Opinions on this - good value or can I do better?

[vadar]

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1180876.asp?b=16&a=12&c=77&cid=131

What do you think - it''s SI1 but it looks like the only inclusions are on the edge. Is that a good price? I was trying to stay closer to 15k, but definitely want at least 2 carats, and as close to ideal cut as possible. Not too concerned with color since I saw some stones in person and couldn''t tell the difference from an G to I. I''d really appreciate it if I can get some input, maybe even some specific suggestions of alternatives you can find.... thanks!

 

[strmrdr]

It is an old style ags ideal it would likely get ags1 in the 3D system.
use the pricescope search engine to check the price.
It has an extra facet which isn't that big of deal.
Face up optical symmetry is excellent.
So it is a step down from the best and would come down to how the IS looks and how the price compares.
If your interested request an IS image and put it on hold.

 

[stone-cold11]

This looks like an old AGS DQD, probably the cut grade is from the old geometry system instead of performance base grading, so the AGS0 should not be accorded in as high a status as current system.

I prefer this, current DQD AGS0, 2.10 Carat H-SI1 at $18540.

 

[AprilBaby]

The inclusions look like they would fit nicely under prongs.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 11/18/2008 5:36:57 PM
Author: strmrdr
It is an old style ags ideal it would likely get ags1 in the 3D system.
use the pricescope search engine to check the price.
It has an extra facet which isn''t that big of deal.
Face up optical symmetry is excellent.
So it is a step down from the best and would come down to how the IS looks and how the price compares.
If your interested request an IS image and put it on hold.

Ditto!

 

[vadar]

wow thanks for all the input.

Can someone explain the "Old" vs "New" AGS DQD? Or point me in the direction of a FAQ that explains this? So much to learn... it''s overwhelming at times.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 11/19/2008 9:10:31 AM
Author: vadar
wow thanks for all the input.

Can someone explain the ''Old'' vs ''New'' AGS DQD? Or point me in the direction of a FAQ that explains this? So much to learn... it''s overwhelming at times.

Of course! This thread might help.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/ags-dqd-grading-reports-old-and-new.45611/

 

[vadar]

Thanks again!

So this revelation raises a new question/issue. It seems that the diamonds online with certs available for viewing are few and far between. Now I also need to weed out those with the old AGS certs/methodology, or at least be more particular in evaluating them... Is there a way I should go about finding potential stones? There are tons that come up in the pricescope search, but without an image of the inclusions, it''s hard to tell one SI1 from another. I mean, I would much rather have one like the first stone I posted - with the only inclusions on the perimeter, than one with a bunch of inclusions smack dab in the center... but both are SI1, and without seeing the cert it''s impossible to know the difference. I know I can request the cert, but when I search there are tons of results. Any input? This whole process is new to me, and this is a lot of money so I want to get the best diamond possible.

 

[neatfreak]

Date: 11/19/2008 2:11:00 PM
Author: vadar
Thanks again!


So this revelation raises a new question/issue. It seems that the diamonds online with certs available for viewing are few and far between. Now I also need to weed out those with the old AGS certs/methodology, or at least be more particular in evaluating them... Is there a way I should go about finding potential stones? There are tons that come up in the pricescope search, but without an image of the inclusions, it''s hard to tell one SI1 from another. I mean, I would much rather have one like the first stone I posted - with the only inclusions on the perimeter, than one with a bunch of inclusions smack dab in the center... but both are SI1, and without seeing the cert it''s impossible to know the difference. I know I can request the cert, but when I search there are tons of results. Any input? This whole process is new to me, and this is a lot of money so I want to get the best diamond possible.

In general Whiteflash, Good Old Gold, and James Allen almost always have certs posted and pictures too. I would start with them personally to make it easier on yourself. And please don''t disregard SI1''s with seemingly "dirty" plots in the center. Sometimes these stones are perfectly eyeclean and are a good choice. Best to ask the vendor to eyeball it for you rather than rely on the cert alone.

 

[stone-cold11]

Date: 11/19/2008 2:11:00 PM
Author: vadar
Thanks again!

