids into who they want them to be.

Also, I agree that birth control needs to be offered to kids; however, I don''t think that would have helped this particular group of people. They seemed to WANT to get pregnant so whether the bc was available or not, I''m sure they would have still ended up where they are now.

I am a huge advocate of education. All kinds of education, not just sex ed. Show these kids what having a baby does to your life. My school had those babies that cried and needed to be fed and were the most obnoxious things ever when I was in high school. Every student had to have one for 3 nights and the baby had a computer in it that printed off how well it was treated at the end. If you didn''t take care of that kid, you didn''t pass health class, and you had to keep doing it until you did. As lame as I thought it was then, I think it was a good idea. The only bad thing was that they gave it to us junior year and there were already a ton of pregnant people by then anyway.

Although I agree that not everything can be blamed on the parents, everything starts at home. Your parents are your first teachers and, even though no matter what they do their children will make mistakes, I think there is no bigger influence on a child''s life. I wonder how many of these girls were not given ''unconditional love'' at home, especially by their fathers? I know I always felt loved by my parents and certainly never felt the need to have someone else to give it to me. Sometimes parents do everything right and things go wrong, but I don''t think that was the case for every one of these girls.

 

[Fancy605]

Date: 6/20/2008 11:45:27 AM
Author: Anna0499

Although I agree that not everything can be blamed on the parents, everything starts at home. Your parents are your first teachers and, even though no matter what they do their children will make mistakes, I think there is no bigger influence on a child''s life. I wonder how many of these girls were not given ''unconditional love'' at home, especially by their fathers? I know I always felt loved by my parents and certainly never felt the need to have someone else to give it to me. Sometimes parents do everything right and things go wrong, but I don''t think that was the case for every one of these girls.

Well, the trouble is that a lot of these girls who are craving the unconditional love they think a baby will bring do not live with parents. Where I work a lot of the girls (aged 12-16) who become pregnant on purpose are in foster care or have been moved from relative to relative depending on who is in jail that month. They have no consistent influences. I have had a few where I met with their social worker rather than an actual parent when it came time to make decisions as far as high school placement. These are not girls who simply lack good parenting. These are girls who lack any sort of strong family ties period. Now, this year we only had one girl to get pregnant (well that we knew of), and it was on purpose. She said she just wanted to have a little baby to love her.

.

 

[Anna0499]

Date: 6/20/2008 1:47:35 PM
Author: Fancy605

Well, the trouble is that a lot of these girls who are craving the unconditional love they think a baby will bring do not live with parents. Where I work a lot of the girls (aged 12-16) who become pregnant on purpose are in foster care or have been moved from relative to relative depending on who is in jail that month. They have no consistent influences. I have had a few where I met with their social worker rather than an actual parent when it came time to make decisions as far as high school placement. These are not girls who simply lack good parenting. These are girls who lack any sort of strong family ties period. Now, this year we only had one girl to get pregnant (well that we knew of), and it was on purpose. She said she just wanted to have a little baby to love her.

.

Children with no parents at all are a whole other problem IMHO - although I think every child needs parental influences, biological or not, in their lives. I think teenage pregnancy is a societal problem rather than one that can be pinpointed to a particular source and a holistic approach will be needed to convince these girls that they are worth more than what many of them are getting. Easier said than done, I know. While having caring parents will not solve the problem, it definitely gives them an advantage in life. God bless the social workers/foster care parents!

 

[Lauren8211]

Well it seems obvious that you can''t pinpoint one particular cause of teenage pregnancy. So many factors contrbute to that, and it will always pose a problem. However, what disturbs me is simply the fact that people won''t get over their religious feelings and deal with the problem! I understand that some religions don''t want people to have sex before marriage, or use contraceptives at all. However, when these traditions were established, people were married at 18, and didn''t live as long as we do now. With people getting married at 25, 30, or later, it seems impossible to hold out for that long. Life is different now, and as much as people would not like to accept it, we have to educate beyond abstinance. We have to support places like Planned Parenthood (yes, even if they perform abortions!), because they educate and provide for people in need! This country does not need unwanted babies, nor does it need babies born to people who can''t afford them. This country needs a more liberal outlook on this topic. The old ways are clearly NOT working anymore.

 

[TravelingGal]

"The school's principal, Joseph Sullivan, told Time magazine the girls confessed to making the pact after the school began investigating. Some of the girls reacted to the news they were pregnant with high fives and plans for baby showers, Sullivan said. One of the fathers "is a 24-year-old homeless guy," Sullivan told the magazine."

I'm sorry, but these girls are idiots. Their poor babies. Party's gonna be over really quick when these babies born.

