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Opinions on 2ct GIA H VS2 antique peruzzi?

Artemisia

Artemisia

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 9, 2022
Messages
42
I'm considering buying a 2.0ct GIA H VS2 antique peruzzi cut diamond for ~$8.5k. This cut is so dreamy to me - the chunky pillow tops! - and I love the size and higher color of this one. I also love fluorescence, so that's a plus for me, but I'm nervous about the carbon spots and "Pinpoints are not shown" that the seller described as eye clean.

Will the carbon spots interfere with performance? Am I missing any other concerns? I don't mind carbon spots if they're only visible at 10x or unless I'm really determinedly peering at a stone. I'd appreciate feedback from more discerning eyes ::)

Video:
https://imgur.com/a/lH9jXDb

Images:

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5D6F89EB-4D09-4E45-A188-344B2AF62AD3.jpeg

3B3269D8-76BA-46B0-A977-FE59CA312160.jpeg


Report:

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I utterly love peruzzis but this but black carbon inclusions are my least tolerable inclusion so I couldn’t learn to love this one unfortunately- even if they are tiny specks. But I’m odd like that.

Any chance you could see it in person to check the clarity level with your own eye?
 
Ionysis said:
I utterly love peruzzis but this but black carbon inclusions are my least tolerable inclusion so I couldn’t learn to love this one unfortunately- even if they are tiny specks. But I’m odd like that.

Any chance you could see it in person to check the clarity level with your own eye?
Click to expand...

Totally understand that perspective! I'm odd the other way, I find them charming artifacts of nature as long as I can't see them. The seller's in another country and I'm asking for a viewing period, but even if they say yes, I'd be out $300 for shipping. I'm happy to risk that if it's just a matter of assessing the carbon spots, but I figured any other potential concerns with the stone might change that calculation...
 
I saw the carbon spots on first glance. If they don’t bother you, the cut is lovely.
 
Mrsz1ppy said:
I saw the carbon spots on first glance. If they don’t bother you, the cut is lovely.
Click to expand...

Rfisher said:
Same opinion here :)

Being out $300 on a 8.5k purchase to see in my own mitts - on something that most likely otherwise isn’t readily available nearby……..I’d not be too much fussed about.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the feedback, I'm glad the cut looks good! I definitely see the carbon spots on the zoomed in photos, but if they don't interfere with performance AND I can't see them with the naked eye, I'm absolutely charmed enough by the cut. Seems like a big if, though.

My heart immediately said yes when I saw the handshot video and I'm afraid I won't encounter a higher color, large peruzzi <$15k again if I pass. Does $8.5k feel like a good price for a 2ct H VS2 with fluorescence and carbon spots? I'm debating whether to take a flier on it, even if the seller says it's final sale...
 
How old is the GIA report? Do you know the prior life of the stone? What are your gut feelings about the vendor and the other items they sell?

None of these questions really matter, I guess. Just curiosities.

Re: the cut /performance that you’ve mentioned
I can’t really tell from the pictures much of anything besides the side profile. 97.7% depth - yowza.

If you plan on setting it - choose your vendor wisely with that girdle. Both for aesthetics and safety.
 
I tend to give old cuts and unusual cuts a certain amount of grace with respect to inclusions. I don't know enough about peruzzi
cuts (I know they are cut deep though) but the depth on this one is 97.7%. Is that considered "typical" for peruzzi cut? It looks like
its priced accordingly.

How do you plan on setting it? The girdle is Extremely Thin to Very Thin so you will need to take that into consideration.
 
Rfisher said:
How old is the GIA report? Do you know the prior life of the stone? What are your gut feelings about the vendor and the other items they sell?
Click to expand...

The report is from June 2021, so fairly recent. Don't know the life of the stone after the report was issued, other than it's had one for 300 years :))

The seller doesn't take risk on their inventory, they just source stones, so it seems like the prices tend to be better vs. a JbG or OWD. But then the tradeoff is either no returns or returns less shipping. You probably can guess who I'm talking about as other posters have linked antique stones from them before, but I haven't seen posts from anyone who's actually bought before. I debated whether to name the seller, and maybe I'm being overly cautious, but I didn't want to get scooped by a lurker before I decided on it!
 
Rfisher said:
Re: the cut /performance that you’ve mentioned
I can’t really tell from the pictures much of anything besides the side profile. 97.7% depth - yowza.
Click to expand...

tyty333 said:
I tend to give old cuts and unusual cuts a certain amount of grace with respect to inclusions. I don't know enough about peruzzi
cuts (I know they are cut deep though) but the depth on this one is 97.7%. Is that considered "typical" for peruzzi cut? It looks like
its priced accordingly.
Click to expand...