So this revelation raises a new question/issue. It seems that the diamonds online with certs available for viewing are few and far between. Now I also need to weed out those with the old AGS certs/methodology, or at least be more particular in evaluating them... Is there a way I should go about finding potential stones? There are tons that come up in the pricescope search, but without an image of the inclusions, it's hard to tell one SI1 from another. I mean, I would much rather have one like the first stone I posted - with the only inclusions on the perimeter, than one with a bunch of inclusions smack dab in the center... but both are SI1, and without seeing the cert it's impossible to know the difference. I know I can request the cert, but when I search there are tons of results. Any input? This whole process is new to me, and this is a lot of money so I want to get the best diamond possible.

Have you looked at my suggestion? That is only $90 more than your original pick, same specs but current AGS0. What are you worried about on that stone?
EDT to add link
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1186693.asp?b=16&a=12&c=77&cid=131

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 11/19/2008 2:15:01 PM
Author: neatfreak

Date: 11/19/2008 2:11:00 PM
Author: vadar
Thanks again!


So this revelation raises a new question/issue. It seems that the diamonds online with certs available for viewing are few and far between. Now I also need to weed out those with the old AGS certs/methodology, or at least be more particular in evaluating them... Is there a way I should go about finding potential stones? There are tons that come up in the pricescope search, but without an image of the inclusions, it''s hard to tell one SI1 from another. I mean, I would much rather have one like the first stone I posted - with the only inclusions on the perimeter, than one with a bunch of inclusions smack dab in the center... but both are SI1, and without seeing the cert it''s impossible to know the difference. I know I can request the cert, but when I search there are tons of results. Any input? This whole process is new to me, and this is a lot of money so I want to get the best diamond possible.

In general Whiteflash, Good Old Gold, and James Allen almost always have certs posted and pictures too. I would start with them personally to make it easier on yourself. And please don''t disregard SI1''s with seemingly ''dirty'' plots in the center. Sometimes these stones are perfectly eyeclean and are a good choice. Best to ask the vendor to eyeball it for you rather than rely on the cert alone.

Great advice!

 

[vadar]

Date: 11/19/2008 2:26:55 PM
Author: Stone-cold11


Have you looked at my suggestion? That is only $90 more than your original pick, same specs but current AGS0. What are you worried about on that stone?
EDT to add link
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1186693.asp?b=16&a=12&c=77&cid=131

I know I shouldn''t put too much stock into the inclusions, but that one looked absolutely loaded with clouds in the middle... wouldn''t that make it look cloudy, for lack of a better term?


What about this one?

http://www.abazias.com/database/NewDiamondInfo.asp?stock=41310793&src=builderhttp://

I had them email me the cert, I am unable to upload it for some reason... I think it''s the old style AGS report though, it does not say performance based and it''s from 2006. I plugged it into the Hollaway cut advisor and it scored 0.7, the cert is a really bad photocopy but I see very, very minimal inclusions.

 

[swingirl]

Whiteflash has some gorgeous ACA 2+ ct with September 2008 AGS reports. The selection is quite varied and it is lucky for you that you''re flexible with color.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 11/25/2008 5:57:27 PM
Author: vadar

I know I shouldn't put too much stock into the inclusions, but that one looked absolutely loaded with clouds in the middle... wouldn't that make it look cloudy, for lack of a better term?


What about this one?

http://www.abazias.com/database/NewDiamondInfo.asp?stock=41310793&src=builderhttp://

I had them email me the cert, I am unable to upload it for some reason... I think it's the old style AGS report though, it does not say performance based and it's from 2006. I plugged it into the Hollaway cut advisor and it scored 0.7, the cert is a really bad photocopy but I see very, very minimal inclusions.

Hi vadar, it's hard to say a lot with this one, they don't have the cert up. But what I can glean from it's diameter is that it's slightly out of round, and the girdle is iffy with the Very thin portion. So we can't say for sure, but that's not a great indication.

Also, as neat pointed out, do not let the clarity plots scare you. These pics are blown up BIG time. What looks like a mine field, could be totally eye clean, all the way down to SI2's (and those lower clarity stones will save you a bundle). Each stone needs to be evaluated in person to know.