ETA...OK, I think "idiots" might have been harsh. But seriously bloody naive might be appropriate.

 

[Blair138]

Date: 6/20/2008 5:24:01 PM
Author: TravelingGal
One of the fathers ''is a 24-year-old homeless guy,'' Sullivan told the magazine.''

I''m sorry but this part is SICK

Her parents must be so proud

 

[anchor31]

Talking about glamorizing... A show called "The secret life of an American teenager" is starting this fall on ABC family... about a pregnant teenager. Will they really show it how it is? I doubt it. *sigh*

 

[Blair138]

A GOOD one starting in July is called the Baby Borrowers- it takes teen couples and gives them a week or 2 (can''t remember) with infants, toddlers-even teenagers! I think it will be awesome and I''m considering taping it to show to my classes.

 

[brazen_irish_hussy]

To be perfectly honest, they are poor and badly educated which statistically, has a big impact on the age of the mothers when they first give birth.
My FI comes from a poor, badly educated family. He is the second of many cousins and the only without a child and he is 24. One of his cousins first got pregnant as 19 by her married boss when they were drunk. She was so excited and I finally asked her why. She said because that was the most important thing she was ever going to do with her life. She never had plans for school or to get a good job, all she felt she was good for is babymaking. She is 21 and pregnant again.
Like these girls, I don''t think it occured to her that she could do better or that she might want to. Unfortunately, having seen all the women in FI''s family who do the same thing, FMIL included, none of them are happy with the way things worked out. They put all their hopes into these kids who do grow up, rebel and move away, leaving them with nothing.

 

[luckystar112]

You know, I think that you can educate your kids to the best of your ability, teach them the dangers of unprotected sex, teach sex ed until their 40 and lecture lecture lecture and kids are still going to do what they want. It''s the sad truth. I went to school in a very established/high dollar town and two of my classmates got pregnant. One of them got pregnant twice! And this was a very small town where all the parents knew eachother and there was a great support system. Now I can''t say that they had the perfect life, or that something didn''t happen for them not to put their own lives before sex, but I can say what I saw by knowing them and their families personally, and that is that both girls went against everything they were taught for one night of fun.

Not related to my above post, but the other day I was watching true hollywood story: dating nightmares, which talked about a kid who knew he was HIV positive and went on to infect at least 13 girls. I was HORRIFIED. I googled his name later and found an article about him, and it really opened my eyes to the lack of education in poor areas.

Here''s an excerpt:

Then there are the babies. Four born, two on the way. The one who has tested HIV-positive was born to a young woman who is "still an adolescent herself," according to Russ Tilaro, who is the head of the local AIDS Coalition. Tilaro, who also is HIV-positive, says the girl didn''t know her own HIV status until after the baby was born.

One of the new mothers told the Buffalo News that her boyfriend knew she was HIV-positive but "wanted to have unprotected sex just once." He left her after she discovered she was pregnant. Another one of the women, Rzepkowski says, seriously considered abortion until her mother talked her into keeping the baby. And then there is Andrea, whose pregnancy was planned.

The evidence leaves Rzepkowski discouraged. "I think maybe some people got the message, but I have a problem when I educate these people and end up with six pregnant," he says. "Nushawn''s people – the majority of them – are continuing to be sexually active, putting people at risk, putting their babies at risk. That''s amazing."

If you''re in the mood for a truly heart-breaking read, yet a horrifying read that will blow your mind at how naive and careless some teens are, here''s the link:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/style/features/jamestown0601.htm

 

[honey22]

Date: 6/20/2008 9:28:32 AM
Author: Deelight

Date: 6/19/2008 5:15:28 PM
Author: Pandora II
It''s not just the US.


The part of London where I am an elected representative has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy in Europe.


We are spending a huge amount of £££ and have put a big team in place to go into schools and run serious sex-ed classes. Above all with the boys. Once you explain to a 15 year-old boy that they will be liable for supporting that kid for the next 18 years and that means a minimum of 15% of their income, they start to wise up.


Contraception is free in the UK and your parents are never informed no matter what your age. We even run specialist teenage drop-in centres for contraceptives and GUM clinics. However our very over-generous welfare system makes it rather easy for them.


The local Catholic girls school refused to let our teams in to teach sex-ed. Right up till the latest figures showed that that school had the highest rate of any in the area!


We''ve also found out that 3 guys are responsible for over 50% of all the pregnancies.


It''s so sad and so often they do seem to get pg in groups. I was still playing with barbie at some of their ages...