This is what I'm struggling with! @Demelza's peruzzi only has 76.6% depth, @klrrrr's is 75.2%, and the 2.41ct at Jewels by Grace is the shallowest at 65.1%. so this seems extremely deep. I don't know enough about cut geometry to know what to make of that or how badly it'd relatively impair performance, so I thought I'd ask. Any guesses?
 
Rfisher said:
If you plan on setting it - choose your vendor wisely with that girdle. Both for aesthetics and safety.
Click to expand...

tyty333 said:
How do you plan on setting it? The girdle is Extremely Thin to Very Thin so you will need to take that into consideration.
Click to expand...

Still debating! A few options at the risk of getting ahead of myself. I'd be happy with a bezel, but below are the options I love that I'm less sure about re balancing aesthetics with girdle protection.

I have a weakness for tab prongs - not sure if four are protective enough with a faux bezel?

1675437880069.png

I also inquired about a Leen Heyne setting a few months ago for a different stone. I'm beyond obsessed with this setting but it'd have to be a special occasion ring if that much of the stone were left exposed. I'd still seriously consider it if the stone is truly eye clean.

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And I love the dimensionality of a classic buttercup - it makes me think of Gothic architectural details. Maybe a cinquefoil/sexfoil/octofoil are protective enough?

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1675438131250.png
 
I think the price is fair—2 ct H VS2 with a cert. Peruzzis don’t come along every day, that’s for sure, and you checked the comps. Cut is what I look for, then size, then color, then clarity.
 
Artemisia said:
Still debating! A few options at the risk of getting ahead of myself. I'd be happy with a bezel, but below are the options I love that I'm less sure about re balancing aesthetics with girdle protection.

I have a weakness for tab prongs - not sure if four are protective enough with a faux bezel?

1675437880069.png

I also inquired about a Leen Heyne setting a few months ago for a different stone. I'm beyond obsessed with this setting but it'd have to be a special occasion ring if that much of the stone were left exposed. I'd still seriously consider it if the stone is truly eye clean.

1675437966789.png

And I love the dimensionality of a classic buttercup - it makes me think of Gothic architectural details. Maybe a cinquefoil/sexfoil/octofoil are protective enough?

1675438073039.png

1675437322047.png
1675438131250.png
Click to expand...

I am not sure it would lend itself to a Leen Heyne with that depth. It seems to me great for a bezel because it would poof out enough to show quite a bit of diamond on the sides.
 
I would be very cautious with a stone that deep. I was told by a very reputable dealer that she will sometimes tolerate stones deeper than 70% if the stone is amazing, but over 80% is a very very tough sell. I've never seen a stone over 90%!
 
Demelza said:
I would be very cautious with a stone that deep. I was told by a very reputable dealer that she will sometimes tolerate stones deeper than 70% if the stone is amazing, but over 80% is a very very tough sell. I've never seen a stone over 90%!
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Curious what the fire looks like on a stone that deep. Does anyone know how that much depth would affect fire?
 
@Karl_K can you gleam anything about this stone (fire etc.) Knowing the depth? I guess I'm looking for a generic opinion...an aset sure would come on handy!
 
tyty333 said:
@Karl_K can you gleam anything about this stone (fire etc.) Knowing the depth? I guess I'm looking for a generic opinion...an aset sure would come on handy!
Click to expand...
other than it is going to face up extremely small for a 2ct not much. Even 3d can not help that much.
 
Does the $300 count toward the purchase price? I would pay that without hesitation to see such a unique diamond. If the depth/loss of face-up size doesn't trouble you (I've seen 2 ct Asschers with similar face-up numbers) I would go for it. It might be spectacular. I love your buttercup setting ideas, I learned from your post.

Would Yoram give an opinion on this? Surely he's seen a bunch of them.
 
Ibrakeforpossums said:
Does the $300 count toward the purchase price? I would pay that without hesitation to see such a unique diamond. If the depth/loss of face-up size doesn't trouble you (I've seen 2 ct Asschers with similar face-up numbers) I would go for it. It might be spectacular.
Click to expand...

My understanding is shipping is free if I keep it! It's coming to me next week for a three-day viewing period. Which certainly might turn into an indefinite keeping period...

I don't mind the loss of face-up size at all. I like that the larger depth means it's closer to the original octahedron, but I'm nervous about whether it'll have to be set higher than I prefer as a consequence.

I'll post pictures and videos! Any advance suggestions of what to look for beyond whether it's truly eye clean? The only other diamond I have is a well-cut antique 2.2-ish ct OEC, but given how different the cuts are it feels unfair to use that as a performance benchmark.
 