Here's a couple I found, and again, don't worry about the clarity plots, just ask if it's eyeclean. And if that means not seeing anything at any angle/distance, let them knowe that too. They will be totally honest with you!

ACA's should be discounted 5%

http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-1466934.htm#

http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-1466932.htm

 

[neatfreak]

Date: 11/25/2008 7:46:57 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 11/25/2008 5:57:27 PM

Author: vadar


I know I shouldn''t put too much stock into the inclusions, but that one looked absolutely loaded with clouds in the middle... wouldn''t that make it look cloudy, for lack of a better term?



What about this one?



http://www.abazias.com/database/NewDiamondInfo.asp?stock=41310793&src=builderhttp://


I had them email me the cert, I am unable to upload it for some reason... I think it''s the old style AGS report though, it does not say performance based and it''s from 2006. I plugged it into the Hollaway cut advisor and it scored 0.7, the cert is a really bad photocopy but I see very, very minimal inclusions.

Hi vadar, it''s hard to say a lot with this one, they don''t have the cert up. But what I can glean from it''s diameter is that it''s slightly out of round, and the girdle is iffy with the Very thin portion. So we can''t say for sure, but that''s not a great indication.


Also, as neat pointed out, do not let the clarity plots scare you. These pics are blown up BIG time. What looks like a mine field, could be totally eye clean, all the way down to SI2''s (and those lower clarity stones will save you a bundle). Each stone needs to be evaluated in person to know.

Here''s a couple I found, and again, don''t worry about the clarity plots, just ask if it''s eyeclean. And if that means not seeing anything at any angle/distance, let them knowe that too. They will be totally honest with you!


ACA''s should be discounted 5%


http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-1466934.htm#


http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-1466932.htm

Ellen has picked some great stones for you, I''d check these out for sure!

 

[vadar]

Date: 11/25/2008 7:46:57 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 11/25/2008 5:57:27 PM
Author: vadar

I know I shouldn''t put too much stock into the inclusions, but that one looked absolutely loaded with clouds in the middle... wouldn''t that make it look cloudy, for lack of a better term?


What about this one?

http://www.abazias.com/database/NewDiamondInfo.asp?stock=41310793&src=builderhttp://

I had them email me the cert, I am unable to upload it for some reason... I think it''s the old style AGS report though, it does not say performance based and it''s from 2006. I plugged it into the Hollaway cut advisor and it scored 0.7, the cert is a really bad photocopy but I see very, very minimal inclusions.

Hi vadar, it''s hard to say a lot with this one, they don''t have the cert up. But what I can glean from it''s diameter is that it''s slightly out of round, and the girdle is iffy with the Very thin portion. So we can''t say for sure, but that''s not a great indication.

Also, as neat pointed out, do not let the clarity plots scare you. These pics are blown up BIG time. What looks like a mine field, could be totally eye clean, all the way down to SI2''s (and those lower clarity stones will save you a bundle). Each stone needs to be evaluated in person to know.

Here''s a couple I found, and again, don''t worry about the clarity plots, just ask if it''s eyeclean. And if that means not seeing anything at any angle/distance, let them knowe that too. They will be totally honest with you!

ACA''s should be discounted 5%

http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-1466934.htm#

http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-1466932.htm

Thanks. I wasn''t considering J Color, I has been the lowest I''ve searched. How do J''s look in person? I know each is different, but for example I looked at an H and an I at a jeweler and I could not tell any difference.

And what do you mean that ACA should be discounted 5%? Is that 5% off the price on the site? On all ACA''s?

 

[Ellen]

Date: 11/26/2008 9:17:07 AM
Author: vadar

Thanks. I wasn''t considering J Color, I has been the lowest I''ve searched. How do J''s look in person? I know each is different, but for example I looked at an H and an I at a jeweler and I could not tell any difference.

And what do you mean that ACA should be discounted 5%? Is that 5% off the price on the site? On all ACA''s?

A well cut J will not look much different than a well cut I, so you should be fine. That''s why I suggested a J, because I saw you had no problem with an I.