That figure there is to me just really highly scary

Honey I think the baby bonus is a good idea and personally if I was preggers would prefer a lump sum so I would have the extra to buy larger items but I agree not everyone is like that. I watched the same program on ACA but had a complete different take on it, could be that I detest that program and other current affairs programs but if the baby bonus was not there a lot of those same girls would have gotten knocked up for the pension or some other reason, it happened before the bonus and it will happen afterwards.

What I think will really stupid is if they means test the bonus that to me is just stupid, punish people for wanting to be self sufficient.

Hey Deelight - I totally agree with you. I would prefer a lump sum payment too as I know it''s going straight to essential items such as a car seat, cot etc. But with teenage mothers, substance abuse problems etc I think payments would be much more beneficial. They have even thought about using vouchers instead. So instead of a payment of cash, they get vouchers for baby shops etc to purchase essential items.

I am sure a lot of girls would have got pregnant anyway, it just seems a little more attractive now.

I hate ACA too!! I am a scientist and I am so sick of hearing about how toothpaste is going to give you cancer and all the bacteria in chicken. They word their stories for shock value - they take snipets of quotes from research studies etc and use what they want to, simply scaring uneducated consumers - it''s so wrong!!! Get''s me so mad, people have nothing to be frightened about when they brush their teeth in the morning!

 

[Deelight]

Date: 6/20/2008 8:34:34 PM
Author: honey22

Date: 6/20/2008 9:28:32 AM

Author: Deelight

Date: 6/19/2008 5:15:28 PM

Author: Pandora II

It''s not just the US.



The part of London where I am an elected representative has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy in Europe.



We are spending a huge amount of £££ and have put a big team in place to go into schools and run serious sex-ed classes. Above all with the boys. Once you explain to a 15 year-old boy that they will be liable for supporting that kid for the next 18 years and that means a minimum of 15% of their income, they start to wise up.



Contraception is free in the UK and your parents are never informed no matter what your age. We even run specialist teenage drop-in centres for contraceptives and GUM clinics. However our very over-generous welfare system makes it rather easy for them.



The local Catholic girls school refused to let our teams in to teach sex-ed. Right up till the latest figures showed that that school had the highest rate of any in the area!



We''ve also found out that 3 guys are responsible for over 50% of all the pregnancies.



It''s so sad and so often they do seem to get pg in groups. I was still playing with barbie at some of their ages...

That figure there is to me just really highly scary

Honey I think the baby bonus is a good idea and personally if I was preggers would prefer a lump sum so I would have the extra to buy larger items but I agree not everyone is like that. I watched the same program on ACA but had a complete different take on it, could be that I detest that program and other current affairs programs but if the baby bonus was not there a lot of those same girls would have gotten knocked up for the pension or some other reason, it happened before the bonus and it will happen afterwards.


What I think will really stupid is if they means test the bonus that to me is just stupid, punish people for wanting to be self sufficient.

Hey Deelight - I totally agree with you. I would prefer a lump sum payment too as I know it''s going straight to essential items such as a car seat, cot etc. But with teenage mothers, substance abuse problems etc I think payments would be much more beneficial. They have even thought about using vouchers instead. So instead of a payment of cash, they get vouchers for baby shops etc to purchase essential items.


I am sure a lot of girls would have got pregnant anyway, it just seems a little more attractive now.


I hate ACA too!! I am a scientist and I am so sick of hearing about how toothpaste is going to give you cancer and all the bacteria in chicken. They word their stories for shock value - they take snipets of quotes from research studies etc and use what they want to, simply scaring uneducated consumers - it''s so wrong!!! Get''s me so mad, people have nothing to be frightened about when they brush their teeth in the morning!

OMG glad I am not the only one, my dad watches it all the time shows like this pray not only on the uneducated but also older people.

Actually thinking about what your saying about the teenage pregnancy I think in someways it would make sense to age test the baby bonus, like you must be over 18 to receive it.

It most likely will never be perfect but it does need a change but not necessarily how they propose.

 

[meresal]

Date: 6/20/2008 6:34:49 PM
Author: brazen_irish_hussy
To be perfectly honest, they are poor and badly educated which statistically, has a big impact on the age of the mothers when they first give birth.
My FI comes from a poor, badly educated family. He is the second of many cousins and the only without a child and he is 24. One of his cousins first got pregnant as 19 by her married boss when they were drunk. She was so excited and I finally asked her why. She said because that was the most important thing she was ever going to do with her life. She never had plans for school or to get a good job, all she felt she was good for is babymaking. She is 21 and pregnant again.
Like these girls, I don''t think it occured to her that she could do better or that she might want to. Unfortunately, having seen all the women in FI''s family who do the same thing, FMIL included, none of them are happy with the way things worked out. They put all their hopes into these kids who do grow up, rebel and move away, leaving them with nothing.