Artemisia said:
My understanding is shipping is free if I keep it! It's coming to me next week for a three-day viewing period. Which certainly might turn into an indefinite keeping period...

I don't mind the loss of face-up size at all. I like that the larger depth means it's closer to the original octahedron, but I'm nervous about whether it'll have to be set higher than I prefer as a consequence.

I'll post pictures and videos! Any advance suggestions of what to look for beyond whether it's truly eye clean? The only other diamond I have is a well-cut antique 2.2-ish ct OEC, but given how different the cuts are it feels unfair to use that as a performance benchmark.
Click to expand...

Off topic but we never saw your OEC right? You had bought and returned a ring I thought but never saw what you decided on!
 
Snippets I've read say to allow some extra depth to step-cuts, it can make a more beautiful diamond. I have an EC with 84% depth, it faces up small but I adore it. I can't wait to hear what you think of the Peruzzi.
Eye-clean is in the eye of the beholder. What is character and identification, and what is not tolerable?
 
Artemisia said:
My understanding is shipping is free if I keep it! It's coming to me next week for a three-day viewing period. Which certainly might turn into an indefinite keeping period...

I don't mind the loss of face-up size at all. I like that the larger depth means it's closer to the original octahedron, but I'm nervous about whether it'll have to be set higher than I prefer as a consequence.

I'll post pictures and videos! Any advance suggestions of what to look for beyond whether it's truly eye clean? The only other diamond I have is a well-cut antique 2.2-ish ct OEC, but given how different the cuts are it feels unfair to use that as a performance benchmark.
Click to expand...
I’m excited for you!

I think you’ll beable to use what you learned in your OEC search.
You still are weighing in what’s available in the market (not much) to your price range to what facet pattern/performance (and it’s possible shortfalls) you see to your eye. If, say, you are looking for a perfectly oriented symmetric under the table pattern that never disappoints…….it’s hard for someone else to say it’s ‘good’ find for you to keep.

Off topic,
I’ve now seen more than a few different vendors that have in the past sold jewelry with the newly cut Frenchies -
Now market what looks (to me) just like those same cuts….but now labeled as peruzzi.
I’d be interesting for one of those vendors to address what they believe is the difference in their stock side by side :)
 
Too late to edit
But what I’m meaning to say
It’s going to be much harder to look at this stone (as opposed to an OEC search) objectively at it’s possible faults because there’s not that many out on the market to wait for another to come along that suits better. It’s said here ALot for OEC searches. Especially with center patterns and table/girdle/culet symmetry/being not parallel.
And wanting eye clean top view only, or along with eye clean side view is going to be a different story I think?
 
Mreader said:
Off topic but we never saw your OEC right? You had bought and returned a ring I thought but never saw what you decided on!
Click to expand...

I've been waiting for setting inspiration to strike before I posted anything about it!
 
I poked around and looked up reports for the peruzzis that I remember bookmarking, sharing for reference:
  • Demelza's peruzzi 76.6% depth
  • klrrrr's peruzzi 75.2% depth
  • This one was graded in the setting by EGL, 105.7% (!)
  • Yoram cut a pair, a half-carat each (one, two) with 78.9% and 77.5% depths
  • Jewels by Whitney had a 1.6 J SI1 for $7,000, 73% depth
  • Jogani had one, 79.2% depth
Wide range...
 
Yay, @Artemisia I think you made the right choice trying a trial period for this stone. Peruzzis don't come up that often, and they're really individual, even amongst antique cuts. It could be lovely, and the puffy crown may take precedence visually over the inclusion(s) that show up under magnification.

Throwing my Peruzzi into the comp pile:
a bit over 1 ct, H VS1, 76.2% depth. I paid a little over $4k for this one in 2021. I love its chunkiness. I don't have this on hand since it has been waiting on its setting at a jeweler for a long time.
 
It's here! I think it's beautiful!

If I really look for the carbon spots I can see one, maybe two, but it takes a lot of holding it up to the light and squinting. They don't bother me at all.

I love the faceting and the shape. It looks like an intact octahedron was brought out of the ground and polished and faceted, but left as close to its original form as the cut would allow. The stone is occasionally prismatic with a rainbow here and there, but it really more moves and flashes white light. It doesn't feel dead to me, but I'd like more neutral opinions.

What questions should I be asking and what conditions should I be looking at it in? I have three days to assess how I feel (and also to figure out how to photograph/video diamonds) before the return window is up, and I would love any advice.

https://imgur.com/a/VbuUA9L

https://imgur.com/a/cByRxFl
 
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