Here''s a thread that might help ease your mind a bit.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/j-color-stones-in-platinum.24731/


And I''m sorry I was unclear. You should receive a 5% PS discount off the listed price, on all ACA''s. 2% off Expert selection.

 

[vadar]

Date: 11/26/2008 11:11:10 AM
Author: Ellen

Date: 11/26/2008 9:17:07 AM
Author: vadar

Thanks. I wasn''t considering J Color, I has been the lowest I''ve searched. How do J''s look in person? I know each is different, but for example I looked at an H and an I at a jeweler and I could not tell any difference.

And what do you mean that ACA should be discounted 5%? Is that 5% off the price on the site? On all ACA''s?

A well cut J will not look much different than a well cut I, so you should be fine. That''s why I suggested a J, because I saw you had no problem with an I.

Here''s a thread that might help ease your mind a bit.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/j-color-stones-in-platinum.24731/


And I''m sorry I was unclear. You should receive a 5% PS discount off the listed price, on all ACA''s. 2% off Expert selection.

Wow, thanks for this info. Do you think I should look for strong flourescence as well, to offset any yellow in a J? Or would that make it cloudy looking? Or (as I suspect) is this a case by case situation and I need to evaluate each one individually?

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 11/26/2008 11:54:18 AM
Author: vadar

Date: 11/26/2008 11:11:10 AM
Author: Ellen

Date: 11/26/2008 9:17:07 AM
Author: vadar

Thanks. I wasn''t considering J Color, I has been the lowest I''ve searched. How do J''s look in person? I know each is different, but for example I looked at an H and an I at a jeweler and I could not tell any difference.

And what do you mean that ACA should be discounted 5%? Is that 5% off the price on the site? On all ACA''s?

A well cut J will not look much different than a well cut I, so you should be fine. That''s why I suggested a J, because I saw you had no problem with an I.

Here''s a thread that might help ease your mind a bit.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/j-color-stones-in-platinum.24731/


And I''m sorry I was unclear. You should receive a 5% PS discount off the listed price, on all ACA''s. 2% off Expert selection.

Wow, thanks for this info. Do you think I should look for strong flourescence as well, to offset any yellow in a J? Or would that make it cloudy looking? Or (as I suspect) is this a case by case situation and I need to evaluate each one individually?

Yes indeed, strong blue fluorescence is considered an asset by some in a J colour, but you would need to check with the vendor if it had a negative effect on the diamond ( rare).

 

[Ellen]

Date: 11/26/2008 11:54:18 AM
Author: vadar

Wow, thanks for this info. Do you think I should look for strong flourescence as well, to offset any yellow in a J? Or would that make it cloudy looking? Or (as I suspect) is this a case by case situation and I need to evaluate each one individually?

First, a well cut (and that's key) J will never look yellow. It may appear a tad "warm", not blazing white, more like winter white, but not yellow.

Also, sure, a strong to very strong blue fluorescence can offset what warmth it might have. Rarely does it affect a stone negatively, but as you said, each stone must be evaluated on it's own. However, I will add, I wouldn't go out of your way to find a stone with flo, it would really limit your selection, and is not really "necessary".

And you're welcome!

*typing at same time*

 

[vadar]

OK, time to ask the experts again. Opinions, reservations, etc. very, very much appreciated.



Report: AGS
. Shape: A Cut Above H&A
. Carat: 2.065
. Depth %: 61.7
. Table %: 56
. Crown Angle: 34.8
. Crown %: 15.3
. Star : 54.5
. Pavilion Angle: 40.8
. Pavilion %: 43.1
. Lower Girdle %: 75.7
. Girdle: Thin to Medium Faceted
. Measurements: 8.15-8.19X5.04
. Light Performance: 0
. Polish: Ideal
. Symmetry: Ideal
. Culet: Pointed
. Fluorescence: Negligible

$18,690.00 - so if there is a 5% discount off that price it would be $17,755. Seems really good to me compared to what I''ve seen in comparable stones. But what I think doesn''t matter, bc I am still pretty clueless!