If there is no one in the family that believes this and reminds her that this is possible, then she would have no reason to believe it herself... My parents contstantly expected the best from me and let me know it. Without that, I could see myself wandering to other ''extra curricular'' activities.

 

[Sha]

This is just really sad. The whole idea of raising kids together just seems so naive and 'teenage- like' - so far removed from real adult life. It really highlights how immature many teenagers can be..and why they often need to be protected from making bad life choices. I mean, what did they think, that they would live in a commune together and all raise their kids? Didn't they think that they might be too busy to even time for their friendships? Didn't they think that some of them perhaps find new partners, maybe decide to go to college, in different town and communities and never see each other again? How many of them have jobs to support their children? Sheesh. It's like these girls think that having a baby is all about planning baby showers and showing off their cute children. I'm sure they'll be in for shock once they have their babies and see how hard and overwhelming life as a single mother can be - it's not a party!

I'm sure the parents of these teenagers will have to pick up a lot of the slack, though. Yay for the parents...

Where I live a lot of poorly educated girls in low-income communities have children in their late teens to early twenties. I think they see 'motherhood' as a status symbol - something that gives them instant status and self-importance. I always use to think, "Don't these girls have anything else they want to do with their lives but have children?" For me, having goals and dreams and interests was always important - and it was something my parents instilled in me. Sadly, I don't think these girls have many goals and dreams - they don't see themselves going to college, getting a good job, or getting married someday.....but they can AT LEAST be mothers. (It doesnt' take any special qualifications for that, right?

) So why not have a child at 20? For them - it's not interrupting any important life plans.

I agree that a lot of these girls have low-self esteem and crave attention and love. Having a baby is one way to fill that empty void (unconditional love) while giving them a self-esteem boost (look everyone! I'm pregnant! I'm carrying a child! I'm a MOTHER!) Many of them go on to have more and more children that they can't afford or handle. The sad thing is that, while these young mothers get such a sense of pride at having children - they are often the WORST mothers around - at least in my community. They are immature, have ZERO parenting skills, no time and energy to instill any good values into their children, AND are emotionally and financially stressed - and often take out these stresses on their children. It's sad. The children of these mothers are often the ones who grow up to be the biggest burdens on the society in terms of unemployment, crime, homelessness, etc. - at least in my area. I see it every day.

 

[brazen_irish_hussy]

What the heck is going on in America? We have sleezy principals cutting contraceptives, facing a pregnancy crisis and lying to the national media to cover his a$$

The only pregnant girl to speak out said they made the pact AFTER they got pregnant because they knew they needed help. She said she was using birth control when she got pregnant and blamed the principal''s rules of birth control for the spike in births.

Now that he is being question, the principal says he isn''t even sure where he heard about the pact.

 

[moderatelypoorstudent]

Oh my! I should keep up with the news more.

How is it that none of these girls ever think that a baby (an infant) does not unconditionally LOVE, it unconditionally NEEDS. Don''t get me wrong, I love babies, I want to have children, but they''re a massive responsibility and I don''t think anyone could even try to convince me that a newborn baby will just unconditionally love me.

Unconditional love is what we''re supposed to give, not receive in having children. ooi! This makes my head spin.

 

[Pushin40]

So it turns out this pact was formed after all of these girls happened to get pregnant.

Wake up America and don''t kid yourselves!

Sex Ed and Birth controll are necessary, no matter how good of a parent you are. Our kids are vicitms of over-sexualized media where girls are sex symbols dancing on stripper poles in music videos. Gangsta rap with the "ho''s".

Little girls are taught they need to be sexy and thei purpose is to please a man. Look at the 12 year olds in tank tops and little shorts and skirts.

Take a look at the stuff thats on TV, when you are at work. It''s disgusting.

It kills me.

 

[tberube]

I read this yesterday. Ridiculous.

 

[Anna0499]

Handing out birth control will prevent some unwanted pregnancies but not solve the problem. Why be content to accept things the way they are? Why not, instead of accepting that CHILDREN will have sex so they need BC, try to solve the issue at a deeper level - i.e. SELF-ESTEEM, SELF-WORTH, etc.? BC doesn''t protect a person''s self-esteem, let alone STDs all the time! Just because something is on TV does not mean that children have to watch it, but also doesn''t mean that they can''t be taught to understand right from wrong and fantasy vs. reality. I saw Madonna prancing around in lingerie when I was growing up, but I never thought I should walk out in public like that!