 

[vadar]

The inclusions look really negligible to me, especially considering it''s an SI2... It looks much more eyeclean than most SI1''s I''ve seen online. What am I missing?

 

[Mrs W]

I don''t think your missing anything.....looks like a great deal to me!!!

 

[Ellen]

Date: 11/26/2008 6:35:16 PM
Author: vadar
The inclusions look really negligible to me, especially considering it's an SI2... It looks much more eyeclean than most SI1's I've seen online. What am I missing?

You can't tell from real pics either vadar. I've seen real pics of stones that you couldn't see a thing, only to find out they weren't eyeclean, and vice versa. Have someone eyeball it for you, and be very specific about what eyeclean means to you. Other than the verdict on that, it should be an absolutely gorgeous stone!

(and the price is good)

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 11/26/2008 6:52:01 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 11/26/2008 6:35:16 PM
Author: vadar
The inclusions look really negligible to me, especially considering it''s an SI2... It looks much more eyeclean than most SI1''s I''ve seen online. What am I missing?

You can''t tell from real pics either vadar. I''ve seen real pics of stones that you couldn''t see a thing, only to find out they weren''t eyeclean, and vice versa. Have someone eyeball it for you, and be very specific about what eyeclean means to you. Other than the verdict on that, it should be an absolutely gorgeous stone!

(and the price is good)

Ditto

 

[vadar]

Ok, so apparently this stone is eyeclean from 8-10 inches. But the inclusions are visible from 3-5 inches. But they recommended an alternative, totally eyeclean that looks like a winner. From what the guy says, there is no noticable difference in the color from the "I" above.

Thanks so much for everyone who helped me out - I REALLY APPRECIATE IT!

Please take a look at this one and let me know your thoughts, any concerns, etc:

Report: AGS
. Shape: A Cut Above H&A
. Carat: 2.114
. Depth %: 61.8
. Table %: 56.5
. Crown Angle: 34.8
. Crown %: 15.1
. Star : 54
. Pavilion Angle: 40.7
. Pavilion %: 42.9
. Lower Girdle %: 76
. Girdle: Thin to Slightly Thick Faceted
. Measurements: 8.20-8.23X5.08
. Light Performance: 0
. Polish: Ideal
. Symmetry: Ideal
. Culet: Pointed
. Fluorescence: Negligible

 

[vadar]

Haven''t gotten the Cert on this one - so I can''t see what the inclusions look like. But here are the specs:

Report: AGS DQR
AGS 2.0 (H)
AGS 5 (SI1)
. Shape: Round Brilliant
. Carat: 2.135
. Table %: 57.9
Crown Angle: 33.0
. Crown height %: 13.7
. Star Length : 54 %
. Pavilion Angle: 41.1
. Pavilion %: 43.5
. Lower Girdle %: 76
Total depth 62.3%
. Girdle: Thin to Thick, Faceted
. Measurements: 8.14-8.22 X 5.10
. Polish: Excellent
. Symmetry: Excellent
. Culet: Pointed
. Fluorescence: Negligible
How does this compare to the one above? Is the Diamond Quality Report the old-style AGS cert? This one scores well in the HCA, the salesguy said 1.1, but I got 1.6 (1.2 if I used % instead of angles...). It''s "Excellent" and not "Ideal" in polish and symmetry, is that a different score, or is that a product of the old style AGS cert? Sorry for all the questions, only wanna do this once!

 

[JulieN]

A DQR does not give a cut grade. AGS issues different levels of reports.

 

[stone-cold11]

The newer stone will at most be a AGS1, as it only score a Ex/Ex in symm and polish, in the DQD cut performance grading system. DQR is a cheaper report for the vendors to use which the cut is not graded.

 

[vadar]

I see... so even this scores better in the HCA, it''s not an AGS0.

I actually found a link on here that explains it, pretty much the exact same situation (https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/ags-dqd-vs-dqr-breakdown-literally-figuratively.18020/).

So which is preferable, with comparable HCA scores - a Ex/Ex in symm and polish, but H... OR Ideal in Symm/polish, but J. Assuming all other things equal, which they pretty much are, including price.